Eating Disorder Support Thread: "Take Action" (part 3)

[Vanzero]

Hello everybody, it's been a while! I hope you're all doing well

I've been away from social media for a while now, trying to stay away from triggering stuff...I feel like it helped a lot.

Now I'm back lol unfortunately I haven't gained weight at all, I weighted myself today and I'm sitting at 59kg.

I don't know if it is normal, but I've been feeling hotter during the day and ESPECIALLY during the nights, like getting up in the middle of the night sweating a lot :/ I feel like I should go for a check up...especially since I've been eating more...Makes me wanna track in order to see where I'm at but I also feel like that would trigger the ED again...

I really don't know what to do lol.

Well, rant over. I'm going to start using the forum again so I wish you guys the best in this recovery let's kick some ED ass together

[fretslayer]

Sounds like progress my friend. Keep it up!

Thanks man, I have been putting in the work that's for sure. My big struggle is more with Body Image and how much it effects me. I'm going through hell with that one unfortunately.

Digging through things in therapy, one day I feel like I'm making progress and then bam, I get hit with a physical trigger (seeing/feeling the body fat adding up) and I'm knocked backwards into ED/Disordered thinking and feeling. It's been rough.

[AdamWW]

Thanks man, I have been putting in the work that's for sure. My big struggle is more with Body Image and how much it effects me. I'm going through hell with that one unfortunately.

Digging through things in therapy, one day I feel like I'm making progress and then bam, I get hit with a physical trigger (seeing/feeling the body fat adding up) and I'm knocked backwards into ED/Disordered thinking and feeling. It's been rough.

It happens man. Keep pressing on. You can do it.

[clk99]

I know this has probably been asked plenty of times by myself and others...but honestly how do you know when to stop eating? I eat until I'm mentally sick and tired of food, yet physically feel driven to go back for more...other times I'll become physically stuffed to the point of feeling sick and uncomfortable yet feel mentally driven to eat more, whether it's cravings or just a general urge.


I know physical and mental hunger are both important to honor in recovery, but right now it seems they can't ever agree on a point of satisfaction.

[AdamWW]

I know this has probably been asked plenty of times by myself and others...but honestly how do you know when to stop eating? I eat until I'm mentally sick and tired of food, yet physically feel driven to go back for more...other times I'll become physically stuffed to the point of feeling sick and uncomfortable yet feel mentally driven to eat more, whether it's cravings or just a general urge.


I know physical and mental hunger are both important to honor in recovery, but right now it seems they can't ever agree on a point of satisfaction.

You know to stop eating when you're satisfied, same as how you know when to stop drinking when you're thirsty.

Physical hunger is largely the result of malnourishment, meaning your body is lacking in some nutrition due to a chronic net calorie deficit. Mental hunger is more related to your decision making process being one of restriction. It's classical conditioning... your brain is testing whether you will continue to starve and kill yourself.

The idea is to eat until your body feels physically good/satisfied and/or you no longer want (mentally) to eat more.

It's much simpler than it probably seems, but it really is that simple.

When you were a toddler, I'm betting you didn't just eat until you puked... somewhere along the line you lost your way
No one is saying to force food in if you won't want it, but there is definitely more than one kind of 'want' in these situations.

Sadly it can mean a lot of discomfort sometimes.

[Bentley41]

Guys, let me be honest. Your advice was very counterproductive for me. When I talked about binge eating and what not, and you guys pretty much told me to eat whatever I want and my relationship with food will normalize, and it didn't. I just recently read a book Never Binge Again and it was some harsh, but good advice.

[ErikTheElectric]

^ A few things.

1. You are receiving "advice" from individuals who deal with eating disorders, not medical advice.
2. You were advised to seek ACTUAL medical advice from a professional a few pages back, if you would like I can repost the link for you.
3. "fixing an eating disorder" isn't about simply "eating whatever I want and my relationship with food will normalize".

[Bentley41]

^ A few things.

