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  1. #361
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by munichveteran View Post
    On the landmines, itís not that I canít feel it at all in the quadsÖwhat I mean is, when I do seated leg curls I really feel it in my hamstrings. They burn like hell once I reached 10-11 reps. Itís not the same feeling in my quads when I do landmines, and Iím trying to figure out if itís because my form is off somehow. Apparently landmines are close to foolproof when it comes to poor form, but if thereís a way to do it poorly Iíll find it!

    Iíll try the inverted row. I checked it out and I expect Iíll struggle to make 2x8 with bodyweight, but letís see what happens. Either way, how do I progress that? Balance a plate on my belly?

    I can switch my chin up grip to facing me, but the assisted chin up machine I use has a weird set up for the bar. If Iím to do chins with palms facing me, by hands will be wider than shoulder width because itís L-shaped on either side. Itís not a straight bar across. Is it OK to do chins (palms facing me) with my hands wider than shoulder width?

    Farmers Walks - For cycle 1 I carried 45lb DBs on heavy day, 40lbs on medium, 35lbs on light. I then walked a little further each week for "rep" progression. Next week (cycle 2) I'll bump the DBs up to 50lb on heavy, 45 on medium, 40 on light, and then follow the same progression of distance as cycle 1. Correct?

    Last question...with these program changes (inverted row instead of BOR etc), do I start to incorporate now (for day 2 of week 5, cycle 1) or finish the cycle as is and incorporate the changes next week (day 1 of week 1, cycle 2)?

    Thanks!
    Leg curl is a ham isolation, just like leg extension is a quad isolation. a landmine is a leg press, it might be a little quad dominant, but its not like your glutes/hams are not doing anything.

    A wider chinup will hit the upper back more, a narrow chinup will hit the forearm and lat more. Most need arm meet, so i have them do narrow grip, however at this stage it doesnt matter, and you may respond well to wide grip.

    Your farmer walk progression sounds good if you keep the distance traveled the same cycle to cycle. You dont want to go from 30-50ft one cycle and then next go real heavy and only do 20-30ft.

    Inverted row you progress on via angle of torso. You might start out with the bar at chest level and just be rowing at 60 degrees or so. Once you can row with feet at bar level, then you start adding plates, but by that time its almost the end of the program.

    I would practice the new movements on off days and then change exercises at the start of next cycle.
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  2. #362
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by enr33 View Post
    thanks brah but i was actually seeking input from nightanole

    also nightanhole what would be my best plan now? The meal I threw up put me at 2800/3500 calories I bulk on and it was a 1000 calorie meal.....

    fml seriosuly, its one thing after another
    As others have stated, average your calories over the week. Eat-stop-eat people make progress just fine, and they go 36-48 hours between food.

    You might also want to think about micro meals instead of 2-3 1000 calorie meals. I know if i eat a 1000 cal break fast (6 eggs +4 peice of toast+ extras) at 8am im lucky if i can DL at 11-12 wihtout spitting up. I dont know how these guys that workout 2 hours a day and eat 6k calories do it.
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  3. #363
    Registered User SmackBang77's Avatar
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    Oh ok my mistake, its all clear now i was like "why drop 10%" lol thanks man
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  4. #364
    Registered User munichveteran's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Leg curl is a ham isolation, just like leg extension is a quad isolation. a landmine is a leg press, it might be a little quad dominant, but its not like your glutes/hams are not doing anything.

    A wider chinup will hit the upper back more, a narrow chinup will hit the forearm and lat more. Most need arm meet, so i have them do narrow grip, however at this stage it doesnt matter, and you may respond well to wide grip.

    Your farmer walk progression sounds good if you keep the distance traveled the same cycle to cycle. You dont want to go from 30-50ft one cycle and then next go real heavy and only do 20-30ft.

    Inverted row you progress on via angle of torso. You might start out with the bar at chest level and just be rowing at 60 degrees or so. Once you can row with feet at bar level, then you start adding plates, but by that time its almost the end of the program.

    I would practice the new movements on off days and then change exercises at the start of next cycle.
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to nightanole again. Why do they make it so difficult to rep this guy!!!
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  5. #365
    Registered User munichveteran's Avatar
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    I have a business trip coming up...and the hotels I stay in are never as good as my local gym. My options are:

    1) I'll be waking up in a hotel this Friday (which is light day - week 5 for me). Do I perform 2 x heavy days this week (Monday and Wednesday) and then just do some cardio at the hotel gym on Friday, safe in the knowledge that my 1st cycle was complete because I completed 2 x heavy days during week 5?

    or...

