Attempting to get KETO locked in and get to the next level

[hedrickbl]

I am using this to log my stats, observations and progress. I tend to do better when I am logging things vs winging it.

Background:
I have been doing skd/ckd for almost a year now. Whether or not I have been doing it correctly is debatable and part of what I am trying to correct. I have mostly been on Carb Night (ckd) but I do feel much better when on a skd for 3+ weeks continuously. I have been a gym rat for almost 5 years now and have gone from around 37% bf to 18-20% (army standard). I was very fat in college, fixed myself and joined the army.

My goals:
I want to cut fat/ build lean mass/ increase my push ups and sit ups/ decrease my 2 mile run time.

My stats:
height - 6' 1"
weight - ~230 (will update tomorrow)
BF (army standard) - 18-20 depending on the day

My fitness routine:
M-W-F - power lifting variation training 1-1.5 hrs
T-TH - run training with shoulder work


My questions to the group:
1. I have been told that carbs are a limit (<30), protein is a goal (0.8-1 gram / lb lean mass) and fat to satiety. Do you guys agree?
2. I just ordered exogenous ketones for use as a pre workout. I have never used them but hear mixed reviews. Keto tends to screw with my run times drastically. Do you guys have any experience with them? Keep in mind that I am using them for pre workout, not some magic weight loss bullet.

[hedrickbl]

UPDATED STATS:

WEIGHT - 230
WAIST - 38"

I have noticed that while on keto, my waist will drop up to 2 inches without a change in weight. Given this, I rarely track weight and am more interested in waist size.
I have been training more on the hypertrophy side for the last 6+ months, I am going back to a powerlifting variation with hypertrophy assistance (BBB) starting next week. I have definitely put on mass over the last 6+ months, but now I feel it is time to really lean out.

[pratherian]

I have been using exogenous ketones for almost a year (27th of this month) on a daily basis.
Own a gym, do nutrition, etc.
Would like to connect with you about this lifestyle.

[hedrickbl]

Hi Pratherian,
I would gladly listen to what you have to say. Thanks for the interest and the feedback.

[pratherian]

I am in between training clients but will try to get on here this weekend.
Interested in what type of ketones you have/are using and what type of diet.

I will look more closely at your posts this weekend.

[hedrickbl]

FRIDAY NUTRITION UP TO BUT NOT INCLUDING DINNER:
MORNING:
COFFEE
.25 CUP HEAVY CREAM
8TBS COCONUT OIL

AFTERNOON:
7 OZ HILLSHIRE FARMS PASTRAMI
3 TILLAMOOK MEDIUM CHEDDAR CHEESE STICKS
AMINO 5400 - 4 TABS
ZIP FIZZ -1 TUBE
MONSTER ULTRA CITRON - 2 CANS

OTHER:
8000 MG OMEGA 3 FISH OIL (WILD ALASKAN SALMON OIL)
10000 IU D3
100 MG ZINC
ANIMAL FLEX
3 TBS CREATINE
1TBS GLUTAMINE

TOTALS:
CALS-1642
NET CARBS-19
FAT-154
PROTEIN-58

TRAINING:
4 MILE RUCK WITH 40 LB VEST - 1 HR, VARIABLE TERRAIN

NOTES:
I am going to have to make up some ground tonight on the protein. My gym was closed this week so have been rucking and running. I have a fitness test in Sep or Nov so I will be adding in event training on top of my weight training starting next week. I don't normally drink 2 monsters in a day but rucking in the heat kicked my ass and I still have to work.

Pratherian:
I ordered KetoForce, a non flavored liquid BHB sodium/potassium salt, I also ordered a powdered MCT to go with it. The MCT I ordered has a great 8-10 profile and the research I saw showed that BHB with MCT yielded better results for reduced oxygen demand than BHB alone.