1. You are receiving "advice" from individuals who deal with eating disorders, not medical advice.
2. You were advised to seek ACTUAL medical advice from a professional a few pages back, if you would like I can repost the link for you.
3. "fixing an eating disorder" isn't about simply "eating whatever I want and my relationship with food will normalize".

noted. I just wanted to share my experience.
And on finding a therapist I contacted like 5 psychologist on PsychologyToday last week and none have responded. What's up with that? And on the NEDA website you posted theirs no one near my area code that deals with BED. And thats supposed to be the most common Ed

[ErikTheElectric]

The NEDA one is very broad, when it comes down to finding a therapist, you need to explore more websites! But props for taking the steps!

Feel free to PM me your zip code and I'd be more than happy to find one. And also, you need to seek help from a therapist, not necessarily a psychologist.

[Bentley41]

The NEDA one is very broad, when it comes down to finding a therapist, you need to explore more websites! But props for taking the steps!

Feel free to PM me your zip code and I'd be more than happy to find one. And also, you need to seek help from a therapist, not necessarily a psychologist.

it says you have too many PMs and need to delete some before I can message you

[Grappa]

Guys, let me be honest. Your advice was very counterproductive for me. When I talked about binge eating and what not, and you guys pretty much told me to eat whatever I want and my relationship with food will normalize, and it didn't. I just recently read a book Never Binge Again and it was some harsh, but good advice.

Taking care of your mental health during recovery is the most important thing. Once you figure out what causes your ED, and u can make things clear in you head, that is the point when your relationship with food will normalize. That is why it is so important to work with a therapist/psychiatrist/psychologist, so you can figure out together what causes your ed. I am not gonna lie, actually my psychiatrist saved my life, she helped me the most. I am not saying that i am fully recovered cuz my past still haunts me a bit, but i have learned that self destruction/restriction is a terrible way to escape reality. Once u are able to indentify your triggers, once you are gonna have a better understanging why u are having an ED, the voice of your ed will slowly going to fade away!!! I wish u my bests! And take care of your mental health more than anything!

[AdamWW]

Guys, let me be honest. Your advice was very counterproductive for me. When I talked about binge eating and what not, and you guys pretty much told me to eat whatever I want and my relationship with food will normalize, and it didn't. I just recently read a book Never Binge Again and it was some harsh, but good advice.

I am only referring to my own input toward your situation (pages 32,34,35, and 38 of this thread), but please refer back to page 32 of this thread wherein I stated that you are likely not over or fully aware of the deeper causes of your ED. In my response there I asked/suggested you seek professional help at your school.

In future posts toward you, I always prefaced by saying that "it depends on the type of ED" you have.

That being said, it appears in many cases that advice being given was based on the possibility you were binging in response to restriction, and in some cases your feedback sounded like extreme hunger, the treatment for which is to respond to that hunger and eat to satisfaction to repair your body. Treatment for BED, IIRC, is more focused on treating the mental/emotional triggers while minimizing damage done by the binged themselves.

I'm sorry you're still struggling

[Bronzzi]

Old poster here, have been suffering from anorexia which eventually turned into binge/restrict and it eventually lead to binge/purge and now I'm somewhat normal (imo you never fully recover from eating disorders)

Regarding the cravings, I used to think food 24/7, dreaming of food all the time, it absolutely ruined me. I would think all the time oh if I could have more ice cream or oh how that pizza sounds lovely or oh maan I would love to eat more potatoes but nope, I've already had enough according to my calories ( and I was eating 5000 ish calories at that point which is plenty for normal people )

Then one day I realized, why on earth am I suffering with thoughts of food daily, this is not a way to live. I'm a young man, I shouldn't be restricting myself if I sometimes feel the need to eat something or if I overate. Then I just said **** it. I went to the grocery store, got everything I wanted, went to fast food places etc and got literally everything I could've dreamed of and ate closer to 24 000 calories that day ( yes I counted it via myfitnesspal and I remember this very well, since this was the first day to a better life srs )

After that day I felt absolutely god awful by the next day and thought to myself I'll never eat that much again. Well I continued eating my normal calories and macros and remaining my super super low bodyfat at the time and after few days I started to think about food even more than I'd never have and I became depressed how my mind is constantly occupied with thoughts of food.

