No weight loss / weight fluctuation on keto

[D3N11]

Okay so,

I have been on keto for nearly three weeks. My weight started at about 72-73kg and the lowest I've been is 69.7. However, the scale keeps fluctuating between 70.2-69.9. I know that weight loss comes to a halt sometimes, but I didn't think it would come so quick. My goal is to get to 60-65kg unless my body is just refusing to go down any lower? I've lost 30kg in about a year and a half.

My maros are; 1,653kcal - 21C, 129F and 103P. I am keeping regularly hydrated, even drinking BCAAs twice a day to get in my magnesium, sodium, potassium and other vitamins just in case I am lacking.

Do I need a refeed day? I resistance train six days a week with regular cardio sessions ranging from either 10, 15, 20 or 30 minutes, depending on how I am feeling, plus how much time I have to train. I also train heavy, too.

Any help with this would be great.

[kennycroxdale]

Okay so,

I have been on keto for nearly three weeks. My weight started at about 72-73kg and the lowest I've been is 69.7. However, the scale keeps fluctuating between 70.2-69.9. I know that weight loss comes to a halt sometimes, but I didn't think it would come so quick. My goal is to get to 60-65kg unless my body is just refusing to go down any lower? I've lost 30kg in about a year and a half.

My maros are; 1,653kcal - 21C, 129F and 103P. I am keeping regularly hydrated, even drinking BCAAs twice a day to get in my magnesium, sodium, potassium and other vitamins just in case I am lacking.

Do I need a refeed day? I resistance train six days a week with regular cardio sessions ranging from either 10, 15, 20 or 30 minutes, depending on how I am feeling, plus how much time I have to train. I also train heavy, too.

Any help with this would be great.

Losing 30 kg

That is very impressive.

Did you lose the 30 kg with the Ketogenic Diet?

"Everything Works But Nothing Works Forever"

The General Adaptation Syndrome is the reason. The body eventually adapt to any new stimulus.

That meaning your metabolic rate has adjusted to your 1653 kcal/per day to maintain your present weight.

With that in mind, you have...

A Couple of Options

1) Option 1: Increase your caloric intake (refeed).

One refeed day probably isn't going to work. What your going to need to do is increase your weekly caloric intake over a number of weeks.

This should increase your metabolism. The downsize is that your body weight will initially increase.

I understand that initially gaining weight can screw with your head.

However, the after a few weeks of the refeed (as you appear to know), you then decrease your caloric intake and should drop the weight you gained and more.

"Reverse Dieting"
https://www.biolayne.com/media/video...verse-dieting/

Dr Layne Norton's podcast provides great information on the benefits of Reverse Dieting (refeeds) and how to make it work

If you decide to do the refeed, an increase in kcals should be approximately 20%.

Thus, you'd increase your kcals from 1653 to around 1983.

Reverse Diet/Refeed Objective

To reiterate, the objective is to Increase Your Metabolism ABOVE where it presently is.

Once that is accomplished, you then decrease your caloric intake.

This should allow you to drop the weight you have added and drop below where you weight loss stalled.

Bodybuilder haves use this method for decades to increase muscle mass and then decrease body fat.

Yo-Yo Dieting

As you know the majority of individuals who go on a weight loss diet, then go off, end up gaining the weight they lost back plus even more weight.

Ironically, the Yo-Yo principle (Reverse Dieting/Refeeds) can be also used to gain muscle mass and then maintain it while losing weight (body fat), providing the diet program is well written and executed.

2) Option 2: Decrease your present intake of 1653 kcal/per day by 20%.

That would mean you drop down to 1322 kcals/per day. This should allow to to "Reboot" you weight loss.

However at some point (based on your training schedule), you'll need to increase your caloric intake.

An interesting method that worked for me (based on research information from Dr Dom D 'Agostino) was...

Stacking Two Method

I obtain some really good results by combining the Ketogenic Diet with Intermittent Fasting.

I found decreasing my caloric intake was much easier by skipping breakfast, Intermittent Fasting.

