B.S Exercise Physiology. ask me your training questions

[tank2003]

I was diagnosed with disc herniation (L4/L5 and L5/S1) one year ago, but I have had the issue for several years prior to that. I know that squats are usually the trigger for severe pain for me.

During good periods, I perform well. In others, the pain is demotivating and sometimes prevents me from doing any exercise that puts stress on my lower back. What exercises do you recommend? Right now I'm doing one-legged squats and regular deadlifts. I also do stretching, especially hamstrings. It doesn't get really bad, but during the last couple of weeks there has been constant aching (not debilitating). Is that a sign to STOP what I'm doing? In any case, I'd just like to know more.

I feel your pain bro. I ruptured my L5/S1 in 2012./ Surgery fixed it but i now have scar tissue the size of my thumb impinging my left sciatic nerve at the root. Hurts 1000x worse than when it was ruptured. My arthritis is way more advanced now though. The main cause of lumbar disc bulging/herniations is a weak core. The muscles hold the joints stable to prevent un-necessary translation. When one joint moves too much, a bulge can happen and it touches the nerve root. If your problem isnt THAT significant, then core work should help you out. Here are some videos that will tell you what you need to know (better than me trying to explain it all)

[anonymous]

Thanks, I will look through those!

[jesusxchrist]

Jeff Cavalier is the fukkin GOAT

[Ace Corona]

Yeah man after this semester I’ll be a senior. Think ima try taking stats over the summer. Gonna take really good fukkin notes and come home and ACTUALLY study them and practice everything out. I hate math but I just gotta stop being a lazy fuk when it comes to it.

Algebra shouldn’t be too bad since that’s all we’re doing in my health related fitness assessment class.

If you're bad at math, isn't taking it during Summer more intense? An 18 or 16 week semester is compressed into 6 weeks, so Monday through Thursday you have class for 4 hours a day. I took an English class in the summer and got an A for the semester, but I told myself never to take a summer class again, unless it's a P.E. class.

[jesusxchrist]

If you're bad at math, isn't taking it during Summer more intense? An 18 or 16 week semester is compressed into 6 weeks, so Monday through Thursday you have class for 4 hours a day. I took an English class in the summer and got an A for the semester, but I told myself never to take a summer class again, unless it's a P.E. class.

There’s less of a work load with summer classes. In fall and spring I take 5 or 6 classes, in summer I take 2 classes and one lab. I can focus more on stats if I take it in the summer and get it over with in 5 weeks.

[Reformed146]

Good read, but you might want to revise this bit:

In order to keep the body from over heating and damaging organs, it works harder to release the heat, which is the only way to lose energy according to Sir Issac Newton's 1st Law of Thermodynamics (Energy cannot be created, nor destroyed, just lost in the form of heat. Logically, man-made machines are exempt from this law.)

The work and heat both transfer energy, and man made machines aren't exempt. I get you were in the context of stimulants where only heat is relevant, but it reads like it can be applied more generally. Great post though.

[SpeedCheeser]

Hey, first off thanks for doing this. Going to be watching those lower back vids above to try and help with my l4/l5 - l5/s1 issues.

Okay serious question op

My shoulders are very sore the day after my chest day. I do incline bench, flat bench, and chest dips.

Is that a bad sign? I don't want something bad to happen to my shoulders if they were being overworked.

Long story short, yes. Your anterior delts should be sore, not your actual shoulder joint (where the humerus meets the scapulas; technically speaking, the should is called the glenohumeral joint; the glenoid fossa is the articulation surface on the scapula where the humerus meets it. In between the two bones is a thin stretch of cartilage called the glenoid labrum. When you tear cartilage in your shoulder, thats what you tear.). I covered this up in the shoulder pain section, but i'll just touch on it again.

