***The Official New England Patriots Thread***

[camaleom]

btw: fuk u bill fuk u...

gronk howard sony white edelman was out ticket for 2 maybe 3 more years being competitive...

[Tyler2106]

I am not a fan of Arians as a coach. I think he's highly overrated. He said this after their win against the Saints:

But Bruce Arians might be more impressed with Tom Brady, the leader.

Arians has been consistently complimentary about Brady’s leadership ever since the Bucs first congregated for training camp in the summer. That trend continued Sunday when Brady helped lead Tampa Bay to a divisional-round win in New Orleans over the Saints.

But while tipping his cap to TB12, the Bucs head coach might have taken a jab at Brady’s former team.

“Consummate leader,” Arians said of Brady, per NBC Sports’ Peter King. “Has been all year. Got the air of confidence that permeates through our team every day. I allow him to be himself. Like, New England didn’t allow him to coach. I allow him to coach. I just sit back sometimes and watch.”

I'm not sure to what extent Arians means by letting him coach, but it's interesting to hear him say that. You would always see Brady on the sideline talking to players and you'd have to imagine he was doing that during practices. Might be a stupid / ignorant comment or Brady is actually getting in and coaching the team like an actual coach vs just a player sitting and commenting while the OC / HC is leading.

Just more things that frustrate us Patriot fans and why Belichick couldn't find a way to keep Brady around.

[Tyler2106]

Also, I don't think anyone has mentioned it, but Gronk says he wants to return next season with the Bucs. Anyone else wonder how badly Belichick messed this team up that Gronk would rather retire than play in New England then come out of retirement to play for more seasons with another team?

[camaleom]

when you have someone sooooo good you let them do their thing and just correct here and there...

MJ and the Bull is a great example of that... MJ was bullying everybody on the team to raise the level and Phil watched the other way... MJ was calliing for the ball and Phil look the other way... MJ BEFORE the SteveKerr play told Steve Kerr be ready cause you getting the ball... and Steve Kerr got the ball and hit the 3

I'm not sold in Bruce either but knowing when to back off is also important as a coach

[HoganIsGOAT]

when you have someone sooooo good you let them do their thing and just correct here and there...

MJ and the Bull is a great example of that... MJ was bullying everybody on the team to raise the level and Phil watched the other way... MJ was calliing for the ball and Phil look the other way... MJ BEFORE the SteveKerr play told Steve Kerr be ready cause you getting the ball... and Steve Kerr got the ball and hit the 3

I'm not sold in Bruce either but knowing when to back off is also important as a coach

Bruce is an above average but not great coach--but he handles Tom much better than Bill did.

Bill Belichick's winning percentage as a head coach WITH Tom Brady as his starting QB: 77%

Bill Belichick's winning percentage as a head coach WITHOUT Tom Brady as his starting QB: 46%

Never mind the difference with and without Brady in playoff appearances, division championships, conference championships, Super Bowl appearances and wins...etc.

The system was Tom Brady, and everyone's eyes have now been opened to that with Tom's success in Tampa Bay. A damn shame it had to happen that way, but Bill is to blame. it was his biggest failure as a coach.

[camaleom]

That was the consensus in most radio stations after Sunday performance around NE

Yes Bill is good no question about that but having a QB that 99% do the right thing and doesn't put the D in tough spot makes a TON of difference

You honestly think Kraft is not double thinking his decision of letting Tom go? how does free agents feel about coming to NE? do you think QBs will like to build a career in NE to be kicked out like they did to Tom? I'm sure some will IF the money is right but Cold weather, cheap organization and no loyalty... we better draft a good/great QB if we want to be relevant again.

I know 20 years this 20 years that but Bill without Tom was mediocre at best and this year team was exactly % wise what Bill used to have/do

[Tyler2106]

It's being reported the McDaniels is working on putting together his team for the Eagles HC position. I hope he gets it. He's been exposed multiple times now as a mediocre coach without Brady. I'd wish him the best and hope he would do well, but can't say I'd miss him.

