Beginner Powerbuilding Routine

[BrotherGG]

Hey bro, the program looks awesome, I have some doubts before start.

1 - I current doing Greyskull LP and taking my lastest sets to failure as the program prescibe. Here the deal, i watch some videos of coach Jeremy Hamilton on Omarisuf channel and he talks about GRINDING reps and the importance of mantain a good SPEED on doing the main lifts. I notice that on my AMRAP set the last reps almost always it's very SLOW on the lockout although my form do not breakdown, I'm worried that this kinda of work eventually could ruinned my form and make dificcult to achieve my goals. What's your opinion on that subject ?? Do you think that this reps could be detrimental to strengh gains, reinforce false movimment patterns and could to leave to overtraining ? or if I'm mantaining good form and only going to technical failure is all right to this slow kinda of reps??
2 - How do you feel about Reverse Hypers,Face pull and Dips in you program??
3- There are any good alternatives to Lat pull downs( my gym to not have a machine with adequate height to this exercise and i feel most of the work on my lower back)
4 - OHP,Bench and Deadlift : Touch and go or Paused reps(how much time?)
5 - What weight it's better to start ? 70-75 % of my 1RM it's good?
6 - For Greyskull LP I have bought some microplates(2,5lbs), its there any space for them in your program?
7 - I'm a beginner, Kroc Rows it's even beneficial for me or should i stick to strict rows?

Thank you very much.

[oliramsay]

Could OP reupload the picture that shows the actual routine to Imgur or something? The link is longer working :/

[CW47]

Could OP reupload the picture that shows the actual routine to Imgur or something? The link is longer working :/

Here's the image (sorry, don't have time to upload it to an image site right now) - Beginners Powerbuilding.png

[grouchyjarhead]

Hey bro, the program looks awesome, I have some doubts before start.

1 - I current doing Greyskull LP and taking my lastest sets to failure as the program prescibe. Here the deal, i watch some videos of coach Jeremy Hamilton on Omarisuf channel and he talks about GRINDING reps and the importance of mantain a good SPEED on doing the main lifts. I notice that on my AMRAP set the last reps almost always it's very SLOW on the lockout although my form do not breakdown, I'm worried that this kinda of work eventually could ruinned my form and make dificcult to achieve my goals. What's your opinion on that subject ?? Do you think that this reps could be detrimental to strengh gains, reinforce false movimment patterns and could to leave to overtraining ? or if I'm mantaining good form and only going to technical failure is all right to this slow kinda of reps??
2 - How do you feel about Reverse Hypers,Face pull and Dips in you program??
3- There are any good alternatives to Lat pull downs( my gym to not have a machine with adequate height to this exercise and i feel most of the work on my lower back)
4 - OHP,Bench and Deadlift : Touch and go or Paused reps(how much time?)
5 - What weight it's better to start ? 70-75 % of my 1RM it's good?
6 - For Greyskull LP I have bought some microplates(2,5lbs), its there any space for them in your program?
7 - I'm a beginner, Kroc Rows it's even beneficial for me or should i stick to strict rows?

Thank you very much.

I apologize for being a month behind, BrotherGG. This is a busy time of the year for me.

1 - In my personal opinion, as long as your form does not falter you are on the right track. As loads get heavier, they will not move as fast as others until you get stronger and it becomes lighter for you. If you watch Hamilton deadlift, he is a "grip it and rip it" kind of guy with good bar speed. However, you'll see his squats and bench tend to be a bit slower and more controlled. It all depends on your lifting style. If you want to do your AMRAP until the reps start slowing down and cease it there, I can't see it being a bad idea.

2 - Great additions to add in after you get used to the program.

3 - Pull-ups, you'll just need to do a good bit of volume.

4 - Up to the individual lifter, but I recommend keeping it under control and avoid using momentum to complete a lift if at all possible.

5 - That's probably a good starting point. Remember, you want to give yourself room to grow so it's better to go too light rather than too heavy.

6 - You certainly can. Once 5# jumps per rep become too much on upper body exercises, or in place of them, use 2.5# jumps instead. So if you press 140 for 7 reps on your last set, bump it up to 142.5 the next time.

7 - Have you tried them? Great workout for not only the back but also for the grip which will improve your deadlift.

