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  1. #8131
    Registered User lolimgood's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Horse86 View Post
    I'm referring to the coins price....

    It's great its got a product and I know you are all aboard...but frankly, in crypto, I couldn't give 2 chits if a coin has a product or not. It's proven to be irrelevant, case in point. I'm here for profit, not projects.
    BAT is one of the best cryptos out there today. If you're looking for a quick pump and dump bullchit coin, this is not for you.

    If you're interested in investing in a real company with monumental potential, BAT is in a league of few.

    BAT has barely lost any value compared to others, unless you invested at the tippy top around 90 cents. But most smart people got in around 30-40 cents. Barely lost anything.
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  2. #8132
    Registered User Horse86's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by lolimgood View Post
    BAT is one of the best cryptos out there today. If you're looking for a quick pump and dump bullchit coin, this is not for you.

    If you're interested in investing in a real company with monumental potential, BAT is in a league of few.

    BAT has barely lost any value compared to others, unless you invested at the tippy top around 90 cents. But most smart people got in around 30-40 cents. Barely lost anything.
    I already know the legitness of BAT...not disputing that. Ive said it a few times here, BTC and ETH are my main main...these others are for the lottery moon shots. There is only one BTC....the rest are chit coins as far as I'm concerned. This is my sandbox. I routinely max out all my investment/retirement avenues so this is really just shot at earlier retirement....I'm not looking at a "safe bet" play or "barely lost any value" I'm here for the homerun....like the Link play I capitalized on. The smart people got on Link at .30 cents
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  3. #8133
    Registered User JuicedMayhem's Avatar
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    Everything looks like it’s about to tank
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  4. #8134
    Registered User ghostfacedup's Avatar
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    Pretty discouraging that people are starting to pump and shill their bullchit projects AGAIN; not a good sign overall for the health of the market and BTC. Don't think BTC,ETH, and the legit stuff will ever go on a massive run unless the crap is separated and ground into dust tbh. I don't believe in this rally anymore.
    Last edited by ghostfacedup; 02-07-2020 at 02:22 PM.
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  5. #8135
    Lord of the Brocean broseidon's Avatar
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    Lol the bear market has done a real number on you guys. People getting exciting that their coins are like 90% down from ATH instead of 95% doesn't mean the market isn't healthy. Everything is matching up perfectly to meme halving charts that have been around for years. Looks good to me.
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  6. #8136
    Registered User PimpMasterC's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ghostfacedup View Post
    Pretty discouraging that people are starting to pump and shill their bullchit projects AGAIN; not a good sign overall for the health of the market and BTC. Don't think BTC,ETH, and the legit stuff will ever go on a massive run unless the crap is separated and ground into dust tbh. I don't believe in this rally anymore.
    Originally Posted by broseidon View Post
    Lol the bear market has done a real number on you guys. People getting exciting that their coins are like 90% down from ATH instead of 95% doesn't mean the market isn't healthy. Everything is matching up perfectly to meme halving charts that have been around for years. Looks good to me.
    I´m good, Tezos is at an all time high. I´m 300% up
    I agree that it´s pretty concerning that so much crap is pumping, like Tron and NEM
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  7. #8137
    Registered User knightofday's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ghostfacedup View Post
    Pretty discouraging that people are starting to pump and shill their bullchit projects AGAIN; not a good sign overall for the health of the market and BTC. Don't think BTC,ETH, and the legit stuff will ever go on a massive run unless the crap is separated and ground into dust tbh. I don't believe in this rally anymore.
    As an outsider looking in that barely follows, its looking pretty bleak imo. I go into crypto threads for lulz sometimes, always a few hardcore people painting the rosiest picture imaginable when damn ner everything is way down from all time highs. IMO those are the people that lost their ass on a coin or three and are trying to gin up support so the can exit a little bit closer to where they entered haha

    Posters always say "Im good, im up 200% on X. Im good, Im still up 300% on Y" but the dont mention that they lost a chit ton of money on other coins, technically true but theyre just trying to save face.