[hedrickbl]

Friday nutrition - updated

morning:
Coffee
.25 cup heavy cream
8tbs coconut oil

afternoon:
7 oz hillshire farms pastrami
3 tillamook medium cheddar cheese sticks
amino 5400 - 4 tabs
zip fizz -1 tube
monster ultra citron - 2 cans

evening
1 bone in - grilled - pork chop
1 cup roasted broccoli w/ olive oil and balsamic vinegar
6 tbs peanut butter

other:
8000 mg omega 3 fish oil (wild alaskan salmon oil)
10000 iu d3
100 mg zinc
animal flex
3 tbs creatine
1tbs glutamine

totals:
Cals-2614
net carbs-43
fat-229
protein-111

NOTES:
A BIT HIGH ON THE CARBS AND STILL A LITTLE LOW ON PROTEIN. I HAVE GOT TO STAY AWAY FROM THE PEANUT BUTTER. I HAD MY CHEAT MEAL SATURDAY NIGHT (BURGER WITH FRIES, SCOTCH WITH GINGER, FROZEN YOGURT). SUNDAY WAS ON POINT, I DIDN'T TRACK IT BUT WAS LOW ON EVERYTHING.
NO FORMAL TRAINING THIS WEEKEND BUT DID MANUAL LABOR ALL WEEKEND SO ENERGY EXPENDITURE WAS HIGHER THAN MY AVERAGE WEEK DAY.

[hedrickbl]

MONDAY - WEEK 1 OF TRACKING AND ADJUSTMENT

NUTRITION:
COFFEE
.25 CUP HALF AND HALF
6 TBS COCONUT OIL
2 TBS KERRYGOLD BUTTER

2 CANS CITRON MONSTER
4 TABS AMINO 5400
1 SCOOP ON GOLD STANDARD WHEY ISOLATE
1 TBS GLUTAMINE
3 TBS CREATINE
8 OZ GRILLED CHICKEN BREAST
2 CUPS BABY SPINACH
.5 CUP FETA CHEESE
8 TBS OLIVE GARDEN ITALIAN DRESSING

8 OZ RIBEYE STEAK
.5 CUP ROASTED BROCCOLI
OLIVE OIL
BLASAMIC VINEGAR
BUTTER

3 STRING CHEESE STICKS

TOTALS:
CALS- 2844
NET CARBS - 30
FAT - 234
PROTEIN - 152

TRAINING:
BOX SQUAT - WORK UP TO 245 4 REP MAX
HIP THRUSTS - 200 X 12 X 3
SEATED CALF RAISE - 225 X 12 X 3
TRX PUSHUP - HANDS IN STRAP - MAX X 3
TRX PUSHUP - FEET IN STRAP - MAX X 3
TRX PLANK - 10 SEC X 4
TRX AB ROLL OUT - MAX X 3

NOTES:
1. Felt great to get back in the gym after a week away, I lost a little on my squat but probably just knocking some rust off. I normally throw in leg ext and leg curl but both were down for maintenance.
2. I am currently working up 4 rep maxes on the big 3 in order to calculate percentages for 5/3/1 (BBB). I have played with 5/3/1 before but not the BBB variation. I am excited to get my strength back up to a respectable level.
3. My left wrist hurt like hell when trying pushups with hands flat, had to switch to knuckle ups. I have been having a lot of problems with that wrist and bicep tendon lately. I have been wrapping it for bench, I will wrap it for pushups tomorrow and see if that helps.
4. My exogenous ketones should get here today and I will try them for bench day tomorrow. I am also excited to try them on a cardio day and see if they help my run at all.

[Mrpb]

150 gram protein for a 225 pound 38 year man in deficit, that's not a lot. I would go a bit higher personally.

[hedrickbl]

150 gram protein for a 225 pound 38 year man in deficit, that's not a lot. I would go a bit higher personally.

It is on the low side, my calculations put my protein between 150-190.
(230-230*.2) = 184
184*.8 = 147

That being said, I would like to get it up to the 180g mark. More meat!!!