I'm willing to bt that when you bench, you are committing some biomechanical principles that contribute to injury which is one of the following:
1. You are letting gravity bring the weight to your chest and/or letting it bounce. This results in a very HIGH torque output on the shoulder.
2. Your elbows are too far out. They should be nor farther than 45 degrees. i prefer to tuck my arms into my lats because this reduces the engagement of the Rotator cup muscles which are small, weak and easily fatigued. The farther you flare your elbows, the more the RC is engaged (and RC engagement is dangerous on BP type exercises)
3. Not pausing at the bottom. Its not IMPERATIVE that you touch your chest because the longer your arms are, the more torque is exerted on the should. Keep in mind that Torque is a rotational force and the RC muscles are the ONLy muscles that rotate the humerus. Now take a step back and look at the BP. When you does this exercise slow and controlled, does your upper arm rotate? The answer should be no. Here is what i talked about above:


This biggest take away from this is any exercise that results in extension and/or flexion at the elbows, then you NEED to tuck your elbows: EX: Bench press, Curls, Tricep Extensions, Overhead Press, Tricep dips etc

I'm starting to have some shoulder issues as well, and though I don't have any videos to critique myself, if I had to guess I'm probably not tucking my elbows enough on bench or OHP. I'll have to look into some videos for pointers or something. I know for sure on military press my elbows point to the sides in a straight line across my chest. Sounding like that's not too good.

Anyhow, was benching last week, 3 sets of 8, and by the end my left shoulder was just throbbing. It feels like it's centered on the front side of my shoulder at the joint, sort of right behind the anterior delt, but not a muscle soreness like DOMS. Hurts like hell when doing any pressing movement, and sometimes when stretching a certain way and even slightly to the touch.

Assuming this is a labrum tear (would that be your guess?), what's the best course of action as far as rehab and getting back to lifting? How long to stay off of it, any sort of stretching or mobility work I should do in the meantime? Or is it something that should be checked out by a doc?

Thanks again.

[tank2003]

Hey, first off thanks for doing this. Going to be watching those lower back vids above to try and help with my l4/l5 - l5/s1 issues.





I'm starting to have some shoulder issues as well, and though I don't have any videos to critique myself, if I had to guess I'm probably not tucking my elbows enough on bench or OHP. I'll have to look into some videos for pointers or something. I know for sure on military press my elbows point to the sides in a straight line across my chest. Sounding like that's not too good.

Anyhow, was benching last week, 3 sets of 8, and by the end my left shoulder was just throbbing. It feels like it's centered on the front side of my shoulder at the joint, sort of right behind the anterior delt, but not a muscle soreness like DOMS. Hurts like hell when doing any pressing movement, and sometimes when stretching a certain way and even slightly to the touch.

Assuming this is a labrum tear (would that be your guess?), what's the best course of action as far as rehab and getting back to lifting? How long to stay off of it, any sort of stretching or mobility work I should do in the meantime? Or is it something that should be checked out by a doc?

Thanks again.

There are several issues that are common in the shoulders (in no particular order):
1. Tendonitis
2. RC strains/inflammation *this technically isnt a shoulder issue since the insertion point of the RC muscles are on the humerus and they perform humeral rotation*
3. SLAP tear
4. Labrum tear
5. AC issues

A few feel hella similar so they can be tough to Dx. You can rule out Rotator Cuff injury though by doing this:


Pain originating from the AC joint


Impingement vs AC dysfunction


SLAP tear (will need someone who knows a few things to help)


Take a look and see if you can narrow down the issue then report back

Here is how to train WITH shoulder pain

[SpeedCheeser]

There are several issues that are common in the shoulders (in no particular order):
1. Tendonitis
2. RC strains/inflammation *this technically isnt a shoulder issue since the insertion point of the RC muscles are on the humerus and they perform humeral rotation*
3. SLAP tear
4. Labrum tear
5. AC issues

A few feel hella similar so they can be tough to Dx. You can rule out Rotator Cuff injury though by doing this:


Pain originating from the AC joint


Impingement vs AC dysfunction


SLAP tear (will need someone who knows a few things to help)


Take a look and see if you can narrow down the issue then report back

Here is how to train WITH shoulder pain

Thanks, man. Performed all of the tests I could, but couldn't do the last with a helper. How I felt about them:

Rotator Cuff vid:

test 1 - thumb pointing downward lateral raise against resistance - this caused pain, especially as releasing tension
test 2 - thumb upward lateral raise slowly lowering - I could feel it some, but pretty mild. possibly still focused on soreness from previous test.
test 3 - behind back, no issues

AC joint test vid:

some mild discomfort in the across the body stretch, but not much.
pull apart test produced some pain, especially as releasing tension
no issues with the up and over test

Impingement vs AC Dysfunction vid:

test 1 - Hawkins test, some discomfort
test 2 - lateral raise, pain starts between 45-90 degrees and is tight at parallel. Seems to fade closer to 180 degrees, but is still tight.
test 3 - across the body, some discomfort
test 4 - bad cop pull down, no issues


It seems like the worst pain of the above tests comes from a lateral raise sort of motion/position, especially with palms down/rotated forward.

