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  1. #1711
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by MrNobodyDidIt View Post
    You've lost me there. How is it a deload if I'm doing 5% more weight than I was in the previous cycle? (And wouldn't a 5% increase be better than repeating the same weight as last cycle - assuming my form is good and I don't fail the test day.)

    It maybe doesn't matter anyway as I did the 10 rep test as you suggested on the light day and made sure I took my time in between reps for the whole set. I'm just so used to busting out 6 reps without having to reset that I was making it harder than it needed to be on the longer sets.
    If you bump 5%, weeks 1-3 will be below last cycles effort, week 4 will be at last cycles test day effort, and week 5 will be the only week greater than last cycle. And how will you get stronger if you just spent 3 weeks below what you could already do?
    with a 10% bump, week 2 is the same effort as last cycles test day, and it goes up from there.
    Its better to just repeat the next cycle with the same weight. Hell the repeat cycle you may find caused you do gain 12.5-15% over those 2 cycles.
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  2. #1712
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    If you bump 5%, weeks 1-3 will be below last cycles effort, week 4 will be at last cycles test day effort, and week 5 will be the only week greater than last cycle. And how will you get stronger if you just spent 3 weeks below what you could already do?
    with a 10% bump, week 2 is the same effort as last cycles test day, and it goes up from there.
    Its better to just repeat the next cycle with the same weight. Hell the repeat cycle you may find caused you do gain 12.5-15% over those 2 cycles.
    Ok, I see what what you mean by "effort" now.
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  3. #1713
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    Hey nightanole,

    any stretching recommendations for the end of the work out ?
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  4. #1714
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by SmackBang77 View Post
    Hey nightanole,

    any stretching recommendations for the end of the work out ?
    I never found a full body routine i liked. Lets be honest, most stretching and mobilty routines are 90% legs, and 1-2 arm movements thrown in "cuz"

    However one that is recommended over and over for power lifting is DeFranco Agile 8. And again, 90% legs...

    Im with rippetoe, stretching and bands is pretty much a waste of time, and you should be focusing on building strength over the entire range of motion, you can not make a muscle longer, you can only increase its pain tolerance of being stretched well past its range of motion.
    I have yet to see any data that shows stretching increases range of motion past a few minutes. On the other hand contracting a muscle at full extension does a much better job of increasing range of motion.
    Last edited by nightanole; 05-25-2016 at 06:47 PM.
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  5. #1715
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    I never found a full body routine i liked. Lets be honest, most stretching and mobilty routines are 90% legs, and 1-2 arm movements thrown in "cuz"

    However one that is recommended over and over for power lifting is DeFranco Agile 8. And again, 90% legs...

    Im with rippetoe, stretching and bands is pretty much a waste of time, and you should be focusing on building strength over the entire range of motion, you can not make a muscle longer, you can only increase its pain tolerance of being stretched well past its range of motion.
    I have yet to see any data that shows stretching increases range of motion past a few minutes. On the other hand contracting a muscle at full extension does a much better job of increasing range of motion.
    Ok but do you ever stretch at the end of a work-out to relax the muscle ? I always thought it was recommended to prevent injury
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  6. #1716
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by SmackBang77 View Post
    Ok but do you ever stretch at the end of a work-out to relax the muscle ? I always thought it was recommended to prevent injury
    How would that prevent injury. There are a few things going on here. 1 muscles shorten their range of motion to protect themselves after a new stress has been placed on the (new exercise, or a dramatic change in reps/weight). To counter act this you increase frequency so they dont have 72hours + to "tighten up". The other way to get them to "relax" is to do the same motion with a much lighter weight first so your CNS does not think its headed to snap city, aka warmup sets.

    If i was going to do anything with an already exercised muscle, i would massage/foam roll it to help increase fluid exchange to get "the pump" down as fast as possible so the muscle can get some nutrient/waste exchange going.

    If you wanted to do some "stretching" after the workout, i would do some VERY high range of motion exercises with some VERY light weight VERY slowly for 15-30 seconds. This could easily be done with some dumbellls.
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  7. #1717
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    Two questions:

    1. Should I assume that this program was designed for both men and women?

    2. At what point can I expect to see some gains?
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  8. #1718
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by sk671221 View Post
    Two questions:

    1. Should I assume that this program was designed for both men and women?

    2. At what point can I expect to see some gains?
    I assume you are a woman, we have at least 2 active women in the thread right now, you can chat with them since they have both been running the routine over 60 days.

