Abs need more definition, continue to cut a little more before lean bulk?

[puthsardarade]

Hi,

I've been cutting for around 10 months, I have reduced my bodyfat from around 18-19% to 10-11% (according to different PT skinfold measurements).

My first goal was to have a flat stomach and abs defined, then to build lean muscle - ideally chest, arms and then legs if I had to prioritise and was able to influence this in anyway.

I am 41 this year, 5'9 and weigh between 61-62kg.
My waist measurement is around 29.5 inches around the belly button and around 30-30.5 inches below the belly.

I have been training 7 days a week and recently I have been doing strength training and then finishing up with a 30 min hiit class. Due to all the classes I have done my stamina is very good much better than when I was 20 and my strength is almost as good as it was when I was bulking around 1 year ago.

Calories I hit around 1800-2100 on most good days. my weight over the last 10 days appears to move down and then move back up a little between 61-62kg so I'm unsure if I am gaining muscle, losing fat etc.

Hoping someone can help with the following questions:

1) Does my bodyfat seem correct around 10-11%? Looking at the pictures, abs appear better when further away then up close they do not look very defined?

2) My initial goals were to have a flat stomach and abs defined before starting to eat at a calorie surplus - do I need to continue to cut and reduce my calories a little more to achieve further weight loss to achieve these goals?

3) Advise on building lean muscle, maintaining flat stomach and achieving better abs definition?

4) Should I consider switching to a HST routine? Any program recommendations which will allow me to increase muscle mass within 12 weeks relatively quickly if I am exercising properly and eating the right amount?

A year ago when I was eating at a calorie surplus I appeared to look bigger but my belly also grew a little, given that I have spent 10 months working hard to cut I am little reluctant to start too early or start eating too many calories too soon for this reason, so any advise from anyone that has been through this would be appreciated. Also as I am getting older I find myself working out a lot harder and more often as I am eager to reach my goals before I lose the age battle, presently I think I am winning as I feel great.

Thanks in advance

[Dorich]

No need to cut further.

Just bewlk.

[jinda628]

That's like 136 lbs for a 5'9".
You need to start bulking bro.

[puthsardarade]

That's like 136 lbs for a 5'9".
You need to start bulking bro.

I know weight seems very low, but my strength has returned and I have the stamina as well.
But need to have abs defined more and worried about the belly getting bigger.
From what I've been told to have my abs more visible I need to lose my bodyfat and by increasing calories I will put on fat and muscle but my abs are not likely to look any better?

[spradish]

You people and your freaking abs.

[JeremyM07201978]

Your abs appear pretty well defined. If you want to lose more body fat, you most likely have to bulk and add mass/increase metabolism, and then cut again.

You may be chasing a look that is only sustainable for short periods with tremendous dedication...which is fine if that's what you want to do, but 10-11% BF (which does appear accurate) is quite an accomplishment.

Make sure you know your goals and you are setting new ones once you've reached them....flat stomach, ab definition...check.

[AaronCF]

OP, don’t take this personally- it’s directed at several posts I’ve seen as of late.

This is a BODYBUILDING site. Why on earth are so many people wanting to lose and lose more weight so the abs are visible and so hell bent on NOT bulking to get there? If you put 5+lbs of mass across your upper body I think it would your abs pop a lot more. Your body fat is crazy low. Find your sweet spot with your calories so you gain slowly, as to not put on additional fat.

[xsquid99]

OP, don’t take this personally- it’s directed at several posts I’ve seen as of late.

This is a BODYBUILDING site. Why on earth are so many people wanting to lose and lose more weight so the abs are visible and so hell bent on NOT bulking to get there? If you put 5+lbs of mass across your upper body I think it would your abs pop a lot more. Your body fat is crazy low. Find your sweet spot with your calories so you gain slowly, as to not put on additional fat.

^^^^ Truth...

[Tommy W.]

You people and your freaking abs.

Right?
It's like they're the only muscle on the body. Everything centers around the abs too many times when just overall symmetry and balance are much more important.

