Meat and water diet

[-Ironside-]

Long time listener, first time caller.
So I've experimented with a ton of different diets, I've tried vegan, gluten free, no sugar, keto/Paleo and just eating whatever I want, I typically go for the latter.
I've been reading a lot about meat only diets and the health benefits people have seen with them, as someone with joint paint, partial paralysis, gut issues and misc other medical issues, I'm curious about this diet.
Are there are meat eaters here? Strictly meat, no vegies, no nuts or supplements, just meat and water?
How do you eat your meat? What cuts do you go for? What are the benefits you've seen?

[Mario875]

You know, you could just eat a normal, varied, balanced diet which includes all sorts of meat, fruit, veg, nuts, etc like you should be doing. Why waste time with all these fad diets that honestly don't do jack. We are omnivores. Look at your teeth, you have incisors and canines at the front for tearing flesh / meat and molars at the back for grinding up plant matter....says it all really, we as a species have evolved to have these teeth because that's what we should be eating.

So maybe try giving you body what it actually needs instead of trying some random diet you read about a handful of times.

[-Ironside-]

Curiosity mostly, I only plan on trying it for a month.
Plus it will drive my vegan friends crazy.

[screwnuts]

I would at least eat green leafy vegetables like spinach, lettuce, kale, etc just to give yourself some vitamins and fiber that you won't get from meat. In any case, I doubt doing it for just a month will cause you any lasting harm.

[gbullock32]

Curiosity mostly, I only plan on trying it for a month.
Plus it will drive my vegan friends crazy.

Nutrient deficiencies would wreck your health far before you make it a month.

[-Ironside-]

Nutrient deficiencies would wreck your health far before you make it a month.

Tell that to the Anderson family, they're currently at 18 years. Nutrients are found in meats, even vitamin c which we need less than 100mg/day of or arguably none if there are no carbohydrates in your diet.
I've starved for longer than a month before, I don't think missing a few nutrients for a month is going up cause me any lasting harm, vegans do it all the time. I know the symptoms if scurvy and how long it should take for it to set in (4weeks to see early signs).

Check out Dr Shaw Baker
http://innerfirepodcast.com/shawnbaker/
http://www.15minutecorporatewarrior....r-zero-carb-2/

[gbullock32]

Tell that to the Anderson family, they're currently at 18 years. Nutrients are found in meats, even vitamin c which we need less than 100mg/day of or arguably none if there are no carbohydrates in your diet.
I've starved for longer than a month before, I don't think missing a few nutrients for a month is going up cause me any lasting harm, vegans do it all the time. I know the symptoms if scurvy and how long it should take for it to set in (4weeks to see early signs).

Check out Dr Shaw Baker
http://innerfirepodcast.com/shawnbaker/
http://www.15minutecorporatewarrior....r-zero-carb-2/

If you actually believe someone can go 18 years with only meat and water than you're too gullible for your own good.

[grouchyjarhead]

Even Mongolian cuisine - which tends to be primarily all meat, dairy, and fat - still has a few veggies squeezed in there from time to time. A salad here and there with some olive oil and vinegar isn't going to kill you. Just eat at ketogenic levels and you'll be getting the same effects.

Shawn Baker has said he eats cheese occasionally, so he's not all meat and water either.

[-Ironside-]

If you actually believe someone can go 18 years with only meat and water than you're too gullible for your own good.

If you believe that, you need to educate yourself because it's been done for thousands of years. There are still tribes whom survive on a diet that is only meat, blood and milk, with less health implications than westerners.
You cannot survive on lean meats, that would obviously kill you. You have to eat fatty meats and organs as well. Liver, heart, eyes, brain, those are full of nutrients.

Grouchy, I probably wouldn't give up cheese either. I don't consume most dairy as it is but cheese and butter are an exception. The diet does call for animal by product as well.
It's really not about the compared results, it's scientific curiousity. I'm a researcher, I like experiments, especially ones where I can constantly monitor the results. I've done keto before so I already know how my body responds there.
Veganism doesn't work for me, felt clean but weak and always hungry.
Keto, felt hungry quite a bit of the time but I was focusing on lean meats then.
Carb cycling, probably one of my favorites since it's easy and you never go long enough to really get that crazy craving feeling.

[-Ironside-]

Btw my background is in nutrition. The reason why I'm so curious in this is because it goes against everything that we know, the only way to verify if people are full of **** or legitimately dieting like this is to do it myself and document it by journaling how I feel and lab work pre and post diet to see if there are in fact any negative effects on my health. What I would expect but people have said does not happen for some of these is elevated LDLs, triglycerides, ACR and likely lower insulin.
Only one real way to find out. I came here to see if anyone else had tried this before and logged it.