With that said, my weight loss eventually stalled.

My objective was to lose 13 lbs. I ended up losing/stalling at 17 lbs in 37 days.

I am now adding breakfast (increasing calories) back into my diet.

Kenny Croxdale

[Rugger7]

I'm not sure why but most recently I was on Keto for about 4 weeks. The first 2 weeks or so I was going at it a more normal pace for 2 weeks where I dropped only 1 lb but also an inch on my waist, I had been lifting and my muscles seemed fuller. I started around 282 lbs and didn't drop anything in fact I was at 281 when I started a really 'intense' pace. Intense pace for me is shootin for a 1750-2400 cal deficit per day aiming for 3.5-5 lb loss per week did this for about 2 weeks. Went down as low as 277 but fluctuated back up as high as 281, Ended up around 280 when I decided to take a break but was down another 2 inches on the waist. Didn't make much sense. At the end of the intense pace I took a break starting 8/12 because I was moving and just worn out from the big deficits. I ate carbs and definitely at a surplus for the next week. I lifted twice and almost no cardio. On 8/19 I was expecting to be 285-290 anticipating maybe 2 lb fat gain and 5-9 lbs of water but I was a t 279. Sometimes it just doesn't make sense. Just keep working. I'm actually feeling just as lean but more muscular than from before the break, going back to intense mode today..

[D3N11]

Losing 30 kg

That is very impressive.

Did you lose the 30 kg with the Ketogenic Diet?

I lost the weight on a normal IIFYM diet during the summer. I was only eating between 1,600-1,300 calories (at my lowest). My body refuses to lose weight in winter, so I was eating at maintenance, which made me gain about 3-4kg, so I pretty much did reverse diet in a way as you've mentioned. Intermittent fasting was incorporated within this, however I am at school for 8 hours a day, seven days a week so doing a fasted workout is not an option.

I've only been on keto for three weeks so I should be regularly losing weight based on the fact that I have dropped my calories, yet it's stalled. I've eaten 1,300 calories before and my appetite was more suppressed back then than it is now.

I have heard that eating at, or above, maintenance calories would be beneficial for a week or so just to kick-start the metabolism, but would this be at keto calories?

I am considering the refeed process since that's more convenient for me, however I don't know where to start. My body has never handled over 200g of carbs before and at one point, I was consuming 190g of carbs at my highest. I felt sluggish, bloated and off.

Thank you for the very informative insight though. I very much appreciate it and will continue to reread it until I figure out the best one for my body.

[D3N11]

I'm not sure why but most recently I was on Keto for about 4 weeks. The first 2 weeks or so I was going at it a more normal pace for 2 weeks where I dropped only 1 lb but also an inch on my waist, I had been lifting and my muscles seemed fuller. I started around 282 lbs and didn't drop anything in fact I was at 281 when I started a really 'intense' pace. Intense pace for me is shootin for a 1750-2400 cal deficit per day aiming for 3.5-5 lb loss per week did this for about 2 weeks. Went down as low as 277 but fluctuated back up as high as 281, Ended up around 280 when I decided to take a break but was down another 2 inches on the waist. Didn't make much sense. At the end of the intense pace I took a break starting 8/12 because I was moving and just worn out from the big deficits. I ate carbs and definitely at a surplus for the next week. I lifted twice and almost no cardio. On 8/19 I was expecting to be 285-290 anticipating maybe 2 lb fat gain and 5-9 lbs of water but I was a t 279. Sometimes it just doesn't make sense. Just keep working. I'm actually feeling just as lean but more muscular than from before the break, going back to intense mode today..

There's no doubt that I feel lean. My abs are becoming way more visible for the first time in my life. My moods are lifted and I do not hit the four o'clock slum of wanting to take a nap, but the weight loss aspect of it is just annoying me. I've been waiting and waiting for the scale to drop down. I am very cautious and aware of the fact that weight fluctuates, so I do keep that in mind whenever I see an odd number on the scale. Usually within a few days, the scale would give me a semi-accurate reading of weight-loss. I guess I just have to wait until something happens.

