when men tell you to smile...

[asteroidbooty]

I mostly get this from older men. I thought it was more a generational thing. I usually forgive older men who flirt like that. For some reason I just can't take them seriously; it's almost like a game to them to practice their "skills".

[BrotherWolf]

My husband/father/grandfather/brother nor any male that KNOWS me ever says this to me. I ONLY get this from random men. I too have an RBF, and usually am not thinking of my "facial expression" but am thinking about the other million things going on in my life. I also ONLY get this when I am alone. so no man approaches me to say this when I am with my husband.

And no, if my husband TOLD me to smile, I would not appreciate it. Usually he does something to make me smile, sends a text or leaves me a sweet note in the book I am reading, brings me chocolate, etc... he doesn't have to tell me what to do.

Usually if someone tells me to smile, I just give them a weird look, because its only random men that say it and only when I am alone. So its really weird to me that the only convo they say is to smile. I actually smile when someone says hello or let me get the door for you, or some other pleasantry, but just walking by and telling me to smile or id look a lot prettier if I smiled or as the case the other day, it cant be all that bad..... that's not something that is NORMAL to say. Men don't walk by other men and say this, and women sure don't say it to each other in my experience...

probably should have worded it better, I didn't mean people literally asking you to smile.. that is weird af lol

[Banbimi]

And no, if my husband TOLD me to smile, I would not appreciate it. Usually he does something to make me smile, sends a text or leaves me a sweet note in the book I am reading, brings me chocolate, etc... he doesn't have to tell me what to do.
.

Me too. My husband will tell me I am beautiful and give me a kiss and that will make me smile. Or bringing me coffee makes me smile. If he told me," you look prettier when you smile." That would seem like an insult to say I don't look pretty now. What am I supposed to be smiling about?

[Banbimi]

the problem is simply being asked the question by the wrong person .. whether you're a guy or a girl
when you find the person asking attractive you smile back , in fact I would say that they don't even need to say anything, a smile comes naturally when the other person is attractive to you

Men and women find different things attractive. The type of person who demands that you smile at them is unattractive to women no matter what they look like.

[Bravoiswhiskey]

would you agree though that if the right person asked you, you wouldn't have a problem ? say the BF or husband or your gym crush
just curious

I don't think my gym crush would remain my gym crush if he told me to smile.

If my fiance asked me to smile, I'd probably bare-toothed grimace at him. But I don't think he'd ever do that or need to. I usually smile like a gross idiot any time we make eye contact for long enough. Can't help it. He's beautiful.

I don't care if people tease me that I always look serious, especially in the gym - because usually I am feeling serious and also I'm probably listening to angry metal. That's the truth. But I don't want people randomly telling me how to make my face look. That's like me telling a stranger, "Hey, your posture makes you look fat and weak. You should stop slouching" and then pretending like it's playful and not a pushy thing to say. It's obnoxious to make someone else's appearance your business.

[LunaLifts]

would you agree though that if the right person asked you, you wouldn't have a problem ? say the BF or husband or your gym crush
just curious

If it were a gym crush, I would be crushing a lot less. It's still a stranger, even if I think they're cute, telling me to do something makes a person much less appealing to me.

My boyfriend doesn't say it, he doesn't have to, I think most people would say their SO makes them smile anyway so they don't have to ask (if they didn't I'd be worried for them).
If he did though, I'd be annoyed. He knows I deal with mental illness, and sometimes that means I have periods of depression. So if he wasn't sure if I was depressed, or just having a bad day, he'd give me a hug, tell me he's sorry I feel bad, etc. If he said "just smile" he chances that he's dismissing my depression as something to be "shrugged off" and he knows how I feel about that. I know this doesn't apply to everyone, but in my case it's like telling someone to "just calm down." When has that ever done anything but make the person less calm? Lol.

[BrotherWolf]

but in my case it's like telling someone to "just calm down." When has that ever done anything but make the person less calm? Lol.

take a chill pill ? would that work better ? lol

[LunaLifts]

take a chill pill ? would that work better ? lol

I prefer "chillax" we need to bring that word back. >.<

[mcbourque]

Must be me being older but this really really wouldn't bother me. There are so many more things in life to be upset about (kids doing without food, people getting shot, etc) that I find this micromanaging of other people's behavior quite tedious.