[hedrickbl]

NUTRITION:
COFFEE
1 TBS BUTTER
6 TBS COCONUT OIL
.25 CUP HALF AND HALF

8 OZ GRILLED CHICKEN BREAST
2 CUPS BABY SPINACH
.5 CUP FETA
.25 CUP PECANS
8 TBS OLIVE GARDEN ITALIAN SALAD DRESSING
2 CANS MONSTER ULTRA

.5 AVACADO
3 PIECES BACON
10 OZ GROUND BEEF
1 OZ SWISS CHEESE

TOTALS:
CALS - 2947
NET CARBS - 29
FAT - 260
PROTEIN - 140

TRAINING:
3 MILE INTERVAL RUN (0.2 FAST/0.2 SLOW) TOTAL TIME - 31:48
TRAP BAR SHRUGS - 265 X 10 X 3
SIDE LAT RAISES - 20 X 10 X 3
REAR FLIES - 15 X 10 X 3

NOTES:
1. As mentioned by the previous poster, I need to increase protein. I will make an effort to get more meat and drop the fats a bit. I feel like my cals my be running a bit high - constantly above 2500.

2. I got my ketones and mct powder last night. I put some mct powder in my coffee this morning with the coconut oil and wow what a difference. Definitely more energy and mental clarity.

3. The monster consumption is getting out of control, I am working 13 hr days this week and the working on guard things when I get home so not sleeping a lot right now. This should be solved after this weekend and I get back on a normal sleep cycle. Also, with the mct and ketones, I may not need the monster anymore.

[Mrpb]

It is on the low side, my calculations put my protein between 150-190.
(230-230*.2) = 184
184*.8 = 147

That being said, I would like to get it up to the 180g mark. More meat!!!

180 gram won't hurt you and will help retaining/gaining muscle.

The 0.8 gram per lb number is meant for total body weight.

If you want to go by LBM, 0.9 to 1 gram per gram of Lean Body Mass.

[hedrickbl]

180 gram won't hurt you and will help retaining/gaining muscle.

The 0.8 gram per lb number is meant for total body weight.

If you want to go by LBM, 0.9 to 1 gram per gram of Lean Body Mass.

Roger, thanks for the heads up. I set my goal to 180 at a minimum. I read alot about protein interfering with ketosis and was worried about getting kicked out. The more studies I read, the more I am starting to believe that ketosis, while having significant beneficial side effects, is mainly a means of maintaining a calorie deficit more comfortably with less hunger and energy issues.

[hedrickbl]

EXOGENOUS KETONES AND MCT POWDER
TRIAL 1
CHEST, ABS AND ARMS

MIX:
30cc KETOFORCE
1 SCOOP QUEST MCT POWDER
**** UP - 1 STICK MEANT FOR 1/2 GALLON CRYSTAL LIGHT PINK LEMONADE
1 TBS GLUTIMINE
3 TBS CREATINE

TIMING:
TAKEN AT 11 AM - 1 HR BEFORE WORKOUT

NOTES:
The taste was fine - probably had to do with so much crystal light.
I got a bit of dry mouth.
No jittery or adrenal response that I noticed.
Pushup Drills - I noticed that I did not get tired, I achieved muscle failure but did not get tired.
Overall workout - I did not get pumped up but it did seam to increase my longevity. I did not get as tired as usual, that out of gas feeling which may have been a crash from stimulant based pre-workout.

[hedrickbl]

NUTRITION:
COFFEE
.25 CUP HALF AND HALF
6TBS COCONUT OIL
1 TBS MCT POWDER

53G BLACK PEPPERED BEEF SLICES
32 SLICES PEPPERONI
1 SCOOP QUEST MCT POWDER
30 CC EXOGENOUS KETONES
CRYSTAL LIGHT PINK LEMONADE
1 READY MADE LABRADA SALTED CARAMEL PROTEIN DRINK
2 SCOOPS ON GOLD STANDARD WHEY

SAUSAGE AND PEPPERS

TOTALS:
CALS- 2405
NET CARBS - 28
FAT - 173
PROTEIN - 169

TRAINING:
BENCH - 1 REP MAX WORK UP - 245
BENCH - 135 (10 LOW/10 HIGH/5 FULL) X 1
TRX PUSHUPS (FEET IN STRAP) - MAX X 4
INCLINE SITUPS (14 LB BALL OVERHEAD) MAX X 4
ARM 100'S (ROPE TRI EXTENSIONS/STR8 BAR CURL)

NOTES:
1. I wrapped my wrist tight, it was fine for bench but hands flat pushups hurt like hell so went to knuckle ups again.
2. I drank a lot of protein powder and still came up short of my goal on protein. I did get extremely gassy. Need to find a better way to gt more protein.
3. I met my calorie goal which is a happy accident. My current calorie goal is 2700

[hedrickbl]

I have been thinking alot this week about what is going on with me/my diet/keto in general and fat loss.
Here is what I think I know about keto without all of the marketing B.S.