    But yes the program is designed for humans to be well rounded and have a firm grasp of basic movements that 99% of all staple lifts that will be used for a life time.

    As for gains, you try to do the exercises in order, while trying to find a weight you can comfortably lift 10 times. You then start the program with 2 sets of 8 reps. You also start the program on a cut till about 13% for men and 19-21% for women, aka flexed abs, but smooth when relaxed. You can progress at normal speed on this program till you get to that point. You are basically "bulking" off your spare tire. At that point you need to either start a lean bulk to continue progression, or continue cutting to relaxed abs, while making sure each cycle you dont miss reps on week 3 (2 sets of 10).

    The recommended starting diet is 100g of fats/protein and 200-300 grams of carbs. This is a little over 2000 cals. Go to much below this on carbs, and the fatigue based routine will become very hard. Going below the 100g of fats is only recommended if you know your stuff and can get in the 20g of both omega 3 and omega 6 (the fats your body can not make from protein/carbs). Technically you can get down to 17g of fats before you slip into a coma, if you had a perfect pharmaceutical grade mix
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  9. #1719
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    Thanks.

    I started a thread a couple months ago and you had recommended I get and adjustable kettlebell for this program, because I wanted a home workout.

    I'm mainly concerned about fat loss (I have about 75 pounds to lose minimum). I track my food through MyFitnessPal, and to lose 2 pounds a week I consume NET 1200 calories per day. This usually means I do eat around 1700 calories and burn about 500 through exercise, though I will eat more if I have a high exercise day. I do vary my macros, but I get about 100 grams of protein per day and do get enough carbs as well.

    I'm mainly focused on keeping as much muscle as I can, and of course lean mass to augment fat loss.
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  10. #1720
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    I just passed week 5.
    BOW 100
    BP 125
    Squat 135
    SLDL 135
    OHP 70
    Curls 60

    I did novice for BP 8 reps x3 with 1 min and 30 sec interval. The rest are the usual 2x12. Is this okey if I use the novice for the next cycle just for BP SLDL and Squat? it seems like my form is better and not struggle so much. What you think about my numbers? I currently weigh 176#. I started this January and I could see muscle gains but I haven't lost weight. I am eating 1800-2000 cal but for some reason weight is not dropping.
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  11. #1721
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Mtbrider71 View Post
    I just passed week 5.
    BOW 100
    BP 125
    Squat 135
    SLDL 135
    OHP 70
    Curls 60

    I did novice for BP 8 reps x3 with 1 min and 30 sec interval. The rest are the usual 2x12. Is this okey if I use the novice for the next cycle just for BP SLDL and Squat? it seems like my form is better and not struggle so much. What you think about my numbers? I currently weigh 176#. I started this January and I could see muscle gains but I haven't lost weight. I am eating 1800-2000 cal but for some reason weight is not dropping.
    Your numbers look great for well rounded strength. Only the first 3 lifts can be converted to "novice". The SLDL is an accessory and should be not be taken heavy. Moving the Row to novice may help with a stall in the SLDL though.
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  12. #1722
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by sk671221 View Post
    Thanks.

    I started a thread a couple months ago and you had recommended I get and adjustable kettlebell for this program, because I wanted a home workout.

    I'm mainly concerned about fat loss (I have about 75 pounds to lose minimum). I track my food through MyFitnessPal, and to lose 2 pounds a week I consume NET 1200 calories per day. This usually means I do eat around 1700 calories and burn about 500 through exercise, though I will eat more if I have a high exercise day. I do vary my macros, but I get about 100 grams of protein per day and do get enough carbs as well.

    I'm mainly focused on keeping as much muscle as I can, and of course lean mass to augment fat loss.
    the ONLY thing required to keep muscle mass is to eat in a way that at least maintains your calculated 1 rep max each week. So the canary in the coal mine is can you perform xxx for one set of xxx reps. On allpro the canary is 10 rep heavy day.

