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  1. #3271
    Registered Nerd Kcrack's Avatar
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    A question regarding warmups for newbs, on my lighter days, if I need to warmup with a weight weighing less than the barbell itself, should I switch to dumbells to get the correct weight?
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  2. #3272
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    Originally Posted by Lunevillain View Post
    Hi!
    I really love this routine, been doing these exact same exercises, should probably work up more into the organization of low/med/heavy days though.. anyways.. I was wondering .. what if instead of lowing the weight in those med/low days, you low the reps? Really just a thought.. I mean, the weight would be the same, and the increase of repetitions would keep going every other week during the cycle, but the weight itself wouldn't change, and the weight addition would be made if you were able to complete the whole cycle of say, 10 reps the 1st day, 8 the 2nd and 5 the 3rd..

    Apologies if this could possibly sound dumb (I'm recently getting into all this! I only have about 5 months of experience) and/or if it has already been asked

    Thanks in advance!
    The point of the lowered weight is to help with connective tissue recovery since the program does not have a deload. You might get away with just lowered reps for a cycle or 2.

    Originally Posted by Kcrack View Post
    A question regarding warmups for newbs, on my lighter days, if I need to warmup with a weight weighing less than the barbell itself, should I switch to dumbells to get the correct weight?
    You have to mimic the movement to warmup your cns too. So the first warmup can just be a plastic pipe or broom handle. You can also use Dumb bells for the 2nd set if "the bar" is still way to heavy to be 50-66% of your working weight. I got around this by buying an aluminum training bar thats only 15lbs, you can also go for just a cheap used "standard" sized weigh set that also come with very light bars.
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  3. #3273
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by JeanRoqua View Post
    Hello to everyone again.

    I just started the 2nd cycle yesterday and i found it really really hard to complete the last rep on squats and bench. Is that normal?

    Also something that bothers me.

    I began working out on October and I started allpro routine the past month. All this time I was eating healthy around 2000 - 2500, paying attention to my macros and working out frequently.

    What bothers me is the stubborn fat around my belly and my waist. It won't go away. Also I'm not so bulked I thought I will be around this time, when I was starting working out.

    So I am on a dilemma. First of all my goal is to have a good beach body on July. I think my body fat percentage is around 25%. So should i eat more to get bulked and do a cut on June? Or should i begin cutting now because 1 month won't last?
    First week after a pass is a mini deload, its less tonnage lifted than the previous test day. 2nd week is just as easy as the previous test day. Either way the program should be ran with reps in the tank or the fatigue will build up too fast. You might want to do a 10 rep test on the squat and bench and start again next week.

    As for the stomach fat, you can run allpro fine with a 250 cal a day food deficit. you can gain another .5lbs lost per week by doing the recommended 3x 10k jogs per week (or something you can sustain for at least 45min).
    Recommended starting diet is 100g of fat/protein, and 200-300g of carbs.
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  4. #3274
    Registered User Lunevillain's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    The point of the lowered weight is to help with connective tissue recovery since the program does not have a deload. You might get away with just lowered reps for a cycle or 2.
    So that would only just lead to plateau right?

    I've been doing mostly just to my rep max instead of lowing the weight but I was afraid this wouldn't work hence why I asked.. My stats are pretty much like Saittis rn. I have seen change though, but guess I'll continue like the programme says and see what happens
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  5. #3275
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Lunevillain View Post
    So that would only just lead to plateau right?

    I've been doing mostly just to my rep max instead of lowing the weight but I was afraid this wouldn't work hence why I asked.. My stats are pretty much like Saittis rn. I have seen change though, but guess I'll continue like the programme says and see what happens
    If you want to run to rep max, you would want to run allpro auto regulated, or The Viking's The Bare Bones Series. Both of those are rep goal programs. They also have deload protocols...
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  6. #3276
    Registered User Lunevillain's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    If you want to run to rep max, you would want to run allpro auto regulated, or The Viking's The Bare Bones Series. Both of those are rep goal programs. They also have deload protocols...
    Actually I'd only do that just out of laziness for the fact that I never sat down to calculate all my weights for low/med days and thought it'd eventually be the same but I knew there would be something wrong behind that. I mean, otherwise Allpro would have pointed it out..

