Is there any DISadvantage to doing same routine for a long time

[banjoman23]

Suppose an experienced lifter was psychologically content doing basically the same routine for 1-2 years and just trying to grind out progress whenever possible. Let's say a relatively balanced upper lower split in 8-12 rep range, with occasional small tweaks as the body dictates (grip switches, etc), and his joints and everything seemed ok with it.

Beyond the fact that the guy's clearly mindless, is there any physiological disadvantage to this versus switching things up every now and then?

Or to look at a specific exercise, let's say one's goal was to progress dumbbell flat bench in the 8-12 rep range, over a period of 1.5 years. Would progress be slower doing 18 straight months of db flat bench in 8-12 rep range grinding for linear progression when possible, or would it be more optimal to do, say 6 months of that, then 6 months of lower rep range and/or different angle, then back to 6 months of 8-12 flat.

[bodyhard]

Staying consistent is the number 1 way to improve, but sticking to the same weight/sets/reps for too long can become counterproductive because the body adapts. The body responds to progressive loads so in order to grow you will have to continue to increase the weight and or the reps. Of course you will hit a point where you just can't keep increasing and that is when you change exercises. I.e lets say you been doing flat barbell bench for 6 months, you will change to doing flat DB bench for another 3 months or so.

Now an experience lifter, who has been training for several years will call what you just described above as "maintaining"

[drudixon]

Eventually you get repeated bout effect and need to change things up to provide new stimulus.

[rlefebvr]

Suppose an experienced lifter was psychologically content doing basically the same routine for 1-2 years and just trying to grind out progress whenever possible. Let's say a relatively balanced upper lower split in 8-12 rep range, with occasional small tweaks as the body dictates (grip switches, etc), and his joints and everything seemed ok with it.

Beyond the fact that the guy's clearly mindless, is there any physiological disadvantage to this versus switching things up every now and then?

Or to look at a specific exercise, let's say one's goal was to progress dumbbell flat bench in the 8-12 rep range, over a period of 1.5 years. Would progress be slower doing 18 straight months of db flat bench in 8-12 rep range grinding for linear progression when possible, or would it be more optimal to do, say 6 months of that, then 6 months of lower rep range and/or different angle, then back to 6 months of 8-12 flat.

Your example is a good way to proceed.The error is thinking you need major change in your routine to mix things up.

Simply going from a flat bench to incline bench can make a difference or just changing one or two exercises fro your routine.

Like previously stated however, if you are still progressing, that is also a change in your routine.

Changing things around becomes more important as you become late intermediate and advanced.

The important thing is not to change thing weekly or even monthly. Best progress is made from doing the same workout over and over again, especially in the early stages.

[ElrondHubbard]

The fundamentals never really change. It should be good to switch up accessories and assistance work from time to time.

[zGwild]

With proper manipulation of volume,intensity and effort(effort being how close you take sets to failure) you could stick to the same exercises and set up indefinitely. Assuming the program is well balanced and goals do not change.

The problem is that most programs are not set up with the forever in mind.

[AD1985]

I'd say the mental effect will be the biggest negative component. Others here have mentioned body adaptation; that sounds awfully close to muscle confusion to me (no evidence for that btw).

But maybe there is something to the idea of changing things up. Body smart guys can sometimes find out truths before the science. Dr. Brad Schoenfeld tested the mind-muscle connection and found that it is both true and significant (compared to just pumping out reps without necessarily thinking about the target muscle). The MMC group got twice the growth in their biceps. They also did a lower exercise, I think squats, and there was no difference there. Brad hypothesized that we have greater potential to mentally isolate upper body muscles than lower.

[JoeDelts]

I think this is probably the biggest factor in developing muscle imbalances. When you see a physique where all of those little stabilizer muscles are developed and in proportion I believe it's largely the result of changing routines and exercises to make sure everything is being hit.

[itsagoodday]

I actually had this conversation with Danny Padilla once. He said the two greatest mistakes he saw people make in the gym were either going in without a program and doing things randomly, or constantly changing programs. Said he did the same program for 35 years, and just got better at it.

His physique turned out ok.

[Bando]

My biggest regret is sticking with a program that was comfortable for over a year. I was making incremental gains, felt good but it was really a waste of an entire year. I respond to changing things up even though the 1st week or 2 are pretty brutal these days.

[dazlittle]

I've been doing P/P/L for at least 2 years, Just switched it up to Upper/Lower.

My big lifts are always in there, I just play around with the isolation exercises to keep things fresh. I don't get all bent up if I can't bench press, I'll just grab the dumbells or I'll do incline..... It works for me, I enjoy it and I've been consistent for quite a few years now.

Most of all I still feel I'm making progress.