[Reznovan]

Nice program. I just have two questions. Can I do cardio on rest days, and when should I start adding weight to chin ups? I just did workout a last night and for chin ups I did 13 reps, 11 reps, and then 11 reps again for the final set. Is 20 reps a good number to add weight?

[grouchyjarhead]

Nice program. I just have two questions. Can I do cardio on rest days, and when should I start adding weight to chin ups? I just did workout a last night and for chin ups I did 13 reps, 11 reps, and then 11 reps again for the final set. Is 20 reps a good number to add weight?

You sure can. Depends on your goals, so the cardio choice is up to you, but if you're looking to add muscle mass, follow the advice of Justin Lascek - keep your conditioning short and hard, just like your pecker. If you want more steady state work, keep it easy if you go long.

My personal opinion is once you hit 10 reps, you can start adding weight. Do 3 sets of 5 reps of weighted chin-ups - after a block or two, you can add a max effort bodyweight set at the end for more volume.

[Reznovan]

You sure can. Depends on your goals, so the cardio choice is up to you, but if you're looking to add muscle mass, follow the advice of Justin Lascek - keep your conditioning short and hard, just like your pecker. If you want more steady state work, keep it easy if you go long.

My personal opinion is once you hit 10 reps, you can start adding weight. Do 3 sets of 5 reps of weighted chin-ups - after a block or two, you can add a max effort bodyweight set at the end for more volume.

Thanks for replying.

[uyutt]

Hey grouchy,

first of all, man, this routine made me fall in love with going to the gym, i absolutely love it and have made sweet gains in the 3 months i've been following it and for that i thank you <3

now for the question - what's your opinion on intentional upper back rounding - lats in front pockets cue - during a deadlift? jeremy hamilton explains it in a video on omarisuf's channel (would link but i'm new to the forums); haven't tried it yet (busy last 2 weeks and for the coming 2 as well) but from the looks of it i think i'd love it.

thanks for the reply, much love

[grouchyjarhead]

Hey grouchy,

first of all, man, this routine made me fall in love with going to the gym, i absolutely love it and have made sweet gains in the 3 months i've been following it and for that i thank you <3

now for the question - what's your opinion on intentional upper back rounding - lats in front pockets cue - during a deadlift? jeremy hamilton explains it in a video on omarisuf's channel (would link but i'm new to the forums); haven't tried it yet (busy last 2 weeks and for the coming 2 as well) but from the looks of it i think i'd love it.

thanks for the reply, much love

My personal opinion is not to round my back during deadlifts.

[davevans]

This is excellent. Thank you for taking the time to put this together grouchy. Have you got an intermediate version of this program?

[grouchyjarhead]

This is excellent. Thank you for taking the time to put this together grouchy. Have you got an intermediate version of this program?

There is an intermediate upper/lower for those who have exhausted linear progression.

https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...hp?t=175303901

[davevans]

Thank you for your reply. I appreciate it.

[Reznovan]

Could I possibly do tbar rows instead of pendlay rows? Pendlay rows just feel unnatural to me and they hurt my shoulder. I honestly don't know why.

[kanerl]

How much progress would there still to be made. I've been lifting casually for a few years, program hopped and made no real effort with nutrition. Got fat, cut, got fat again so basically no real bulk made either. Currently I'm cutting for the last time. Not regaining that weight again.
Currently my numbers are 225 bench, 340 squat, 360 deadlift, 135 OHP. All are 1 rep maxes. I'm 6'3 240lbs. Aiming to get around 205-210lbs.

[grouchyjarhead]

Could I possibly do tbar rows instead of pendlay rows? Pendlay rows just feel unnatural to me and they hurt my shoulder. I honestly don't know why.

I would have someone check your form before you completely toss them out but typically if an exercise gives you pain it makes sense to substitute something else that does not.

[grouchyjarhead]

How much progress would there still to be made. I've been lifting casually for a few years, program hopped and made no real effort with nutrition. Got fat, cut, got fat again so basically no real bulk made either. Currently I'm cutting for the last time. Not regaining that weight again.
Currently my numbers are 225 bench, 340 squat, 360 deadlift, 135 OHP. All are 1 rep maxes. I'm 6'3 240lbs. Aiming to get around 205-210lbs.