    I would like to check the autoregulated one though.. is that optimal for building muscle as well? or you would mostly recommend this one? .. Although I think, now checking it out, I should keep going with the original version until I can lift heavier..
    My stats rn would be:
    Squats: 40
    Bench: 35
    BOR: 35
    SLDL: 42.5
    OHP: 25
    Calf Raises: 57.5
    Curls: 25 (probably switching to upright rows)


    Thanks so much for your time! x and sorry for bothering!
    Last edited by Lunevillain; 03-07-2017 at 01:40 PM.
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  7. #3277
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    Can someone recommend a good ab workout for tues and thurs? I've been doing 3x10-15 of weighted decline situps, weighted side bends and weighted leg lifts
    Last edited by liquida45; 03-07-2017 at 07:20 PM.
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  8. #3278
    Registered User JeanRoqua's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    First week after a pass is a mini deload, its less tonnage lifted than the previous test day. 2nd week is just as easy as the previous test day. Either way the program should be ran with reps in the tank or the fatigue will build up too fast. You might want to do a 10 rep test on the squat and bench and start again next week.

    As for the stomach fat, you can run allpro fine with a 250 cal a day food deficit. you can gain another .5lbs lost per week by doing the recommended 3x 10k jogs per week (or something you can sustain for at least 45min).
    Recommended starting diet is 100g of fat/protein, and 200-300g of carbs.
    Thanks nightanole.

    But how can I not stall permanently on bench and squat if I follow a 250 cal deficit? Am I not supposed to eat more in order to lift more? That's my problem.

    Also what do u mean 3x10k jogs? Jogging 10 kilometers in per day for 3 days? Sorry for the newbie question!
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  9. #3279
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    Originally Posted by JeanRoqua View Post
    Thanks nightanole.

    But how can I not stall permanently on bench and squat if I follow a 250 cal deficit? Am I not supposed to eat more in order to lift more? That's my problem.

    Also what do u mean 3x10k jogs? Jogging 10 kilometers in per day for 3 days? Sorry for the newbie question!
    Do a 10k jog 3 days a week. Like on Tues, thurs and sat jog fotmr 10k that day
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  10. #3280
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by JeanRoqua View Post
    Thanks nightanole.

    But how can I not stall permanently on bench and squat if I follow a 250 cal deficit? Am I not supposed to eat more in order to lift more? That's my problem.

    Also what do u mean 3x10k jogs? Jogging 10 kilometers in per day for 3 days? Sorry for the newbie question!
    Your not stalling, you will be gaining at 2.5-3.3% per cycle. its just going to take 3-4 cycles before you are 10% stronger and need a weight bump.

    Once you are done with your cut, you switch back to eating normal, and then start adding 250 cals per day in order to continue progression. Once you hit 15-18% bf again, its back to a cut for a few months. Once you have tensed abs you should be bulking 2/3-3/4 of the year and cutting the rest. Another good rule is only gain at 1/4-1/3 the pace you can lose it at. So if 2lbs per week cut causes missed reps, you better not be bulkin at more than a half pound per week.
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  11. #3281
    Registered User JeanRoqua's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Your not stalling, you will be gaining at 2.5-3.3% per cycle. its just going to take 3-4 cycles before you are 10% stronger and need a weight bump.

    Once you are done with your cut, you switch back to eating normal, and then start adding 250 cals per day in order to continue progression. Once you hit 15-18% bf again, its back to a cut for a few months. Once you have tensed abs you should be bulking 2/3-3/4 of the year and cutting the rest. Another good rule is only gain at 1/4-1/3 the pace you can lose it at. So if 2lbs per week cut causes missed reps, you better not be bulkin at more than a half pound per week.
    Thanks for the generally rule. I will follow exactly what u suggested starting from September for the new season. Now I think that I'll stick to my nutrition plan and all pro routine until I complete 3 cycles. I will try something like freeletics in June just to switch routines a little bit.

    Sorry to repeat my question but by saying 3x10k jogs u mean to run 10 kilometers per day on non training days??
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  12. #3282
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    Originally Posted by JeanRoqua View Post
    Thanks for the generally rule. I will follow exactly what u suggested starting from September for the new season. Now I think that I'll stick to my nutrition plan and all pro routine until I complete 3 cycles. I will try something like freeletics in June just to switch routines a little bit.