IMHO - so what, an old man wants to acknowledge a young woman because he thinks she is pretty and this is how he does it.

One day (when we turn middle-age like me) we get to the stage where people totally ignore us and we become completely invisible - that feels a lot more worse to me that a few looks, open doors and awkward comments.

Must be a generation thing and I don't mean to be insensitive here since I rarely post in the female section anymore, but I don't remember feeling like such a victim all the time in my 20s when interacting with men (and I was one of the very few female in my STEM field). Is this a new thing? Personally I find it sad and a waste of energy. And the opposite of empowering.

If it bothers you, say something. We are not victims. We can either say something if we think it's a huge deal worth fighting over, or shrug it off and move on. IMO

... ok retreating back the O35 now

[Charuto222]

take a chill pill ? would that work better ? lol

I'm partial to "go smoke a joint and get laid" myself.

Had to learn the hard way to keep my hands up when I say it tho

[BrotherWolf]

I prefer "chillax" we need to bring that word back. >.<

yeah that'll go really well

[BrotherWolf]

Must be me being older but this really really wouldn't bother me. There are so many more things in life to be upset about (kids doing without food, people getting shot, etc) that I find this micromanaging of other people's behavior quite tedious.

IMHO - so what, an old man wants to acknowledge a young woman because he thinks she is pretty and this is how he does it.

One day (when we turn middle-age like me) we get to the stage where people totally ignore us and we become completely invisible - that feels a lot more worse to me that a few looks, open doors and awkward comments.

Must be a generation thing and I don't mean to be insensitive here since I rarely post in the female section anymore, but I don't remember feeling like such a victim all the time in my 20s when interacting with men (and I was one of the very few female in my STEM field). Is this a new thing? Personally I find it sad and a waste of energy. And the opposite of empowering.

If it bothers you, say something. We are not victims. We can either say something if we think it's a huge deal worth fighting over, or shrug it off and move on. IMO

... ok retreating back the O35 now

I think age can have something to do with this, you don't get easily offended and learn to deal with these situations without letting it get to you

[Charuto222]

Must be me being older but this really really wouldn't bother me. There are so many more things in life to be upset about (kids doing without food, people getting shot, etc) that I find this micromanaging of other people's behavior quite tedious.

IMHO - so what, an old man wants to acknowledge a young woman because he thinks she is pretty and this is how he does it.

One day (when we turn middle-age like me) we get to the stage where people totally ignore us and we become completely invisible - that feels a lot more worse to me that a few looks, open doors and awkward comments.

Must be a generation thing and I don't mean to be insensitive here since I rarely post in the female section anymore, but I don't remember feeling like such a victim all the time in my 20s when interacting with men (and I was one of the very few female in my STEM field). Is this a new thing? Personally I find it sad and a waste of energy. And the opposite of empowering.

If it bothers you, say something. We are not victims. We can either say something if we think it's a huge deal worth fighting over, or shrug it off and move on. IMO

... ok retreating back the O35 now

It's more the sociocultural conditioning within the generation than it is the generation itself. Otherwise I concur with this 100%. Have some (comparatively poverty) greens

[LisaSkinnoble]

I always smile at people.

When I am walking and I see someone approaching in my peripheral, I raise my head and smile. I look right at them and I smile and say Good Morning or Hello, whether I am having a good day or a bad day.

When my telephone rings, I pause one ring and smile. A smile is reflected in one's voice.

These are just social niceties. Kind of like a good handshake, or saying "How do you do" when introduced to someone, and remembering to say "please" and "thank you" with sincerity. (To smile with sincerity, smile with your eyes as well as your mouth.) You might call that having manners.

And, barring any horrific dental conditions, we all look better when we smile.

[rockangel]

Must be me being older but this really really wouldn't bother me. There are so many more things in life to be upset about (kids doing without food, people getting shot, etc) that I find this micromanaging of other people's behavior quite tedious.