    The typical cylce seems to be: early adopters hit homerun-make 1-500%, they got over confident and reinvested in other coins and diversified, coins all tanked and they lost most if not all gains.
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  8. #8138
    Incel Parkerscott's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ghostfacedup View Post
    Pretty discouraging that people are starting to pump and shill their bullchit projects AGAIN; not a good sign overall for the health of the market and BTC. Don't think BTC,ETH, and the legit stuff will ever go on a massive run unless the crap is separated and ground into dust tbh. I don't believe in this rally anymore.
    I was thinking this as well. Go over to r/cc and people are back to pumping things like raven,icon,litecoin,iota etc etc. Coins that have basically done nothing in the past two years and will continue to do nothing. You would think the bear market gave people some time to thoroughly review just what it is they invested in. The bull market was just about buying first and asking questions later. A rumor of a rumor was literally all it took.
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  9. #8139
    Registered User PimpMasterC's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by knightofday View Post
    As an outsider looking in that barely follows, its looking pretty bleak imo. I go into crypto threads for lulz sometimes, always a few hardcore people painting the rosiest picture imaginable when damn ner everything is way down from all time highs. IMO those are the people that lost their ass on a coin or three and are trying to gin up support so the can exit a little bit closer to where they entered haha

    Posters always say "Im good, im up 200% on X. Im good, Im still up 300% on Y" but the dont mention that they lost a chit ton of money on other coins, technically true but theyre just trying to save face.

    The typical cylce seems to be: early adopters hit homerun-make 1-500%, they got over confident and reinvested in other coins and diversified, coins all tanked and they lost most if not all gains.
    I agree. Fortunately for me, I invested in crypto after the big crash, and tezos is my only significant investment. There will be a winner crowned in crypto, and that winner has not be crowned yet. (protip). Bitcoin is not a true winner yet, since it has failed to be mass adopted and it´s stuck in old slow tech. In the long run, there will be a clear winner, and all the chitcoins will die. The main use case for crypto is being money, and btc has not succeeded at that. The winner is most likely out there right now, the one to overthrow btc, and it has not been crowned yet.
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  10. #8140
    Registered User ghostfacedup's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by PimpMasterC View Post
    The main use case for crypto is being money, and btc has not succeeded at that.
    It's actually better, in some ways. Crypto likely isn't gonna be crap unless it's btc
    Last edited by ghostfacedup; 02-08-2020 at 10:51 AM.
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  11. #8141
    Registered User PimpMasterC's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ghostfacedup View Post
    It's actually better, in some ways. Crypto likely isn't gonna be crap unless it's btc
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  12. #8142
    Registered User Matty5RA's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by knightofday View Post
    As an outsider looking in that barely follows, its looking pretty bleak imo. I go into crypto threads for lulz sometimes, always a few hardcore people painting the rosiest picture imaginable when damn ner everything is way down from all time highs. IMO those are the people that lost their ass on a coin or three and are trying to gin up support so the can exit a little bit closer to where they entered haha

    Posters always say "Im good, im up 200% on X. Im good, Im still up 300% on Y" but the dont mention that they lost a chit ton of money on other coins, technically true but theyre just trying to save face.

    The typical cylce seems to be: early adopters hit homerun-make 1-500%, they got over confident and reinvested in other coins and diversified, coins all tanked and they lost most if not all gains.
    This is why I’m so glad I only really put money into BTC. I’m in profit thanks to some smart trading over the last 2 years, not mega profit, but enough to make the headaches worthwhile.
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  13. #8143
    Registered User inb4everything's Avatar
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    Weekend ltc gains...nice.
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  14. #8144
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    Originally Posted by PimpMasterC View Post
    There will be a winner crowned in crypto, and that winner has not be crowned yet. (protip). Bitcoin is not a true winner yet, since it has failed to be mass adopted and it´s stuck in old slow tech. In the long run, there will be a clear winner, and all the chitcoins will die. The main use case for crypto is being money, and btc has not succeeded at that. The winner is most likely out there right now, the one to overthrow btc, and it has not been crowned yet.

