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  1. #1
    Registered User GetReadyPhil's Avatar
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    Question Whats worth sweating over and not?

    My goal is to get as big as i can and get close to my genetic potential, and there are so much information around on how to get big, i feel like i know everything i need, but what are worth focusing on vs not?

    How important are workout split and periodization? does it matter so much? as long as you hit your muscles twice a week and are adding volume over time?

    I usually keep my working weight between 60-80% off my 1RM, but i have heard that new studies show that weight does not matter for hypertrohy as long you lift it close to failure, is this right?

    So if i do follow those basic fundamentals i posted below, would this be enough to get very close to my potential off gains?

    Hiiting muscles 2-3 frequency
    Hittlng my macros and surplus
    Doing more over time, adding weight, reps and sets (volume)
    Doing enough sets per muscle group
    Keeping weight between 60-80% off 1RM
    Rest and sleep enough

    How much does the other stuff matter? like programming and periodization where you plan when to add weight, how many days you train vs just adding sets, weight and reps over time when you are able too and make sure you deload at times?

    So whats worth caring about and whats not?
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  2. #2
    Weak and foolish OldFartTom's Avatar
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    You describe programming as "other stuff" but, roughly speaking it covers all the list you gave above about training and rest so it falls into the stuff to care about.

    Very pleased you seen to have understood the 80:20 rule concept. A lot of the 20% that makes the real difference is discussed https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...hp?t=168581133 (ignore the fact this is posted in over 35, it's just as valid at any age).

    Some can't be answered directly because periodization, for example, is essential for advanced, but is unhelpful (just complicates and slows things down) for novice. So some will depend on where you are with your training.

    Read through the "stickies", the fixed articles at top of each section, they are what you're after. If you only tried to get 3 things from this site I'd say make that... Fierce5 (as written... don't "improve" it), consistent/persistent training, nutrition.

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  3. #3
    pay the iron price SuffolkPunch's Avatar
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    A pretty good list.

    I don't think periodization is important at all for hypertrophy. It's seldom used by top athletes and everyone else probably doesn't need it anyway. You do have to know (informally) about the tradeoff between directed adaptation (doing the same thing repeatedly to get better at it) and variation (to overcome repeated bout effect adaptataions). Most advanced people need more variation and less DI but novices start prioritising DI.

    Split doesn't matter that much although from a performance point of view it's better to train a muscle at a time when it feels ready to go again. Just beware that lower frequency training leads to longer lasting DOMS - which makes you think that you aren't recovered yet - whereas you could quickly adapt to higher frequency if you tried.
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  4. #4
    Registered User Damnentia's Avatar
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    It's mostly a game of finding the balance between:
    a. Working hard.
    b. Allowing for adequate ecovery.

    Progressing at higher level requires more and more work, and that - gets hard to recover from...and that's where it can get tricky, with all the "weird strategies" you are confused with at the moment.

    ----

    *Regarding rep-range: You can probably get very big trying to work with the heaviest weights, but when talking purely hypertrophy, what matters is how much tonnage you moved, in total.

    Intensive (Heavy work; the type you can't do for more than just a few sets) can get very taxing and fatiguing, therefore working in a higher rep-range can allow for more volume total.

    To sum it to: If you care about strength, then you obviously have to be working heavy, but if it is only hypertrophy, then you can get away with not doing necessarily doing so, and that makes things much more convenient.

    ---

    *As for splits:
    Splits are no magic;
    They are just how you choose to...split...yout work.
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  5. #5
    Registered User BDStraining's Avatar
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    - Pick a proven, progressive program (there are loads)
    - Hit your planned calories and protein consistently.
    - Work HARD, consistently.
    - be consistent for a prolonged period of time- stick to the program.
    - consistency really is KEY. It's also where most people fail and complain a program didn't work. If not consistency, then it's their work ethic that lets them down.

    That covers all the bases pretty much.

    Originally Posted by Damnentia View Post
    *Regarding rep-range: You can probably get very big trying to work with the heaviest weights, but when talking purely hypertrophy, what matters is how much tonnage you moved, in total.

    To sum it to: If you care about strength, then you obviously have to be working heavy, but if it is only hypertrophy, then you can get away with not doing necessarily doing so, and that makes things much more convenient.
    I'd disagree with both of the above points- total tonnage isn't the most important Factor. 10 x 10 with 60kg bench will not give you the same results at 5 x 8 with 150kg though the total tonnage is the same (6000kg). Intensity plays a very important role.

    If you want to grow, then you need to get stronger- the muscle needs to adapt to the stresses applied to it- if you do not continually up the stress, you will not grow. Getting stronger is the major driver in hypertrophy.
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  6. #6
    Registered User rlefebvr's Avatar
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    I think there is this misconception that people that are known for their body got there without lifting heavy.

    Probably cause they go on tv and the internet and say you don't have to lift heavy for hypertrophy.

    The problem is their understanding of heavy is not the same as most people.

    You don't need a 600 pound squat for major hypertrophy, but your also not getting there with a 200 pound squat. (for most people anyway.)

    You still have to lift heavy, just not crazy hulk heavy.

    Ive come to believe that until you reach middle to late intermediate (most of us will not reach that),
    you need to keep trying to lift as heavy as you can before you have to worry about lifting for strength vs hypertrophy
    Ron

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  7. #7
    It's ****ing Chucky! Farley1324's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by rlefebvr View Post
    I think there is this misconception that people that are known for their body got there without lifting heavy.

    Probably cause they go on tv and the internet and say you don't have to lift heavy for hypertrophy.

    The problem is their understanding of heavy is not the same as most people.

    You don't need a 600 pound squat for major hypertrophy, but your also not getting there with a 200 pound squat. (for most people anyway.)

    You still have to lift heavy, just not crazy hulk heavy.

    Ive come to believe that until you reach middle to late intermediate (most of us will not reach that),
    you need to keep trying to lift as heavy as you can before you have to worry about lifting for strength vs hypertrophy
    And people who who are known for their body have that little something extra that is a yuge game changer, so, there's always that. BRB building muscle faster than a natty just by sitting on the couch
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  8. #8
    Registered User GetReadyPhil's Avatar
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    How far could the periodization type used in fierce 5 interdemiate/advanced program? could i basically be running this for a long time to get close to my potential?

    As a bodybuilder looking to gain as much muscle as possible, how advanced periodization is really needed for good gains? could simple periodization types like linear periodization and double progression be enough to basically run forever?
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  9. #9
    Weak and foolish OldFartTom's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by GetReadyPhil View Post
    How far could the periodization type used in fierce 5 interdemiate/advanced program? could i basically be running this for a long time to get close to my potential?

    As a bodybuilder looking to gain as much muscle as possible, how advanced periodization is really needed for good gains? could simple periodization types like linear periodization and double progression be enough to basically run forever?
    https://www.powerliftingtowin.com/po...-organization/ has a video in page if you don't want to read the article.
    Faith in Jesus first and faith in squats second.
    Then other details will start to slot themselves into place.
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