IMHO - so what, an old man wants to acknowledge a young woman because he thinks she is pretty and this is how he does it.

One day (when we turn middle-age like me) we get to the stage where people totally ignore us and we become completely invisible - that feels a lot more worse to me that a few looks, open doors and awkward comments.

Must be a generation thing and I don't mean to be insensitive here since I rarely post in the female section anymore, but I don't remember feeling like such a victim all the time in my 20s when interacting with men (and I was one of the very few female in my STEM field). Is this a new thing? Personally I find it sad and a waste of energy. And the opposite of empowering.

If it bothers you, say something. We are not victims. We can either say something if we think it's a huge deal worth fighting over, or shrug it off and move on. IMO

... ok retreating back the O35 now

I understand what you are saying here, but, this has gone on my whole life. Not just now. And I have always "looked younger" than my true age to most people, to the point where its common for people to believe my children are my brother/sister and if I am with my mom, who is older than you, they assume my kids are hers and not her grand babies. We had someone call the police on my husband because they thought I was 15 and he looks much older than me even though he is younger. They thought he was "molesting" me. I was 24 and we had been married a year.

While this might seem like a "nice problem" to have, I find it creepy when old men hit on me in this manner thinking I am 15. That's not flattering, its scary.

Also, I think that its more of an issue if you have been assaulted before. Its not about being offended, its about not feeling safe and comfortable. Its not about being a victim, but I also don't want to be in a situation where I feel this person might be an issue. I do not think all men are bad. Far from it. But I don't trust people easily either since my trust has been broken.

I will be happy to reach the age (and look it) where people ignore me. I don't need them to tell me to smile or anything else. Just leave me alone and let me go about my life. Is that really that hard to do or understand? Just let people be.

Men in here may not think its a big deal, and maybe to them it isn't. But to someone else, it might be an issue. Their intent may have been to be nice or show "appreciation" (to which i still find it an inappropriate method)but to me, its creepy and impolite and puts that person on my radar as a potential threat. I don't want to talk to you, or worry if you are going to follow me to my car, or worse. There are so much better and more appropriate ways to approach a female. A simple hello is polite, respectful and hella less creepy.

I really don't understand why people don't get that and feel the need to say stupid crap like "smile darling" as a way to approach a woman. Maybe you men in here should better explain this. Why do men THINK this is cool?? If its so cool to say this and harmless and polite, then why don't they say this when I am with my hubby?? Why don't they tell this TO my hubby who looks a shyte ton meaner, he doesn't smile because he has an under bite and he is self conscious about it. Yet no man or woman ever tells him to "smile"..... its not a generational thing.

[likeafish]

Quick way for most men to figure out if your social interactions are creepy or annoying to a lot of women, would you do/say it to another man?

Would you tell your fellow male coworkers they're too attractive to not be smiling?

[LisaSkinnoble]

I understand what you are saying here, but, this has gone on my whole life. Not just now. And I have always "looked younger" than my true age to most people, to the point where its common for people to believe my children are my brother/sister and if I am with my mom, who is older than you, they assume my kids are hers and not her grand babies. We had someone call the police on my husband because they thought I was 15 and he looks much older than me even though he is younger. They thought he was "molesting" me. I was 24 and we had been married a year.

While this might seem like a "nice problem" to have, I find it creepy when old men hit on me in this manner thinking I am 15. That's not flattering, its scary.

Also, I think that its more of an issue if you have been assaulted before. Its not about being offended, its about not feeling safe and comfortable. Its not about being a victim, but I also don't want to be in a situation where I feel this person might be an issue. I do not think all men are bad. Far from it. But I don't trust people easily either since my trust has been broken.

I will be happy to reach the age (and look it) where people ignore me. I don't need them to tell me to smile or anything else. Just leave me alone and let me go about my life. Is that really that hard to do or understand? Just let people be.