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  15. #8145
    I ain't no bitch lowstrife's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by knightofday View Post
    The typical cylce seems to be: early adopters hit homerun-make 1-500%, they got over confident and reinvested in other coins and diversified, coins all tanked and they lost most if not all gains.
    This is broadly true. People are not ready for the bear markets post-bubble. Lot of unrealized gains and hype, but once the music stops, people keep averaging down and eventually eat a lot of ****. The last year has been accumulation time for me.

    Early adopters hit a lot more than 2-6x.
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  16. #8146
    Registered Republican Omnivium's Avatar
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    Ayyyy back over 10k
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  17. #8147
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    10k boys
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  18. #8148
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    3 things are certain in life; death, taxes and ads.

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    But also putting $100 every week into btc and eth
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  19. #8149
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    btc.dominance falling. Wow are we finally going to see another alt season - Maybe it will give us one last chance to get rid of our alt coins.\


    edit: nvm! ETH btc still near resistance

    Also arthur hayes tweeted 20k soon.
    Last edited by BDSMBBW; 02-09-2020 at 01:31 AM.
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  20. #8150
    Lettuce be reality Bluestar92's Avatar
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    I honestly have no idea where this market is going between now and halving. I'm 100% in on USDC now
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  21. #8151
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    Originally Posted by Gringo12 View Post
    3 things are certain in life; death, taxes and ads.

    BAT crew


    But also putting $100 every week into btc and eth

    Brave/BAT is about to start stepping on the gas. Once publisher ads and the self service dashboard are ready, its all about scale and getting to profitability. User growth has been about 12% per month and ad buys have been doubling. Brave/BAT will probably start coming up in more and more conversations. I think Brave is getting pretty close to a tipping point and its something that shouldnt be ignored.
    lol at chromecels and firefoxcels

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  22. #8152
    Registered User Serenadium's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by PimpMasterC View Post
    …………..
    I will address each section of the copy pasted white paper:

    Mining Power Concentration

    This is one of the weakest arguments and has been addressed ad-nausem.

    1. A miner or pool with 51% hash rate is disincentivized from hacking the network. They have invested a significant sum in terms of energy costs, hardware costs and they most likely own a significant amount of POW coins. Why would they attack the network and devalue their own investments. This is moronic.
    2. A miner or pool that launches a 51% on the network will need to pay a significant amount of energy cost and forgo mining opportunity cost to make a ‘double spend’ attack. The current hash rate of the bitcoin network is 106 million terahashes per second. To double spend on a transaction from a block even 20-30 blocks old will cost a SIGNIFICANT amount, all for what? to double spend an extra $10,000 USD and be booted from the network?. Meanwhile they could have mined for actual bitcoin.
    3. Mining pools self regulate. In the past there has been mining pools that approached a 51% hash rate, however, the miners left the pool to join others in a perceived interest for a ‘decentralised’ network.
    4. In the extremely unlikely event all of the above fails, and a significant 51% takes place, Bitcoin will just hard fork from the date of the hack and the impacted users will recognize the fork as the ‘real’ chain.
    5. Practically all POS/DAG coins will have 51% currency ownership among a few users. This is far more centralised than Bitcoin.

    Bad incentives

    “Unfortunately, there is reason to expect that the demand for transactions will fall to very low levels. People are likely to make use of off-chain transaction mechanisms via trusted third parties, particularly for small amounts, in order to alleviate the need to wait for confirmations. Payment processors may only need to clear with each other infrequently. This scenario is not only economically likely, it seems necessary given the relatively low transaction rate supported by Bitcoin. Since blockchain transaction will have to compete with off-chain transaction, the amount spent on transactions will approach its cost, which, given modern infrastructure, shouldbe close to zero.”

    This seems to be the crux of the argument but doesn’t make any sense. The author talks about what I presume to be the lightning network then throughput on the main chain?. It’s very poorly written particularly the last sentence.

    Cost

    This section shocked me. If the person who authored this has any kind of development role at Tezos, I would be convinced it is a flat-out scam – there are a number of statements that are either wrong or intentionally misleading.

    The part about POW increasing costs to users without increasing profits to miners – Wut? Miners pick transactions out of the pool based on the fee that is set by the user. Miners also setup their business based on electricity which varies significantly around the world. My mind fragmented reading this sentence.