OP you look good. Time to start adding mass. If you lean out more you'll just lose the added leanness when you start adding mass so there is no point in cutting further. You'll have sharper abs for a very short time and it isn't worth it

[puthsardarade]

Your abs appear pretty well defined. If you want to lose more body fat, you most likely have to bulk and add mass/increase metabolism, and then cut again.

You may be chasing a look that is only sustainable for short periods with tremendous dedication...which is fine if that's what you want to do, but 10-11% BF (which does appear accurate) is quite an accomplishment.

Make sure you know your goals and you are setting new ones once you've reached them....flat stomach, ab definition...check.

Thanks, that's helpful. My calories have actually increased over the last few days naturally as I've felt more hungry due to the workouts.
2200-2400 from Saturday which I guess I will know from any weekly weight gain if it's maintenance or just right for lean bulking.

I had been Intermittent fasting as well for 15-16 hours and working out just before the end of this and then eating straight after. It didn't seem to affect my strength training and it is supposed to be effective at burning any fat and keeping calories under control so perhaps I may continue this most days?

I understand this is a bodybuilding forum so I was fully expecting most responses to be you need to bulk even if I had more bodyfat.

Any advise on the other questions which I asked:

3) Advise on building lean muscle, maintaining flat stomach and achieving better abs definition?

4) Should I consider switching to a HST routine? Any program recommendations which will allow me to increase muscle mass within 12 weeks relatively quickly if I am exercising properly and eating the right amount?

Have a holiday planned in 12 weeks so would be good to have some muscle put on before that which is a nice target for me to focus on next.

[Spanishdream]

3) Advise on building lean muscle, maintaining flat stomach and achieving better abs definition?

4) Should I consider switching to a HST routine? Any program recommendations which will allow me to increase muscle mass within 12 weeks relatively quickly if I am exercising properly and eating the right amount?

My advice would be to spend some time reading the stickies in Nutrition, Losing Fat and choosing a good routine while you're at it from Workout Programs.

[Tommy W.]

I had been Intermittent fasting as well for 15-16 hours and working out just before the end of this and then eating straight after. It didn't seem to affect my strength training and it is supposed to be effective at burning any fat and keeping calories under control so perhaps I may continue this most days?



3) Advise on building lean muscle, maintaining flat stomach and achieving better abs definition?

No real benefit to IF from a fatloss standpoint provided weekly calories are the same. It's good if you like a bigger meal later and that's really about it. As far as maintaining a flat stomach while adding mass that's from dialing in your calories to be in a surplus small enough to where fat gain is minimal. You'll build better abs while adding mass however they won't show more definition until your next cutting cycle

[sunsean]

OP, we are very similar. I'm also 5'9, and before I started really bulking up I cut down to super lean levels, I was about 140lb at my leanest if I remember, and was super cut, maybe had a bit more muscle than you...anyway, it feels great getting that lean, but you have to realize that a) it's not sustainable long term at that bodyweight; and b) you have to let go of the abs to put on some muscle...I was where you are about 7 or 8 years ago, and let me tell you, I'm now 160lb around 10% bf after cutting the last couple months and feel and look way better than at I did at the low bodyweight.

As everyone else is saying, adding some muscle will do more for your physique than losing another pound of fat.

[puthsardarade]

OP, we are very similar. I'm also 5'9, and before I started really bulking up I cut down to super lean levels, I was about 140lb at my leanest if I remember, and was super cut, maybe had a bit more muscle than you...anyway, it feels great getting that lean, but you have to realize that a) it's not sustainable long term at that bodyweight; and b) you have to let go of the abs to put on some muscle...I was where you are about 7 or 8 years ago, and let me tell you, I'm now 160lb around 10% bf after cutting the last couple months and feel and look way better than at I did at the low bodyweight.

As everyone else is saying, adding some muscle will do more for your physique than losing another pound of fat.

That's impressive. You started a lot younger than me.
Believe me I don't enjoy having to eat so little and resist food.

I have already started on lean bulking over the last few days with the calories I've been eating - was just keen on having re-assurances that it's the correct move.

Should I consider switching to a HST routine? Any program recommendations which will allow me to increase muscle mass within 12 weeks relatively quickly if I am exercising properly and eating the right amount?