    And ill give you the same progression advice i give to most people who have a lot to lose. Just add the weight lost to the bar weight. If you started out with a 25-45lb weight, and just added 1-2lbs a week, after a year you are talking about having a body weight for 10 squat, which is VERY good for a woman(advanced novice for a woman is 1 rep of 1.25x bw), and most men would be huffing and puffing with that weight till at least the 6 month mark.
    Last edited by nightanole; 05-26-2016 at 06:35 AM.
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  13. #1723
    Platinum Account Member enr33's Avatar
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    Would it be ok for me to do my 2nd heavy day this saturday instead of friday?

    Also I have 2 20lb dumbells at home. Are there any isolation excericises I can do with them on off days to build biceps?
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  14. #1724
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by enr33 View Post
    Would it be ok for me to do my 2nd heavy day this saturday instead of friday?

    Also I have 2 20lb dumbells at home. Are there any isolation excericises I can do with them on off days to build biceps?
    72hours off before any heavy. So sat heavy means the next heavy wont happen till tues unless you are feeling really froggy.

    As for biceps, close grip chinups work the best for putting meat on your arms. Otherwise incline sitting curls have the most rom of any bicep exercise (and with less tendon irritation vs preacher curls). You could rig up a rest pause protocol. First set to RPE 8 (guaranteed 2 more reps in the tank), rest 15-20 seconds (you kinda "know" by the feeling of the cool blood flushing out feeling) and do another set to failure, repeat the protocol again for the final set. If tuned properly you will get half the reps of the previous set each time. So 16/8/4 for example. If you got more than rep or so above/below, retune the rest.
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  15. #1725
    Registered User PolishDude83's Avatar
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    Question on my nutrition, most of my meals are pretty set for the day or trying to be...

    I currently wake up at 7:30 AM and have a Banana and a Preworkout

    Work out from 8-9am

    9:15am I have 2 scoops of Gold Standard Whey Protein

    Noon - Go to lunch with coworkers

    4pm - Have some beef jerky as a snack

    7pm - Have a sweet potato and about 10 oz of chicken

    I calculate that out to be around 1055 calories, 69 grams of carbs and 155 grams of protein. What should I try to be eating for lunch? Seems like I am really low on the carbs although places my coworkers choose for lunch, I think I make those up real quick. And/or what should I change in my nutrition. I hate cooking so I have to make it simple for myself to actually do it or I will find myself not doing it at all, hence making chicken and sweet potato are a really easy and pretty delicious dinner. So if I need to change something around, it would be something that I can easily change up. I just want to make sure I am doing this program correctly, I think I have the workout out part down, but nutrition is where I always struggle.
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  16. #1726
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by PolishDude83 View Post
    Question on my nutrition, most of my meals are pretty set for the day or trying to be...

    I currently wake up at 7:30 AM and have a Banana and a Preworkout

    Work out from 8-9am

    9:15am I have 2 scoops of Gold Standard Whey Protein

    Noon - Go to lunch with coworkers

    4pm - Have some beef jerky as a snack

    7pm - Have a sweet potato and about 10 oz of chicken

    I calculate that out to be around 1055 calories, 69 grams of carbs and 155 grams of protein. What should I try to be eating for lunch? Seems like I am really low on the carbs although places my coworkers choose for lunch, I think I make those up real quick. And/or what should I change in my nutrition. I hate cooking so I have to make it simple for myself to actually do it or I will find myself not doing it at all, hence making chicken and sweet potato are a really easy and pretty delicious dinner. So if I need to change something around, it would be something that I can easily change up. I just want to make sure I am doing this program correctly, I think I have the workout out part down, but nutrition is where I always struggle.
    Not sure how you are still upright eating 1k a day....