[TheDukeUSMC]

Will U train me long time?

[tank2003]

Will U train me long time?

Anytime u want

[tank2003]

Thanks, man. Performed all of the tests I could, but couldn't do the last with a helper. How I felt about them:

Rotator Cuff vid:

test 1 - thumb pointing downward lateral raise against resistance - this caused pain, especially as releasing tension
test 2 - thumb upward lateral raise slowly lowering - I could feel it some, but pretty mild. possibly still focused on soreness from previous test.
test 3 - behind back, no issues

AC joint test vid:

some mild discomfort in the across the body stretch, but not much.
pull apart test produced some pain, especially as releasing tension
no issues with the up and over test

Impingement vs AC Dysfunction vid:

test 1 - Hawkins test, some discomfort
test 2 - lateral raise, pain starts between 45-90 degrees and is tight at parallel. Seems to fade closer to 180 degrees, but is still tight.
test 3 - across the body, some discomfort
test 4 - bad cop pull down, no issues


It seems like the worst pain of the above tests comes from a lateral raise sort of motion/position, especially with palms down/rotated forward.

that is a lot of positive tests brah. To be honest, this is above my pay grade. You should really see a doc if things dont start to get better. ESPECIALLY if nerves are involved

[SpeedCheeser]

that is a lot of positive tests brah. To be honest, this is above my pay grade. You should really see a doc if things dont start to get better. ESPECIALLY if nerves are involved

Aww fuk. No worries. Appreciate the effort and feedback. I think on some of them I'm mistaking a lingering soreness from the triggering test still being present, but it's hard to tell. Either way I'm kind of thinking I may need to have it checked out as well if it isn't feeling better after a couple weeks off of it.

Should I go straight to an orthopedic to get it checked?

[tank2003]

Aww fuk. No worries. Appreciate the effort and feedback. I think on some of them I'm mistaking a lingering soreness from the triggering test still being present, but it's hard to tell. Either way I'm kind of thinking I may need to have it checked out as well if it isn't feeling better after a couple weeks off of it.

Should I go straight to an orthopedic to get it checked?

you'd have to see a GP first to get a referral i'd imagine. If you can see a kinesiologist or an athletic trainer then that is probably better but i doubt you'd be able to

[jesusxchrist]

Question, how accurate are submax VO2 treadmill tests at predicting VO2max?

Did one today in my lab. Now I’m not exactly the most fit person out there, but I did relatively the same as everyone in the lab. I did all my calculations right, and my predicted relative VO2max came out to 29.9mL/kg•min

How the FUK is it so low when everyone in there did pretty much the same? The lowest poor classification for males 20 - 29 on the chart we have is 41mL/kg•min

[tank2003]

Question, how accurate are submax VO2 treadmill tests at predicting VO2max?

Did one today in my lab. Now I’m not exactly the most fit person out there, but I did relatively the same as everyone in the lab. I did all my calculations right, and my predicted relative VO2max came out to 29.9mL/kg•min

How the FUK is it so low when everyone in there did pretty much the same? The lowest poor classification for males 20 - 29 on the chart we have is 41mL/kg•min

They can give you some useful info as well as give you a notion of how well you respond to stress, but you wont get much physiological info from it in order to determine you anaerobic threshold (but holds little weight on determining lactate threshold). Ive never done a sub max test, but on my max tests, my VO2 was fairly low until i started to reach my threshold, then it jumped way up. But submaximal testing is a tool to measure thresholds mainly in groups that cannot perform an actual max test

[anonymous]

