Kabuki Strength Power and Squat Bars

[urbanlifter]

It's done specifically for effect, so you can visually see and feel where the rings are. On other bars it's just bare... so easier to see and feel. They're going after some signature look. Remember, they're trying to separate themselves from others... hard to innovate in this space.

Intentionally messing up knurl for a signature look? Not buying that, unless you lift with a blindfold and gloves, finding the smooth areas isn't difficult. Product differentiation was achieved with the electrolysis nickel and Rockwell ratings, they should fix the knurl LOL.

[Jason2459]

Here's an interesting video from Duffin and he covers this...



More info here: https://kabukistrength.com/power-bar-squat-bar/



It's done specifically for effect, so you can visually see and feel where the rings are. On other bars it's just bare... so easier to see and feel. They're going after some signature look. Remember, they're trying to separate themselves from others... hard to innovate in this space.

I don't buy that. A bare ring in the middle of rough knurl of any kind or any precision is easy to see and feel. A very clean stop and start is expected on a high end bar. If they expect that to be a feature then they better call it out as it just looks sloppy.

I do feel the bar is way over built. That said I do have one ordered with the black Friday deal. Also preordered the vulcan stainless steel absolute power bar.

It doesn't bother me that the kabuki bars are not offered in stainless. One of the top bar makers that are deemed top of the line for both weightlifting and powerlifting is chrome and bare steel. Eleiko hasn't gotten on the stainless bandwagon yet.

But I don't agree with Chris that its just marketing hype besides how stainless steel is marketed in all industries. It can still rust especially the type used in barbells. I do agree yeild strength generally goes up with tensile strength but he doesn't really disclose what the bar's yeild strength is.

I'm also not impressed or excited to have a bar designed to eat through my equipment. That is hyped up I feel to much and to me a negative.

But will see. That's jusy my initial opinions on a bar I have no experience with but will soon find out.

[CharlottePT]

I don't buy that. A bare ring in the middle of rough knurl of any kind or any precision is easy to see and feel. A very clean stop and start is expected on a high end bar. If they expect that to be a feature then they better call it out as it just looks sloppy.

I do feel the bar is way over built. That said I do have one ordered with the black Friday deal. Also preordered the vulcan stainless steel absolute power bar.

It doesn't bother me that the kabuki bars are not offered in stainless. One of the top bar makers that are deemed top of the line for both weightlifting and powerlifting is chrome and bare steel. Eleiko hasn't gotten on the stainless bandwagon yet.

But I don't agree with Chris that its just marketing hype besides how stainless steel is marketing in all industries. It can still rust especially the type used in barbells. I do agree yeild strength generally goes up with tensile strength but he doesn't really disclose what the bar's yeild strength is.

I'm also not impressed or excited to have a bar designed to eat through my equipment. That is hyped up I feel to much and to me a negative.

But will see. That's jusy my initial opinions on a bar I have no experience with but will soon find out.

have you got any updates on the kabuki bar being shipped out yet? I ordered saturday and still by thursday haven't gotten any details. Was hoping I would've had it by end of week, everything else I ordered will be here by friday it looks like

[Jason2459]

have you got any updates on the kabuki bar being shipped out yet? I ordered saturday and still by thursday haven't gotten any details. Was hoping I would've had it by end of week, everything else I ordered will be here by friday it looks like

Haven't seen any updates yet. But hope to soon. I didn't expect to have the bar in hand for a couple weeks.

[thejosef]

Was the knurl really messed up? Or did it just feather off a bit at the markings? I'm pretty picky with my stuff, but I didn't see much wrong with it in the video. I mean, my Eleiko bars feather off a bit at the markings.. It's not the end of the world. American Barbell & Ivanko probably have the cleanest knurl stops/starts in the biz, at least on the bars I've owned. I'm more concerned with knurl feel on the Kabuki. I just hope it's grippy without being "Iron Wolfe squat bar painful." I'm pretty confident it will feel great, as they have been talking smack about the 'perfect knurling' in their marketing.

What I DID see on the Kabuki is the endcap that was peeling like crazy on day 1.. but Coop says they have addressed that and have a fix. We'll see.