    The part about ghash.io – see mining centralisation above.

    The part about real economic goods being removed from the economy for POW mining – except POW mining is a real economic good given the transaction fee guarantees your transaction on a secure, decentralised, immutable, censorship resistant ledger.

    Control

    “Proof of work system puts the miners, not the stakeholders, in charge”
    Wrong. Miners create blocks on the blockchain. Nodes maintain the ledger (i.e. record all transactions and ensure consistency within the network).

    “This poses a potential conflict of interest: a majority of miners could decide to hold the blockchain hostage until stakeholders consent to a protocol forkincreasing the mining rewards; more generally, they will hold onto the hugely wasteful system that empowers them longer than is economically beneficial for users.”

    This will never happen. Miners are not incentivised to devalue a network they’ve invested capital and energy costs on (imagine mining BTC with your hardware that you used previously to try make BTC worthless).

    Even in some weird universe this happens, Bitcoin will fork and the users will recognize the former chain as the ‘real’ chain. The real chain will still carry its value and miners would mine on that network (why would you want to mine a worthless forked cryptocurrency?)

    Bitcoin Mine is shutdown

    This is irrelevant. Bitcoin has 106 terahashes/s. Even if it loses 95% of its hash rate, it is FAR FAR FAR more secure than any other cryptocurrency.

    https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate

    Also free market forces come into play. If there is a major miner that leaves the market, there would be more block rewards split amongst a lower number of miners and creates new incentives for miners that were on the borderline to enter.

    yes, im a tezos fanboy and think arthur is one of the smartest guys in crypto

    Never take advice from anyone as gospel. All advice should be critically assessed by yourself. If you take other people’s word for things, you leave yourself open to the logical fallacy known as ‘genetic fallacy’.

    Just because a person is smart (or you perceive them to be smart), doesn’t make what they say to be correct.
    Last edited by Serenadium; 02-09-2020 at 02:22 AM.
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    Originally Posted by Bluestar92 View Post
    I honestly have no idea where this market is going between now and halving. I'm 100% in on USDC now
    #free6ix9ine
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  24. #8154
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    Originally Posted by Serenadium View Post
    I will address each section of the copy pasted white paper:
    Everything he pointed out is a weakness in POW. It may not be a problem for btc right now, but it could become one. Mining pools have big weaknesses, even tho attacking the network dont make much sense, but humans don´t make much sense. No, not all pos coins have 51% ownership to a few people, thats wrong. i agree that most pos chain have this problem tho, and btc is the most decentalized for now.


    The miners are in control. No, maybe they don´t have an intencive to harm the network, but they are still in control and could theoretically hold the network hostage if they wanted too.


    I don´t follow what he says blindly, I agree with what he is writing, but his writing style is odd. What is it you don´t understand about off chain transactions becoming more attractive? It´s a likely scenario and a weakness of POW. There have been written academic papers on why Block rewards are necessary. It´s not sure 100% it will happen, most things he writes aren´t. But everything he is writing are legit scenarios of what might happen.

    If one bitcoin mine can be shutdown that easy, it won´t be a problem to shut down 200 bitcoin mines if the government decides to. And even if the gap can be filled, it will still be a problem.

    As for Arthur, he is very smart (tezos founder). He has won several international medals in informatics and has a very impressive background. He has a background in mathematics, computer science and economics, the three most important fields when it comes to creating a crypto currency. He forsee the problems that btc might have in the future. He has a extremely good economic understanding, unlike satoshi and other crypto founders. Yeah, I think satoshi had a good, but pretty shallow economic understanding, but I might be wrong. (I´m currently doing a bachelor in econ, so not an expert myself tho, but I see weaknesses in the btc econ model). I dont have a good knowledge of computer science tho, so maybe I´m overlooking some things. I choose to value the opinion of people that do, but at the same time not follow it blindly.

    This is not a very strong response from me, but I won´t be wasting time trying to change your mind beacuse we have two very different ways of thinking about the subject. I think bitcoin and proof of work is good, but I think a decentralized enough POS can be better. BTC lack on chain governance, speed and privacy tho, which I think will be a necessity for a a succesfull crypto long term. The huge energy consumption is also a problem. You bring up good arguments and some valid point, but I don´t think you see that these are still problems that might happen in pow, even tho some of them are very unlikely.