1. Fat loss is about calories in/calories out - fact/plain and simple but not so simple.
2. Keto has given me some amazing benifits i.e. I do not get constant sinus infections any more, I am not hungry all the time and I can go long periods of time without eating and not get angry or extremely tired.

MY NEW KETO RULES:
1. Establish and maintain a calorie deficit - don't stress too hard about what formula to use, just establish it, maintain it for 2 weeks and adjust as needed.
2. Keep carbs below 30g/day net
3. Shoot for 1g/lb of lean body mass for protein.
4. Use fat to fill in the rest where hungry.
5. Do not get caught up in the ratio mess, people always try to say you need more fats because you are in ketosis, being in ketosis does not magically cause you to lose weight ( except the water weight in the beginning). Get as many fats as you can while first getting protein then staying within your pre determined calorie limit.

This is all based on my experience over the last year. I have put on about 10 lbs of lean mass while maintaining the same bf and even going down by about 2%. A year in ketosis and I had hoped to be close to 12% by now but I focused too hard on being in ketosis and not hard enough on maintaining a calorie deficit. That being said, I am greatfull for the new mass!

[hedrickbl]

WEEKEND

FRIDAY:
Friday was on point diet wise, no numbers to report as was a travel day but I stayed very aware of what and how much I was eating.

SATURDAY:
Was in keto up until dinner which was an Officers Call. I had a few beers, a potato with my steak and some bread.

SUNDAY:
Sunday was a full blown mess, travel day and gave in to all of the junk my wife had in the car. Not stressing it, just the fact.

NOTES:
Supposedly exogenous ketones can be used to get you into ketosis quickly, I will take it after my workout today instead of before. My theory is that the exorcise will help deplete the glycogen.
Today is the first day of 5/3/1 BBB using the maxes I developed last week.

SAD LITTLE STARTING NUMBERS:
SQUAT - 272
BENCH - 245
DEAD - 339

[danfleysher]

I have been thinking alot this week about what is going on with me/my diet/keto in general and fat loss.
Here is what I think I know about keto without all of the marketing B.S.

1. Fat loss is about calories in/calories out - fact/plain and simple but not so simple.
2. Keto has given me some amazing benifits i.e. I do not get constant sinus infections any more, I am not hungry all the time and I can go long periods of time without eating and not get angry or extremely tired.

MY NEW KETO RULES:
1. Establish and maintain a calorie deficit - don't stress too hard about what formula to use, just establish it, maintain it for 2 weeks and adjust as needed.
2. Keep carbs below 30g/day net
3. Shoot for 1g/lb of lean body mass for protein.
4. Use fat to fill in the rest where hungry.
5. Do not get caught up in the ratio mess, people always try to say you need more fats because you are in ketosis, being in ketosis does not magically cause you to lose weight ( except the water weight in the beginning). Get as many fats as you can while first getting protein then staying within your pre determined calorie limit.

This is all based on my experience over the last year. I have put on about 10 lbs of lean mass while maintaining the same bf and even going down by about 2%. A year in ketosis and I had hoped to be close to 12% by now but I focused too hard on being in ketosis and not hard enough on maintaining a calorie deficit. That being said, I am greatfull for the new mass!

Brilliant thoughts and good rules. Calories is the root of the weight loss and weight gain and once people understand that, it's very easy to lose weight and understand why you're stalling.

[hedrickbl]

EXOGENOUS KETONES/MCT POWDER
Today was a lifting day and I again noticed that I was able to achieve muscle failure but not get winded and tired. Tomorrow will be the big test as it will be my first cardio day using the ketones.

I have notice that immediately after taking them, I get a little sleepy for about 30 min. Not sure why and I have not noticed this said by anyone else.