I'd be too scared to **** my metabolism up with such an intense caloric deficit, weren't you afraid of losing a considerable amount of muscle mass based on the drastic cut?

[kennycroxdale]

I'm not sure why but most recently I was on Keto for about 4 weeks. The first 2 weeks or so I was going at it a more normal pace for 2 weeks where I dropped only 1 lb but also an inch on my waist, I had been lifting and my muscles seemed fuller. I started around 282 lbs and didn't drop anything in fact I was at 281 when I started a really 'intense' pace. Intense pace for me is shootin for a 1750-2400 cal deficit per day aiming for 3.5-5 lb loss per week did this for about 2 weeks. Went down as low as 277 but fluctuated back up as high as 281, Ended up around 280 when I decided to take a break but was down another 2 inches on the waist. Didn't make much sense.

Good Feed Back

This is some very interesting, good feed back.

I agree that it doesn't make much sense.

However, the really cool part is you waist dropped 2 inches while pretty much maintaining your weight.

At the end of the intense pace I took a break starting 8/12 because I was moving and just worn out from the big deficits. I ate carbs and definitely at a surplus for the next week. I lifted twice and almost no cardio. On 8/19 I was expecting to be 285-290 anticipating maybe 2 lb fat gain and 5-9 lbs of water but I was a t 279.

Fat Gain Expected

I question if you put on 2 lbs of body fat in a week by eating carbohydrates.

Secondly, the majority of method utilized to determine body fat and lean mass are very inaccurate.

It incredibly hard for the majority of individuals to have any idea of how much body fat they lose in any weight loss program.

Tape Mesure

I am a huge proponent of the tape measure.

It's a more practical, easier method.

Water Weight Gain Expected

I find it hard to believe, like you, there wasn't much if any water weight gain.

As we know, the muscle soak up water like a sponge.

In the past, when I did a Cyclic Keto Diet (5 Day Keto/2 Day Carb Load), I'd gain between 5 - 6 lbs in two days.

Two of my buddies that were on the program, would put on 10 lbs of weight in two days.

Carb Loading For Strength Athletes

Before moving on, I want to go slightly off topic.

One of the caveats of the Keto Diet is that that Carb Loading the week before the event, dramatically increase performance (Research Dr Jake Wilson (formerly the Director of the University of Tampa Human Performance Lab).

Dr Dom D 'Agostino (University of South Florida) discussed in an online interview.

My Personal Experience

Ironically, in utilizing a Quazi-Keto Diet, I came to the same conclusions.

I used the a Quazi-Keto Diet to get into a lower weight class for a Powerlifting Meet.

Two week out from the meet, I was 8 pound to heavy for one weight class or 8 pound too light for the other.

I had plateaued with my weight loss. I knew that cutting 8 pound wasn't going to happen.

I decided to bulk up by going high carbohydrate.

In that two week period, I gain right at 8 lbs which was primarily water weight.

My strength blew through the roof.

Mechanical Advantage

My hypothesis was that "Superhydration" dramatically increases strength.

That appears to one of the reason that creatine increase strength, as well...via "Cell Voluminizing".

"Superhydratation" also appear to be one of the driving factors with some anabolics.

Another Factor

Research has demonstrated a substantial drop strength (athletic performance) with dehydration.

When hydration is restored back to normal levels, strength/athlete performance returns to normal.

My conjecture is that when "Superhydration" occurs, performance levels are appreciably increased.

Car Tire Analogy

My "Superhydration Hypothosis" is much car tires.

1) Under inflated tires get lower milage.

2) Tires inflated to the recommended standards get better milage.

3) Over Inflated tired get the best mileage.

Ironically, a great example of this is...

Mitsubishi Motors admits falsifying fuel economy tests
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36089558

Mitsubishi cars mileage was better because they Over Inflate the tires!