    Sorry to repeat my question but by saying 3x10k jogs u mean to run 10 kilometers per day on non training days??
    Yup 3 45min+ cardio sessions per week. You can do them on off day or on days if you do them anytime after the workout. 10k is about the min since some people can get their 5k down to sub 20min, and that is a bit too intense. We are shootin for 45min+ of low intensity steady state cardio.
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  13. #3283
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    What in your opinions are the benefits of 2-3 45-minute low intensity cardio sessions per week? Is it just to aid fat loss, and if so, is it better to do the cardio and eat x calories, or not do the cardio and eat x minus (# of cals the cardio would burn) calories?

    EDIT: Assume goal is non-athletic in nature (i.e. losing fat while gaining or maintaining muscle, not cardio for the sake of improved athletic performance).
    Last edited by OryxOryx; 03-08-2017 at 01:49 PM.
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  14. #3284
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by OryxOryx View Post
    What in your opinions are the benefits of 2-3 45-minute low intensity cardio sessions per week? Is it just to aid fat loss, and if so, is it better to do the cardio and eat x calories, or not do the cardio and eat x minus (# of cals the cardio would burn) calories?

    EDIT: Assume goal is non-athletic in nature (i.e. losing fat while gaining or maintaining muscle, not cardio for the sake of improved athletic performance).
    If you were not gaining/losing weight, and started allpro, it would be good for about .5lbs lost per week. If you did the recommended cardio that would be another .5lbs per week.

    But the real reason for the cardio is to tax the recovery system that is not hit on allpro. Without cardio that 2nd set is going to get real hard, real quick. Ive seen people do the first set with 1 in the tank, and the 2nd set they couldnt even get in half the required reps. Their conditioning and work capacity was just that bad.

    As for the rest of it, the recommended starting diet is 100g of fats/protein and 200-300g of carbs, its hard to perform on less than that.

    So now its just your goals. Cutting the nutrition back too much will cause a drop in performance. However increasing the caloric deficit with cardio will INCREASE performance. So there is a lot of wiggle room. Adjusting the diet to the min nutrition level might be enough for your fat loss goal rate without cardio. Adjusting the diet to the min nutrition rate might not be enough of a caloric deficit for weight loss, and you need cardio. Adjusting the diet to the min nutrition level might not be enough to perform on, and you need to up the nutrition and cardio at the same time for both weight loss and strength gains.



    Then again ive had people completely blow it. They start off at 300-350lbs, have a 75lb squat working weight. A year later they are down to 200-220lbs, and have a 150lb squat working weight... Im like why didnt you just put the weight you lost on the bar over a year, you would be squatting well over 2 plate by now without any muscle gains????
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  15. #3285
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    I'm coming up on one year of allpro in May, and I've been running auto-regulated for the past few months. I'm still making decent strength gains, but I feel like my arms aren't growing at the same rate as my chest and back. I have very long arms, which is probably a factor. A couple of months ago, you suggested I add heavy push press to address a shoulder weakness and get my triceps to pop a bit more. Do you think it would be beneficial for me to also add a little bit of direct tricep work, like pushdowns or skullcrushers?
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  16. #3286
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by hoverboy View Post
    I'm coming up on one year of allpro in May, and I've been running auto-regulated for the past few months. I'm still making decent strength gains, but I feel like my arms aren't growing at the same rate as my chest and back. I have very long arms, which is probably a factor. A couple of months ago, you suggested I add heavy push press to address a shoulder weakness and get my triceps to pop a bit more. Do you think it would be beneficial for me to also add a little bit of direct tricep work, like pushdowns or skullcrushers?
    Can you do tricep dips, even unweighted? If so that would be the best option and if fits nicely with the program since we have no downward pushes.
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    Hey nightanole,

    What are your thoughts on weighted wrist bands?

    I'm using the Bowflex 1090 adjustable dumbbells and they go up in 5lb increments so now the weight is increasing I'm struggling between 60 and 65 lb dumbbells - it's two big of a jump for me. I want to microload and perform a cycle at 62.5lb but I can't add things like spin lock or whatever to these weights cos of their type.

    I had an idea to use weighted wrist straps (2.5lb on each wrist) and do bench press using these.......do you think that's a doable substitute or might it have some negative effects??
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  18. #3288
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    Originally Posted by petropietro View Post
    Hey nightanole,

    What are your thoughts on weighted wrist bands?

    I'm using the Bowflex 1090 adjustable dumbbells and they go up in 5lb increments so now the weight is increasing I'm struggling between 60 and 65 lb dumbbells - it's two big of a jump for me. I want to microload and perform a cycle at 62.5lb but I can't add things like spin lock or whatever to these weights cos of their type.