[blue9steel]

The key is continued progression. If you are making progress then there is no reason to change, if you aren't then change something until you are.

[AD1985]

I would like to ask this question in reverse to the guys who switch programs regularly: Don't you feel that your gains on a specific movement just atrophy away after some time off?

If so, it would seem to me that exercise selection with regular switching, becomes like juggling multiple balls to keep them in the air.

My dips are pretty lousy right now, which I'm okay with because I have a lot of bench pressing variations and am making consistent progress in that one direction. But if I were to constantly shuffle say OH extensions one cycle with kickbacks on another, I feel like I'd just be limiting progression and muscle gain on both movements.

[Bando]

I would like to ask this question in reverse to the guys who switch programs regularly: Don't you feel that your gains on a specific movement just atrophy away after some time off?

If I don't squat those go downhill fast. If I don't deadlift, even like a year, I can get back in my PR territory in like 6 weeks.

[JoeDelts]

I would like to ask this question in reverse to the guys who switch programs regularly: Don't you feel that your gains on a specific movement just atrophy away after some time off?

1. You will lose some strength on that exercise for sure but I don't think you'll lose the muscle gains you made while you were progressing on it as long as you replace it with a similar exercise.

2. You will get back to your max fairly soon after returning to an exercise and you can continue progression on it.

3. Changing exercises keeps things fresh. For me that's even more important than any incremental gains I may be sacrificing by not doing it. This is a long term thing and I doubt there would be any noticeable difference after 5-8 years provided you're given'er in the gym.

4. Injuries can make the choice for you. People are just built differently and some exercises that are fine for some people might cause you problems.

5. Despite what some people will tell you there is NO exercise that is a must do and can't be replaced with something else.

[drudixon]

I actually had this conversation with Danny Padilla once. He said the two greatest mistakes he saw people make in the gym were either going in without a program and doing things randomly, or constantly changing programs. Said he did the same program for 35 years, and just got better at it.

His physique turned out ok.

imagine if he'd varied it

[drudixon]

Read and consider

https://www.strongerbyscience.com/gr...-lifter-again/

[EjnarKolinkar]

Others here have mentioned body adaptation; that sounds awfully close to muscle confusion to me (no evidence for that btw).

I believe the comment was about 'repeated bout effect'. Do a google scholar search for it. It has noting to do with confused people trying to confuse their muscles.

Many people confuse a well designed progression with randomly changing programs, or changing out a movement to rest joints and prevent staleness with the need for excessive or constant variation. It's a shame.

[banjoman23]

I believe the comment was about 'repeated bout effect'. Do a google scholar search for it.

I just did that. My quick take, in all of 10 mins:

The mainstream belief seems to be "repeated bout effect" is your body's adaptations making workouts less effective over time and is a negative thing.

While the actual good literature/studies seem to indicate it's more of a (positive) protective thing than a (negative) gainz thing. Basically:
- High amounts of muscle damage occur during new eccentric movements (for some reason it's much less in concentric movements) and this is a negative thing - affects strength, causes DOMS, etc
- Repeated bout effect is your body's adaptation to limit that damage, which is generally a positive - stops that strength loss, DOMS, etc
- And I couldn't find any studies offhand which indicated any negative effect regarding neuromuscular adaptations from it.

But that's just my quick take in a whole 10 min of checking.

[lovelife745]

It's advisable to change routines after about every 3 months.

[ElrondHubbard]

It's advisable to change routines after about every 3 months.

No.

[grubman]

It's advisable to change routines after about every 3 months.

...and post once every 2 years

[wesleysh21]

...and post once every 2 years

And give chitty advice.

[drudixon]

So all are clear, rbe takes years, not months.

[AD1985]

I did some research to clarify in my own mind the repeated bouts effect (real) vs muscle confusion (not real). What I found:

1) Applying muscle confusion to a workout unstructures it, and therefore harms progression.

2) Repeated bouts effect results from structured, or at the very least, consistent progression. It actually shows that you are advancing as lifter, since advanced guys obviously gain less than newbs.

It is a necessarily negative in terms of growth, but a theoretical positive for resiliance. Newbs grow a lot faster but also get sore.

I remember years ago hiding from my instructor because my forearms could only move inbetween 110 and 150 degrees (probably damage from rows or curls). I didn't want to have to repeat the day so just walked around holding something constantly at weird angles to maintain the ruse

Also when I first deadlifted I had legit lower back pain, not even soreness. I worked through it, which was probably a bad decision, but the pain eventually went away and has never returned.

https://www.strongerbyscience.com/gr...-lifter-again/

The primary way to gain more myonuclei is through reasonable amounts of muscle damage. 4. Over time, it becomes harder to damage your muscles due to the Repeated Bouts Effect.