Dr Dom D 'Agostino

In a podcast interview, D 'Agostino stated researched demonstrated that athletes on a Ketogenic Diet who Carb Loaded the week before the event preformed better due to primarily a "Mechanical Advantage"...

One way of putting is, "There muscle cells were Over Inflated with water".

Sometimes it just doesn't make sense. Just keep working.

"Research is what I am doing when I don't know what I am doing." Einstein

Sometimes it doesn't initially make sense. Even Einstein struggled with it.

But as you said, if you keep working it you eventually get enough clues to under the "Cause and Effect" of how it works for you and possibly for others.

Kenny Croxdale

[kennycroxdale]

I lost the weight on a normal IIFYM diet during the summer. I was only eating between 1,600-1,300 calories (at my lowest). My body refuses to lose weight in winter, so I was eating at maintenance, which made me gain about 3-4kg, so I pretty much did reverse diet in a way as you've mentioned. Intermittent fasting was incorporated within this, however I am at school for 8 hours a day, seven days a week so doing a fasted workout is not an option.

Fasted Cardio

I never mentioned Fasted Cardio.

Secondly, Fasted Cardio minutely affects weight loss. For that matter, exercise isn't the optimal method of losing weight.

As the saying goes, "You can't out train a bad diet".

I have heard that eating at, or above, maintenance calories would be beneficial for a week or so just to kick-start the metabolism, but would this be at keto calories?

Calories Count

No matter what diet you're on, calories count.

It applies to keto calories, as well.

I am considering the refeed process since that's more convenient for me, however I don't know where to start. My body has never handled over 200g of carbs before and at one point, I was consuming 190g of carbs at my highest. I felt sluggish, bloated and off.

Insulin Resistance

My wife, like you, has a problem with carbohydrates.

She can walk by a plate of donuts and gain weight.

You like her, appear to be Insulin Resistant. Insulin Resistant individuals who consume carbohydrates gain weight/body fat for what migh be viewed as no reason.

Based on that, here my suggestion on a...

Refeed

First of all, I never mentioned your refeed include increasing your carbohydrate intake.

To reiterate, all calories count.

With that in stated, my recommendation is if you decided to do a refeed, increase your protein and fat intake. Leave your carbohydrate as it is.

That increase in protein and fat intake Needs to remain in the percentage you are now using.

Thank you for the very informative insight though. I very much appreciate it and will continue to reread it until I figure out the best one for my body.

You're "Smarter Than The Average Bear"

Back in the day, a cartoon character (Yogi Bear) would say that.

Your definitely smarter than the majority (as is Rugger7).

Rugger7 provided with some good information, as well. He does a good job of breaking things down.

It a learning process which take time.

“I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work.”
― Thomas A. Edison

In other words, if you keep trying (as Rugger7 said), you eliminate what does NOT work and MOVE Closer to What Will Work!

Losing 30 kg proves you have the resolve to do that.

Kenny Croxdale

[Rugger7]

There's no doubt that I feel lean. My abs are becoming way more visible for the first time in my life. My moods are lifted and I do not hit the four o'clock slum of wanting to take a nap, but the weight loss aspect of it is just annoying me. I've been waiting and waiting for the scale to drop down. I am very cautious and aware of the fact that weight fluctuates, so I do keep that in mind whenever I see an odd number on the scale. Usually within a few days, the scale would give me a semi-accurate reading of weight-loss. I guess I just have to wait until something happens.

I'd be too scared to **** my metabolism up with such an intense caloric deficit, weren't you afraid of losing a considerable amount of muscle mass based on the drastic cut?

Not at all afraid to mess up my metabolism or lose muscle for several reasons, and I'm not one to read hundreds of scientific studies but I've been exercising and doing various diets, routines, and supplement programs for 18.5 years.

A) I think the whole idea about going to low on calories will 'permanently damage your metabolism' is false. The body is like a chameleon. Give it lots of extra calories it will raise the metabolism and even waste a large amount of the surplus. Give it a severe deficit, it will burn fat and also lower your metabolism to compensate. However, it will make these shifts very easily and rapidly as if we are in the wild going through feast and famine seasons like we're bears about to hibernate for the winter. This is why intermittent fasting and calorie cycling works. I just don't believe you permanently damage your metabolism, I think it adjust to whatever circumstances you place it under, and pretty rapidly.