[Tyler2106]

Unfortunate stat, but from 2011-2016 the Patriots were ranked 12th in draft value (they have a formula for value of a player where they were drafted) and over the last 5 years, we are now ranked 26th. Sooooo, that means we are going the wrong direction with our drafts and explains why we've been so disappointed the last few season with our picks.

Hopefully that starts to change moving forward because if we can't draft, good chance we don't start competing for a long time.

[Tyler2106]

McDaniels didn't get the Eagles job which means he'll be back for another season

I wonder why he isn't getting the jobs? I know he screwed over the Colts, but I feel like teams wouldn't use that against him at this point. Is he telling them he's going to bring "the Patriot Way" with him and teams don't like that? Patricia tried that and failed miserably. Maybe teams see that McDaniels isn't good unless he has Tom Brady.

[camaleom]

Unfortunate stat, but from 2011-2016 the Patriots were ranked 12th in draft value (they have a formula for value of a player where they were drafted) and over the last 5 years, we are now ranked 26th. Sooooo, that means we are going the wrong direction with our drafts and explains why we've been so disappointed the last few season with our picks.

Hopefully that starts to change moving forward because if we can't draft, good chance we don't start competing for a long time.

last few years struggle is due to bad drafting no question about that

we can't always look for value - 1sr and 2nd round pick should be for guys that are ready to play NOW, the rest yeah look for value but we need to start hitting those early rounds (specially when we don't pay big $$$$ to free agents)

McD: F'ed up big time - rich people don't like to be put on the spot like that and now without Brady making him look "genius" things are not going to change for him.

[Tyler2106]

Matt Patricia is back! Initial feelings are I dislike that, but he'll be in a new position so we'll see what he can do for us.

[GarthVader]

Can't wait for teams to be 3rd and 15 on their own 30 yard line and convert because of bend don't break.

[HoganIsGOAT]

Matt Patricia is back! Initial feelings are I dislike that, but he'll be in a new position so we'll see what he can do for us.

Awful decision. He was always very overrated.

[HoganIsGOAT]

Can't wait for teams to be 3rd and 15 on their own 30 yard line and convert because of bend don't break.

This.

[camaleom]

Awful decision. He was always very overrated.

I don't think that the "bend don't break is overrated"

they play %

not many teams/qb can play a drive perfectly...

he is here for free but I don't see him taking over the D... Bill is not going to hinder his kids development

[Tyler2106]

Boyos...do we want Matthew Stafford?

[camaleom]

dude is old, we need way too many pieces...

dude is 32 with all kind of injuries - at best he has 2 maybe 3 ok years.

I hope he goes to SF and we can get Jimmy back lol

[GarthVader]

Boyos...do we want Matthew Stafford?

He'd be a decent stop gap type of player until we can find the QB of the future.

[HoganIsGOAT]

I don't think that the "bend don't break is overrated"

they play %

not many teams/qb can play a drive perfectly...

You do understand they were able to do that because they had Tom Brady, right? That isn't a successful strategy going forward.

[Tyler2106]

Imagine letting Tom Brady go and the next season you're watching him in the Super Bowl. Players have to be questioning Belichick right now.

[camaleom]

of course BB is taking heat here... if next year they play like last year watch how more and more people are going to do the same

[Tyler2106]

Accidentally got sad Brady isn't on the team anymore and watched Super Bowl 51-53 highlights. Crazy how it feels like that was so long ago...maybe it's because it'll never happen again with Brady.

Anywho, thought it was "funny" that another ex-Patriot, Amendola, took a shot at the Patriots organization

When you see the 'Patriot Way' in the dictionary, it's got Tom Brady's picture next to it," Amendola said. "None of those coaches threw any passes. None of those coaches caught any passes. None of those coaches made any tackles. They got guys in the right position because they watch a lot of film and they spend all their time at the facility. "But Tom Brady is the 'Patriot Way,' and that's the reason why Tom Brady's in the Super Bowl right now and the Patriots aren't."

