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  1. #1
    Registered User LanceSaintAsh's Avatar
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    Normal state/look of Abs?

    45 male, 5'7", a bit of a long torso. Getting in shape for next level of competitive tennis - not so much body building. Broad shoulders.
    My question is: when I've been at my leanest, my stomach still tends to curve out "ahead" of my chest. I'm curious if guys in magazines (and at the gym...) are clenching in and down on their abs to get the "chest first" look or if some body-types or level of fitness really does get a guy to the point where he can be naturally going about his day, not thinking about his abs, and he's leading "chest first". Before I kill myself trying to get that, I'd like to know how real it is...

    Thanks for any help!
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  2. #2
    Quarantined Finja Cass40's Avatar
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    Curious why you compare yourself with bodybuilders since you're not a bodybuilder nor train like one?

    Edit: never mind, I googled tennis player and Serena Williams came up. How the heck does she have so much muscle?
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    Originally Posted by LanceSaintAsh View Post
    45 male, 5'7", a bit of a long torso. Getting in shape for next level of competitive tennis - not so much body building. Broad shoulders.
    My question is: when I've been at my leanest, my stomach still tends to curve out "ahead" of my chest. I'm curious if guys in magazines (and at the gym...) are clenching in and down on their abs to get the "chest first" look or if some body-types or level of fitness really does get a guy to the point where he can be naturally going about his day, not thinking about his abs, and he's leading "chest first". Before I kill myself trying to get that, I'd like to know how real it is...

    Thanks for any help!
    Have you seen Roger Federer's abs? Me neither. But top-form male tennis players look extremely lean to me. It's all a matter of body fat percentage.
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    Registered User grubman's Avatar
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    I think I know where you are coming from.

    It's not really a question of muscle (or flexing). What you are describing is the result of one of two things (or a combination of both).

    The first is posture...you may just have bad posture.

    Second, and most likely, is your skellitons structure. This could be the curving of your spine, or perhaps you have a slight (not severe) concave chest like me. On me you can't really tell because I've put on some muscle...if I had a "normal" ribcage, I would look a LOT bigger.

    Pictures would help, especially if someone on the forum has medical or anatomy experience.

    Hope that helps.
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    Registered User LanceSaintAsh's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Cass40 View Post
    Curious why you compare yourself with bodybuilders since you're not a bodybuilder nor train like one?

    Edit: never mind, I googled tennis player and Serena Williams came up. How the heck does she have so much muscle?
    I understand that perhaps I wasn't very clear. I'm not comparing myself to other body builders. Here's the story: when I was in my teens and 20s, I'd look at guys on the cover of Men's Health and think "I want to look like that when I'm over 40" - because my Father was squat and round and all the men I knew around me were round, too. I got my Black Belt in Tae Kwon Do at 17, began lifting that same year, and got up to running 3 miles a day while I lived in Boston during college - but my Father's body has been stalking me since college! I worked for a moving company for 3 summers, presently I'm doing BeachBody's 21 Day Fix workouts, Shakeology, and doing modest lifting. Maybe I'm really naive but on average (whatever that means) I guess I've convinced myself I'm in good shape for a 45 yo - because I'm intentional about trying to be. What ISN'T happening is that my stomach ever flattens out. I've fasted several days (not while exercising), I've cut out all bloat-creating foods, I've gone super intense and it just doesn't happen for me. So I thought I'd find out if it was a "trick" for taking photos or if guys around me are walking around sucking their guts in... like I do. ;-)
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  6. #6
    Bootless Errand ironwill2008's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by LanceSaintAsh View Post
    I understand that perhaps I wasn't very clear. I'm not comparing myself to other body builders. Here's the story: when I was in my teens and 20s, I'd look at guys on the cover of Men's Health and think "I want to look like that when I'm over 40" - because my Father was squat and round and all the men I knew around me were round, too. I got my Black Belt in Tae Kwon Do at 17, began lifting that same year, and got up to running 3 miles a day while I lived in Boston during college - but my Father's body has been stalking me since college! I worked for a moving company for 3 summers, presently I'm doing BeachBody's 21 Day Fix workouts, Shakeology, and doing modest lifting. Maybe I'm really naive but on average (whatever that means) I guess I've convinced myself I'm in good shape for a 45 yo - because I'm intentional about trying to be. What ISN'T happening is that my stomach ever flattens out. I've fasted several days (not while exercising), I've cut out all bloat-creating foods, I've gone super intense and it just doesn't happen for me. So I thought I'd find out if it was a "trick" for taking photos or if guys around me are walking around sucking their guts in... like I do. ;-)
    Your protruding abdomen may be caused by a couple of things; visceral fat (fat surrounding your internal organs), or, more commonly for those who don't weight train, your abdominal muscles aren't developed.
    No brain, no gain.