Some knurl sport/start reference pics, just for fun:

Eleiko Sport Training Bar:


AB SS Oly 20kg:


AB Super Power Bar:


Ivanko OBS-20kg:

[urbanlifter]

Was the knurl really messed up? Or did it just feather off a bit at the markings?

I know pictures don't always seem to tell the tale so I'll reserve judgement until our respected members receive their bars, but it was the first thing i noticed outside of the endcaps. Then the reviewer addressed that there appeared to be 1/8" worth of double tracked knurling near the smooth areas of the powerlifting marks. Not trying to incite outrage, but if I pay $450+ for a barbell and it comes with DT knurling, it's going back in the tube for Kabuki to deal with. Not with the quality that AB is putting out these days, effing clean knurl and their Power Bars are plenty strong enough for any human being.

[chadsalt]

Haven't seen any updates yet. But hope to soon. I didn't expect to have the bar in hand for a couple weeks.

I just hit the "buy" button figuring it will be a surprise.......

Not like I don't have a bar or two laying around to use in the meantime.

[thejosef]

I know pictures don't always seem to tell the tale so I'll reserve judgement until our respected members receive their bars, but it was the first thing i noticed outside of the endcaps. Then the reviewer addressed that there appeared to be 1/8" worth of double tracked knurling near the smooth areas of the powerlifting marks. Not trying to incite outrage, but if I pay $450+ for a barbell and it comes with DT knurling, it's going back in the tube for Kabuki to deal with. Not with the quality that AB is putting out these days, effing clean knurl and their Power Bars are plenty strong enough for any human being.

Ah, nice photo! Honestly, that may be intentional where the "double-tracking" is.. I only mean it's not in a random place.. it's right at the stop/starts. Just speculating, obviously, but this /\ is no big deal at all to me. It doesn't even look bad since it's near the mark. Obviously, I understand this may be an issue to some.

This \/ is unintentional double tracked knurling, that looks bad IMO:
Rogue boneyard bar:

[chadsalt]

Looks too uniform to be accidental double track. Almost like they started a second pass, but stopped in the 1/8".

[urbanlifter]

Just speculating, obviously, but this /\ is no big deal at all to me.

MSRP on this barbell is $599 + shipping, that double track knurling wouldn't be an issue for you having owned so many nice barbells? Whether unintentional or on purpose to avoid having to be precise, wouldn't you rather have the knurling stop on a dime like it should for such an expensive barbell?

[Cleveland33]

I don't think that is double track

ETA - maybe it is, hard to look at it, like it's playing tricks on my eyes.


That said, I wouldn't have a problem with it.

[thejosef]

MSRP on this barbell is $599 + shipping, that double track knurling wouldn't be an issue for you having owned so many nice barbells? Whether unintentional or on purpose to avoid having to be precise, wouldn't you rather have the knurling stop on a dime like it should for such an expensive barbell?

Usually I prefer a clean stop, sure, but I think it kinda looks fine in the pic. The biggest thing to me symmetry honestly (touch of OCD.. lol). If it's the same at each ring, I'm good. If it's different, that's not as cool, and maybe unacceptable on a bar at this price point. It's almost like they stepped down the knurl here.. Regardless, these bars will be hitting the streets soon, so we'll see if it's intentional or not. I'll definitely post pics when mine shows up.

[dragon360]

Usually I prefer a clean stop. It's almost like they stepped down the knurl here..

this is how is saw it. Like it is fading to the break line.

[thejosef]

As an aside, I can see Kabuki reading this thread and seeing these knurl pics.. "These dudes are NUTS".. Lol. Yes. Yes we are.

[Jason2459]

As an aside, I can see Kabuki reading this thread and seeing these knurl pics.. "These dudes are NUTS".. Lol. Yes. Yes we are.

I would agree too. And it would be nice to see him on the forums again. Have followed him since FI hay days. I remember when he first started to get into fabricaring equipment and showing it off. Definitly always wanting to improve on things.

[keyboardworkout]

Synthetic's duffalo bar. Some of the worst knurling I have seen.

https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...hp?t=169690483

[Synthetickiller]

Worst in what way?
I can say it's functionally superior to a lot of other bars I've used.

[MGM711]

Worst in what way?
I can say it's functionally superior to a lot of other bars I've used.

