TGreggors' Second Training Log

[TGreggors]

Looking solid dude, crazy how you've maintained your leanness/weight this long. Hell I concluded my cut in early October and I'm up about 8-10lbs right now and it's only been 2 months.

Like yourself, I've never gotten my hormone levels tested. Honestly I want to sometime as well just to get a baseline reading because it would be cool info to have. My only problem is the fact that I passed out during a blood drive my senior year as well lol. Funny part was that I filled the bag up in roughly 2-3 minutes, which is unheard of. My biology teacher at the time thought they may have hit an artery instead of a vein so they were taking oxygenated blood out of my system.

Sucks about the tweak, but I've found that when I tweak something it heals in no time at all. I think you'll be good to go by Saturday. I think you'll do super well at this meet considering your squat and DL strength are crazy good for your body weight.

It has been challenging...wanting to delay having to go into a minicut to clean things up for as long as possible after that prep. Those 41 weeks of dieting really took it out of me physically and mentally. Hey, don't beat yourself up over it at all. I also gained around that much after my prep. Just have maintained for the most part for the last four months after I put on that weight. Can't tell if you passed out due to just having a hard time with needles or because you lost so much blood. Geeeeezzz. Call me selfish, but I don't think i'll ever be one to give blood. The whole process stresses me out.

You're right on the money though, I do believe. Back is feeling completely 100% fine today. wasn't much of anything. Now I just am going to do a modest cut in sodium and go lightish on the fluids tonight to ensure that I have no problems weighing in tomorrow. May go on a ride in my car with the heat all the way turned up/dressed in like three layers of clothing as well if i'm having any problems in the morning.

We'll see! I have quite a few people coming to watch so i don't wanna let them down either. Going to lay it all out there Saturday.

[TGreggors]

12/8/16:
164.8 lbs.

Paused Standing BB Overhead Press:
45 x 10
65 x 5
95 x 10, 9, 8

HS Chest Supported Low Rows:
2 45s + 25/side x 9, 9, 8

Seated Hammer Curls:
35s x 9
30s x 12, 12

Seated DB Overhead Triceps Presses:
55 x 14, 14, 13

Last session before the meet. Just went in to get the prescribed accessory work in so I don't have to go in after the meet on Saturday. Thinking I'll be going in for a full body hypertrophy session on Sunday before consulting with Brad on Monday. Beginning the new program on Tuesday.

[TGreggors]

Woke up this morning to a bodyweight of 160.6 lbs. before driving up to the venue that's two hours away for the weigh in. Sodium cut worked like a charm.

[IK9]

I haven't. Although I kinda wish I had the data on hand. Believe it or not, I have a relatively strong aversion to needles (not the best thing to hear from a dude who will be able to give immunizations in a month, haha). I passed out twice when I went to the gastroenterologist back in February to get some blood work done. Probably should bite the bullet just to see.


Probably a similar situation for me, tbh. Were your test levels like chronically low or did you get prescribed after a single low measurement? Not knocking you at all for staying on...especially if it allows for you to live a normal life. Not at all shocked about the muscle mass levels, though.

Hey, if you're not loving lifting hard, why do it? Cliche as it sounds, life is too short to devote yourself to something so much if you're not getting what you feel are adequate returns. I bet that diet attributed to you getting burnt out.

In 2013, I was at 300 ng/dl so it was pretty low even without having ever taken anything at that time. I think I would have had to go down that route eventually considering test lvls drop about 1% per year after a certain age

Yeah, I never had my carbs below 200g before that diet.. not rushing is the best option

Good luck on your powerlifting meet.. I'm excited to see how you do & your bodybuilding vs powerlifting comparison story!

[TGreggors]

In 2013, I was at 300 ng/dl so it was pretty low even without having ever taken anything at that time. I think I would have had to go down that route eventually considering test lvls drop about 1% per year after a certain age

Yeah, I never had my carbs below 200g before that diet.. not rushing is the best option

Good luck on your powerlifting meet.. I'm excited to see how you do & your bodybuilding vs powerlifting comparison story!

dang man. 300 is quite low. Really piquing my curiosity about my own levels.

Thanks man....Really testing the waters this year to see which I prefer. Love both disciplines.

[TGreggors]

Just drove two hours to the venue and weighed in at 161.4 lbs. on their scale. So I am in the clear. Meet isn't until 8 am tomorrow so I am just hanging around this super small town and am using free wifi at a local Mcdonalds ahahaha. Happy to finally have the worry of making weight off my mind. Killing time until checking in at the hotel.