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  7. #7
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    Google anterior pelvic tilt. Then get rid of it
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  8. #8
    Bootless Errand ironwill2008's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by drudixon View Post
    Google anterior pelvic tilt. Then get rid of it
    Yep. ^^^^This too.
    No brain, no gain.

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  9. #9
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    When you build overall muscle, it helps to support the look you're going for.

    It's hard to say anything without pictures but I'd guess you lack muscle. Even as a woman, I always thought the problem was not getting my stomach flat enough, and no matter how low body weight I got, tummy always looked protruding.

    It looks much better now even with higher weight because I look more balanced. I never really get flat stomach either. It's genetics, where you store fat, posture, and in my case lordosis but you can do a lot with building muscle.

    (And why are some tennis players skinny and others like Serena Williams look like bodybuilders?)

    Oh the trick for the photos? They usually diet for those pictures and dehydrate their bodies to look really lean just for that photo session. So the people in pictures don't even look like that IRL so you shouldn't compare yourself with them. Unrealistic.
    Last edited by Cass40; 12-21-2017 at 08:17 AM.
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    I'm a Swifty Now mtpockets's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by LanceSaintAsh View Post
    when I was in my teens and 20s, I'd look at guys on the cover of Men's Health and think "I want to look like that when I'm over 40"
    Not the gender or type of magazines I looked at in my younger years. I have abs, perhaps you wasted the good years.
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  11. #11
    Take with grain of salt Gloryhound's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Cass40 View Post
    Oh the trick for the photos? They usually diet for those pictures and dehydrate their bodies to look really lean just for that photo session. So the people in pictures don't even look like that IRL so you shouldn't compare yourself with them. Unrealistic.
    This is part of it, but in reality most of us never get lean enough that dehydration makes a big enough difference. You have to get into your single digits, for men, to get photogenic abs. Most will never get there and most that do get there never maintain it. I was in shock when I learned how low my weight had to be for me to see abs. Then at that point when I started talking about going into a body building show my coach informed me how much more I would have to loose. At that point I decided I was going further down for me, but probably not as low as he wanted me to go for the show.

    Originally Posted by mtpockets View Post
    Not the gender or type of magazines I looked at in my younger years. I have abs, perhaps you wasted the good years.
    Strong forearms to build a strong core. That doesn't sound quite right, but I'm married and thankfully it cuts into my forearm development significantly.
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    Here's a couple pics of me at around 6% and 15%. Abs are my weakest bodypart. I'm 5'6". Lower abs are a bitch for me to dial in. As a natural lifter I have to sacrifice a good bit of strength for my lower abs to show. I prefer to have the upper 2 (sometimes 4 on a good day) showing most of the time and steadily gain strength across compound movements. I hate feeling hungry.
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    Originally Posted by Domf3 View Post
    Here's a couple pics of me at around 6% and 15%. Abs are my weakest bodypart. I'm 5'6". Lower abs are a bitch for me to dial in. As a natural lifter I have to sacrifice a good bit of strength for my lower abs to show. I prefer to have the upper 2 (sometimes 4 on a good day) showing most of the time and steadily gain strength across compound movements. I hate feeling hungry.
    You think that is 6%? I would say 12% first photo (plus your flexed), 16-17% second photo (hard to tell at that angle).

    This is 6%, http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attach...4&d=1069531013
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    6% is when your hair falls out?
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    Registered User LanceSaintAsh's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by mtpockets View Post
    Not the gender or type of magazines I looked at in my younger years. I have abs, perhaps you wasted the good years.
    Well, I'm a heterosexual male, married 21 yrs, and quite happily sexually active with my gorgeous wife, so ;-). So, I think the Mens Health covers were like an alien bit of information about what an older man could be (I'm a licensed counselor in private practice presently, so I've always been fascinated by the abstracts of life). As for the "best" years, yeah - probably. But some posts below are informing me that body fact percentage, dehydrating, and the work necessary for defined abs are probably beyond what I'm willing to invest. So while I could get there now, not sure I want to make that such a focus. Thanks!
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  16. #16
    Registered User LanceSaintAsh's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Domf3 View Post
    Here's a couple pics of me at around 6% and 15%. Abs are my weakest bodypart. I'm 5'6". Lower abs are a bitch for me to dial in. As a natural lifter I have to sacrifice a good bit of strength for my lower abs to show. I prefer to have the upper 2 (sometimes 4 on a good day) showing most of the time and steadily gain strength across compound movements. I hate feeling hungry.
    This was a hugely helpful reply - thank you!
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    Registered User LanceSaintAsh's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Gloryhound View Post
    This is part of it, but in reality most of us never get lean enough that dehydration makes a big enough difference. You have to get into your single digits, for men, to get photogenic abs. Most will never get there and most that do get there never maintain it. I was in shock when I learned how low my weight had to be for me to see abs. Then at that point when I started talking about going into a body building show my coach informed me how much more I would have to loose. At that point I decided I was going further down for me, but probably not as low as he wanted me to go for the show.