I'm curious as well...I very much like the feel of my Duff knurl.

[keyboardworkout]

Worst in what way?
I can say it's functionally superior to a lot of other bars I've used.

It looks like it was done in high school metal shop by kids using a lathe for the first time.

Only one of the cutters was making deep contact with the bar.

[Synthetickiller]

It looks like it was done in high school metal shop by kids using a lathe for the first time.

I know I posted this somewhere, but I had emailed Kabuki Strength about this & here was the response from last year.

Here's what Kabuki Strength told me about the knurling...

"I loved the review and I like your format so i will give away a little secret. The variant knurling you observed is a cosmetic defect caused by chips getting into the chuck and causing the bar to ride akimbo in the lathe. The tiny variation in the width of one set of diagonal lines over the other makes the knurls appear to be a swirl instead of a grid. The next batch will not have this problem. In theory knurling for hand grips should always be a series of diamond shaped lands with v grooves in between. The Iron Wolf bar knurling is (as grandpa taught me) actually functionally defective, there is no land at the top and the v grooves touch to form a nail point which cuts into the skin rather than gripping it.

Properly pitched knurling for grip actually interlocks with the ridge patterns in the friction skin on your hand, which is why ours feels so grippy without actually being painful.

Michael Lopushok
Director of Operations
Kabuki Strength

Also consider that I already posted this response in my thread that you are pulling info/pics from:
https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...post1407696213

Let's get our story straight, shall we?


Even the "lines" of "knurl" on the Duffalo are better than my Ivanko, bar none. What I got from Kabuki was a bad batch that in no way effected performance. I bench & squat with the bar weekly & heavy (at least heavy for me). I'm pretty anal about knurling, fit, and finish, yet I have no issue. I don't even feel it or notice it unless someone points out lifting with the bar. As a basis of comparison, I still use my Ivanko and other bars with "correct" knurling weekly, as well. I will also add that while my Iron Wolf squat bar is great for being a prototype, I guess I'm too much of a pussy to use it without 2 shirts as it hurts like all hell when squatting heavy. The knurling on that bar looks amazing in person, but it's a torture device for those not willing to use a bar that's for lifters who move serious weights.

I'll add another instance of form of function not working out. Thejosef posted the pic of the OBS-20kg. He sold that bar because the finish (SS) and the knurl was slippery. Who the hell wants that in a bar? A slick bar? No thank you. The bar is a work of art, but we lift, not stare at it all day...

At least use the current batch of Duffalo bars as a basis for comparison. My bar is not comparable. Hell, it's 2 lb heavier than the current batch (57lb vs 55lb/25kg).

From a functional standpoint, the knurling is good, period. The forum is too caught up in cosmetic BS. I see a lot of guys bitching about how knurling looks or appears, yet haven't held the bar to actually make a determination of how real world use is. I'm starting to question if half of the forum even lifts. It's like some people just collect hunks of metal to fit in.

[Jason2459]

Even the "lines" of "knurl" on the Duffalo are better than my Ivanko, bar none. What I got from Kabuki was a bad batch that in no way effected performance. I bench & squat with the bar weekly & heavy (at least heavy for me). I'm pretty anal about knurling, fit, and finish, yet I have no issue. I don't even feel it or notice it unless someone points out lifting with the bar. As a basis of comparison, I still use my Ivanko and other bars with "correct" knurling weekly, as well. I will also add that while my Iron Wolf squat bar is great for being a prototype, I guess I'm too much of a pussy to use it without 2 shirts as it hurts like all hell when squatting heavy. The knurling on that bar looks amazing in person, but it's a torture device for those not willing to use a bar that's for lifters who move serious weights.

I'll add another instance of form of function not working out. Thejosef posted the pic of the OBS-20kg. He sold that bar because the finish (SS) and the knurl was slippery. Who the hell wants that in a bar? A slick bar? No thank you. The bar is a work of art, but we lift, not stare at it all day...

At least use the current batch of Duffalo bars as a basis for comparison. My bar is not comparable. Hell, it's 2 lb heavier than the current batch (57lb vs 55lb/25kg).