[IK9]

Grats on breaking 1K at your first meet!

In for write-up and bodybuilding vs powerlifting comparison hehe

[TGreggors]

Grats on breaking 1K at your first meet!

In for write-up and bodybuilding vs powerlifting comparison hehe

Thanks brah. It was SO MUCH fun. I will say that the adrenaline rush was not as much as what I experienced back in June. But the preparation process was not nearly as excruciating, which is a plus. And there's something to be said for feeling like an athlete. Which I did. The objectivity associated with competing in powerlifting vs. bodybuilding was also refreshing. Not that I got robbed in June...but something to think about. I loved being able to do something the day of the competition to change the end result, whereas with bodybuilding, all of the work was done by the time I stepped on stage. I didn't have anyone in my class, though....which kind of sucked some of the fun out of it

[TGreggors]

Well, so I finished with a 1010 total yesterday. I went 7/9. First attempt was 360 on the squat. I hit 375 and missed 385. Moved over to the bench, where I hit 205 and then 215 afterwards with relative ease. I missed my final attempt with 225. Then we went to the deadlift. While I was warming up, I was a bit bummed/psyched out about my performance on the other two lifts...but I tried not to let it get to my head. Started with an easy 375 on the deadlift followed by 395. I told the event coordinator that I wanted 410 for my final attempt because my confidence had been shaken after the other two lifts. After reviewing the video of the 395 that my dad took, though, I knew I had more in me. So I went for 420. Put 420 on the bar, and while it was a grinder, I got three white lights.

So. 375 squat. 215 bench. 420 deadlift. Fell short of my expectations on the squat, but that is okay.

Started lifting at 8 am yesterday and went until 2 pm. There were only 12 lifters in total at the competition (eleven men and one woman). And I was the lightest lifter there aside from the woman. The guy in the 181 class was a monster. Total was ~1250. Then there were some real freaks in the mid/upper 200s. I witnessed a 720 pound squat and an 805 pound deadlift yesterday. Another guy showed up who did bench only who benched 625. Twas unreal to witness that kind of strength in person. Another event worth noting was that when a dude was squatting 600+, the collar slipped off the bar and a 45 fell off, causing the guy to lose balance. He dropped all of the 45 pound plates off the bar into the floor and the bar went flying LOL. So that was pretty nuts to watch from like ten feet away.

So i'm sitting here and am trying to determine which I enjoy more, competing in powerlifting or bodybuilding. Hard to say for certain because my views of both sports are rather underdeveloped from a personal experience standpoint. While there are things that I like/dislike about each discipline, I'm going to say that I prefer bodybuilding and will identify myself as a bodybuilder primarily as opposed to a powerlifter. If I would have had another 165 lb. competitor to lift against, I probably would have had a more enjoyable time (although I still had a blast). I will compete in powerlifting again in the future for sure because it was such a good time with some really passionate people....and I just love lifting heavy/pushing myself. But the difficulty associated with the journey of bodybuilding...the utter adversity...it's a love-hate relationship for me. I feel that competing in bodybuilding was more of an experience of self-growth than a powerlifting meet could ever provide. The feeling of stepping on that stage and finally making it. It was complete euphoria. and while pulling 420 with everyone screaming/encouraging me was also very cool, that internal feeling of accomplishment of stepping on stage was not paralleled yesterday.

Anyways, found out that the qualifying total for USAPL raw nationals for my weight class/age is 1072.5. So I'm only 62.5 pounds off. too bad i'll probably be 24 before I compete again.

[TGreggors]

12/11/16:
161.4 lbs.

Hack Squats:
45/side x 10
2 45s/side x 5
3 45s/side x 12, 12, 12

Slight Incline DB Presses:
20s x 10
40s x 5
55s x 15, 14, 12

High Cable Rows:
100 x 14, 15, 15

Wide Neutral Grip Pulldowns:
120 x 19
130 x 17, 16

Underhand Grip Pulldowns:
130 x 16, 16, 15

Standing Calf Raises: *w/ pause*
195 x 16, 16, 16

Dips:
BW x 14, 14, 14

HS Machine Crunches:
2 45s x 10, 10

Decline DB Situps:
60 x 18, 18

Just a fullbody hypertrophy session before beginning the new program this week. Having a consultation with Brad tomorrow.

