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  1. #61
    Registered User bobilly's Avatar
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    As most people are saying here, don't waste your time asking that question and reading through the replies. Being honest with you in that you are better off spending your time reading about (aka googling it and reading different sources, comparing the results and then making a decision). I would recommend staying away from the stock market, because it isn't a perfect science that requires a lot of time and focus. You can't just jump drop $10k and expect to make money. Put that $10k into a Roth IRA/401k and save yourself the pain.
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  2. #62
    Mr. Gecko Kiknskreem's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by bobilly View Post
    I would recommend staying away from the stock market, because it isn't a perfect science that requires a lot of time and focus.
    Passive investing requires no time or focus.


    Originally Posted by bobilly View Post
    You can't just jump drop $10k and expect to make money.
    If you simply invest in a diversified index and let it sit long term, you will actually most likely make very good money.


    Originally Posted by bobilly View Post
    Put that $10k into a Roth IRA/401k and save yourself the pain.
    IRA's and 401k's are simply types of accounts, you still have to choose your investments.
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  3. #63
    Registered User bobilly's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Kiknskreem View Post
    Passive investing requires no time or focus.




    If you simply invest in a diversified index and let it sit long term, you will actually most likely make very good money.




    IRA's and 401k's are simply types of accounts, you still have to choose your investments.
    Thank you for the clarification. Correct me if I am wrong, but I was told Scottrade is more ideal for Index funds because of ease of use with research and investing.
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  4. #64
    Registered User Dan_S's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Letthemcome View Post
    Yeah so wait for it to come down genius.

    Actually the reason people invest in index funds is because they want a steady return. **** me there's some low iq people on here.

    And just lol at people saying you can't time the market. Yes you can. Stop repeating garbage you've read like a robot. Obviously if the market has skyrocketed far higher and longer than ever before, the probability of it continuing to do so for much longer is low. That's not to say you can time when it will crash. But you know it will go back down. You know they're starting to raise interest rates. So you time your entry for when it does go back down, especially if it's an index fund of only stocks. You don't just enter at any random moment you morons. I already gave you the example of waiting 11 years just for a return from 2000-2011 but of course you all ignored that despite it being direct proof that you're wrong because you read that 'you can't time the market' so you just repeat it mindlessly.
    I agree with you that the reason people invest in index funds is for a steady return. And really, the biggest part of that is due to fees (index funds are generally low fee and will outperform an actively managed fund with high fees almost every single time).

    And yes, the market will eventually come down. It always does. But then it'll go back up. How do you know when you're actually buying and selling the dip?

    Play this game and see if you can beat it This game will show you just how foolish it is to sell stocks right now. Also, keep in mind that it's based on historical periods, so you can potentially beat it if you know enough about historical performance. With that knowledge, can you still beat it? Or does it just reinforce how difficult that is?

    Anyway, I mostly wanted to address your point about interest rates. Everyone thought that when the Fed finally raised them last week, the market would surely get the drop that we've been waiting for. And what happened? All those people waiting for the dip were wrong. Again. Or hell, what about all the people that were sure a Trump win would mean a significant drop. Meanwhile we're up like 16%.

    I'm also not sure what your example was between 2001 and 2011, but had you bought in regularly over those years, you would have made a significant amount of money. Most people don't just buy in one year and hold it for a decade. They buy every month, or maybe even two weeks. Dollar cost averaging in a long period like that is quite advantageous because you DO end up buying most of the dips. You get the peaks too, but it evens out the volatility.
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  5. #65
    Registered User Sh1f7's Avatar
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    Save yourself the hassle OP and just take your 10k to vegas and put it all on red.
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  6. #66
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    Originally Posted by bobilly View Post
    Thank you for the clarification. Correct me if I am wrong, but I was told Scottrade is more ideal for Index funds because of ease of use with research and investing.
    Ease of use in regards to buying index funds? I can't imagine "ease of use" is anything more than a marketing line. You want low fee index funds, preferably < .1%
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  7. #67
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    Originally Posted by Dan_S View Post
    I agree with you that the reason people invest in index funds is for a steady return. And really, the biggest part of that is due to fees (index funds are generally low fee and will outperform an actively managed fund with high fees almost every single time).

    And yes, the market will eventually come down. It always does. But then it'll go back up. How do you know when you're actually buying and selling the dip?

    Play this game and see if you can beat it This game will show you just how foolish it is to sell stocks right now. Also, keep in mind that it's based on historical periods, so you can potentially beat it if you know enough about historical performance. With that knowledge, can you still beat it? Or does it just reinforce how difficult that is?

    Anyway, I mostly wanted to address your point about interest rates. Everyone thought that when the Fed finally raised them last week, the market would surely get the drop that we've been waiting for. And what happened? All those people waiting for the dip were wrong. Again. Or hell, what about all the people that were sure a Trump win would mean a significant drop. Meanwhile we're up like 16%.