From a functional standpoint, the knurling is good, period. The forum is too caught up in cosmetic BS. I see a lot of guys bitching about how knurling looks or appears, yet haven't held the bar to actually make a determination of how real world use is. I'm starting to question if half of the forum even lifts. It's like some people just collect hunks of metal to fit in.

I totally appreciate everything you said up to the last paragraph. If it was a sub-$300 bar then I would totally agree. But when the marketing hypes up that the bar I just spent over $500 on will have a "perfect" knurl I hope it is done right. I won't care to much about rough starts and stops but I really hope it's complete and not doubled.

[keyboardworkout]

Here's what Kabuki Strength told me about the knurling...

And yet they still sent the bar out looking like that. That is the unnerving part.

[Synthetickiller]

I totally appreciate everything you said up to the last paragraph. If it was a sub-$300 bar then I would totally agree. But when the marketing hypes up that the bar I just spent over $500 on will have a "perfect" knurl I hope it is done right. I won't care to much about rough starts and stops but I really hope it's complete and not doubled.

And yet they still sent the bar out looking like that. That is the unnerving part.

My take on why they shipped out bars like that is so they wouldn't eat the cost & possibly go bankrupt or at the very least operate in the red for a while. I'm not saying that's right or wrong (I'll be the first to say that they shouldn't), just that's probably their reasoning. I don't consider it justifiable, but we're not talking about my bar & these bars don't look bad.

The inherent argument that "all double tracked knurling is bad" is one hell of an interesting argument that the forum members here drop all the time. Is it bad? Can you tell me why it's bad? Have you held the bar to see if it is even noticeable?

I always use my Ivanko as a comparison, but the knurling on the left and right sides is different & feels different. I can flip the bar over and over and over & still tell which side has weaker knurling. That was a $600 bar 15 years ago... People call it "funny knurl." I call it crap, but people have a lot of brand preference. Even my post about it fell on deaf ears around here. I trust my hands over opinions. It's ruined more than one deadlift session in my life time...


Here's my issue. Why are you using my bar, a first off, as a comparison to this bar? Most people agree that the power bar knurling by the rings looks like the design was intentional. Instead of using my bar as an example (massive strip of miss knurled area), how about let's email them directly & see what's up? I, for one, want to see if this design was to be "kinder" to the finger of choice that sits on the ring. Instead of a harsh, sharper, aggressive knurl meeting a flat surface (I don't like this), it tapers so there's at least some comfort without ruining the entire grip on the bar when benching. Squatting and deadlift, in this case, shouldn't be effected.




There's a lot of assumptions floating around here right now. I want to see a bar that's fully double tracked come out. I am seriously curious to see how the grip compares to normal knurling. We have no control so no one REALLY knows. We're dealing with a lot of herd mentality here. Is there some double tracked knurling thread I missed out on before I started posting here in 2014 or something?


And before anyone claims that I'm a shill for Kabuki, I'm hoping to see some real world feedback before dropping $500+ on a power bar. There's a number of cheaper options out there & I want to see if I can save $100+ and get the same or better experience. I'm hoping this thread can share some light on that topic. Before we say there are or aren't issues, let's have some members get it in their hands & put it through some abuse first?

[Jason2459]

I'm not comparing your bar to anything so if quoting me keep the reply to me in context. I'm more concerned with bars coming out currently and the one I will be receiving.

Saying double tracked is bad as bad is because it is bad. It is a defect. That is not how it is supposed to happen. That is why Eleiko dumps the bar and others like Rogue sell them at a discount.

If I receive one missgroved I'm calling up CS and using the lifetime warranty. I have before with Rogue getting an unsatisfactory bar and I won't hesitate with Kabuki. From what I hear their CS is good.

And I agree there needs to be some hands on reviews. I've seen two so far. Both good. But I am always a skeptic even though I like Chris a lot and very happy to support his business.

[Synthetickiller]

I'm not comparing your bar to anything so if quoting me keep the reply to me in context. I'm more concerned with bars coming out currently and the one I will be receiving.

Saying double tracked is bad as bad is because it is bad. It is a defect. That is not how it is supposed to happen. That is why Eleiko dumps the bar and others like Rogue sell them at a discount.

If I receive one missgroved I'm calling up CS and using the lifetime warranty. I have before with Rogue getting an unsatisfactory bar and I won't hesitate with Kabuki. From what I hear their CS is good.