[JerG]

Congrats on having a solid performance at the competition dude!


As far as the hormone discussion... Total Test isn't the only thing that matters. You can have mid, or high levels of total test and still have symptoms of low test or hypogonadism. Free Test is a better measure. It's important to get a full panel done. You want to check your Thyroid (TSH), Estrogen, liver enzymes etc. But yeah, if your total test is only 300, you're probably going to have low Free Test too and likely other problems. Or at least have sub-optimal hormones.

[TGreggors]

Congrats on having a solid performance at the competition dude!


As far as the hormone discussion... Total Test isn't the only thing that matters. You can have mid, or high levels of total test and still have symptoms of low test or hypogonadism. Free Test is a better measure. It's important to get a full panel done. You want to check your Thyroid (TSH), Estrogen, liver enzymes etc. But yeah, if your total test is only 300, you're probably going to have low Free Test too and likely other problems. Or at least have sub-optimal hormones.

Thank you!

Seems like you've done your homework. Have you gotten any bloodwork done yourself?

[IK9]

http://www.privatemdlabs.com/lp/fema...ne-testing.php

Here you go.. it's the $66.99 female hormone testing one that will give you all the info you need

Yes, I understand it's a "female" test but it's for men too.. the men's one doesn't give you everything you need

There is a coupon code out right now for 15% off until Dec 31st which is YGB4221 at checkout

Me and Billy and a few of my friends use this test.. you just purchase it.. go first thing in the morning FASTED to Lab Corp or Quest Diagnostics or whatever blood draw place you have near you and they draw your blood no questions asked.. you get an email of the results within a week

Or if you want to go see your general practitioner.. if you have insurance.. that works too.. but I'd rather pay the $50-67 instead of having my doc harass me with stupid questions or tell me I need to get all these other tests from different specialists such as endocrinologists, hemotologists, gastro, etc. on top of the info I'm requesting just so all his buddies can make extra money too

I've gone through both my PCP and outside labs to get bloodwork done.. it's just your preference

[TGreggors]

http://www.privatemdlabs.com/lp/fema...ne-testing.php

Here you go.. it's the $66.99 female hormone testing one that will give you all the info you need

Yes, I understand it's a "female" test but it's for men too.. the men's one doesn't give you everything you need

There is a coupon code out right now for 15% off until Dec 31st which is YGB4221 at checkout

Me and Billy and a few of my friends use this test.. you just purchase it.. go first thing in the morning FASTED to Lab Corp or Quest Diagnostics or whatever blood draw place you have near you and they draw your blood no questions asked.. you get an email of the results within a week

Or if you want to go see your general practitioner.. if you have insurance.. that works too.. but I'd rather pay the $50-67 instead of having my doc harass me with stupid questions or tell me I need to get all these other tests from different specialists such as endocrinologists, hemotologists, gastro, etc. on top of the info I'm requesting just so all his buddies can make extra money too

I've gone through both my PCP and outside labs to get bloodwork done.. it's just your preference

Thank you for the info, but I probably won't get hormonal blood work done until I start having problems that start interfering with my day-to-day life heavily. As of right now, I don't have any problems that I can detect aside from not having as crazy of a libido as I once did. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, really. Although I will keep the site in mind for the future in the event that I do start having some problems.

[TGreggors]

12/13/16:
163.4 lbs.

Squats:
45 x 10
135 x 5
225 x 5
245 x 10, 10, 10

Paused Bench Press:
135 x 5
145 x 10, 10, 10

Wide Neutral Grip Pulldowns:
140 x 13, 13, 13, 13, 12

Face Pulls:
90 x 8, 8, 8, 8, 8

Triceps Pushdowns:
110 x 8, 8, 8, 8, 8

Single Leg Leg Press:
45 + 25/side x 12
45 + 30/side x 12, 12, 12, 12

Met with Loomis yesterday and got my new program. It is pretty much a modified version of "Helmsko" by Eric Helms (the program that Helms made for Loomis). Except that I will be benching four times per week. The main lifts (squats, bench and deadlifts) have programmed loads that are pretty much just spit out based upon a formula in an excel spreadsheet. So I will not really be manipulating the loads that I will be working with on those lifts as they will be pre-determined. Squatting 3x weekly, benching 4x weekly and deadlifting 2x weekly. Eager to see what happens here.