NEW METHOD STARTING TOMORROW
I have decided to put the MCT in my coffee and not use as a pre workout. This is mainly a calorie control issue as the coconut oil in my coffee was adding a lot of calories. If I order another tub, I will use it at both times but for now, just in the mornings. The ketoforce will still be used as a pre workout.

[hedrickbl]

NUTRITION:
1 CAN MONSTER ULTRA WHITE

15 SLICES BLACK FORREST HAM
3 OZ EXTRA SHARP WHITE CHEDAR CHEESE
4 SLICES SALAMI
2 SCOOPS ON WHEY
1 SCOOP MCT POWDER
30 CC KETOFORCE
1 PACKET CRYSTAL LIGHT
1 CAN MONSTER ULTRA WHITE

12 OZ GRILLED SALMON
ASPARAGUS

TOTALS:
CALS - 1698
NET CARBS - 26
FAT - 86
PROTEIN - 192

TRAINING:
BENCH - 145 X 5, 165 X 5, 190 X 5
STANDING BB PRESS - 85 X 10 X 5
PULL UPS - ALTERNATING GRIP - MAX X 3
SEATED ROW - HIGH GRIP - 120 X 10 X 3
INCLINE CURL - 30 X 10 X 3
HAMMER CURL - 35 X 10 X 3
SKULL CRUSHER - 75 X 10 X 3
ROPE TRI EXTENSION - 10? X 10 X 3
WRIST CURLS - 65 X 15 X 3
REV WRIST CURLS - 45 X 15 X 3

NOTES:
I forgot how hard it is to not push the boundaries on my big lifts, I had no problem (at all) on the bench. I need to focus on sticking to the plan, last time I got impatient and went off on my own, got stronger, got hurt, got weak.

I like the calorie deficit, needed to be steep after Sundays debacle. I managed to get my protein which is good, this is the first time since I have been tracking that it has been this high.

[hedrickbl]

MIX:
30CC KETOFORCE
12 OZ CRYSTAL LIGHT
1 TBS GLUTAMINE
3 TBS CREATINE

CARDIO:
3 MILE INTERVAL RUN - 0.2 MILES SLOW/0.2 MILES FAST
TOTAL TIME - 31 MINUTES

Notes:
1. I did not notice any marked improvement on the run, in fact, I struggled trying to keep my fast rounds under 1:35 which was a performance reduction from last week when I had all but 2 rounds under 1:35.
2. I did a TRX pushup/situp training drill after my run, I did notice that my recovery following the run was very good and I was not too tired to perform the TRX drills. I usually do shoulders after my run and would be sucking wind and having a hard time putting in work at that point.

TEMPORARY HYPOTHESIS:
1. The exogenous ketones help with endurance but not speed or max power.
2. The exogenous ketones help reduce recovery time.

[hedrickbl]

NUTRITION:
COFFEE
0.25 CUP HALF AND HALF
2 SCOOPS MCT POWDER

7 OZ PASTRAMI
5 COLBY JACK CHEESE STICKS
2 SCOOPS ON WHEY

8 OZ GRILLED CHICKEN BREAST
1 OZ GORGONZOLA CHEESE
1 OZ WHITE CHEDAR
1.5 OZ GOAT CHEESE
3 CUPS BABY SPINACH
0.1 CUP ONION
0.25 CUP GORGONZOLA
3 TBS PEPPERCORN SALAD DRESSING
2 MONSTER REHAB TEAS

TOTALS:
CALS - 2138
NET CARBS - 33
FAT - 128
PROTEIN - 209

TRAINING:
3 MILE INTERVAL RUN - 31 MINUTES
TRX:
CHEST PRESS
SPIDERMAN PUSHUPS
ATOMIC PUSHUPS
PLANK
SIDE PLANK
INCLINE SITUPS

NOTES:
I have got to stay away from the damn monsters, talk about carb creep. It was still a good day regardless. I like having the mct powder in my coffee, more energy and clarity.