Have a holiday planned in 12 weeks so would be good to have some muscle put on before that which is a nice target for me to focus on next.

[sunsean]

That's impressive. You started a lot younger than me.
Believe me I don't enjoy having to eat so little and resist food.

I have already started on lean bulking over the last few days with the calories I've been eating - was just keen on having re-assurances that it's the correct move.

Should I consider switching to a HST routine? Any program recommendations which will allow me to increase muscle mass within 12 weeks relatively quickly if I am exercising properly and eating the right amount?

Have a holiday planned in 12 weeks so would be good to have some muscle put on before that which is a nice target for me to focus on next.

What are your major lifts at right now?

Muscle gain has a terminal rate, meaning a point at which you cannot gain more muscle, only fat. Lifting and eating more than advised won't result in faster muscle gain, just fat. You need adequate stimulation, rest, recovery, and proper nutrition to grow muscle. By all means get in the best shape possible for your holiday, but also realize that you won't accomplish any great transformation in that time frame. Building muscle takes years, not weeks.

If you already have a solid lifting history, then you can train however you feel works best for you. If you're a relative newbie to lifting, I'd recommend a novice program like Fierce 5.

[puthsardarade]

What are your major lifts at right now?

Muscle gain has a terminal rate, meaning a point at which you cannot gain more muscle, only fat. Lifting and eating more than advised won't result in faster muscle gain, just fat. You need adequate stimulation, rest, recovery, and proper nutrition to grow muscle. By all means get in the best shape possible for your holiday, but also realize that you won't accomplish any great transformation in that time frame. Building muscle takes years, not weeks.

If you already have a solid lifting history, then you can train however you feel works best for you. If you're a relative newbie to lifting, I'd recommend a novice program like Fierce 5.

I had been training 7 days a week although that was usually limited to 45 mins strength workout followed by 30 mins of a hiit class of some kind.

Bench Press - I could do around 68kg - 4 reps
Shoulder Press Seated - 28kg each arm - 4 reps
Standing Bicep Curl - 20kg - 6 reps per arm
Deadlifts - 100kg - 4 reps

So would you recommend HST / GVT or something else?

You mentioned adequate stimulation - what did you mean by that?

I was planning to cut down on my gym sessions to around 4 times a week.

In addition to gym I planned to do swimming, badminton and Muay thai once a week and from what I understand I should also continue doing hiit classes but after my strength program?

Would my gains be limited if I did the above activities on the same day as a gym session?
How often should I do a 30 min hiit class? Can I do one after each strength workout or would I be potentially losing any gains?

Thanks

[sunsean]

I’d recommend a simple lifting routine with progression. Again, Fierce 5 is good. As far as all the extra cardio activity, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with cardio in general, but just keep in mind to build muscle you need surplus calories, and all of that extra activity means you’ll have to eat more. Decide what your priorities are and design your plan around that. If you want to bulk up you may have to ease back on some other activities while doing so.

[CommitmentRulz]

I’d recommend a simple lifting routine with progression. Again, Fierce 5 is good. As far as all the extra cardio activity, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with cardio in general, but just keep in mind to build muscle you need surplus calories, and all of that extra activity means you’ll have to eat more. Decide what your priorities are and design your plan around that. If you want to bulk up you may have to ease back on some other activities while doing so.

This ^^^^.

OP, prioritize weights over cardio every time. A good program with a written progression (and reset) scheme is the way to go.

[Tommy W.]

If abs are a big priority plan on including a good amount of direct work to your program

[EjnarKolinkar]

You'll have sharper abs for a very short time and it isn't worth it

Oooooh, look at that^

So what you are saying is that losing the last few pounds will be a load of work? Much more work than losing the initial pounds on a diet. After which if someone is planning to gain some weight the added effort will be high and the return low and short lived?

[Tommy W.]

Oooooh, look at that^

So what you are saying is that losing the last few pounds will be a load of work? Much more work than losing the initial pounds on a diet. After which if someone is planning to gain some weight the added effort will be high and the return low and short lived?

Haha much more eloquently said