Nutrition vs Calories

[MasonTeggen]

What’s more important in bodybuilding.... nutrition or calories?

[Mikeez0]

Fuel or gasoline?

[gbullock32]

Fuel or gasoline?

Give me fuel, give me fire, give me that which I desire!

[SuffolkPunch]

They are related. Perhaps frame your question a bit better if you want sensible responses OP.

[rufretic]

I think op means which is more important, origin of calories or number of calories. For example, if trying to gain muscle, would it be better to get 3000 calories from unhealthy foods vs 2000 calories from healthy foods. I think it is a difficult question to answer and I guess it depends on your goals. If you just want to gain weight then get your calories however you can but if you care about overall health then stick to healthy calories.

[rhadam]

I think op means which is more important, origin of calories or number of calories. For example, if trying to gain muscle, would it be better to get 3000 calories from unhealthy foods vs 2000 calories from healthy foods. I think it is a difficult question to answer and I guess it depends on your goals. If you just want to gain weight then get your calories however you can but if you care about overall health then stick to healthy calories.

Calories aren't inherently healthy or unhealthy.

[SuffolkPunch]

I think op means which is more important, origin of calories or number of calories. For example, if trying to gain muscle, would it be better to get 3000 calories from unhealthy foods vs 2000 calories from healthy foods. I think it is a difficult question to answer and I guess it depends on your goals. If you just want to gain weight then get your calories however you can but if you care about overall health then stick to healthy calories.

Calories are a unit of energy. Both nutrient rich and nutrient poor foods have both high and low calorie densities.

"healthy" is a word that should only be applied to a person, not a diet and certainly not an individual food.

[Plateauplower]

If one wants to look like a body builder it’s going to require some dietary restraint to achieve and maintain lower bodyfat levels. In that case, choosing nutrient dense food such as meats, veg, fruit, etc is going to help to hit micros at the necessary caloric levels which are important for both overall health and performance by preventing micro nutrient deficiencies. Ie not many bodybuilders are going to be living off of hot dogs, and Dairy Queen blizzards.

If you want to just “get big and strong” you will be eating a lot more. Calorie surplus is a major component in strength gains. To some extent the more food you eat, the less likely that you will need to worry about missing micro nutrients provided you are eating a varied diet. There is more room for Low nutrient calories, and in some cases those foods might be what is required for some to hit their surplus.

Overall it comes down to individual goals and the person. Macro & Micro nutrients as well as total calories are important to performance and therefore results.

[rufretic]

Calories aren't inherently healthy or unhealthy.

Calories are a unit of energy. Both nutrient rich and nutrient poor foods have both high and low calorie densities.

"healthy" is a word that should only be applied to a person, not a diet and certainly not an individual food.

Ok so I worded it wrong but just switch unhealthy to fast food and healthy to chicken and green beans for my example. I honestly don't know the answer to his question but was trying to give a little bit of clarity to the question so we could get an answer because I'm interested to learn as well.

If one wants to look like a body builder it’s going to require some dietary restraint to achieve and maintain lower bodyfat levels. In that case, choosing nutrient dense food such as meats, veg, fruit, etc is going to help to hit micros at the necessary caloric levels which are important for both overall health and performance by preventing micro nutrient deficiencies. Ie not many bodybuilders are going to be living off of hot dogs, and Dairy Queen blizzards.

If you want to just “get big and strong” you will be eating a lot more. Calorie surplus is a major component in strength gains. To some extent the more food you eat, the less likely that you will need to worry about missing micro nutrients provided you are eating a varied diet. There is more room for Low nutrient calories, and in some cases those foods might be what is required for some to hit their surplus.

Overall it comes down to individual goals and the person. Macro & Micro nutrients as well as total calories are important to performance and therefore results.

Thank you, this is a helpful response.

[SuffolkPunch]

Ok so I worded it wrong but just switch unhealthy to fast food and healthy to chicken and green beans for my example. I honestly don't know the answer to his question but was trying to give a little bit of clarity to the question so we could get an answer because I'm interested to learn as well.

It's understandable since unless you make a special effort to study nutrition, the information we get from the general media is very misleading.

For example, even fast food is not necessarily a no-go in a diet that has healthy outcomes for a typical lifter.

This article may help:

https://completehumanperformance.com.../clean-eating/

[squatsbrahhh]

In all the years I’ve been lifting/powerlifting I’ve always done better when my calories were coming from foods with high quality nutrition.

I’ve been on dirty bulks where all I ate was pizza, burgers, McDonald’s etc. I weighed 350lbs at one point.