    2) Perform medium day as normal on Wednesday, and then do whatever I can to replicate my light day routine on Friday using the limited facilities at the hotel gym?

    or...

    3) Perform medium day as normal on Wednesday, and then go again on Thursday for my light day.

    Which option do you recommend?
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  6. #366
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by munichveteran View Post
    I have a business trip coming up...and the hotels I stay in are never as good as my local gym. My options are:

    1) I'll be waking up in a hotel this Friday (which is light day - week 5 for me). Do I perform 2 x heavy days this week (Monday and Wednesday) and then just do some cardio at the hotel gym on Friday, safe in the knowledge that my 1st cycle was complete because I completed 2 x heavy days during week 5?

    or...

    2) Perform medium day as normal on Wednesday, and then do whatever I can to replicate my light day routine on Friday using the limited facilities at the hotel gym?

    or...

    3) Perform medium day as normal on Wednesday, and then go again on Thursday for my light day.

    Which option do you recommend?
    Since its test week it is up to you. You are allowed to skip 1 light day per cycle. Ive done heavy heavy test weeks before (i call them the holiday pattern) and gotten the same results both days. Your 2nd heavy would need to be 2 days after your first, so it would have to be on thurs if test day is monday. You cant do monday heavy weds heavy.
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  7. #367
    Registered User munichveteran's Avatar
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    Ok. Can I do option 3? That may be my preference because it ensures that I get 3 workouts in, but is it ok to have only 24 hours rest between medium and light day?
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  8. #368
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by munichveteran View Post
    Ok. Can I do option 3? That may be my preference because it ensures that I get 3 workouts in, but is it ok to have only 24 hours rest between medium and light day?
    Option 3 works in a pinch. By now you realized medium day is the hardest day of the week, and its test week, god speed...
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  9. #369
    Registered User Rodman1's Avatar
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    interesting thoughts, i must admit..
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  10. #370
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    I think you are doing the movement wrong, and are flexing the back durring the movement vs using the spinal erectors for a static hold. This causes an extra sore back and no glute (since you removed tension from them).

    If you switch to sumo, you will also need to include at least one set of good mornings. And if you do the good mornings the same way as your sldl, its still not going to fix the problem. The sumo is not a hamstring stretch, and its why the SLDL is chosen on this program. The only alt to the SLDL is the good morning.
    Thank you! I read your answer yesterday, mulled over it last night, and applied what you noted by really focusing on engaging my hamstrings & glutes. I thought I was before but I was actually tightening my lower back more than anything. Now I also think I was going too low. Today was medium day and while it's still not perfect, I definitely felt it much more where I'm supposed to. Thanks again!
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  11. #371
    Fuk Alvarezzz's Avatar
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    I want to start doing muay thai soon but still want to keep up with all pro. Would that be overtraining? Or is there a modified version that i can do. I still want to keep getting stronger, but it seems like that heavy cardio would set my strength gains back a bit.
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  12. #372
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Alvarezzz View Post
    I want to start doing muay thai soon but still want to keep up with all pro. Would that be overtraining? Or is there a modified version that i can do. I still want to keep getting stronger, but it seems like that heavy cardio would set my strength gains back a bit.
    You can do beginner routines while maintaining a heavy warehouse job 12 hours a day, i dont think a few hours of muay thai is going affect you. Worse case you might need a few more carbs. The only thing that can really set you back is 45min of true HIIT.
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  13. #373
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    You can do beginner routines while maintaining a heavy warehouse job 12 hours a day, i dont think a few hours of muay thai is going affect you. Worse case you might need a few more carbs. The only thing that can really set you back is 45min of true HIIT.
    Ok thanks!
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  14. #374
    Registered User Cowsbreath's Avatar
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    Hi there. Long time reader first time poster.

    I have been doing All pro's beginner routine for exactly 1 year now and have seen most of my weights increase by 100% from where I started which has been great.

    I messed up a bit at the start and was eating to much and went from 82kg to 88kg. I have cut back down slowly over the last 6 months and am currently back down to 84kg with more definition, nothing amazing but definitely have made gains. I am going to lose 2 more kg which will have me at 15-20% body fat.