    Anyway base diet is 100g of fat/protein and 200-300g of carbs. Your solution maybe powdered oats. 3 scoops(100g) in a shaker cup would net about 350 cals, 65g of carb, and 15g of protein. The stuff is cheap too, 10lbs for like 10-15 bucks.
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  17. #1727
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    I'm currently on cycle 3, second week and whilst my strength has improved:

    Squat 120lb > 160lb
    Press 60lb > 90lb
    BOR 70lb > 100lb
    OHP 50lb > 60lb
    SLDL 80lb > 100lb
    Curl 60lb = 60lb

    I still haven't seen any hypertrophy gains at all

    In you experience, is it a case of not being patient enough...gains normally seen in cycle 4,5,6...etc? Or is it a case of the weights being used not enough to stimulate gain?
    Last edited by petropietro; 05-27-2016 at 07:56 AM.
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  18. #1728
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    Originally Posted by petropietro View Post
    I'm currently on cycle 3, second week and whilst my strength has improved:

    Squat 120lb > 160lb
    Press 60lb > 90lb
    BOR 70lb > 100lb
    OHP 50lb > 60lb
    SLDL 80lb > 100lb
    Curl 60lb = 60lb

    I still haven't seen any hypertrophy gains at all

    Is it a case of not being patient enough...gains normally seen in cycle 4,5,6...etc? Or is it a case of the weights being used not enough to stimulate gain?
    I think for most people it takes years to look like you lift. My numbers are higher than yours (eg. 200lbs squats for 10 reps) and I still look the same as a non-lifter.
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  19. #1729
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by petropietro View Post
    I'm currently on cycle 3, second week and whilst my strength has improved:

    Squat 120lb > 160lb
    Press 60lb > 90lb
    BOR 70lb > 100lb
    OHP 50lb > 60lb
    SLDL 80lb > 100lb
    Curl 60lb = 60lb

    I still haven't seen any hypertrophy gains at all

    In you experience, is it a case of not being patient enough...gains normally seen in cycle 4,5,6...etc? Or is it a case of the weights being used not enough to stimulate gain?
    6'3", 214 lbs....

    Look ill be honest, at 6.3 you will need to get into the 1000lb club of power lifting before you have a chance to look like you lift. If you want to get to "otter mode" You are still going to have to get your squat to body weight and be able to rep out at least 1 bench rep of body weight. Then its just a matter of cutting down to below 12% bf so every thing "pops" regardless of muscle size. And its called otter mode because you are expected to not change your diet or lifting pattern, and add a lot of cardio(aka swimming) to slim down.

    If you want me to shatter your dreams even more:
    http://muscleandbrawn.com/strong-str...tural-lifters/

    Allpro runs out around "strong", and "very strong" is considered early intermediate, and you are expected to have half your natty gains by "very strong".
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  20. #1730
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    6'3", 214 lbs....

    Look ill be honest, at 6.3 you will need to get into the 1000lb club of power lifting before you have a chance to look like you lift. If you want to get to "otter mode" You are still going to have to get your squat to body weight and be able to rep out at least 1 bench rep of body weight. Then its just a matter of cutting down to below 12% bf so every thing "pops" regardless of muscle size. And its called otter mode because you are expected to not change your diet or lifting pattern, and add a lot of cardio(aka swimming) to slim down.

    If you want me to shatter your dreams even more:


    Allpro runs out around "strong", and "very strong" is considered early intermediate, and you are expected to have half your natty gains by "very strong".
    Thanks man. I'm not expecting for it to start becoming obvious I lift but want to keep the motivation by seeing at least some kind of development at this stage.

    Take your points that for my size my lifts are small. As I'm using dumbbells for press, and my dumbbells go up to 90lb each, my first goal is to get to 75lb each dumbell for 12 reps which I believe is my bodyweight for 1 rep. Think that's doable by cycle 9 so long as I don't stall.

    So I'm not realistically gonna see "ottermode" until cycle 9?
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  21. #1731
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by petropietro View Post
    Thanks man. I'm not expecting for it to start becoming obvious I lift but want to keep the motivation by seeing at least some kind of development at this stage.

    Take your points that for my size my lifts are small. As I'm using dumbbells for press, and my dumbbells go up to 90lb each, my first goal is to get to 75lb each dumbell for 12 reps which I believe is my bodyweight for 1 rep. Think that's doable by cycle 9 so long as I don't stall.

    So I'm not realistically gonna see "ottermode" until cycle 9?
    Ottemode requires a bmi of 23 @ 11-12%bf (relaxed abs if dam good lighting). For your size that is about 190lbs. It also requires no lifting, like i said "otter", aka just swimming or playing a hand sport would provide enough hypertrophy so nothing was "flat".