But when I’m getting a perfect balance of protein-fats-carbs and all my micronutrients my performance improves. This may sound obvious but sometimes people go too far with the whole IIFYM thing. There’s definitely room for what people would consider “cheat” foods in any diet but that should only be after your macros and micros are in order.

[rhadam]

In all the years I’ve been lifting/powerlifting I’ve always done better when my calories were coming from foods with high quality nutrition.

I’ve been on dirty bulks where all I ate was pizza, burgers, McDonald’s etc. I weighed 350lbs at one point.

But when I’m getting a perfect balance of protein-fats-carbs and all my micronutrients my performance improves. This may sound obvious but sometimes people go too far with the whole IIFYM thing. There’s definitely room for what people would consider “cheat” foods in any diet but that should only be after your macros and micros are in order.

The fast food didn't make you fat. Chronic over-consumption of calories did.

[squatsbrahhh]

I'm glad what you did works for you, however what you just said is not founded in actual dietary science/physio.

Interesting, so is it more about meeting your calories and macros, micros don’t matter for your bodybuilding goals?

[Mikeez0]

Interesting, so is it more about meeting your calories and macros, micros don’t matter for your bodybuilding goals?

For bodybuilding no, never.
Nah, he just ate some micro nutrients, nothing else.
Kali muscle still claims to be natty?

[SuffolkPunch]

Interesting, so is it more about meeting your calories and macros, micros don’t matter for your bodybuilding goals?

He didn't say that

What's more likely is that the two food types you are comparing, one has a higher calorie density, lower overall protein and fiber. All these things affect satiety - and therefore how much you would consume on an ad libitum diet.

So it comes back to total calories - and possibly protein too (although the latter wouldn't be the case if it was lots of cheeseburgers we're talking about).

As for micros, it's conceivable that both had sufficient for general health because fast food is not as devoid of micros as the popular opinion would have you believe.

[ankmiike]

What’s more important in bodybuilding.... nutrition or calories?

1. Calories: Determines your rate of weight gain/loss.
2. Macros & fiber: Coupled with a good exercise program, determines WHAT you gain/lose -- muscles and/or fat.
3. Micros & water: So, that you don't end up with any nutrient deficiencies, which is bad in the long term.
4. Nutrient timing: Get that small extra edge in muscle growth and performance.
5. Supplements: Supplement the nutrients that you can't get from a normal diet.

That's the order of importance, from what will have the most impact on body composition and health, to what will have the least impact, i.e. if you're worrying about what pre-workout shake and supplements to take to build your body, while the rest of your diet (calories & macros) is s**t... you're just going about it the wrong way.

They are ALL are important, though. You can't just give one up because "it's not that important."

[broganoff]

1. Calories: Determines your rate for weight gain/loss.
2. Macros & fiber: Coupled with a good exercise program, determines WHAT you gain/lose -- muscles and/or fat.
3. Micros & water: So, that you don't end up with any nutrient deficiencies, which is bad in the long term.
4. Nutrient timing: Get that small extra edge of muscle growth and performance.
5. Supplements: Supplement the nutrients that you can't get from a normal diet.

That's the order of importance, from what will have the most impact on body composition and health, to what will have the least impact, i.e. if you're worrying about what pre-workout shake and supplements to take to build your body, while the rest of your diet (calories & macros) is s**t... you're just going about it the wrong way.

They are ALL are important, though. You can't just give one up because "it's not that important."

Well said, probably the best summary I've seen. Repped!

[allrnder]

I think op means which is more important, origin of calories or number of calories. For example, if trying to gain muscle, would it be better to get 3000 calories from unhealthy foods vs 2000 calories from healthy foods. I think it is a difficult question to answer and I guess it depends on your goals. If you just want to gain weight then get your calories however you can but if you care about overall health then stick to healthy calories.

#triggered

3000 calories vs 2000 calories? LOl wut?

[allrnder]

In all the years I’ve been lifting/powerlifting I’ve always done better when my calories were coming from foods with high quality nutrition.

I’ve been on dirty bulks where all I ate was pizza, burgers, McDonald’s etc. I weighed 350lbs at one point.

But when I’m getting a perfect balance of protein-fats-carbs and all my micronutrients my performance improves. This may sound obvious but sometimes people go too far with the whole IIFYM thing. There’s definitely room for what people would consider “cheat” foods in any diet but that should only be after your macros and micros are in order.

Have a look at this
https://www.today.com/health/man-los...ths-2D79329158

http://www.odditycentral.com/news/ma...-100-days.html