    I had an idea to use weighted wrist straps (2.5lb on each wrist) and do bench press using these.......do you think that's a doable substitute or might it have some negative effects??
    Easy fix, since i have the same set. If you set both sides to the same value, and then only click one side up, it will go up 2.5lbs. So 35 on one side and 30 on the other is 32.5.
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Easy fix, since i have the same set. If you set both sides to the same value, and then only click one side up, it will go up 2.5lbs. So 35 on one side and 30 on the other is 32.5.
    Hahaha! Why didn't I think of that. Genius!
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  20. #3290
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Can you do tricep dips, even unweighted? If so that would be the best option and if fits nicely with the program since we have no downward pushes.
    I'll give them a shot today. Should I aim for two sets of 8-12 like everything else?

    Also, do you recommend anything for tight shoulders? My right shoulder has less mobility than my left one, and I have a feeling I'm going to notice it on the dips. I definitely notice it on the bench and OHP. It's not bad, but I want to deal with it before it gets any worse.
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  21. #3291
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    Originally Posted by hoverboy View Post
    I'll give them a shot today. Should I aim for two sets of 8-12 like everything else?

    Also, do you recommend anything for tight shoulders? My right shoulder has less mobility than my left one, and I have a feeling I'm going to notice it on the dips. I definitely notice it on the bench and OHP. It's not bad, but I want to deal with it before it gets any worse.
    Band pull aparts and shoulder dislocations. Unfortunately strength training will only fix muscle imbalances, not mobility or tightness.

    For dips, i recommend either 1 set to failure(the last few will be real grinders with a lot of time under tension), or 3-4 sets of half your max with 15-30 seconds of rest between sets.
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    I'm on a cut been using this and on c2w3 light day, I need to add cardio in but don't have the time to go on my days off and very tight with time on my days in the gym is HIIT a defo no go? I'm trying to get cardio health back to play football and I've currently got 21lb to lose until I'm down to where I need to be to start playing
    "The journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step"

    21/12/16: 259lb
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    Tranformation Log: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=173362951&p=1481295921&posted=1#post1481295921
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  23. #3293
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    Originally Posted by PhantomEater View Post
    I'm on a cut been using this and on c2w3 light day, I need to add cardio in but don't have the time to go on my days off and very tight with time on my days in the gym is HIIT a defo no go? I'm trying to get cardio health back to play football and I've currently got 21lb to lose until I'm down to where I need to be to start playing
    Cant do HIIT on a fatigue based program. You could, but its about the same as just doing the allpro workout 2-3 more times during the week, its not recommended. You could try doing cardio on workout days even if its several hours before the workout.

    Also cardio is cumulative, even if you did 10min bouts of walking around with a weighted backpack would work if you can get in the 2-3 hours during the week.
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    Registered User Barnets's Avatar
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    Hi, thanks for all the advice so far. I'm a beginner - 6ft tall - 74kg looking to gain muscle mass.
    I'd like to run this programme but I can only get to the gym on Mon, Tue, Thu, Fri. How do you recommend I split the workouts given that I can't do the standard Mon-Heavy/Wed-Medium/Fri-Light? In order to reduce fatigue by doing two workouts on consecutive days I was considering Mon-Light/Tue-Medium/Friday-Heavy. Alternatively I could just do two heavy workouts per week but I'm concerned that it wont give me enough volume. Do you think I would be better off with a different programme and if so could you recommend one?

    Also, I think I read earlier in the thread that you shouldn't run this on a calorie surplus unless your BMI is under 22. My BMI is 22 exactly and I'm looking to bulk, does this mean I should be eating around maintenance level and aim for the correct macros?
    Thanks in advance
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    Originally Posted by Barnets View Post
    Hi, thanks for all the advice so far. I'm a beginner - 6ft tall - 74kg looking to gain muscle mass.
    I'd like to run this programme but I can only get to the gym on Mon, Tue, Thu, Fri. How do you recommend I split the workouts given that I can't do the standard Mon-Heavy/Wed-Medium/Fri-Light? In order to reduce fatigue by doing two workouts on consecutive days I was considering Mon-Light/Tue-Medium/Friday-Heavy. Alternatively I could just do two heavy workouts per week but I'm concerned that it wont give me enough volume. Do you think I would be better off with a different programme and if so could you recommend one?

