pullups question

[alfalfaa]

Hi, new here.

In pullups we lift the whole body. But when we're learning we're advised to do negative pullups. How much percentage of body are we lifting in negative phase? I do both BB rows n negative pullups but my friend said negative pullups would involve more weight since I am moving a large percentage of my body... and so better than bb rows.

Is this right? Do I continue with bb rows or focus on negative pullups?

[SuffolkPunch]

That's tricky to answer because we aren't lifting the body, we're letting it drop. I think this comes down to the level of how muscles work internally because negatives are (anecdotally) harder than just holding a position at the top. So the muscles are still moving and still applying a force - but being overcome by the opposing force.

[SuffolkPunch]

I don't think it's useful to try to put a number to it. My advice is that if you can do at least 1 proper pullup then do pullups - do plenty of sets, hopefully staying 1 or 2 reps away from failure.

I would prefer to use the lat pulldown if you have access to one since it's a closer approximation to a pullup than a row is. Rows are useful for other reasons.

[alfalfaa]

I don't think it's useful to try to put a number to it. My advice is that if you can do at least 1 proper pullup then do pullups - do plenty of sets, hopefully staying 1 or 2 reps away from failure.

I would prefer to use the lat pulldown if you have access to one since it's a closer approximation to a pullup than a row is. Rows are useful for other reasons.

Thanks, friend. I can do one pullup so if i do that, wouldn't that be like training to failure?
Also when I use negatives to improve pullups, it takes a long time recover so I can't do rows properly either.

It's a catch 22.

[beowulf359]

Hi, new here.
Is this right? Do I continue with bb rows or focus on negative pullups?

While rows and pull-ups work similar muscles in your back the emphasis is different as pull-ups (or lat pull-downs) are a vertical pull while rows are horizontal.

A good program should include both horizontal and vertical pulling movements for the back.

[alfalfaa]

While rows and pull-ups work similar muscles in your back the emphasis is different as pull-ups (or lat pull-downs) are a vertical pull while rows are horizontal.

A good program should include both horizontal and vertical pulling movements for the back.

My main interest is a wide back, so I assume pullups or any vertical pull is best for it instead of rows?

[SuffolkPunch]

Thanks, friend. I can do one pullup so if i do that, wouldn't that be like training to failure?
Also when I use negatives to improve pullups, it takes a long time recover so I can't do rows properly either.

It's a catch 22.

Try to do 3 singles one day with 2 mins between. Next time try 4 and so on. When you get to 10, then try doing sets of 2 etc.

My main interest is a wide back, so I assume pullups or any vertical pull is best for it instead of rows?

Do both ideally.

[BeginnerGainz]

My main interest is a wide back, so I assume pullups or any vertical pull is best for it instead of rows?

You can’t target growth vs width. That is a myth that simply won’t die.

Do both but do 2:1 horizontal to vertical pulls.

[Ironface]

That's tricky to answer because we aren't lifting the body, we're letting it drop. I think this comes down to the level of how muscles work internally because negatives are (anecdotally) harder than just holding a position at the top. So the muscles are still moving and still applying a force - but being overcome by the opposing force.

I guess you could say we're *exerting against* our entire bodyweight, but not necessarily lifting it.

Slow negatives, lat pulldown, and rows can help too since they train similar muscles. Also, if you're fat - losing weight can make pull-ups easier.

[Ironface]

You can’t target growth vs width. That is a myth that simply won’t die.

Do both but do 2:1 horizontal to vertical pulls.

Vertical pulls recruit lats more than horizontal pulls. Lats and teres seem to be the biggest contributors to back width. The "thickness" people refer to is more likely to be the mid/lower traps, erectors, rhomboids - the stuff located in the "inner" back.

That said, you can still build humungous lats from horizontal pulls. You just need to do more of them to get the same amount of lat growth you'd get from doing fewer sets of vertical pulls.