If you were still regularly adding weight to the bar then this will have some benefit. If not you'll need a more intermediate progression.

[Bladerunner1811]

Now let's discuss rep scheme. You'll notice there's a few different rep schemes here. Let's cover them and I'll explain the rationale behind them.

For most of the exercises, you'll see 3x6, 1x6+. The idea is to pick a weight you can do 4 sets of 6 reps with. If you are a beginner, it is best to start off light and feel out the exercises until you find a comfortable working weight. I'd say roughly 50% of your body weight for the bench/ row/lat pulldown as a good starting point, and about 30% of your body weight for the press. These are rough estimates based on my individual experience and of working with others - individuals may vary. For the first three sets, you will perform 6 reps each work set. The final set is your money set. Your goal is to do as many reps as you can with that weight before you see your form falter. Be very conservative in this, as you'll see why in a moment. If you do 8 but see a break down in form, stick with 8 - don't try for 9. If you get greedy and start searching for extra reps of poor quality, you will significantly reduce your success on this program. Multiple sets of 6 reps were popular with a lot of lifters, but most specifically with Doug Young, whom this program is dedicated to. He favored multiple sets of 6 reps for all of his accessory work as well, feeling that it was the perfect combination for developing strength and size.

You'll notice for the squat and the deadlift the rep scheme is different: 5+-4-3-2-1. This is the old 5/4/3/2/1 system you'll often see mentioned and which is still popular since its introduction (which was at least in the 1960s from my limited research, if not earlier). Warm up accordingly, then in this instance the first set is your money set. Again aim for as many repetitions as you can successfully complete with good form. If your last rep falters even the slightest, don't go for another one. The deadlift especially will punish you if you push for more reps than you should. From here, each set you will add 10 pounds (though some trainees can add 15-20 pounds depending on their squatting proficiency) and drop one repetition. So if you squatted 300x5, your next four sets would be 310x4, 320x3, 330x2, 340x1. This approach is great for beginning powerlifters in my opinion as you do a hard volume set (the 5+ reps) then work your way up to a heavy single afterwards so you can get used to handling some heavier weight.

Now, the question of - what about progressing in weight? That's what the AMRAP set is for. For every rep over 6 for the 1x6+ exercises, you will add 5# to your work set the next time. For every rep UNDER 6, subtract 5# from your work set the next time. For every rep over 5 for the squat and deadlift, you will add 10# to your work set the next time. For every rep under, subtract 10#. Always subtract the weight. However, I would not add more than 10-15 pounds total to any of the 6+ exercises, or 20-30 pounds to the squat/deadlift in one session. Going higher tends to make the next session 6+ or 5+ set to fall short. For most folks, 10 and 20 is about right. This doesn't mean to skimp on your reps though - if you can do more than 7-8 reps, do more.

Bear with me, as this next part might get a bit technical. How does that work and what does it mean for you, the trainee? This is essentially a microcycle done workout to workout. It's understood that some days your body will be fresher and others more worn down just due to life. This program accounts for that. If you're having a rough week and do poorly one workout, the next will be a forced deload and let you accomodate for it. If you're feeling strong, you'll keep progressing. It's a mixture of volume work with a bit of intensity work thrown in, so you're working both size and strength at the same time (because, after all, this is a powerbuilding routine). In short, this is a simplified version of periodization that takes all the guesswork out of the equation. If you do more reps, you add weight - if you do less, you take off weight. This was both Young's offseason and contest preparation approach (though for contest prep he would alternate with 5x3 for the bench after a while and then eventually exclusively 5x3, but again doing as many reps as possible on the last set).
I'll try to address a few questions people might have, if anyone has any more worth mentioning I will add them to here as they come in.

(1) Why only three days a week? I want to train more. - I want a Ferrari, but we can't always get what we want. Full body routines, done properly, are effective but tiring. If you tried to do this four, five, or even six times a week you will quickly learn the error of your ways. Effective training is different from overtraining simply because at some point there is diminishing returns. If you have a 12oz cup, you can only fill it up with water to 12oz - the extra few drops you can get in aren't worth all the waste of water. It's a lot more preferential to have a good workout and still feel good by the end of it than to wreck yourself and be sore by the next one. Fill up your cup, but don't go crazy. For the average beginner or intermediate (and even a lot of advanced trainees), three heavy full body workouts a week is plenty to grow on. For those who have their doubts, they need to look no further than Reg Park, Tommy Kono, Bill Starr, Paul Anderson, and the many many other strength and physique competitors who have trained in that same way.