B) Keto itself is muscle sparing, and the way I achieve large deficits is normally through incline walking which is a fairly low intensity way to burn a large number of calories in a fairly short period of time. So in my opinion (once again I don't go into the science too much) the way you are going to lose mass is more based on not hitting a certain 'minimum' amount of nutrients for recovery vs. the actual deficit. What I mean is if my BMR is 3000 and I lay in bed and only eat 1000 calories to achieve the deficit or let's say my BMR was 2000 and I burn an extra 1000 to hit 3000 and only eat 1000 I'd imagine in either of those scenairos I would be dropping muscle. Or if I was lifting 3-4 days a week and consuming 1000 calories with 80 g protein or something yes. However, I estimate my BMR at 3100 and then go burn an extra 1500-2500 per day. So I am still eating between 2700-3200 calories on average while still achieving my large deficit. I estimate I'm 200-210 lbs LBM so 2700-3200 cals with 200+ g protein is plenty to maintain my LBM. At least in my experience. Lastly, I think MY genetics and physiology is geared both towards keto and being muscular vs. lean.


Lastly - I went back on Keto for the past two days, don't think I've been at a deficit wasn't counting, possibly about maintenance on 8/21 and surplus on 8/22 and weighed in at 275.4 this morning. I walked for an hour yesterday and ate a lot. Sometimes it just doesn't make sense!

[Oneside1]

If you feel good the way you have it. Then dont change it. Refeeds might not help all that much and you will also get back those carb cravings (if you had them before).

[sabketo]

Hi,
I need some help as I have been on keto for a month now and im vert confused.
Starting keto I was 189 pounds but I successfuly dropped to 171 about 2 weeks in. After that I had a terrible cheat weekend, which I regret. My weight went up to about 175 but I focused back on keto and was able to loose it. Now a month later, ive been dedicated to keto but my weight yesterday was 161. I weigh myself today and I am 181. Im very confused about the 20 pound weight gain. Someone please help me understand.
more about my diet:
1423 calories a day
18g of carbs
111 g of fat
89 g of protein
I workout about 3 times a week
age: 19

[SherMir]

I lost the weight on a normal IIFYM diet during the summer. I was only eating between 1,600-1,300 calories (at my lowest). My body refuses to lose weight in winter, so I was eating at maintenance, which made me gain about 3-4kg, so I pretty much did reverse diet in a way as you've mentioned. Intermittent fasting was incorporated within this, however I am at school for 8 hours a day, seven days a week so doing a fasted workout is not an option.

I've only been on keto for three weeks so I should be regularly losing weight based on the fact that I have dropped my calories, yet it's stalled. I've eaten 1,300 calories before and my appetite was more suppressed back then than it is now.

I have heard that eating at, or above, maintenance calories would be beneficial for a week or so just to kick-start the metabolism, but would this be at keto calories?

I am considering the refeed process since that's more convenient for me, however I don't know where to start. My body has never handled over 200g of carbs before and at one point, I was consuming 190g of carbs at my highest. I felt sluggish, bloated and off.

Thank you for the very informative insight though. I very much appreciate it and will continue to reread it until I figure out the best one for my body.

I'm sorry, but what CARBS did you eat? If carbs made you feel sluggish, i don't know what the hell is wrong with the world.
And are you sure that it's carbs, but that not what you ate before.
I will put my last 3 pennys here and let you go on with your thought: Bangladesh carb consumption is 3rd highest in the world at 80%, following Burundi (82%) and Rwanda (82%). Bangladesh obesity rate is the lowest in the world along with Vietnam at 1-2 %. Almost every central africa country carb consumption is above 65% , did you see a lot of fat people coming from that place? Where are the best track & field athletes are coming from? Hope you guessed it.