And I agree there needs to be some hands on reviews. I've seen two so far. Both good. But I am always a skeptic even though I like Chris a lot and very happy to support his business.

I just combined the responses because I'm just not patient enough today, lol. It's not you guys. The people I'm dealing with, with this house would drive anyone to homicide, lol.

I know you're not comparing it. That was directed at Keyboard. I feel that it's an apples to oranges comparison. Even my thread stated that it's a defect. Why they didn't give me a new one is beyond me. I was just too happy to squat/bench pain free & didn't want to give up that up. At the time, I had no time to make a return...


What I am asking about the knurling is, "How bad is a bar that is fully double tracked?"
This is someone no one seems to comment on. If there's superior grip due to that design, I'd like to see it.


Yes, we need hands on reviews. We also need some clarification by Kabuki on the double tracking by the rings. I'm hoping someone will step up & send a question to Kabuki CS. I would, but I don't own the bar, so i feel someone else can do the leg work.

I want to see how this bar compares to Vulcan, American Barbell, Ivanko's power bar (not that they are getting my business again), or even Rogue (not that I'd buy a bar from them after my DL bar fiasco).

I can't remember if it was you, Jason, or someone else who mentioned that he was worried about this bar chewing through the UHMW on his power rack j-cups. This has been a bone of contention with me. I'm glad it was brought to my attention. That might be a deal killer for me & might be the only instance I've see where a request for no knurling on the racked area of the bar is entirely justified.

[keyboardworkout]

I believe the double track is caused by chatter when the tool initially makes contact with the spinning bar. It's a defect.

[Jason2459]

I just combined the responses because I'm just not patient enough today, lol. It's not you guys. The people I'm dealing with, with this house would drive anyone to homicide, lol.

I know you're not comparing it. That was directed at Keyboard. I feel that it's an apples to oranges comparison. Even my thread stated that it's a defect. Why they didn't give me a new one is beyond me. I was just too happy to squat/bench pain free & didn't want to give up that up. At the time, I had no time to make a return...


What I am asking about the knurling is, "How bad is a bar that is fully double tracked?"
This is someone no one seems to comment on. If there's superior grip due to that design, I'd like to see it.


Yes, we need hands on reviews. We also need some clarification by Kabuki on the double tracking by the rings. I'm hoping someone will step up & send a question to Kabuki CS. I would, but I don't own the bar, so i feel someone else can do the leg work.

I want to see how this bar compares to Vulcan, American Barbell, Ivanko's power bar (not that they are getting my business again), or even Rogue (not that I'd buy a bar from them after my DL bar fiasco).

I can't remember if it was you, Jason, or someone else who mentioned that he was worried about this bar chewing through the UHMW on his power rack j-cups. This has been a bone of contention with me. I'm glad it was brought to my attention. That might be a deal killer for me & might be the only instance I've see where a request for no knurling on the racked area of the bar is entirely justified.

Ha! no problem. Like I said I totally appreciate your opinions on this as well.

I will be getting the Vulcan SS Absolute Power bar sometime in January and also comparing these two bars to my existing bars which includes

* Original Black Oxide 32mm Jessup power bar that I absolutely LOVE the knurling on. New power bars from there seem to be some shinny coating. The knurling to me is a perfect powerlifting knurl. Deep Vulcano type of knurling. Using the terms used on that garage gym reviews review. It's supper grippy with out being painful at all. Digs into the back even with gear on. Only issue is back in 2013 I switched to a hook grip and just can't do it on 32mm well at all. I still like using this for squats sometimes and overhead pressing. It's become my beater bar too with doing landmine stuff and wrapped rack pulls. For alternate grip its great for building up grip strength on the deadlift. Makes pulling on a 27mm or 29mm bar feel easy both of which I've used at meets in different feds.

* Rogue B&R Bar v1 York made. I love it only because it's york made and style with the end pinned donuts. The knurl is super light but the bare steel helps a lot. I use this bar a lot for deadlifting and front squats. With hook the light knurl isn't much of a factor and the light knurl reduces the ripping up of my shins. So happy I got v1 of this bar when it was available.