I decided to have a ''**** it'' day again, exactly similar as I mentioned above, pretty much the same amount of calories etc. And again I felt god awful the next day and I thought what should I do to not let the same happen again, me starting to think about food etc. So first thing in the morning, I started stuffing myself with food again. I had no hunger, I felt god awful and full from the day before but I didn't care. Ate still over 10 000 calories that day. Repeated the same process for everyday for almost 2 weeks. Ate anything I wanted and even more, way over past the point of feeling good. Only vomited twice because I felt so full. I just ate non stop, clean and junk foods, and did not went to the gym for that 2 weeks at all.

Well obviously I gained weight, a lot, I went from super low bodyfat, where my abs were easily visible without flexing to the point where I couldn't see them no matter how hard I flexed them in just 2 weeks but guess what? Ever since that 2 week period I was no longer thinking about food nearly at all and still today don't think about it.

Eventually I learned it's just food and fitness, my bodyfat got lower again and nowadays I'm still super lean and I'm happy with myself and occasionally splurge with food etc. but the most important part is I no longer feel the food is controlling me, I no longer think about food as often and I can actually enjoy life instead

I feel 239239x times better these days and I'm just as lean as I was in my darkest days ( yes I know being lean isn't important, fuk being lean )

My point just is, if you feel you are constantly craving something and one cheat day here and there won't help, have a 2 week long cheat period, and eat until you feel physically and mentally ill and way beyond that for 2 weeks straight, that helped me and I guarantee it should help you too

[AdamWW]

@bronzzi

I'd avoid 'guanteeing' such a thing. Everyone is different and you shouldn't call it a 'cheat'

Glad you're feeling better

[Strength93]

@bronzzi

I'd avoid 'guanteeing' such a thing. Everyone is different and you shouldn't call it a 'cheat'

Glad you're feeling better

Totally agree, Adam!

@ clk99
Whenever I become physically stuffed to the point of feeling sick and uncomfortable I ALWAYS feel mentally driven to eat more. Just trying to point out that you are not alone.

[MosToorani]

Whenever I become physically stuffed to the point of feeling sick and uncomfortable I ALWAYS feel mentally driven to eat more. Just trying to point out that you are not alone.

I agree with this...

I remember those days where I ate upwards of 10 cals..

In my head it was a 'fuk it mentality' .. I kept on telling myself "why not, I came this far" and I'd stuff my face with mediocre stuff like protein bars, rice cakes, plain toast etc.. until I'd pass out, literally.

Haven't had a day like that in about 6 months or so.. in other words, it's been a while.

Now when I come close to having that 'fuk it' mentality. I'd calm myself down and convince myself that it isn't the right thing to do. Now whether I'm correct in convincing myself or not, I don't know.

Cheers

MT

[Bentley41]

I am only referring to my own input toward your situation (pages 32,34,35, and 38 of this thread), but please refer back to page 32 of this thread wherein I stated that you are likely not over or fully aware of the deeper causes of your ED. In my response there I asked/suggested you seek professional help at your school.

In future posts toward you, I always prefaced by saying that "it depends on the type of ED" you have.

That being said, it appears in many cases that advice being given was based on the possibility you were binging in response to restriction, and in some cases your feedback sounded like extreme hunger, the treatment for which is to respond to that hunger and eat to satisfaction to repair your body. Treatment for BED, IIRC, is more focused on treating the mental/emotional triggers while minimizing damage done by the binged themselves.

I'm sorry you're still struggling

I totally appericate your help and everyone elses.
in the book I read, Never Binge Again, the main point I got from it is to just straight up NEVER BINGE AGAIN. Idk why I didnt think if it lol. But I'm still trying to get a therapist and have emailed several (with the help of Erik) but in the mean time, just never Binge again. of course he gives a really good way of not doing it, which is hard to explain, and if i try I'll fail.

[clk99]

You know to stop eating when you're satisfied, same as how you know when to stop drinking when you're thirsty.

I used to, yes, but after manipulating my body's eating habits and restricting I can't seem to grasp what satisfaction is. My assumption is that my body isn't sending the signals. I always have to convince myself I've had enough by distracting myself from food and moving on.

@ clk99
Whenever I become physically stuffed to the point of feeling sick and uncomfortable I ALWAYS feel mentally driven to eat more. Just trying to point out that you are not alone.