    I'm also not sure what your example was between 2001 and 2011, but had you bought in regularly over those years, you would have made a significant amount of money. Most people don't just buy in one year and hold it for a decade. They buy every month, or maybe even two weeks. Dollar cost averaging in a long period like that is quite advantageous because you DO end up buying most of the dips. You get the peaks too, but it evens out the volatility.
    Really oversimplified question to your response:

    DCA every 2 weeks would typically reduce your time in the market? If you're spreading your contributions out over a year but could afford to put more in sooner isn't it a disservice? I fully understand you're trying to hedge against volitity but if you're investing for retirement (30+ years in the market) shouldn't it be more important just to get those funds rolling with whatever you're able to contribute especially with dividends?
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  8. #68
    Mr. Gecko Kiknskreem's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by allianc3 View Post
    DCA every 2 weeks would typically reduce your time in the market? If you're spreading your contributions out over a year but could afford to put more in sooner isn't it a disservice? I fully understand you're trying to hedge against volitity but if you're investing for retirement (30+ years in the market) shouldn't it be more important just to get those funds rolling with whatever you're able to contribute especially with dividends?
    Most people DCA their investments by default because they buy investments over time as they are earning money.

    But yes, according to Vanguard's studies, in about two thirds of cases it is better to lump sum invest than dollar cost average, if you were to already have a sum of money to be invested.
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  9. #69
    Work Hard. Play Hard. XterraRob's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by pelbismeasly View Post
    About to drop 10k on some stocks, whats a good buy now? Some have suggested Nvidia, Tesla.
    Wouldn't buy stocks, better served investing in an ETF since the market is over-valued.
    Education is humanity's key to salvation.
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  10. #70
    Mr. Gecko Kiknskreem's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by XterraRob View Post
    Wouldn't buy stocks, better served investing in an ETF.
    Derp.

    An ETF is just a 'wrapper' for a particular investment. An ETF could be stocks, bonds, currencies, etc.
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  11. #71
    Registered User CHARBACK's Avatar
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    I suggest hookers and cocaine instead
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  12. #72
    Work Hard. Play Hard. XterraRob's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Kiknskreem View Post
    Derp.

    An ETF is just a 'wrapper' for a particular investment. An ETF could be stocks, bonds, currencies, etc.
    I have no respect for the way you respond to posters in this thread, really disrespectful for someone coming off as knowledgeable yet unable to restrain emotion.

    Since I should of assumed you'd jump on my post, I should of said individual stocks. For someone not familiar with where they want to put their money, an ETF would be the safest bet.
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  13. #73
    Mr. Gecko Kiknskreem's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by XterraRob View Post
    Since I should of assumed you'd jump on my post, I should of said individual stocks...
    Well, I agree you should have said 'individual stocks', though not because I would jump on your post, but because it changes the meaning of your post entirely.
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  14. #74
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    You guys went full derail, figured we got some input on individual stocks instead went full ETF and IRA

    Stock market is going full Trump if you havent noticed, probably for the next 8 years. I have faith in the Emperor.
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  15. #75
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    Best way to know what stocks to invest in is to eavesdrop on Wall Street bankers during lunch break.

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  16. #76
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    Why don't you ask notbadnotbrad
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  17. #77
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    I out performed the market by like 400% and I'm a retard just invest in emerging industries and do your dd
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    Originally Posted by quadfecta View Post
    Why don't you ask notbadnotbrad
    I heard his career is over after this little stunt he pulled

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    algorithmic trading not even once ITT.

    Look it up boyos.

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    MO and PM

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    Originally Posted by CptClean View Post
    I out performed the market by like 400% and I'm a retard just invest in emerging industries and do your dd
    Cool, now do it consistently over time and you'll be the world's greatest investor!
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  22. #82
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    Originally Posted by Kiknskreem View Post
    Cool, now do it consistently over time and you'll be the world's greatest investor!
    Your posts are really helpful but your delivery sucks

    Got a rep for you later
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  23. #83
    Registered User Dan_S's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by allianc3 View Post
    Really oversimplified question to your response:

    DCA every 2 weeks would typically reduce your time in the market? If you're spreading your contributions out over a year but could afford to put more in sooner isn't it a disservice? I fully understand you're trying to hedge against volitity but if you're investing for retirement (30+ years in the market) shouldn't it be more important just to get those funds rolling with whatever you're able to contribute especially with dividends?
    Originally Posted by Kiknskreem View Post
    Most people DCA their investments by default because they buy investments over time as they are earning money.

    But yes, according to Vanguard's studies, in about two thirds of cases it is better to lump sum invest than dollar cost average, if you were to already have a sum of money to be invested.
    Kiknskreem mostly answered it. My example was just because he mentioned 2001 to 2011 as if he was only looking at start value and end value. While that works if someone is doing a lump sum, the vast majority (probably all) investors don't do that. At the very least you might have a lump sum in a year, but then continue to invest over the next decade. The only exception I suppose would be retirees.

    But you're correct that time in market almost always beats DCA. I think the biggest overlooked reason why is that you get dividend payouts on all your shares, and the longer you own them the more you get. While DCA might have you buy in some shares lower (and hence cheaper, potentially getting more total shares), because you own them for less time it may be a wash. And you're only going to come out ahead with DCA if you get lucky and end up timing the market by accident.

    I think the biggest takeaway for people should be that most of us are going to be long term investors. When you're talking about 401k's and IRA's, that's a given. Long term investors maximize their performance with time, and that's why doing a lump sum in an index fund wins. Lump sum means more time in the market, and almost no institutional investors can beat an index over a long period of time.
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    I'd go physical metals, this bubble gonna burst soon dog, dead serious. Lolz at 21k dow and the usa is economically devastated outside of cities.
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