    Strong forearms to build a strong core. That doesn't sound quite right, but I'm married and thankfully it cuts into my forearm development significantly.
    Helpful reply - thank you! And I have strong forearms because of tennis ;-)
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    Originally Posted by ElrondHubbard View Post
    6% is when your hair falls out?
    You want hair at 6%? How about this one.
    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attach...7&d=1027498129
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    Originally Posted by LanceSaintAsh View Post
    Helpful reply - thank you! And I have strong forearms because of tennis ;-)
    It is not a popular notion around these parts but a bloated belly can be caused by full intestines. Clean out the intestines and things lay flat or flatter. Just some food for thought. Yes i have done it and the difference is astounding.
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    Originally Posted by drudixon View Post
    Google anterior pelvic tilt. Then get rid of it
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    Originally Posted by x-trainer ben View Post
    It is not a popular notion around these parts but a bloated belly can be caused by full intestines. Clean out the intestines and things lay flat or flatter. Just some food for thought. Yes i have done it and the difference is astounding.
    Believe it or not, I'm ignorant of such things. I assumed my daily constitutional took care of such things. What can you teach me and advise to try?
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    Originally Posted by LanceSaintAsh View Post
    Believe it or not, I'm ignorant of such things. I assumed my daily constitutional took care of such things. What can you teach me and advise to try?
    Look at high fiber foods and Psyllium-Husk. I believe in( most do not) cleanses that "scrub" out your insides. Just do a little reading and see what you come up with. This is in addition to a great diet and exercise plan.
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    I’ve never been super lean as adult, but my abs do show at whatever bodyfat percentage I am in my avi (est 12-13%), but really is just the top two rows. In my experience, at that bf level, if I completely relax, my stomach probably sticks/hangs out out a little.

    I think self conscious guys, including fitness models, are always flexing their abs slightly to improve the look of their torso. After a while, it’s second nature, and you’re always keeping your stomach a little tight, like you’re ready to take a punch, at least when the shirts off.

    I think that was your original question, if they’re flexing at all to get that look. In my opinion, yes, but again I’ve never been that lean so what do I know. They probably also have a pump on their muscles and are at very low bf % and in suitable lighting, which helps.

    If you want see see what viscerally fat looks like (mentioned in the thread and it’s a good point), you can check my profile pics, “before” picture. You can see the launch under my shirt. That was visceral fat, thankfully it was the first to go.
    Last edited by loggerboots; 12-23-2017 at 07:27 AM.
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  24. #24
    Registered User ElvisCaprice's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by LanceSaintAsh View Post
    45 male, 5'7", a bit of a long torso. Getting in shape for next level of competitive tennis - not so much body building. Broad shoulders.
    My question is: when I've been at my leanest, my stomach still tends to curve out "ahead" of my chest. I'm curious if guys in magazines (and at the gym...) are clenching in and down on their abs to get the "chest first" look or if some body-types or level of fitness really does get a guy to the point where he can be naturally going about his day, not thinking about his abs, and he's leading "chest first". Before I kill myself trying to get that, I'd like to know how real it is...

    Thanks for any help!
    Yeah, it's just body fat. As a former tennis player I've seen many players with moderate body fat and quite active, obviously not the elite pros. If you want to see the Abs you need to count calories accurately and go on a cut. Is doable as a tennis player and probably beneficial to your joints, less weight on the court. Lifting is also beneficial for tennis.
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    Registered User Deafjohn's Avatar
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    Just curious.... I read several magazines and books that some people work on abs 6 times a week while other only do 3 times a week because to give abs some rest to grow bigger abs! Which is best for good look abs?
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    Crawling back under rock OldFartTom's Avatar
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    I was once told by an accomplished bodybuilder (who spoke a lot of sense) that some muscles benefit from more frequent training than others, he gave abs calves and forearm as examples, then said train some others less frequently such as delts as they are slower to recover. I've no idea if this is bro myth or has any science behind it, but the guy gave me some good advice so I'll go with it. Work abs frequently.

    Although whether they look good is as much the bodyfat issue. The normal ab look for a 45 year old is hidden
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