[hedrickbl]

Wednesday:
Nutrition totals:
Cals - 2362
net carbs - 24
fat - 156
protein - 200

training:
Deadlift 3 x 5
squat - 5 x 10
situps - max x 4
trx ab rollout - max x 3
arms

thursday:
Nutrition total:
Cals - 1984
net carbs - 39
fat - 138
protein - 145

training:
None - surveying field day

[hedrickbl]

Nutrition:
coffee
half and half
MCT powder

8 oz chicken breast
2 eggs
1.5 oz chedar cheese
1 monster
2 scoops ON whey
0.25 cups macadamia nuts

6 oz grilled pork chop
1 cup broccoli

Totals:
Cals - 1548
Net Carbs - 22
Fat - 86
Protein - 172

Training:
Bench - 3 x 3
Incline Bench - 15 x 5
Pull-ups - max x 3
Seated Row - 10 x 3
Incline curl - 10 x 3
Hammer Curl - 10 x 3
Skull Crushers - 10 x 3
Tri-extensions - 10 x 3
wrist curl - 15 x 3
rev wrist curl - 15 x 3

Notes:
I have to remember to weigh in and get a measurement this week. I know my calories were too low but I think that as long as I am not this low consistently, it should not be an issue. More like calorie cycling.

[hedrickbl]

Nutrition:
coffee
half and half
2 scoops MCT powder

0.25 cup macadamia nuts
2 scoops ON whey
2 monster ultra
7 oz roast beef
6 chedar cheese sticks

6 oz tri tip
4 cups baby spinach
1 oz gorgonzola
0.25 cups pecans
6 tbs wishbone cesar vinegrette
3 chedar cheese sticks

Totals:
Cals - 2565
Net Carbs - 30
Fat - 180
Protein - 201

Training:
3 mile interval run - 31:43 - min time 1:29
TRX
chest press - max x 5
plank - 10 sec x 4
side plank - 10 sec x 4 ea side
atomic push up - max x 3
row series 10 ea x 3
incline situps - max x 3

Notes:
Starting to get cranky again, happens a lot when cutting calories. Also notices internal temperature swings, from cold to sweating yet don't feel sick.

[hedrickbl]

Mix:
Unchanged
12 oz crystal light
30 cc ketoforce
3 tbs creatine
1 tbs glutamine

Notes:
As far as I am concerned, my research is complete on this product.

1. I consistently have a dry, salty mouth for a few hours after taking.
2. I have seen no improvement in weight loss or max power output.
3. I have noticed increased endurance.
4. I have noticed an improvement in mood and energy in general.

Given these observations, I have decided to continue taking this product for the duration of my journey with ketosis.

[hedrickbl]

Nutrition:
Coffee
half and half
mct powder

6 oz 85% ground beef
2 pieces bacon
3 sticks string cheese
7 sticks chedar cheese
2 scoops on whey

8 oz grilled chicken
1 cup brussel sprouts

total:
Cals - 2263
net carbs - 21
fat - 137
protein - 215

training:
Hex dead - 3 x 3
back squats - 10 x 5
hip bridge - 12 x 3
sit ups - max x 5
partial situp with holds - 2
preacher curl - 15 x 3 ea arm
overhead rope tri extension - 15 x 3
arnold concentration curl - 15 x 3
rev grip tri extension - 15 x 3 ea arm

[hedrickbl]

Progress notes:
3 weeks
start weight - 232
start waist - 38"

current weight - 231
current waist - 38"

total progress"
weight = -1
waist = 0

NOTES:
Even though I have 0 progress on waist, I can see that I am leaning out. My pants are also getting looser which is a good indicator. I think I may need to add in some more daily cardio to start making some real progress.

[hedrickbl]

Nutrition:
Coffee
half and half
mct powder

4 chedar cheese sticks
8 oz grilled chicken
0.25 cup macadamia nuts

4 oz ribeye steak
6 cups baby spinach
1 oz gorgonzola
6 tbs cesar vinaigrette
1 can monster ultra

totals:
Cals - 1815
net carbs - 19
fat - 130
protein - 130

training:
None

[hedrickbl]

Nutrition:
coffee
half and half
mct powder

0.25 cups macadamia nuts
8 oz grilled chicken
6 string cheese sticks
2 scoops ON whey

1 cup half and half
3 tbs coconut oil
2 scoops ON whey

Totals:
Cals - 2349
Net Carbs - 35
Fat - 158
Protein - 208

Training:
squat
dead
bench
arms
abs