That's exactly how it is for me, too. Thank you.

Usually I end up feeling much more hungry after I've eaten than I did before I started...which gives me a lot of anxiety toward eating since I'm afraid I won't be able to stop, even though I love food and the freedom to eat whatever I want.

Since we share a few similarities I don't know if you're like this either, but while "binging" I rarely eat an excessive amount of any one food. It'll always be a normal to large-sized portion of one food, then more of another type of food, and so on. Kind of getting bored with one food and spreading the session around. I can easily stop after 1 bowl of ice cream for example, but the urge to consume more food of any type is so overwhelming that I have to grab an apple or cook myself something in response.

In my head it was a 'fuk it mentality' .. I kept on telling myself "why not, I came this far" and I'd stuff my face with mediocre stuff like protein bars, rice cakes, plain toast etc.. until I'd pass out, literally.

Now when I come close to having that 'fuk it' mentality. I'd calm myself down and convince myself that it isn't the right thing to do. Now whether I'm correct in convincing myself or not, I don't know.

I can relate. I'll remind myself that I'm a growing teenager, that I'm in a huge deficit from my ED, and just ask myself "why not". But after gorging on food alone in my room at late hours, I ask myself if it was really worth it just to satisfy that confusing drive to eat, and whether or not I truly enjoyed it.

As a side note, I tend to stuff my face with mediocre foods too...cereal, fruit and yogurt in particular. However, once I begin eating something high fat+high carb that I would have feared in the past (such as pizza), I'll begin craving more foods like grilled cheese, waffles, etc.

This is just me, but I try and center my eating in social contexts as much as possible to make it a more pleasant experience...then again I can't always eat as much as I want in those situations, so not always practical. If it's damaging your relationship with food and putting a strain on other parts of your life then no I'd say it's not the right thing to do, otherwise honor the hunger if you're recovering.

[fretslayer]

It happens man. Keep pressing on. You can do it.

Cheers buddy, I'm gonna keep on fighting.

[AdamWW]

I totally appericate your help and everyone elses.
in the book I read, Never Binge Again, the main point I got from it is to just straight up NEVER BINGE AGAIN. Idk why I didnt think if it lol. But I'm still trying to get a therapist and have emailed several (with the help of Erik) but in the mean time, just never Binge again. of course he gives a really good way of not doing it, which is hard to explain, and if i try I'll fail.

I hope the author didn't make much money from that because I could have given the same advice. Lol

[Grappa]

Okay guys, i am going to be brutally honest here. I am going to deatail everything what happened me during refeeding, and how much damage can a restrictive ed can make to your body.

So at 2016 04.12 i was diagnosed with anorexia nervosa restrictive subtype along with chronic depression, self harm issues and a really bad addiction issues. I have not eaten anything for 4 months just drank bottles of wine/vodka combined with massive amounts of ***** to make myself a zombie, pass out sleep and repeat. Cuz of this awesome habit i have reached an extremely dangerous weight, i have weighted 44kg before i have passed out at home and got hospitalised, where i was between life and death for 2 weeks.

My skin was yellow cuz my liver started to shut down, along with my kidneys. I have lost increadible amount of muscle mass, cuz of this my core was not strong enough to hold my organs, i have developed s****osis along with 3 herniated discs cuz my spinal erectors was unable to keep my spine in neutral position. My hair stopped growing, my nails was really fragile and thin, i was cold 24/7, my skin was really dry. And i had digestive issues. Now that i have learned to accept and love myself i will NEVER forgive what i have done to my body.

After the hospital i have received a mealplan, i had to stay in bedrest, etc etc. I was able to stick to that mealplan for 3 days. To be honest i was not even hungry until i have started eating during that time. After that 3 days i said okay idgaf i am hungrier than this and i have experienced the thing called "extreme hunger". Mentally i have dealt with this easily, i admit that this period was waaaay more easier for me to deal with cuz i never had issues with my weight/body image/with food in my entire life, so gaining weight/fat not haunted me. I have experienced refeeding edema, my joints was swollen, i cuould bareley walk during that time, i was in massive pain. To be honest this was the worst part, the pain + the withdrawal effects of *****. I was in so much pain that i screamed and scratched my wall in the middle of the night. Time went by and i stopped gaining weight, my docs ordered a thyroid profile test asap, it turned out that i had/have an overactive thyroid. So i became hypermetabolic. I had/still experiencing the typical symptoms of this condition, which is increased body temperature, which was soo elevated during last summer that i had borderline fever for almost 3 months straight, the dreaded night sweats, and the hot flushes after meals. Luckily this settled down to a certain degree, but it is still present and my docs refuses to prescribe medications for it cuz they want it to heal by itself.