Not going to lie, felt weird not pushing myself to my limits on the squats and bench as I normally would...may sound extremely naive, but I have a hard time ever really holding back. When you're benching 4x weekly, though, it does make sense to not push the envelope in every single session due to having residual fatigue. Anyways, got this workout in before work today. First day back in the pharmacy for break!

[JerG]

Thank you!

Seems like you've done your homework. Have you gotten any bloodwork done yourself?

I have gotten blood work done recently. I was curious because I feel my libido is much lower than normal. And I wake up a lot in the middle of the night. I fall back asleep, but wake up a lot, and urinate a lot too. I drink a lot of water but it doesn't matter even if I stop drinking later in the day.

My results showed total test near 850... which is very good, however my Estrogen was high, and my Sex hormone binding globulin was way above the normal range which is very bad. So I have pretty low free test. My TSH is also on the high end, not quite Hypothyroid but definitely not what it should be. My liver enzymes (AST / ALT) are also way above the normal range.

I initially saw a urologist and got my labs done for free. I'm seeing a specialist on the 12-23. I'm a pretty unusual case I think

I think I had hormone problems when I was younger, I had a pretty severe case of gyno from puberty and had to get surgery

[TGreggors]

I have gotten blood work done recently. I was curious because I feel my libido is much lower than normal. And I wake up a lot in the middle of the night. I fall back asleep, but wake up a lot, and urinate a lot too. I drink a lot of water but it doesn't matter even if I stop drinking later in the day.

My results showed total test near 850... which is very good, however my Estrogen was high, and my Sex hormone binding globulin was way above the normal range which is very bad. So I have pretty low free test. My TSH is also on the high end, not quite Hypothyroid but definitely not what it should be. My liver enzymes (AST / ALT) are also way above the normal range.

I initially saw a urologist and got my labs done for free. I'm seeing a specialist on the 12-23. I'm a pretty unusual case I think

I think I had hormone problems when I was younger, I had a pretty severe case of gyno from puberty and had to get surgery

What have they done/what are they doing for treatment? seems like a more complicated case that wouldn't be alleviated just by prescribing test. Sorry to hear about that, man. Please do provide an update after your appointment if you don't mind. I'd be interested in hearing about how a professional would go about treating it.

[TGreggors]

12/14/16:
163.2 lbs.

Squats:
45 x 10
135 x 5
225 x 5
285 x 3, 3, 3

Paused Bench Press:
135 x 5
165 x 3, 3, 3

Deadlift:
275 x 3
315 x 3, 3, 3

Lat Pulldowns:
180 x 8, 8, 8, 8, 8

Low Cable Rows:
120 x 12, 12, 12, 12, 11, 1

HS Seated Crunches:
2 45s x 11, 10

Decline DB Situps:
60 x 19, 17

Gotta say, having my doubts creep in with the progression on my main lifts. The squats. bench and deads were EASY. But this program was developed based upon the principles of DUP/ the studies done in the lab of Mike Zourdos. Just going to stay true to the numbers for now. Zourdos did the programming for Brian Whitacre so I know that there is definitely something to this that I'm not seeing.

[JerG]

What have they done/what are they doing for treatment? seems like a more complicated case that wouldn't be alleviated just by prescribing test. Sorry to hear about that, man. Please do provide an update after your appointment if you don't mind. I'd be interested in hearing about how a professional would go about treating it.

The first doctor basically had no idea what to do ha. However the specialist next week has a better idea.

[TGreggors]

The first doctor basically had no idea what to do ha. However the specialist next week has a better idea.

Best of luck to you. Crazy how high your total test is, though.

[TGreggors]

12/16/16:
164.2 lbs.

Paused Bench Press:
45 x 10
95 x 5
135 x 5
165 x 6, 6, 6

Standing DB Lateral Raises:
20 x 12, 12, 12, 12, 13

Lying Leg Curls:
110 x 8, 8, 8, 8, 8

Standing BB Overhead Press: *paused*
85 x 12, 12
75 x 12
65 x 12, 12

Cable Pull-Throughs:
Full stack + 45 x 12, 12, 12, 12, 12

Standing Calf Raises: *paused*
225 x 12, 12, 12, 12, 13

This was a definite adjustment. Okay, starting to feel the volume.

[TGreggors]

12/17/16:
164.8 lbs.