[grouchyjarhead]

Go for it then, see how it feels. I'd be interested in following along.

[-Ironside-]

Starting in Jan, I wouldn't last though Dec, too much good food.

[Mrpb]

Keto, felt hungry quite a bit of the time but I was focusing on lean meats then.

What you were doing was probably not keto. If you focus on lean meats protein will come out too high to ever make it deeper into ketosis.

Keto needs to be high fat, which suppresses hunger.

Keto might be worth a try for you. You can eat meat all day and get important benefits from low carb vegetables.

Tell that to the Anderson family, they're currently at 18 years.

Anyone can claim anything. That doesn't make it true.

What's your background in nutrition?

[Mikeez0]

Who cares? Go and do it. If you don't do it in my bed/ house, I don't care.

[-Ironside-]

What you were doing was probably not keto. If you focus on lean meats protein will come out too high to ever make it deeper into ketosis.

Keto needs to be high fat, which suppresses hunger.

Keto might be worth a try for you. You can eat meat all day and get important benefits from low carb vegetables.



Anyone can claim anything. That doesn't make it true.

What's your background in nutrition?

I did leaner meats, high fats from plant sources and fish oils, **** load of natural PB. Was mostly trying to keep away from saturated fats but I'd occasionally use butter to help balance out the ratios.
Nutrition was a minor, I'm certified as a nutritionist consultant, which is just a bs certificate imo. Not a CNS, that requires a masters or above.
Joined a zero carb group on ********, couple thousand people that are all on similar meat and water diet, some with cheese and some other dairies, some without. A lot claim they've been doing it for years, not sure why someone would lie about a diet when they're not selling anything, just giving/getting out information and making logs. It's also not that extreme or unfathomable, they're not airatarians. 😄

[-Ironside-]

But to be fair mrpb, you're probably right. I don't think I ever let my fats get high enough.

[Mrpb]

I did leaner meats, high fats from plant sources and fish oils, **** load of natural PB. Was mostly trying to keep away from saturated fats but I'd occasionally use butter to help balance out the ratios.

I found this pretty interesting: seems like high SFA intake is not a problem at all on keto. The keto group actually improved their LDL
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28399015

Joined a zero carb group on ********, couple thousand people that are all on similar meat and water diet, some with cheese and some other dairies, some without. A lot claim they've been doing it for years, not sure why someone would lie about a diet when they're not selling anything, just giving/getting out information and making logs. It's also not that extreme or unfathomable, they're not airatarians. ������

People get very passionate about extremist diets. They're usually suffering from several cognitive biases, confirmation bias being the strongest one.

If you go into raw vegan groups they will claim all sorts of nonsense like cancer curing etc.

[-Ironside-]

I found this pretty interesting: seems like high SFA intake is not a problem at all on keto. The keto group actually improved their LDL
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28399015



People get very passionate about extremist diets. They're usually suffering from several cognitive biases, confirmation bias being the strongest one.

If you go into raw vegan groups they will claim all sorts of nonsense like cancer curing etc.

I'm fairly unbiased about any diet, more skeptical actually. I'm interested in what I hear and maybe their results are true for them but I never assume something will work for me.
I'm going to go keto for the rest of this month, then next month I'll do the full conversion to meat and see how it goes.
I'm more interested in how I will feel vs my overall health. If I feel great and labs look like ****, I'll stick with it. If it's vice versa, I'll stop. My body is too broken to want to live past 60, I just hope I can get there and feel good because right now I feel like ****. Too many injuries and medical issues.

[Mrpb]

Perhaps this is interesting to you: http ://borgefa gererli.com /the-zero-carb-experience/ (remove spaces)

I'm not sure as I haven't read it but I heard it's relevant.

[-Ironside-]

Good read. I started yesterday with the transition. Made a 1.3lb ribeye, rare, covered in a quarter sick of butter and garlic and another 1lb of New York strip.
I've never done a side by side comparison of the two meats and wanted to try it. The ribeye is definitely better and will likely be the staple in my diet.
I didn't make it through the whole thing, my body is accustomed to smaller meals so I got through the ribeye and a little over half the New York. Figured I'll finish it for breakfast this morning

[Peppesbodega]

Check out cbd oil for your problems.
You do not get high from it - it activates the endocannabinoid system present in human amd Animals, enabling homeostatis according to theory.

Ive been using it for like a year, recommended.