Thanks again for your answer to my previous question. I have a somewhat related one. I have limited ankle dorsiflexion (20 degrees less than normal), meaning that my knees cannot physically move over my toes. That means that whenever my squat form is even slightly off, I have no choice but to compensate by moving my upper body forward, which places a lot of stress on my lower back. It has caused my form to be less than optimal, despite many honest attempts to fix it. Do you have any tips for squat and deadlift stances (wide/narrow, and also feet angle), suggestions of alternative exercises, or of variations of these exercises, to mitigate the issue? I do use lifting shoes with high heels, but it hasn't been enough help up to this point. I don't see the point anymore to keep hammering my head at something which does not appear to give way if there are good enough alternatives. I'm basically interested in the optimal way to mitigate the issue, while still doing squats and deadlifts or any reasonable alternatives of these.

[tank2003]

Thanks again for your answer to my previous question. I have a somewhat related one. I have limited ankle dorsiflexion (20 degrees less than normal), meaning that my knees cannot physically move over my toes. That means that whenever my squat form is even slightly off, I have no choice but to compensate by moving my upper body forward, which places a lot of stress on my lower back. It has caused my form to be less than optimal, despite many honest attempts to fix it. Do you have any tips for squat and deadlift stances (wide/narrow, and also feet angle), suggestions of alternative exercises, or of variations of these exercises, to mitigate the issue? I do use lifting shoes with high heels, but it hasn't been enough help up to this point. I don't see the point anymore to keep hammering my head at something which does not appear to give way if there are good enough alternatives. I'm basically interested in the optimal way to mitigate the issue, while still doing squats and deadlifts or any reasonable alternatives of these.

Bro. i cant imagine there is much you can do since you dont have the possible ROM in your feet. But knees over toes ESPECIALLY bodyweight + tension is bad news for ACLs. You could possibly do a low bar squat rather than a high bar. That will relieve some tension on the low back. A low bar squat, when you are between the eccentric and concentric phases matches your deadlift stance almost perfectly (when you are about to pick the weight up that is). My only suggestion, given my limited knowledge on the subject, is to ISO the chit out of your core. The low back muscles are somewhat small and tend to be weak since they are so close to your center of gravity. The stronger you make them, the more stable you will be able to keep the load on your shoulders

[iloveus]

I had a Chriopractor recently tell me that I have muscle hyper....something(lol). Where my muscles are just constantly tight and locked up all the time. They always have a hard time adjusting me. How do I fix this?

[DDSF1]

My knees are killing me. I have somewhat intense pain on the outside of the left knee and both in knees in general have a horseshoe shape of pain above kneecap and the two sides. I foam roll and stretch and it helps a lot but the pain is still severe enough that I am having trouble squatting and getting up from ground at times. I need some help ASAP because I have a wrestling tournament this Saturday. This is really bad, it limits me majorly. Playing through the pain is becoming more and more difficult.


So the two questions are, what can I do during this week, if anything, and then for a more long term recovery?


Ps- how I injured them is just general over usage and very intense training the last month. I do lots of squats atg, low box squats, sled push/pull, and hours and hours of technique drilling. There is no one thing I can recall but rather a slow and steady progression of pain until last week when it has become really bad. I was careless because foam rolling and lots of stretching really helped at first and still does help to a certain extant.


Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

[tank2003]

My knees are killing me. I have somewhat intense pain on the outside of the left knee and both in knees in general have a horseshoe shape of pain above kneecap and the two sides. I foam roll and stretch and it helps a lot but the pain is still severe enough that I am having trouble squatting and getting up from ground at times. I need some help ASAP because I have a wrestling tournament this Saturday. This is really bad, it limits me majorly. Playing through the pain is becoming more and more difficult.


So the two questions are, what can I do during this week, if anything, and then for a more long term recovery?


Ps- how I injured them is just general over usage and very intense training the last month. I do lots of squats atg, low box squats, sled push/pull, and hours and hours of technique drilling. There is no one thing I can recall but rather a slow and steady progression of pain until last week when it has become really bad. I was careless because foam rolling and lots of stretching really helped at first and still does help to a certain extant.


Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

There are 1000000 different ways to give yourself knee pain (weak glute medius, flat feet, strength imbalance between quads and hams). But if you do knee extensions, then that is probably the cause. Take a look at these videos to see what rings a bell. This is alot easier than me trying to figure out the genesis of the knee pain
[youtube]kbe_DqMJfzg/youtube]

[DDSF1]

There are 1000000 different ways to give yourself knee pain (weak glute medius, flat feet, strength imbalance between quads and hams). But if you do knee extensions, then that is probably the cause. Take a look at these videos to see what rings a bell. This is alot easier than me trying to figure out the genesis of the knee pain
[youtube]kbe_DqMJfzg/youtube]

Thanks. I am adjusting but damn it is bad for this to get so bad all of a sudden right before something important.

when i can i will give my measly greens brah.

[tank2003]

Thanks. I am adjusting but damn it is bad for this to get so bad all of a sudden right before something important.

when i can i will give my measly greens brah.

Try taking some Naproxen a few times per day to help with the inflammation. I absolutely HATE using ice compresses but i think that will go farther than heat

[DDSF1]

Tankbrah why do my legs/knees feel worse after foamrolling at end of workout after monster leg/cardio session? Has happened a couple times now.

I have noticed this only very recently.



Edit- I must spread reputation around...

[Iceman1800]

Can I do kettle bell swings 15 months post op from lumbar fusion?

[tank2003]

Tankbrah why do my legs/knees feel worse after foamrolling at end of workout after monster leg/cardio session? Has happened a couple times now. I have noticed this only very recently.
Edit- I must spread reputation around...

Can you elaborate on what you mean by "hurt worse?" Rolling is best when used before or during a workout. If you have blasted your legs then foam roll, then you are most likely irritating muscles that are torn (on a neromuscular level). It could be that you are making the nerves hypertonic from the workout THEN the added pressure of foam rolling. And if you foam roll over your IT band (on the lateral quads) then that could be contributing.
why you need to learn HOW to foamroll correctly

Can I do kettle bell swings 15 months post op from lumbar fusion?

That is more of a question your neurosurgeon should answer since it is no where in my scope. But i'd say it Depends on your mobility and whatnot. After major surgeries like fusions, you can develop "lower cross syndrome" where the core, glutes and rectus femoris become weak and other muslces have to pick up the slack which is no bueno. If you can do a standing back extension without pain, numbness or tingling, then you could probably ease your way into a swing with resistance

[PrimeraRS]

Fasting promotes auto****y... true or false?

[tank2003]

Fasting promotes auto****y... true or false?

After 10 hours or so of intermittent fasting i believe. Seems counter intuitive to me though

[ctsa]

Hey bro thanks for this thread.
I’ve been lifting on and off for the last decade, and after 2 years without touching weights I’m now getting back to the gym. I’m a bit overweight, so I’m doing cardio and need to lose ~20 pounds. Should I start lifting right away, or would it be a waste of time (and of muscle tear) to do so while cutting?
Won’t the muscles be left without sufficient resources to repair the micro tears and grow if I’m on a daily calorie deficit?
Thanks!

[tank2003]

Hey bro thanks for this thread.
I’ve been lifting on and off for the last decade, and after 2 years without touching weights I’m now getting back to the gym. I’m a bit overweight, so I’m doing cardio and need to lose ~20 pounds. Should I start lifting right away, or would it be a waste of time (and of muscle tear) to do so while cutting?
Won’t the muscles be left without sufficient resources to repair the micro tears and grow if I’m on a daily calorie deficit?
Thanks!

Do both cardio and strength/resistance training. NOTHING burns more kcals than resistance training. A lot of people think that just by lifting weights, you will just start building muscle right away which isnt the case. You have to be in a caloric surplus AND train the right way to do that. If you are in a deficit, strength/resistance trainign and doing cardio, then you'll be on track to cut weight quickly because once you get your muscles hungry and active, they will take care of most of the kcals you take in. About 70% of your daily kcal intake (assuming you eat a maintenance amount every day) automatically goes to basil metabolic processes (the basic functions to keep you alive; autonomic functions, metabolic adjustments etc), so if you have the will power to keep your intake the same AND train then weight loss isnt much of a problem but the majority of us experience much greater hunger once we become more active because out metabolism operates at a faster/higher capacity