Squats:
45 x 10
135 x 5
225 x 5
285 x 6, 6, 6

Paused Bench Press:
135 x 5
150 x 9, 9, 9

Deadlift:
275 x 3
325 x 5, 5, 5

Flat DB Presses:
70s x 12
60s x 12, 10.5
50s x 13
45s x 14

Standing Cable Curls:
55 x 12, 12, 12, 12, 12

Hanging Leg Raises:
BW x 18, 18

Twisting Kneeling Cable Crunches:
Full stack x 12, 12

Good. Did this session at a YMCA. Chest is not used to doing this kind of work

[LoganBrown]

I imagine the decreased loads is so you can get cleaner, smoother reps. Your reps were clean and smooth at heavier weights as well, but I can vaguely recall watching a video of Jeremy Hamilton saying that working with lighter (70-80% of 1RM) loads and focusing on keeping the reps as smooth and quick as possible is better for developing the neural strength needed to move heavier weights. I forget what he said exactly, but that theory makes sense to me. Then again, I also think it depends on your goals. Believe it or not, for me personally I found my bench Press starting to skyrocket after I introduced different kinds of training aside from purely strength. I have one day where I focus on high reps done quickly, then a pure strength day, followed by a more moderate rep day where TuT is the focus. I started this program roughly 6-7 weeks ago and my bench has increased by a good 45lbs. Keep in mind this is coming from a guy who's always been a poverty bench presser. I mean there's also the muscle memory factor and the fact I'm on much higher cals now, but still a nice jump.

Just dropping in my 2 cents though, Loomis has been in this game since before I was born so I'm not one to question anything he says. Those guys at 3dmj know every fine grain of bodybuilding, and then some.

[TGreggors]

I imagine the decreased loads is so you can get cleaner, smoother reps. Your reps were clean and smooth at heavier weights as well, but I can vaguely recall watching a video of Jeremy Hamilton saying that working with lighter (70-80% of 1RM) loads and focusing on keeping the reps as smooth and quick as possible is better for developing the neural strength needed to move heavier weights. I forget what he said exactly, but that theory makes sense to me. Then again, I also think it depends on your goals. Believe it or not, for me personally I found my bench Press starting to skyrocket after I introduced different kinds of training aside from purely strength. I have one day where I focus on high reps done quickly, then a pure strength day, followed by a more moderate rep day where TuT is the focus. I started this program roughly 6-7 weeks ago and my bench has increased by a good 45lbs. Keep in mind this is coming from a guy who's always been a poverty bench presser. I mean there's also the muscle memory factor and the fact I'm on much higher cals now, but still a nice jump.

Just dropping in my 2 cents though, Loomis has been in this game since before I was born so I'm not one to question anything he says. Those guys at 3dmj know every fine grain of bodybuilding, and then some.

Funny that you mention the Jeremy Hamilton video, because that's also exactly who came to mind when I wasn't pushing my last sets to an RPE of 9.5/10. I notice that the guys who really know what they're doing train to failure much less frequently than I typically do. Damn though, man. That's a sick improvement. Maybe being a bit too hopeful, but maybe, just maybe, i too can experience some of those same gains on the current program....only time will tell.

The fact that 3dmj is controlling my loads does put my mind at ease at least to some extent....not too many people who I'd place above them in terms of bodybuilding knowledge. Especially Helms and Berto.

[TGreggors]

12/19/16:
164.0 lbs.

Squats:
45 x 10
135 x 5
225 x 5
260 x 9, 9, 9

Paused Bench Press:
135 x 5
155 x 3
170 x 2, 2, 2, 2

Wide Neutral Grip Pulldowns:
150 x 11
160 x 10, 10, 10, 10

Face Pulls:
90 x 9, 9, 9, 9, 8

Cable Triceps Pushdowns:
90 x 12, 12, 12, 12, 12

Single Leg Leg Press:
45 + 30/side x 13, 13, 13, 13, 13

Squats and bench were pretty easy. Worked on honing my technique on the bench as much as possible. Leg Press was a grind. Chest and anterior delts have been extremely sore

[LoganBrown]

Funny that you mention the Jeremy Hamilton video, because that's also exactly who came to mind when I wasn't pushing my last sets to an RPE of 9.5/10. I notice that the guys who really know what they're doing train to failure much less frequently than I typically do. Damn though, man. That's a sick improvement. Maybe being a bit too hopeful, but maybe, just maybe, i too can experience some of those same gains on the current program....only time will tell.

The fact that 3dmj is controlling my loads does put my mind at ease at least to some extent....not too many people who I'd place above them in terms of bodybuilding knowledge. Especially Helms and Berto.