* Westside Power bar v1. Another first version I like better then the second. I don't like the black sleeves on the v2 and from what I understand it has the same knurling type as on the ohio power bar now. The V1 Westside PB is sharp or a "pointy mountain" type. I like using this bar for squats now as it grips on the back really well. True low bar squatting a light "hill" type knurling is generally not liked. This bar grips. I'll bench with it at times too. If I know I'm headed to a meet with a texas bar or a sharp knurled bar I'll use this for all three lifts peaking into it. Otherwise it's not very shin friendly on the deadlifts. Fun first time hook grip videoinvolving passing out with this bar going full max effort.

* Rep Fitness Excalibur. Not necessarily a power bar though but is a mixed used type bar. Super light "hill" knurl like the B&R bar but has a mag. phosphate coating which is grippy. I will use this for some high pulls, power cleans, snatch stuff, etc. And OHP and front squats at times.

* Rogue Ohio Power bar bare steel version. It's a good bar. Great price for a good power bar. Good specs. Really nothing wrong with it and would recommend it for others lookinig for a good power bar at a good price with a good warranty and Customer service. However, I personally do not like the feel of this knurling. It's a "volcano" type knurling. But it's like each top has a bit of a roughness to it. I just do not like the feel of it. Just not my favorite. Otherwise good bar.

Otherwise have a bunch of other specialty bars like an old bow bar I got from westside years ago, EFS SS Yoke bar, EFS Cambered squat bar, and a Swiss bar I think I got from Edge fitness. But can't compare to those bars.

I think that's it.


And yes, I brought up the fact a few times that I really don't feel the Rockwell Hardness of the Kabuki power bar is really a big plus IMO. I have actually just bought some J-hooks with UHMW to replace my bare steel J-hooks on my old westside 2x2 combo rack. At least then I can replace the UHMW as it wears down. Really I'd rather the knurling on the bar wear down where the hooks are. When squatting, benching, pressing, etc I often have to slide the bar slightly to the right or left after my previous re-racking. Having knurl there makes it a bit tougher. My bars where it has worn down there makes it much easier to slide left or right.


Edit: and I can compare to other bars I've used in competition which include texas power bar, texas squat bar, texas deadlift bar, okie deadlift bar, mastodon, ivanko, eleiko, and bars I have had in the past like a cap ob86. Actually really liked the knurl on the capob86 for a general purpose knurl and bar. Talk about a great value bar.

I have never used an American Barbell bar though. I have looked at them many times over the years but the mild knurl has always held me off.

edit edit: oh and the commercial gym I do go to as well has a few other rogue bars in as well like a bella, ohio, and some other I can't remember. The ohio reminds me of the cap a bit.

[thejosef]

* Rogue Ohio Power bar bare steel version. It's a good bar. Great price for a good power bar. Good specs. Really nothing wrong with it and would recommend it for others lookinig for a good power bar at a good price with a good warranty and Customer service. However, I personally do not like the feel of this knurling. It's a "volcano" type knurling. But it's like each top has a bit of a roughness to it. I just do not like the feel of it. Just not my favorite. Otherwise good bar.

I've had that bar also and what you said matches my thoughts exactly on the knurl feel. It just has an unnecessarily sharp or rough feel to the knurl, IMO. Still an Excellent power bar, just not my favorite in use. I'm very curious to see how the Kabuki power bar compares..

[Mitcho7]

It looks like it was done in high school metal shop by kids using a lathe for the first time.

Only one of the cutters was making deep contact with the bar.

The knurling on my zinc duffalo bar looks prime, but its one of the later 55lb ones so maybe things were fixed by then.

Im more interested in the KS squat bar than the power bar, hopefully they go out soon and we can see a review. Im surprised we havent seen footage of duffin squatting a huge amount using the bar or another one of the drop tests like they did for the duffalo bar.

[jimbuick]

The knurling on my zinc duffalo bar looks prime, but its one of the later 55lb ones so maybe things were fixed by then.

Im more interested in the KS squat bar than the power bar, hopefully they go out soon and we can see a review. Im surprised we havent seen footage of duffin squatting a huge amount using the bar or another one of the drop tests like they did for the duffalo bar.

I was told they are supposed to receive them (from plating) on Tuesday and that mine would "be the first one out."