Men in here may not think its a big deal, and maybe to them it isn't. But to someone else, it might be an issue. Their intent may have been to be nice or show "appreciation" (to which i still find it an inappropriate method)but to me, its creepy and impolite and puts that person on my radar as a potential threat. I don't want to talk to you, or worry if you are going to follow me to my car, or worse. There are so much better and more appropriate ways to approach a female. A simple hello is polite, respectful and hella less creepy.

I really don't understand why people don't get that and feel the need to say stupid crap like "smile darling" as a way to approach a woman. Maybe you men in here should better explain this. Why do men THINK this is cool?? If its so cool to say this and harmless and polite, then why don't they say this when I am with my hubby?? Why don't they tell this TO my hubby who looks a shyte ton meaner, he doesn't smile because he has an under bite and he is self conscious about it. Yet no man or woman ever tells him to "smile"..... its not a generational thing.

I'm sorry bad things have happened to you. There is very good counselling available.

Not every man is a rapist. Not every man is hitting on you. I actually thought we were talking about OP's security guard/concierge, not the guy on the subway with yellow teeth wearing a trench coat on sunny day.

[VO2Maxima]

Quick way for most men to figure out if your social interactions are creepy or annoying to a lot of women, would you do/say it to another man?

Would you tell your fellow male coworkers they're too attractive to not be smiling?

Or go with it this way...if another man, preferably one who outweighed you by 50-100lbs, said it to you, would you be comfortable with it?

[HeroesFall]

I think sometimes you ladies over analyze things. Yes, men have a bad habit of being flirty when not desired, although that's conditional. At the same time sometimes things are said in innocence or in an effort to be friendly. Yes multiple times a week is overkill, but if it's a random comment said because you always seem droopy or pissed off, maybe there's a reason. Or the person is just trying to playfully poke you to get you to laugh / smile to brighten your day.

You should work at an engineering company. People are so introverted that saying good morning or eye contact in the hallway never happens, well unless the other person is a female. Always enjoy joking with some of the female engimeeting friends about how I feel slighted on human decency.

So, I understand and see where it can be tiresome, but at the same time - and speaking as a male here obviously - if you don't show your lighter side people will perceive you as darker, unfriendly, or negative and it will affect your standing perception where you work. Maybe it's not the same for you ladies, but from what I've seen / been told as a rather serious person myself, it does

[rockangel]

I think sometimes you ladies over analyze things. Yes, men have a bad habit of being flirty when not desired, although that's conditional. At the same time sometimes things are said in innocence or in an effort to be friendly. Yes multiple times a week is overkill, but if it's a random comment said because you always seem droopy or pissed off, maybe there's a reason. Or the person is just trying to playfully poke you to get you to laugh / smile to brighten your day.

You should work at an engineering company. People are so introverted that saying good morning or eye contact in the hallway never happens, well unless the other person is a female. Always enjoy joking with some of the female engimeeting friends about how I feel slighted on human decency.

So, I understand and see where it can be tiresome, but at the same time - and speaking as a male here obviously - if you don't show your lighter side people will perceive you as darker, unfriendly, or negative and it will affect your standing perception where you work. Maybe it's not the same for you ladies, but from what I've seen / been told as a rather serious person myself, it does

Its obvious you don't understand at all.

We as women, as people even, don't owe anyone anything, including "showing someone my lighter side".... just because my mind is going over a million things and my face is not insanely smiling like a stupid stepford wife in no way means that I have to change my facial expression for anyone. I don't know these people, nor care to, so I don't care to talk to them or show them anything. I want them to leave me alone.... how hard is that for men to understand???

This is not "flirting".

I mean, do you just go around and say, hey, I need to show my lighter side today so I'm not perceived as some bad thing to random people so I will smile like a lunatic about nothing so people will not tell me to smile???

No, you don't and neither should I.

If you want to flirt with me, there are better ways to approach it, and, when done in a non creepy manner, I say I'm flattered but married. But as noted, rejecting men can be DANGEROUS to us and have severe consequences.

If I am interested in making friends with someone, they will "see my lighter side" as usually I am a joking, sarcastic, goof ball anyways, I'm just not that way every second of my day to every random person I meet just so they will like me or whatever. Why cant he just shut up and let me be??? Its creepy and rude. So why do you say to "lighten up" when its creepy and rude???