    So with some basic math of 1% bw loss per week, 20ish pounds to lose, you could have it in 10-12 weeks on a slow cut if you played your cards right. the hard part is finding the time to do enough cardio to drop 2lbs a week. You wont achieve otter mode lifting and cutting calories, you will just end up small. You have to drop weight via increasing your TDEE. If you just cut cals it will reduce your lifting performance/gains.
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Ottemode requires a bmi of 23 @ 11-12%bf (relaxed abs if dam good lighting). For your size that is about 190lbs. It also requires no lifting, like i said "otter", aka just swimming or playing a hand sport would provide enough hypertrophy so nothing was "flat".

    So with some basic math of 1% bw loss per week, 20ish pounds to lose, you could have it in 10-12 weeks on a slow cut if you played your cards right. the hard part is finding the time to do enough cardio to drop 2lbs a week. You wont achieve otter mode lifting and cutting calories, you will just end up small. You have to drop weight via increasing your TDEE. If you just cut cals it will reduce your lifting performance/gains.
    Gotcha my man. I think...

    So keep cals the same at maintenance (circa 2,500 cals with at least 100g protein, 100g fats and 400g carbs).

    Keep lifting on All Pro.

    Up the cardio to get the 2lb a week drop.

    Aim could be circa 12% body fat in 12 weeks.

    24lb drop in weight = circa 190lbs

    That's about 3 more cycles of All Pro in that time so without stalling on lifts.

    Bench will be at 120lbs (12 reps, 1 rep max = 170lbs, 20lbs shy of body weight)
    Squat will be at 210lbs (12 reps, 1 rep max = 309lbs, 1.5 x body weight)

    Hey that's pretty damn impressive progress in 12 weeks if I can keep this going (and I've got the maths and theory right..lol!)

    So, just need to work out what swimming or running I can do to reach the 2lb a week mark. Guess I need to think about getting a Fitbit to track calories burnt to hit the 7000 cals per week!! Doable I think.
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    You wont achieve otter mode lifting and cutting calories, you will just end up small. You have to drop weight via increasing your TDEE. If you just cut cals it will reduce your lifting performance/gains.
    I saw you mention something like this before, that people shouldn't cut calories to lose weight, they should increase calorie expenditure via cardio. Why do you say this? The general idea I read everywhere is always something like bulk on 2300 calories and cut on 2000 calories by adjusting carbs either up or down. Is the recommendation specifically for AllPro since it requires carbs for reps? If I was running something like MadCow would you give the same advice?
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    Originally Posted by WrathfulOne View Post
    I saw you mention something like this before, that people shouldn't cut calories to lose weight, they should increase calorie expenditure via cardio. Why do you say this? The general idea I read everywhere is always something like bulk on 2300 calories and cut on 2000 calories by adjusting carbs either up or down. Is the recommendation specifically for AllPro since it requires carbs for reps? If I was running something like MadCow would you give the same advice?
    Your recommendation is great for an intermediate and advanced lifter (and so is mad cow considering its a program meant to take you from a 4 plate deadlift to a 5 plate end game deadlift).

    However intermediate and advanced lifters are well versed on how their body responds to cardio/lifting/diet. They are also not eating 2300-2000 calories, they are eating well over 3000 for just maintenance even if they are small (even me at 150lbs and no cardio is up to 2300-2500 TDEE). When going over n00b calories, a 3500 calorie diet is still going to be the same 100g of fats/protein and the rest will be upwards of 1000g of carbs. Even if they went high protien of 1g per pound(so 200g of protein unless you are over 6.2, or not natty, or well above 13%) it still would be 800-900g of carbs. THOSE people can adjust carbs just fine up and down 500cals and get away with it.

    However a beginner has a very low calorie requirement at 1800-2200 cals. At that low of a level macros and micros matter more than calories. You cant just cut 500 cals of carbs, your lifts turn to crap. You cant just go low "anything", because you are not eating enough "stuff" for the body to make the non essential fatty acids and amino acids, and hormones. So beginners need to focus on increasing their TDEE. They need to focus on increasing their caloric turnover. In 18 months a 210lb guy can go from needing 2200 cals to maintain, to 180lbs and need 2800+ cals to maintain, if he did everything properly.