(2) I'm the opposite, I can only train two days a week. - You can actually do well on twice a week, though not as optimal as three days a week the extra rest and recovery can actually be more beneficial for those bulking. If you are competitive in a sport or martial art, twice a week can be effective as it still gives you plenty of time to focus on your sport/art. Simply do Workout A one day, and then Workout B the other.

(3) I can't deadlift twice a week. - Some people might find this problem, typically more for intermediate or advanced lifters who are using a lot more weight than the average beginner. With a little modification though, this can work out easily. Simply do A-B-A each week, but make sure you alternate the press and bench so both get equal treatment (e.g. so one week you will bench/row/squat/chin-up on Monday, the next week you will press/row/squat/chin-up the next). You can alternate the rows and lat pulldowns, and the chin-ups and one-arm rows too if you wish - I prefer that personally.

(4) I can't squat heavy twice a week either. - This can happen with intermediate and advanced trainees who are moving impressive poundages. I recommend two approaches. The first is when you go to your second squat day of the week, to use front squats instead of back squats. This will still let you squat heavy, but not as much as back squats. If that is still too much, as an alternative you can back squat on the second day that week but instead only do 2 sets of 6 reps, with the last set being your AMRAP set as usual (but don't adjust for Monday's workout).

(5) Where’s [insert favorite accessory exercise]?? – A lot of people get obsessed with accessory work far before they should. If you’re building a house, don’t start throwing up windows before you even have the walls built. Most people will fare far better focusing on upping the weights of their main movements to see the growth they want. If you blast your arms the same day you bench, the next time you go to press, you might not make your target weight. In the long run, that’s only going to hinder your growth. Some of the biggest names in powerlifting rarely did any work outside of just squatting, benching, and deadlifting heavy and hard (for two examples, see Don Reinhoudt and Mark Chaillet).

(6) What about my guns, bro? – There isn’t any direct arm work in this program, but don’t think for a minute your arms won’t grow if you’re eating properly and training intensely. You’re pressing or benching every workout, which will aid in triceps growth. You’re also doing lots of back work with the rows, chin-ups, and pulldowns which will also aid in biceps growth. Get over your bodyweight on the majority of these exercises (or lots of strict reps with the chin-up) and you will see some improvement in your arms.

(7) OK, I’ve been doing this for a while. NOW can I add accessory movements? – After at least 12 weeks on this basic routine, you can start thinking about addressing lagging body parts for aesthetic purposes. I would focus on 1-2 areas tops (e.g. biceps and triceps) and alternate them each workout. So maybe after Day One you could add in skullcrushers, and after Day Two you could throw in EZ-bar curls. Keep the accessory work short (3 sets of 10 reps is ideal). You also don’t want it to be too taxing, so use some common sense. Doing Romanian deadlifts at the end of Day Two would probably be too much, same with leg presses on Day One. Switching them around, however, could be beneficial. Just take it slow with accessory work at first and assess as you go.

(8) I’m doing the routine, but it’s hard to eat enough. – It’s hard to squat several hundred pounds too. It all boils down to how bad you want it. If you think you can’t eat enough, read this and reassess your opinion. http://70sbig.com/blog/2009/10/if-yo...t-eat-the-man/

(9) What’s a good way to warm up for these? – Everyone has their own way of warming up, but I’ll share one I recommend and like. Let’s say you’re using 200 for your sets of six for the bench press. I would start off by using 100 (50%) of that weight for 5 reps. I ‘d then use 130 (65%) for a set of 3, and then finally 160 (80%) for a single. I typically only rest long enough between warm-up sets to change the plates and get settled for the next lift. Once I finish that final single is when I will rest the full rest period (e.g. typically 3 minutes for me).