I think as you raise calories and gain more muscle, your bench will increase quite a bit. A bigger muscle is a stronger muscle. I'm looking forward to seeing you repping 225.

Helms, Berto, Alberts, and Loomis all have such a wealth of knowledge. I love how they all different types of knowledge as well. Helms is such a scientific, fact based guy. Same with Berto too. I've gotta say though, I love Alberts' knowledge from his experience. The guy's been in the game for a few decades now and just knows so well how to treat the sport and go about it to get the best possible results. I know Loomis is more of a PLing guy now, but his conditioning when he competed was absolutely sick. All guys are super high level.

[TGreggors]

I think as you raise calories and gain more muscle, your bench will increase quite a bit. A bigger muscle is a stronger muscle. I'm looking forward to seeing you repping 225.

Helms, Berto, Alberts, and Loomis all have such a wealth of knowledge. I love how they all different types of knowledge as well. Helms is such a scientific, fact based guy. Same with Berto too. I've gotta say though, I love Alberts' knowledge from his experience. The guy's been in the game for a few decades now and just knows so well how to treat the sport and go about it to get the best possible results. I know Loomis is more of a PLing guy now, but his conditioning when he competed was absolutely sick. All guys are super high level.

repping 225...one day. hopefully i can do it at a respectable body composition as well. Oh, i do agree. and i think that andrea even brings something special and unique to the crew. Alberts is a master of his craft and really has the soft skills down. and Loomis is the strongest of the group. Guess that saying "especially helms and berto" is a bit of an insult to the other two. They all bring something to the table. Can listen to them all ramble for hours...Their podcasts are too ideal for road trips

[TGreggors]

12/21/16:
164.0 lbs.

Squats:
45 x 10
135 x 5
225 x 5
275 x 3
295 x 2, 2, 2, 2

Paused Bench Press:
135 x 5
155 x 3
175 x 5, 5, 5

Deadlift:
275 x 3
325 x 2, 2, 2, 2

Standing BB Overhead Press: *paused*
90 x 10, 10, 10, 10, 9, 1

Lat Pulldowns:
180 x 9, 9, 9, 9, 9

Twisting Cable Crunches:
Full stack x 42
Full stack + 45 x 11

HS Seated Crunches:
2 45s x 11, 11

Good! Doing "power" work is a lot of fun. Just gripping it and being as explosive as possible on deads is a good time. Still kinda messing around with the placement of my assistance work throughout the week, but I think I may have found the setup that's ideal for me. Currently eating 2700 cals/day and have been since the meet. Looking for about a pound/month of gain. Slowest gaining phase that I've ever had. Still looking for an average morning weight of ~170 in May.

[LoganBrown]

12/21/16:
164.0 lbs.

Squats:
45 x 10
135 x 5
225 x 5
275 x 3
295 x 2, 2, 2, 2

Paused Bench Press:
135 x 5
155 x 3
175 x 5, 5, 5

Deadlift:
275 x 3
325 x 2, 2, 2, 2

Standing BB Overhead Press: *paused*
90 x 10, 10, 10, 10, 9, 1

Lat Pulldowns:
180 x 9, 9, 9, 9, 9

Twisting Cable Crunches:
Full stack x 42
Full stack + 45 x 11

HS Seated Crunches:
2 45s x 11, 11

Good! Doing "power" work is a lot of fun. Just gripping it and being as explosive as possible on deads is a good time. Still kinda messing around with the placement of my assistance work throughout the week, but I think I may have found the setup that's ideal for me. Currently eating 2700 cals/day and have been since the meet. Looking for about a pound/month of gain. Slowest gaining phase that I've ever had. Still looking for an average morning weight of ~170 in May.

Any particular reason you're looking to gain at such a slow rate? Just to minimize fat gain as much as possible?

[TGreggors]

Any particular reason you're looking to gain at such a slow rate? Just to minimize fat gain as much as possible?

Pretty much. Still not too fond of the idea of having to mini-cut et all for at least like a year and a half from now. Yeah, gaining fat is going to have to happen in order to make gains, but I feel that I can milk this gaining phase for all it's worth by going extremely slowly. My thinking is that I probably won't be benefitting too terribly much from going faster. I've gone faster on a previous bulk, although still somewhat slow (2 pounds/month) and I got sloppy looking a lot faster than I anticipated. So we're going to take things even slower this time around.