    Also, I think I read earlier in the thread that you shouldn't run this on a calorie surplus unless your BMI is under 22. My BMI is 22 exactly and I'm looking to bulk, does this mean I should be eating around maintenance level and aim for the correct macros?
    Thanks in advance
    For the 2 heavies pattern, you add 1 extra set to the first 3 lifts, this makes up the volume. doing monday/thurs heavy heavy would be the best bet since you would be literally working out heavy every 3 days.

    If that doesnt work then just pick an upper/lower or push/pull that you can run 4 days a week. One wont be faster than the other since frequency is still going to be 2x per week per muscle group.

    The starting diet is 100g of fats/protein and 200-300g of carbs. Id start the program with the 300g of carbs, since just starting the program will make a 150-200lb person start to lose .5lbs per week, which is not what you want.

    Adjust the calories (carbs preferred since they increase performance) so that you hit a bmi of 24 in about 4 cycles. The 100g of protein is well above the 1g per kg recommended for college sports and you dont have to do the 1g per pound thing unless you are getting your body fat so low that you are getting hormone imbalances and performance in other areas start to decline.
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    Quick question regarding form on the bent over row, until now I've been pulling the bar to my chest rather than to my stomach like in the example video on page 1. What problems could this cause? I've been having lower back pain just above my hips on both sides, which I put down to bad squatting form/deadlift form. But since looking into it, could my bad bent over row form actually be the cause?
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    Hey,

    So week 5 heavy day (i.e. test day) is tomorrow (Tuesday)

    Only problem is, I spent the last couple days (Sun, Mon) with a bad stomach bug. I'm feeling quite a bit better now but still not 100%. Should I go through with the test day or push it to Wednesday and rest tomorrow? If I should do it tomorrow and I fail a bunch of exercises that I easily completed on week 4 heavy day, should I give myself another test day or just go back through the cycle with the same weights?


    Thanks
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  28. #3298
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Confucuis View Post
    Quick question regarding form on the bent over row, until now I've been pulling the bar to my chest rather than to my stomach like in the example video on page 1. What problems could this cause? I've been having lower back pain just above my hips on both sides, which I put down to bad squatting form/deadlift form. But since looking into it, could my bad bent over row form actually be the cause?
    Ideally it should naturally hit the same spot as when you bench or a little lower since you are not going as wide as the bench unless you are benching narrow. Its possible your are not between 45-60 degrees, and are getting closer to parallel with the floor, combine that form with hitting much higher on the chest, and it could easily double the amount of torque applied to the SI joint. Now the SI joint is the strongest mobile joint in the body (with 200lbs on your back on the squat its creating about 4000ft/lbs of torque on the SI joint) But it can get aggravated if its hammered and not given enough time to recover. Most of the time it just happens due walking around with a weak core with a lot of pelvic tilt, at least in women who dont lift. It also happens in high volume programs If the peak torque is applied in too high of volume(going heavy every day of the week).

    When i did it i was old school SLDLing(or you could say strong man boulder lift) something heavy from the ground around the house, and had my head all the way down when i grabbed the object, when i stood up i created waaaay to much torque and the ligaments where stretched. I couldnt do the yoga Child's Pose/Balasana for amount 3 months else i couldnt lift the next day. I ended up having to stop squatting for about 2 months due to the bounce at the bottom of the lift, so i switched to hex bar deadlifts for the time.

    If you are in pain, id look into seeing if its the SI joint. If it is id switch to pedlay rows and hacksquats instead of bent over rows and back squats, till the connecting tissue heals up.

    Id also start doing some ab wheel roll outs for preventative maintenance.
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    3 months in bulking. The starting pic is from a cut. Do you think I should lower my cals to maintenance for a while because of the fat??
    The starting pic was from a cut, very low carbs and no creatine.

    http://imgur.com/fr7rUom
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    Originally Posted by Time2Sleep00 View Post
    3 months in bulking. The starting pic is from a cut. Do you think I should lower my cals to maintenance for a while because of the fat??
    The starting pic was from a cut, very low carbs and no creatine.

    http://imgur.com/fr7rUom
    Id keep going. I do not notice a decrease in muscle tone, so fat percentage has not increased. Odds are you went from 154 14% to 166 14%. You will notice from the side shots your torso has gotten considerably thicker.

    Even the best are going to be putting on 1lb of fat for every 3lbs of muscle. The trick is when you cut to only be losing 1lb of muscle for every 3-4lbs of fat. You are not going to be able to change one without the other unless you are on drugs.
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