And you answered none of my questions? Why is it ok only when I am alone. I don't get approached with this when I am with my hubby and for sure no one ever tells my husband to smile more?? Why must I show a lighter side only when I am alone to people who have no bearing in my life ???

[Banbimi]

I always smile at people.

When I am walking and I see someone approaching in my peripheral, I raise my head and smile. I look right at them and I smile and say Good Morning or Hello, whether I am having a good day or a bad day.

When my telephone rings, I pause one ring and smile. A smile is reflected in one's voice.

These are just social niceties. Kind of like a good handshake, or saying "How do you do" when introduced to someone, and remembering to say "please" and "thank you" with sincerity. (To smile with sincerity, smile with your eyes as well as your mouth.) You might call that having manners.

And, barring any horrific dental conditions, we all look better when we smile.

do you tell people in your office repeatedly, "oh come on give me a smile" or "you're too pretty not to smile" or "you need to smile its beautiful outside" or would you consider that bad manners?

[HapaHaoleOkole]

I agree with rockangel, it is also intrusive. I don't walk around telling other people to smile. It is trying to force someone else you don't know, to interact with you, to give you attention in the way you want.

[Charuto222]

Their intent may have been to be nice or show "appreciation" (to which i still find it an inappropriate method)but to me, its creepy and impolite and puts that person on my radar as a potential threat. I don't want to talk to you, or worry if you are going to follow me to my car, or worse.

So then what would be an appropriate method to show appreciation to someone like you who, due to previous experience, is wary of and - from what I'm reading - perhaps a little avoidant when it comes to male encounters? If I strike up a conversation with a woman who - unbeknownst to me - may have had similar experiences to yours which has shaped her perception of these things in a similar way and I notice that she's not really comfortable with talking to me, should I just never speak to her again? That's what it sounds like when I read this:

Just leave me alone and let me go about my life. Is that really that hard to do or understand? Just let people be.

And this

I don't know these people, nor care to, so I don't care to talk to them or show them anything. I want them to leave me alone.... how hard is that for men to understand???

Or am I misinterpreting?

I really don't understand why people don't get that and feel the need to say stupid crap like "smile darling" as a way to approach a woman. Maybe you men in here should better explain this. Why do men THINK this is cool??

Men don't specifically think it's cool, they're just more likely to see it as some silly, socially awkward thing as opposed to a threat. More or less everyone understands that it COULD be a threat, it's just not the first thing to come to mind. If you live in fear of everything that COULD be a threat you'd have to spend your entire life inside a bubble and that's not a good place to be. Just about all of the men in here can see how it's silly and not the best way to strike up a conversation with someone, what we're not seeing (or at least what I'm not seeing) is why some of the women itt feel the need to turn this into a male dominance/entitlement/control issue and make an "I will not bow to your demands" situation out of this. It seems manufactured. Is EVERYTHING a person asks/wants you to do a dominance/control/entitlement issue or is there something special about that person being a man and what he's asking for being a smile that makes it so? Even if some of them have been through the same thing as you, I can understand wariness and maybe some fear or otherwise just not wanting to deal with it but why the above sentiment?

[DNABabe]

It totally depends on context, and "vibes" I get from the person in question. Men have no clue about our past bad experiences, can't expect even the sweetest ones to read our minds. I've got a pretty good "creep" radar, I just don't acknowledge those, just get the heck out of there. But if I view it as a sincere way to broach a conversation with me and the guy seems genuine, then I don't see it as a threat, just a maybe a bit awkward way of opening a convo with me :-)

[BrotherWolf]

do you tell people in your office repeatedly, "oh come on give me a smile" or "you're too pretty not to smile" or "you need to smile its beautiful outside" or would you consider that bad manners?

can totally see Lisa saying that around the office

[FallenAngel80]

I prefer "chillax" we need to bring that word back. >.<

The word 'chillax' is like the equivalent of someone running their nails down a blackboard for me lol!


