What's the point in lean bulking if...

[Ihave2PHDs]

For one, take a beginner who will be able to gain 2lbs of LBM each month for the year and have him gain the exact amount in body weight. Now, in a perfect world this individual's 2lb gain in weight would be 100% LBM, however this isn't the case realistically. So now this thought brings me to my question of what benefit there is in lean bulking if all one would be doing is delaying the inevitable? From what I've read around here the average ratio of muscle to fat gain is 1:1 given you aren't gaining excessive weight. By this logic, the beginner gaining 2lbs of BW a month would yield a gain of only 1lb LBM, which in the long-run only means that he isn't gaining less fat than the beginner who puts on 3-4lbs of BW monthly. The whole reasoning behind my question is that if one's goal were to stay lean (8-12% BF) year-round whilst gaining muscle then such a goal would be unrealistic in the long term as lean bulking for say 6 months will inevitably put them at a higher BF%.

In the end, the person who bulks slightly aggressively will reach their goals faster at the cost of seeing fat gain sooner, nevertheless, the lean bunker will come to the same result maybe months later.

[AdamWW]

For one, take a beginner who will be able to gain 2lbs of LBM each month for the year and have him gain the exact amount in body weight. Now, in a perfect world this individual's 2lb gain in weight would be 100% LBM, however this isn't the case realistically. So now this thought brings me to my question of what benefit there is in lean bulking if all one would be doing is delaying the inevitable? From what I've read around here the average ratio of muscle to fat gain is 1:1 given you aren't gaining excessive weight. By this logic, the beginner gaining 2lbs of BW a month would yield a gain of only 1lb LBM, which in the long-run only means that he isn't gaining less fat than the beginner who puts on 3-4lbs of BW monthly. The whole reasoning behind my question is that if one's goal were to stay lean (8-12% BF) year-round whilst gaining muscle then such a goal would be unrealistic in the long term as lean bulking for say 6 months will inevitably put them at a higher BF%.

In the end, the person who bulks slightly aggressively will reach their goals faster at the cost of seeing fat gain sooner, nevertheless, the lean bunker will come to the same result maybe months later.

First off, you don't gain an even 2lb of LBM per month... it slowly decreases as time goes by. Could be 4lbs the first month, 3 lbs in month 2-5, 1lb from 6-8, etc.... over the course of a PERFECT year, the amount of lean tissue (not LBM, but actual muscle tissue) ends up being 20 or so pounds, give or take.

I don't know where you're getting a 1:1 ratio from... i've never heard of that number at all, and it's probably pointless to try and bother figure it out.

I'm not really following the rest of your post though... perhaps it's how you wrote it, but i'll say this...

If you're a newbie, you can HOPE to gain that optimal 20lb of muscle at best in the first year.

If you're eating in a 'leaner' surplus of say 300 calories over maintenance, you'll gain on average about 2.5lb per month in non-lean tissue. However, as you gain muscle, your TDEE will also increase, so your 'old surplus' slowly becomes your 'new maintenance'.

As a result, the same 300 calories surplus eventually won't net as much hypothetical fat gain as it would have early on.... this is likely why some weight gain stalls, in which case people bump calories again, and at the end of a year it's no longer a 1:1 fat/muscle gain.

Does that make sense?

[Mikeez0]

^.
Exactly this. I would add that 1:1 muscle to fat gain ratio comes exactly from gaining 1lb a week.

[Ihave2PHDs]

^.
Exactly this. I would add that 1:1 muscle to fat gain ratio comes exactly from gaining 1lb a week.

I just don't see how it's possible for one to gain more lbm than fat tissue when gaining half a pound a week. The end result of gaining 2lbs a month would theoretically yield a 1lb lbm gain.

[SuffolkPunch]

OP, you may be reading too much into information you've seen about rates of LBM gain.

There is huge variation between people for one thing. Yes, it's conceivable that someone could be leaving gains on the table only gaining 2lbs a month - BUT based on what we know, they would have to be an extreme outlier or a drug user.

Also, note that muscle gain is not purely a function of extra calories... it's possible to gain muscle in a mild calorie deficit. In this case, stored bodyfat is being used as part of the fuel for the bodies growth processes.

It's better to think of LBM gain / loss as a continuum...

1. Protein synthesis - the building of new tissue
2. Protein breakdown - the breakdown of tissue

More calories, more protein and more weight training tend to raise the opportunities for protein synthesis (up to a point).
Less calories and less protein and (possibly) unproductive activity will increase protein breakdown.

So whether you gain or lose mass is a balancing act between the two which may or may not require a surplus in different individuals...

Fat gained or lost is more simple - just the net calorie balance over time (including any needed for muscle gain processes).

[chamelious]

Very quickly into your lifting career, "bulking" becomes more about "definitely not being in a deficit" than it does anything else.

[Plateauplower]

The longer you are in a calorie surplus the better. Calorie surplus + lifting = getting stronger. Getting stronger in calorie surplus = more muscle.

You can be more agresssive with a surplus, and I have found I get stronger faster with a slightly higher surplus, but it’s at the cost of more fat gain and needing to stop the surplus sooner. 6 one way, half a dozen the other. Several paths to the same destination.

If your intermediate or beyond, it’s my opinion your better off to use a little more moderation and take it slower on the way up since a higher surplus simply results in faster fat gain. BY definition a surplus is anabolic an$ a deficit is catabolic so you are better off spending more time overall in an anabolic state.

[Mrpb]

For one, take a beginner who will be able to gain 2lbs of LBM each month for the year and have him gain the exact amount in body weight. Now, in a perfect world this individual's 2lb gain in weight would be 100% LBM, however this isn't the case realistically. So now this thought brings me to my question of what benefit there is in lean bulking if all one would be doing is delaying the inevitable? From what I've read around here the average ratio of muscle to fat gain is 1:1 given you aren't gaining excessive weight. By this logic, the beginner gaining 2lbs of BW a month would yield a gain of only 1lb LBM, which in the long-run only means that he isn't gaining less fat than the beginner who puts on 3-4lbs of BW monthly. The whole reasoning behind my question is that if one's goal were to stay lean (8-12% BF) year-round whilst gaining muscle then such a goal would be unrealistic in the long term as lean bulking for say 6 months will inevitably put them at a higher BF%.

In the end, the person who bulks slightly aggressively will reach their goals faster at the cost of seeing fat gain sooner, nevertheless, the lean bunker will come to the same result maybe months later.

Put 2 people a on a surplus that makes them gain 2 pounds per month, one person can gain only LBM no fat, another can gain 70% fat, even though they do everything the same.

This is why you have to find out what works for you. And you can only do that by experimenting.