    I recommend you learn more about tezos, even tho you don´t agree with what the founder has written in that position paper. He is a very smart man, and different view perspectives are always good. Tezos is one of the few promising pos networks imo. Both pos and pow have advantages and disadvantages, so i guess it comes down to what u value.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zl5Ice0z9oU&t=745s
    Last edited by PimpMasterC; 02-09-2020 at 05:31 AM.
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  25. #8155
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    WTC is up 100% in last 1 week.
















    Its also down 98% overall from ath, just need to pump 5100% more to reach ath.
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    Originally Posted by iifymbro View Post
    If it can't hold where it is rn, green box is where I'ma punt a margin long setup and probably dump a bit of fiat in. Macro swing pocket retrace, .786 from the 5k level, horizontal s/r area, 50MA weekly all right there.


    If that area fails (and it definitely could, lets be real tea this looks weak af right now), 200MA is gunna be coming up right into that 5K area, that's the spot to go pretty balls deep with the fiat injection, though it could be capitulation at that point and wick down to the 4k level it never re-tested on the initial break but for long term fiat buys that doesn't matter.


    Any of you boyos dump some fiat in or play longs there?

    Didn't get my 200MA revisit for additional heavy fiat penor injection, but ya never know..... maybe we'll get one last gift from the gods in a final shakeout to end this bear tyranny


    **MFC**
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    Originally Posted by iifymbro View Post

    Didn't get my 200MA revisit for additional heavy fiat penor injection, but ya never know..... maybe we'll get one last gift from the gods in a final shakeout to end this bear tyranny

    9.6k weekly resistance most likely going down - This could end up being a fantastic bull trap or a legit bull run. All those unfilled CME gaps at 8k's - 9k..

    Here's something i found regarding CME gaps that you guys will find interesting.

    https://marketsscience.com/gap_study.html
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    You guys bought Tezos right? There is not a single more bullish chart or crypto in the market right now
    Last edited by PimpMasterC; 02-09-2020 at 08:14 AM.
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    Originally Posted by PimpMasterC View Post
    You guys bought Tezos right? There is not a single more bullish chart or crypto in the market right now
    It's a solid project in terms of governance and smart contracts but one caveat: they don't have a scaling solution. They're looking at L2 for their scaling solution. Head dev already said they're not gonna go the sharding route. We all know how L2 worked for ETH or BTC so there's that. No scaling solution=no future imo. What's the point of doing all the rest if they're not gonna have a scaling solution? Might as well keep using ETH then.

    My guess is people don't have a clue what they're buying, they just follow the herd. They just see the shiny new mysterious staking coin on Coinbase and buy it.
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    Originally Posted by darkeminence View Post
    It's a solid project in terms of governance and smart contracts but one caveat: they don't have a scaling solution. They're looking at L2 for their scaling solution. Head dev already said they're not gonna go the sharding route. We all know how L2 worked for ETH or BTC so there's that. No scaling solution=no future imo. What's the point of doing all the rest if they're not gonna have a scaling solution? Might as well keep using ETH then.

    My guess is people don't have a clue what they're buying, they just follow the herd. They just see the shiny new mysterious staking coin on Coinbase and buy it.
    You obviously haven´t been keeping up with the project. Nomadic labs have developed a brand new consensus algorithm called tenderbake. It will offer immediate finality and scale tezos. It might be implemeted eoy if voted on.

    "We have recently announced a technical report 10 on Tenderbake, a classical BFT style consensus algorithm inspired by Tendermint and motivated by Tezos. This work is a joint effort with CEA List 6." Some very compotent people have developed this, and it will likely make tezos a lot faster without relying on second layer. Think tendermint´s 10 000 tps. And btw, tezos is still quite a lot faster than eth in it´s current form, almost twice as fast.
    They have been working on finding a new faster consensus for tezos, for quite a while now. So, tezos will scale soon, as well as sapling for privacy. Exciting times

    btw, tezos has no "head dev"
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