I totally get the 'being asked to smile' thing. There are times where I don't want to smile. I think a lot about things, (which isn't always a good thing), and when I think I frown just because I am concentrating. To have that train of though interrupted by someone asking me to smile....NO!

OP, could you carry round something like this in your purse? lol!

[LisaSkinnoble]

do you tell people in your office repeatedly, "oh come on give me a smile" or "you're too pretty not to smile" or "you need to smile its beautiful outside" or would you consider that bad manners?

I've never had to. Everyone smiles at me, probably because I've smiled at them. I do hear "you have such a pretty smile" a lot. I am told I have a contagious laugh too. I remember a lawyer whose office was about 4 down from mine used to send me something funny in an email, then he'd go out in the hallway and wait for me to laugh. Then he and his assistants would just erupt with laughter!

[Echo814]

From personal experience, I got this a lot from older women when I was younger. It never really bothered me even on the odd couple of times it came from a male. I have a permanent case of resting b!tch and even my family thinks I'm pissed all the time lol.

[kimm4]

[rockangel]

So then what would be an appropriate method to show appreciation to someone like you who, due to previous experience, is wary of and - from what I'm reading - perhaps a little avoidant when it comes to male encounters? If I strike up a conversation with a woman who - unbeknownst to me - may have had similar experiences to yours which has shaped her perception of these things in a similar way and I notice that she's not really comfortable with talking to me, should I just never speak to her again? That's what it sounds like when I read this:



And this



Or am I misinterpreting?



Men don't specifically think it's cool, they're just more likely to see it as some silly, socially awkward thing as opposed to a threat. More or less everyone understands that it COULD be a threat, it's just not the first thing to come to mind. If you live in fear of everything that COULD be a threat you'd have to spend your entire life inside a bubble and that's not a good place to be. Just about all of the men in here can see how it's silly and not the best way to strike up a conversation with someone, what we're not seeing (or at least what I'm not seeing) is why some of the women itt feel the need to turn this into a male dominance/entitlement/control issue and make an "I will not bow to your demands" situation out of this. It seems manufactured. Is EVERYTHING a person asks/wants you to do a dominance/control/entitlement issue or is there something special about that person being a man and what he's asking for being a smile that makes it so? Even if some of them have been through the same thing as you, I can understand wariness and maybe some fear or otherwise just not wanting to deal with it but why the above sentiment?

How a bout a "hi, how are you doing today?" Or a simple hello??? Because if someone says hi to me, I will smile and say hello back, if I feel like this person is someone I want to have a convo with, then I will take it further. A converstation is a back and forth between two people.

Telling me to smile is not a conversation, it does not invite me into an exchange. It only allows for me to "smile" as an "appropriate" response to the other person's demands. It does not allow me to get to know you, all it does is make me think you are rude.

I don't avoid men and I don't live my life in a bubble. But I am wary and aware of my surroundings when alone and I do not appreciate when any stranger just randomly demands me to smile.

Also, as a woman, we are TAUGHT to fear and be wary of men. Not to walk alone at night, to ask for escort to our car late at night, to carry mace, hold our keys in our hand as we walk to our car, to get in our car and lock it straight away, to not drink or if we do drink, never leave our drink unattended.... these are things that men are not told or taught, yet we as women are. We do have a need to be cautious. And I do think its unfair to men as well that we are taught this as not all men are horrid creatures.

But the reality is, men are dangerous and can be unpredictable. So if its not something that is ok to say to me with my husband standing right there, then maybe men should rethink the things they say. You called it "socially awkward" because it is, its impolite and the wrong thing to say. It shows that you aren't thinking of the woman as a person, but as someone who must do what you wish. Why is it so hard to just say hello like a normal person??

If a man wants to talk to a woman, you don't need some dumb contrived excuse. just say hi and ask hows it going... you are polite, less creepy and can easily judge if the woman wants to carry on a convo with you. If she walks away, just shrug an go on. Obviously. she wasn't in to you. Chances are, you wont see her again to worry about it. If its a person you see regularly, it behooves you to actually try to get to know her rather than telling her to smile all the time.