I don't think Tom Brady was the Patriot Way, but he embodied the Patriot Way to the fullest. He helped create the Patriot Way. Hard worker, dedicated and willing to do whatever for the team to help them win. He was the leader of the team for 20 years. I think players this season were still buying into the Patriot Way, but the challenge with it is you have to be winning for it to work. As the season went on and we started to really struggle, you could tell players were "phoning it in."

Tom took the hard working, dedicated and willing to do whatever to help the team win mentality to Tampa Bay and players bought in. I posted in the TB team thread how Bowles said Brady made the defense better because he worked hard and the defense didn't want to get "picked on" during practices so they worked hard to get better.

I think that's what Brady did for our entire team for 20 years. People will say he was carried by the defense at times, but he was the reason the defense improved over the course of the season. Everyone worked hard to help the team and they all fought hard to help each other.

It'll be interesting to see if we can continue this type of culture without Brady. Players who leave the Patriots always seem to say they enjoy football more on their other teams. Sad that New England doesn't seem like a place anyone wants to go play at right now. Hopefully we can make some big splashes in the off season and get people back to being excited about New England football.

[camaleom]

was MJ the bulls dynasty?

YES - because he mold that team good coaching does help no question but Players are the key (even Bill repeat this over and over again after game interviews)

[camaleom]

I think that's what Brady did for our entire team for 20 years. People will say he was carried by the defense at times, but he was the reason the defense improved over the course of the season. Everyone worked hard to help the team and they all fought hard to help each other.

you can also argue (and it has been said by TB D players) that you get better playing Tom day in day out

[Tyler2106]

I agree ^^^

It's going to be interesting if we "lose" players because they don't want to come here and play. There are a lot of other good teams that good players can go to and compete for a Super Bowl. Belichick most likely won't pay players top dollars to come here, so there isn't much incentive without us having a QB signed. That's going to be key IMO. Can we sign a good enough QB that will make a talented WR or TE come here and play. Sign Cam again and there is zero chance of that.

[GarthVader]

Guys, chill. We're not the Lions. Players will still come to New England to play.

[camaleom]

Guys, chill. We're not the Lions. Players will still come to New England to play.

as of right now player chasing rings would prob go to:
- KC: Mahommes is on his prime
- RAM: weather, coach and some cool player in the roster already
- TB: weather, goat, tax heaven, and a great roster
- GB: Rodgers, coach
- Bills, Ravens and Titans: they have some good mojo going on


The rest imho better be ready to throw money at top talent or hit the jackpot during the draft

[Tyler2106]

Guys, chill. We're not the Lions. Players will still come to New England to play.

You could be right, but right now it doesn't feel that way. I mean, we can get the players who are at the end of their career or just not great talents to come because they just want to play. But it feels like top talents aren't interested if it's us vs another team with SB hopes that offers them a contract.

Time will tell. I think if we can somehow bring in a competent QB it'll help bring in other talent.

[JUGGERNAUT1333]

You could be right, but right now it doesn't feel that way. I mean, we can get the players who are at the end of their career or just not great talents to come because they just want to play. But it feels like top talents aren't interested if it's us vs another team with SB hopes that offers them a contract.

Time will tell. I think if we can somehow bring in a competent QB it'll help bring in other talent.

I agree with you here. It's not exactly a secret that playing for the Patriots isn't the most enjoyable experience. Lots of guys went there to win. You can put up a lot when you're a yearly favorite to get to the Super Bowl and have the GOAT under center leading the team.

That isn't the case now. Players will have a hard time buying into the "Patriot Way", when you are fielding a .500 team and don't have a franchise QB. It's not like the Pats' hand out lucrative contracts either.

[GarthVader]

All I'm saying is we're just as likely as any other team in the league to attract free agent talent. I don't think players will avoid NE because of the Patriot Way. I think NE is just as attractive if not more attractive than 80% of the league. The only real issue is how much money Bill the GM is willing to spend. Great coaches attract great players. Bill is still one of the top coaches in the league and NE is a solid, well run franchise. We're not Detroit, Houston, Cleveland or Cincinnati.

Of course after this season it's gonna feel dire. Cam absolutely blew goats. We may not return to dominance but I think we can be competitive going forward.