[-Ironside-]

Update on how it's going. Pretty interesting, I noticed my chronic joint paint was receding and in some areas, gone completely. I made a post asking people if they've experienced similar affects especially so soon and most reported the change within 4 days. That's pretty impressive, because I don't even take nsaids or pain killers for my chronic pain issues.
Ketosis has kicked in, I can taste it and with it comes the drowsiness. It's not like my normal chronic fatigue but just sleepy.
Mentally I'm clearer, I attribute this to the lack of carbs and not so much the meat diet.
Gastrointestinally, I have no bloating and no gas. Literally none. It's very very weird for me as I've become accustomed to being sassy and having stomach issues over the years and have had 3 corrective surgeries for tears and been scoped many times because of IBS.
My 'output' is much less than normal, i assume because there's less wasted material in meat due to less fiber and plant cells (read: none). I have no issues with BM.
Hunger is waning. It's hard to eat just meat, I love carbs. I made my friend steak and Mac n cheese for dinner yesterday and that Mac n cheese looked like what I picture heaven to be like.
Will I be able to sustain this diet for an extended period? Unlikely, I love pizza, cookies, icecream, fruit and carbs but for now, I will continue giving it the old college try and maybe resort to something along the lines of carb cycling in the future.

[-Ironside-]

This is a post that just went up on the FB group I'm part of 'zeroing in on health'. It's an interesting read.

Hi, fellow Carnivores!

I have eaten an all-meat diet for the last eight years. When I ate carbs, I was obese, infertile, had acne, and had no energy. I also suffered from frequent staph infections, which resulted in painful absesses/boils. I was miserable.

After eight years of eating a Zero Carb diet, I feel amazing! I regained my “cycle” and have had three ZC pregnancies and three healthy babies. My skin is clear! I haven’t had a single boil since starting ZC in 2009! I also lost 120 pounds and regained my energy and joy for life!

If you are new here, welcome! There are many, many stories like mine! Stories of people who got their life and health back when they stopped eating carbs and started properly fueling their bodies with meat.

If you’d like to read more about how I first started a ZC diet, click here: http://myzerocarblife.jamesdhogan.co...se-100-pounds/

To see my blood-work after several years of ZC, click here: http://myzerocarblife.jamesdhogan.co...y-cholesterol/

For my answers to frequently asked questions: http://myzerocarblife.jamesdhogan.co...ked-questions/

ZC during pregnancy: http://myzerocarblife.jamesdhogan.co...carb-pregnant/

Why ZC is easier/better than Low-Carb: http://myzerocarblife.jamesdhogan.co...sier-low-carb/

Six tips for eating ZC: http://myzerocarblife.jamesdhogan.co...ing-zero-carb/

#ZCforlife !!! ❤️

[grouchyjarhead]

Will I be able to sustain this diet for an extended period? Unlikely, I love pizza, cookies, icecream, fruit and carbs but for now, I will continue giving it the old college try and maybe resort to something along the lines of carb cycling in the future.

Another option could be the Gironda "steak and eggs" diet. Eat steak (or any red meat really) and eggs twice a day for four days, then the fifth day eat a normal variety of foods.

[necon76]

In to follow.

[Mrpb]

I also lost 120 pounds and regained my energy and joy for life!

It's a very common theme. Someone was obese because they were eating too many calories, usually on a crappy diet. Then they go on some sort of extreme diet where they severely restrict their intake (cutting out all carbs or all fat or all animal products or all cooked foods). Because of the restriction they start to eat less calories.

They lose a ton of weight, regain their health and naturally they think that their extreme diet was the cause of it all.

Similar stories can be found in raw vegan groups, vegetarian groups, paleo groups etc.

They overlook that they lost weight and regained their health because they simply ate less calories than they expended.

Even on a Twinkie diet people can lose a lot of weight and improve their blood work: http://edition.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/1...sor/index.html

[kwong486]

Nutrient deficiencies would wreck your health far before you make it a month.

Not necessarily true. Have you read about meat only diets before?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj_Bc9hdHa0

Dr. Shawn Baker in this episode of Joe Rogan's podcast is an orthopedic surgeon and is on a carnivore diet and a large proponent. Not sure if he's just a genetic freak or what, but you can't argue that what he does with a meat only diet works (for him at least.) I'm pretty sure he does address the idea that some people are genetically more inclined to benefit from the diet, however.

Either way, your whole "would wreck your health" comment is baseless.

[Mrpb]

On a meat only diet, where would you get vitamin K1 from?

[kwong486]

On a meat only diet, where would you get vitamin K1 from?

The same way you make up any other vitamin deficiency, right? Supplementation. Or eat small servings of animal liver I guess....lol

[AutistTrigger]

Better off following a keto/Atkins style diet IMHO. You'll need some carbs for energy.