    The formula has been the same for decades. Eat just enough to maintain lifting progress. If you are fat, the caloric intake required to progress will be alot lower vs someone who is underweight. And guess what, once you are at that 13% when progression gets hard, you will require more and more calories in order to progress, and you will put on body weight as an adaptation to the increased progression.

    Alan thrall and rippetoe Have a chip on their shoulder from this topic because they deal mostly with highschool/college kids. They walk in 170lbs with a gut and cant squat 95lbs, and then bitch 6 months later when they are 150lbs and cant figure out why their squat stalls at 2 plate. They never adjusted their diet and their TDEE increased. Their lifting numbers went up till their gut couldnt sustain the progress.
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Your recommendation is great for an intermediate and advanced lifter (and so is mad cow considering its a program meant to take you from a 4 plate deadlift to a 5 plate end game deadlift).

    However intermediate and advanced lifters are well versed on how their body responds to cardio/lifting/diet. They are also not eating 2300-2000 calories, they are eating well over 3000 for just maintenance even if they are small (even me at 150lbs and no cardio is up to 2300-2500 TDEE). When going over n00b calories, a 3500 calorie diet is still going to be the same 100g of fats/protein and the rest will be upwards of 1000g of carbs. Even if they went high protien of 1g per pound(so 200g of protein unless you are over 6.2, or not natty, or well above 13%) it still would be 800-900g of carbs. THOSE people can adjust carbs just fine up and down 500cals and get away with it.

    However a beginner has a very low calorie requirement at 1800-2200 cals. At that low of a level macros and micros matter more than calories. You cant just cut 500 cals of carbs, your lifts turn to crap. You cant just go low "anything", because you are not eating enough "stuff" for the body to make the non essential fatty acids and amino acids, and hormones. So beginners need to focus on increasing their TDEE. They need to focus on increasing their caloric turnover. In 18 months a 210lb guy can go from needing 2200 cals to maintain, to 180lbs and need 2800+ cals to maintain, if he did everything properly.

    The formula has been the same for decades. Eat just enough to maintain lifting progress. If you are fat, the caloric intake required to progress will be alot lower vs someone who is underweight. And guess what, once you are at that 13% when progression gets hard, you will require more and more calories in order to progress, and you will put on body weight as an adaptation to the increased progression.

    Alan thrall and rippetoe Have a chip on their shoulder from this topic because they deal mostly with highschool/college kids. They walk in 170lbs with a gut and cant squat 95lbs, and then bitch 6 months later when they are 150lbs and cant figure out why their squat stalls at 2 plate. They never adjusted their diet and their TDEE increased. Their lifting numbers went up till their gut couldnt sustain the progress.
    I see, damn that sounds like I have to go gym more to do cardio which is boring as hell

    I've been cutting via diet, so I'm on 1900 calories per day (5'10" 165lbs). I'm running AllPro auto-regulated, so every workout I'm just trying to ensure I maintain 2x10 (or as close as possible, some lifts are like 10,9 but I make sure I never drop to 10,8) on all my lifts while my weight goes down. I've already hit the ceiling for progression while cutting, so I'm in the hamster wheel now where I just do the same weights every workout. Some off days I go and ride a bike for 45mins which burns 300 calories according to the display.

    Oh and I've lost 4lbs in 3 weeks so far.
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    re

    thanks for this great and informational article and comments . It is very useful for me . great job .
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    On my 2nd heavy day last week (8 rep week) I only got 6 reps on 3rd work set of bench. I just know that once I reach 11 and 12 rep week Im not gonna be able to get all reps for 5 sets.

    Also, I was honestly a bit scared when doing 3 work sets on squat, I felt like I wouldnt be able to finish.....

    Maybe 100g of carbs 1 hour before lifting isnt enough.... I took 5g creatine pwo too to try to alleviate my worries about squats...
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    Finally managed 2x12 50kg bench today on AllPro auto-regulated while on a cut. Previous session I completed OHP 32.5kg 2x12, so it's weird upper body has increased but my lower body is still stuck at 90kg squats and 75kg SLDL (both 2x10). Bodyweight seems to have stopped dropping now on 1900 calories, so I'm dropping to 1800 to see what happens. I've actually been running this with 3x16-20 facepulls and 2 or 3x10 chinups depending on how I'm feeling.
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    It took me most of 2 days to read part 1 and a lot of this thread. First thing. THANK YOU nightanole for continuing it! I rep as much as possible but I'm new so unfortunately it won't be worth much but thanks anyways!!