At august i have reached a kinda low-normal weight. That was the time when my bloodwork came back good, so i was allowed to do lifting and hunting. So i have picked up da iron time went by, yes i have gained weight in a pretty good rate this time, but what happened is that i started to gain strength really fast. And almost 2 months ago during my weight in my docs stated that i am too lean so i have to gain fat. So my intake was increased by tremendously. I am not saying that i am experiencing extreme hunger again, but my appetite is deff increased cuz of the low bf%.

How i was able to stop coping with restriction: Breaking my habits was hard, really really hard. Also accepting myself again and not dancing for others like a puppet. Cuz i have been treated really really badly, she sucked the life, the happiness, my personality, my emotions, my will out of me. (and this is not a referring to a mind blowing bj. xD) And yes, i have almost relapsed during mid september after an one night stand where i have realised how humans can use others for their own good without giving a fk about the other person's emotions. And this reminded me what i have been through, so i had a 2 day period where i have almost returned to my old habits, but i was able to get my **** togather in time.

Hope this post can be informative for some1 who is dealing with something what i have experienced so far, if so, keep in mind, you are not alone!

[MosToorani]

@Grappa Thank you for sharing your experience. I commend you for your fight.

My plan is to ditch the counting and tracking etc soon enough. I'll be experimenting starting this Saturday (the start of the religious fasting month). I'll be eating what's cooked at home etc.

My concern is what most of the posters have already pointed out. Just like Clk mentioned as well. It's the extreme desire for high calorie foods like sweets and deep fried stuff.

With my experience of counting calories, I know that these foods are high in calorie and I'm worried that if I'm not tracking everything I eat then I would overeat these foods. I'm worried that restriction would happen and that my ED will stop me from having these foods freely. Deep down, I know that the ED will try to stop me and I'm worried that I'll listen to it.

So what should I do? Eat these high calorie foods in moderation and fill the rest of the foods with volume? Eat normally and have a few bites of these 'delicacies'?

I'm used to eating lots of veggies + fruits and then fitting ice cream or sweets in my daily caloric allowance. So yeah, the worry is that I'll automatically restrict ice cream and sweets by listening to restrictive ED.

How would one deal with that? I have a large stomach capacity. Should I eat 80% volume and whole foods + 20% treats for example?

How did you guys go through this phase of recovery?

Cheers

MT

[ErikTheElectric]

^ That is the primary reason why you should be doing as much as possible to reach out to those closest to you in regards to your recovery and how impacting it is on your day to day life. Have you told them that you disclose (What you have disclosed) to an online forum of strangers? You've been (from what I've read when I do pop in here from time to time) trying to recover from an eating disorder on your own accord, which 99% of the time is not realistic.

If you truly have a large stomach capacity, the LAST thing you should be doing is feeding yourself during these stages. You're still viewing food as "treats" and using it as a reward mechanism. When in reality you need to be in a regimented treatment facility, under the eyes of therapists that can help you get through this. I know that you've stated that therapists aren't available, but medical doctors ARE available and eating disorders aren't unnoticed in society.

[MosToorani]

@Erik

Yes.. Friends, family and even coworkers are aware of my ED.

The last time I tried to reach out to a therapist, he immediately wanted to put me on SSRI (I think that's what the medicine is called).

Can you provide any sort of advice that I can use during this period? This sort of disorder is not taken seriously here unfortunately.

Cheers

MT

[AdamWW]

^ That is the primary reason why you should be doing as much as possible to reach out to those closest to you in regards to your recovery and how impacting it is on your day to day life. Have you told them that you disclose (What you have disclosed) to an online forum of strangers? You've been (from what I've read when I do pop in here from time to time) trying to recover from an eating disorder on your own accord, which 99% of the time is not realistic.