Any other questions I’ll try to add in as we go.

the 5/4/3/2/1 system was not introduced in the 60s but was in fact introduced in the 1930s by Bob Hoffman and his York Training System

[grouchyjarhead]

the 5/4/3/2/1 system was not introduced in the 60s but was in fact introduced in the 1930s by Bob Hoffman and his York Training System

Thanks for the info. I figured it was older. There's rarely anything new in the Iron Game.

[Reznovan]

If I do front squats and back squats, instead of just back squats, would I still do the same progression in weights in correspondence to the amount of reps above 5 on the first set? Or since I'm not back squatting or front squatting twice a week, would I add 5 pounds for every rep on each lift, instead of 10?

[ASMahwah19]

Going to start this program today and a log to go with it, looks perfect for my goals. But I do have a few questions

What do you think about adding some direct ab work after each workout? Probably 2 sets of leg raises and 3 of knee raises both AMRAP

Will I be able to run this on a cut/maintenance? I have been doing this for the past few months and still progressing in my lifts. Will probably start bulking at the end of the summer.

With my current lifts (S-225x5, B-175x5, D-315x1)how long do you think I could run this on linear progression?

Awesome write up man. This looks like exactly what I have been looking for in a program

[beydola]

Great thread people!

[BullyFoot]

Great thread

[Barbecuebarbell]

I cannot say enough great things about this program! I legit ran it for 6 months and I now weight 250lbs from 225. I also benched 320lbs the other week and felt like I could have hit 325 even 330. I deadlifted 475lbs pretty easily and squatted 370 x 2 as well. I also pressed 212lbs and was doing Kroc Rows with the 130lbs db's. However as the weights kept getting heavier I definitely started to feel really beat up doing full body training. A tip of mine to milk more out of the program was that after the 4x6 stopped working on certain lifts, I switched to 5x3. I gotta say, I wish the intermediate program was a bit different but this beginner program was by far the best one I have done. My arms also measure 17 inches cold flexed now. Granted, I trained before this and am not a total newb, it is a great alternative to something like Strong Lifts or SS and provides much more upper body size and overall mass. 10/10

[ritesh0407]

Now, the question of - what about progressing in weight? That's what the AMRAP set is for. For every rep over 6 for the 1x6+ exercises, you will add 5# to your work set the next time. For every rep UNDER 6, subtract 5# from your work set the next time. For every rep over 5 for the squat and deadlift, you will add 10# to your work set the next time. For every rep under, subtract 10#. Always subtract the weight.

I wanted to confirm my understanding of the deloading scheme. Assume I have a working weight of 185 for bench press and I get reps like 4,5,5,5. So do I subtract 25 lbs next session since I missed 5 reps in total?

[grouchyjarhead]

If you fail to make the reps on the very first set, it's usually because it's one of your earlier workouts and you're starting too heavy. If on your first set you do 185x4, I would treat that as a sign to drop 10lb the next time. Usually after you done the workout a handful of times, typically you won't fall short on reps in the first few sets. Fatigue and life happens though. If it does and you fall short, penalize yourself with the lowest-performing set (in this case, 4 reps instead of 6), not the total amount missed.

[ritesh0407]

If you fail to make the reps on the very first set, it's usually because it's one of your earlier workouts and you're starting too heavy. If on your first set you do 185x4, I would treat that as a sign to drop 10lb the next time. Usually after you done the workout a handful of times, typically you won't fall short on reps in the first few sets. Fatigue and life happens though. If it does and you fall short, penalize yourself with the lowest-performing set (in this case, 4 reps instead of 6), not the total amount missed.

Thanks for clarifying. I am starting the program on Monday.

[naokiudo]

dope routine

[bizepcurlz]

What would happen if someone did smolov JR or another bench press program like 5 months in a row? is injury inevitable?

so example...using smolov

week 1 to 3, benching. Week 4 rest week. Week 5, reset 1rm PR to slightly higher then start again at smolov week 1.

[grouchyjarhead]

Eventually you would need more than a week to recover from Smolov so running it back to back would only work for a few blocks I'd think. Never tried it.

[TLWeight]

Eventually you would need more than a week to recover from Smolov so running it back to back would only work for a few blocks I'd think. Never tried it.

Is it possible to run your intermediate program twice a week

I’m still a novice running f5
But i’m just curious about my options when i can no longer use linear progression