    I'm currently about 165 lbs (F) and just coming back after probably almost 2 years away from any serious gym work. I lost about half of my max lifts and gained back about 25 lbs from my profile pic at @145 - damn depressing! Anyways, I saw that there are a couple of ladies active in this thread so hopefully I can get some feedback from them (or anyone else who can help) regarding how much progress I can get as a woman. I recall seeing that this program would be good for about bw X 10 bench and 1.5 bw squat - is that applicable to women also? I used to be able to squat 85 and bench about 65 at my best but probably could have done more if I was really dedicated. I'd be really stoked to be able to push even 130, thoughts?

    Also, I need to drop off about 35 / 40 lbs at this point to get where I want to be - OR about 12-15% bf (weight is secondary as long as I get the look I want) I won't be working on my calves because they ARE already bigger than my neck (if this applies to women even) I got a lot of the smaller guys beat on biceps too haha (though likely none who work out) My diet is **** right now as I USED to maintain about 2300 and so I have been having a really hard time coming down food wise. Probably still around 2k most days though thankfully I seem to have mostly stopped the scale climbing at this point. What are the thought on being able to get lifting heavy enough that I can lose a bit of this flab without having to starve further? And are any of the ladies that are doing this right now over 40? Do you think the age will impact my ability to get "bad-ass"? My goal is to be in the best shape of my life by 50 and be able to either compete or just be in 'jaw-dropping' shape

    Thanks again to everyone who has been giving up so much great info - so much patience!!
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    Originally Posted by koldnomore View Post
    It took me most of 2 days to read part 1 and a lot of this thread. First thing. THANK YOU nightanole for continuing it! I rep as much as possible but I'm new so unfortunately it won't be worth much but thanks anyways!!

    I'm currently about 165 lbs (F) and just coming back after probably almost 2 years away from any serious gym work. I lost about half of my max lifts and gained back about 25 lbs from my profile pic at @145 - damn depressing! Anyways, I saw that there are a couple of ladies active in this thread so hopefully I can get some feedback from them (or anyone else who can help) regarding how much progress I can get as a woman. I recall seeing that this program would be good for about bw X 10 bench and 1.5 bw squat - is that applicable to women also? I used to be able to squat 85 and bench about 65 at my best but probably could have done more if I was really dedicated. I'd be really stoked to be able to push even 130, thoughts?

    Also, I need to drop off about 35 / 40 lbs at this point to get where I want to be - OR about 12-15% bf (weight is secondary as long as I get the look I want) I won't be working on my calves because they ARE already bigger than my neck (if this applies to women even) I got a lot of the smaller guys beat on biceps too haha (though likely none who work out) My diet is **** right now as I USED to maintain about 2300 and so I have been having a really hard time coming down food wise. Probably still around 2k most days though thankfully I seem to have mostly stopped the scale climbing at this point. What are the thought on being able to get lifting heavy enough that I can lose a bit of this flab without having to starve further? And are any of the ladies that are doing this right now over 40? Do you think the age will impact my ability to get "bad-ass"? My goal is to be in the best shape of my life by 50 and be able to either compete or just be in 'jaw-dropping' shape

    Thanks again to everyone who has been giving up so much great info - so much patience!!
    The programs stops being effective for women around 1 rep of 3/4 body weight bench and 1 rep of 1.25x bw squat, These need to be technical pr's at the gym, not calculated. This is assuming a bf of around 20%+-2%. If you are not at those strength levels yet you should be able to cut at 1% bw per week while progressing at normal speed. Based on your numbers it looks like you will be slow cutting for 3 cycles, and hopefully adding at least 25% to all your lifting stats while dropping the 35lbs.

    Base diet is 100g of fats/protein and 200-300g of carbs, so its well within what you are used to eating. If you want to go very low fat you still need to get in the 20g of both omega 3 and omega 6.
    Base cardio is 3x10k jogs take take at least 1 hour (or as much as you want of anything you can do continuously for at least 45min).
    Between just starting allpro and doing base cardio is normally good for 1lb of weight loss per week if you where maintaining before starting the workout.
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