If you truly have a large stomach capacity, the LAST thing you should be doing is feeding yourself during these stages. You're still viewing food as "treats" and using it as a reward mechanism. When in reality you need to be in a regimented treatment facility, under the eyes of therapists that can help you get through this. I know that you've stated that therapists aren't available, but medical doctors ARE available and eating disorders aren't unnoticed in society.

X2 on the reward system.

Until recently I had not realized how much I both punished and rewarded myself with food. I would go play golf, and I would end the round feeling justified in eating what I wanted afterward if I did well. Conversely, I would eat less and more strictly if I did poorly.

It's very, very difficult to break those habits, and right now I don't know if I would be making progress if I wasn't able to pull the lessons I learned from my anxiety treatment (CBT) into my ED recovery. It really is invaluable.

[MosToorani]

@Adam

Cheers for that.

I've been on the reward system as well, unfortunately.

I hate it.

I hate that my ED is controlling me.

Cheers

MT

[deadliftbrah19]

Mos, take some deep breath, and caaaaaaaalm down. Gather all of your manliness and take action. Face your fears and make them to your bitch. Drive your attention from your apperance to your performance and how u feel on a daily basis. No1 fking cares about your skin, no1 fking cares about how you look, no 1 fking cares about if u have abs or not. You are a person not a statue so stop fking judging yourself god damn it. Live your life at it's fullest, enjoy your youth, cuz no1 will going to give this time back to you when you are older. How u want to remember back to your 20's when u are 50-60 years old? You want to see a guy who is afraid of food, judging himself without a reason and lives his day in a constant fear of fat/weight gain? Or u want to see a guy who is energetic as fk, banging chicks left and right enjoying his life, does stupid **** with his friends and smiles a lot?. Listen, i have faced DEATH, and i can tell you you should live your life at it's fullest... I am really sorry for being a rude now, but i can not see you suffer. You are a nice guy just please for god's sake TRY to overcome your irrational fears.

Okay you was obese. You had an ED during that time? You had a care free life? You was able to feel happiness? Cuz i can tell you, i would rather be obese, than like who i was during the peak of my ED almost a year ago.

As someone who has battled an ED from age 22 to 45, recovered with relapses, I don't know but perhaps I am looking at this as too harsh for MosToorani.

To someone in the midst of an ED, being obese is the worst fear possible. Even now I would be scared of that thought and I'm at my biggest size since pregnancy.

I don't know the right answer as I've had some therapists who did more damage than help. For me Dialectical Behavioral Therapy worked the best.

[Grappa]

As someone who has battled an ED from age 22 to 45, recovered with relapses, I don't know but perhaps I am looking at this as too harsh for MosToorani.

To someone in the midst of an ED, being obese is the worst fear possible. Even now I would be scared of that thought and I'm at my biggest size since pregnancy.

I don't know the right answer as I've had some therapists who did more damage than help. For me Dialectical Behavioral Therapy worked the best.

You are right, i was harsh for a reason. My situation would be much better if someone during the peak of my ed woul shake me and tell me that dude stop slowly killing yourself. Cuz my harsh lesson was when life slammed my doors and i have experienced a close call. I do not know if any of u have experienced such things i really hope not. To this given day i do not know how i am alive. Even the docs while i was at the hospital told my parents that i will prbly going to die...

[MosToorani]

@Grappa @Deadlift and the rest.

I actually appreciate the harshness or directness. I'm a stubborn individual that has been controlled by my OCD and ED.

I need the harshness to get me back on track. It has helped me so far and I want to kick this ED ouT of my life!

It has put way too much stress on my life and my family's.

Thank you all for the support and advice.

Cheers

MT

[Grappa]

@Grappa @Deadlift and the rest.

I actually appreciate the harshness or directness. I'm a stubborn individual that has been controlled by my OCD and ED.

I need the harshness to get me back on track. It has helped me so far and I want to kick this ED ouT of my life!

It has put way too much stress on my life and my family's.

Thank you all for the support and advice.

Cheers

MT

You are not stubborn as a person, your ed makes you stubborn. When u are over with your ED you ll going to understand what i am talking about.