    I have changed the rountine to the novice version for this last cycle which I feel has help me greatly.

    My question is this. I feel like I can recover a lot quicker now, more than when I started. Would I be able to train heavy 3x a week? I under stand the deload is built into the program and have also read the self regulating version and see you can train up to four times a week heavy. My weights are high enough to move to that version (Squat only just)., but I was wondering if sticking to the novice version at 3x heavy with a slight deficit would be reommended or ok to do after a solid year training with this program?

    I am in no rush with my lifting. I am comitited to training now for the rest of my life, no if's or but's about it and thats thanks to this rountine . I just don't want to be selling myself sort or stay doing this longer than I should. I'm also keen to start eating more again , but will wait until winter in Australia.

    Thanks in advance for any advice.
    Last edited by Cowsbreath; 11-18-2015 at 05:30 PM.
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  15. #375
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Cowsbreath View Post
    Hi there. Long time reader first time poster.

    I have been doing All pro's beginner routine for exactly 1 year now and have seen most of my weights increase by 100% from where I started which has been great.

    I messed up a bit at the start and was eating to much and went from 82kg to 88kg. I have cut back down slowly over the last 6 months and am currently back down to 84kg with more definition, nothing amazing but definitely have made gains. I am going to lose 2 more kg which will have me at 15-20% body fat.

    I have changed the rountine to the novice version for this last cycle which I feel has help me greatly.

    My question is this. I feel like I can recover a lot quicker now, more than when I started. Would I be able to train heavy 3x a week? I under stand the deload is built into the program and have also read the self regulating version and see you can train up to four times a week heavy. My weights are high enough to move to that version (Squat only just)., but I was wondering if sticking to the novice version at 3x heavy with a slight deficit would be reommended or ok to do after a solid year training with this program?

    I am in no rush with my lifting. I am comitited to training now for the rest of my life, no if's or but's about it and thats thanks to this rountine . I just don't want to be selling myself sort or stay doing this longer than I should. I'm also keen to start eating more again , but will wait until winter in Australia.

    Thanks in advance for any advice.
    I can not honestly recommend someone to stay on allpro for over a year unless they are cutting. I would start looking around for a better pattern for an experienced lifter. The problem is what you described, all pro just doesnt have enough volume to push an experienced lifter.

    The solution is to try out the auto regulated version, or tryout allpro intermediate, there are 4-5 programs in the intermediate thread, V2 is the closest to beginner.

    Hell auto regulated might be able to be pushed out to a 3-5 year program if you can figure out the volume and rest. I ran it well with 3 sets with 2min rests, it did make the program like 75min long though.
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  16. #376
    Registered User Cowsbreath's Avatar
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    I appreciate the response.

    I have looked at the intermediate section previously and have a good understanding of them.

    My two concerns are:

    1. I'm 20kg shy of my bw 1x 1.5 bench and 40kg shy of my 1x2 bw squat. I'm sure this is down to my food intake as my weights flew up at the start, should I still move to intermediate if I can't get these lifts?

    2. A lot of the programes are two times a week. I understand I can add alot of accessorie exercises, but am concerned it won't be enough? I suppose I should just try and see.
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  17. #377
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Cowsbreath View Post
    I appreciate the response.

    I have looked at the intermediate section previously and have a good understanding of them.

    My two concerns are:

    1. I'm 20kg shy of my bw 1x 1.5 bench and 40kg shy of my 1x2 bw squat. I'm sure this is down to my food intake as my weights flew up at the start, should I still move to intermediate if I can't get these lifts?

    2. A lot of the programes are two times a week. I understand I can add alot of accessorie exercises, but am concerned it won't be enough? I suppose I should just try and see.
    v2 is a 4 day upper lower split. And to be considered a intermediate you would need to be around 10 reps of bw for bench and 1.5x bw for squats, and thats with a 15% bf.

    Still an intermediate routine is just 50-100% more volume and 1/2-1/3 the progression rate. You move on when you stall from the lack of volume and the super progression of the beginner routines.
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  18. #378
    Registered User Destor's Avatar
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    What would the experienced brahs recommend doing when you're sick during your 12-rep week?

    I picked up a bad head cold in the middle of last week and am just now getting over it. I've stuck to the regular routine, but my second-set performance has tanked on the lifts where I was ready to push personal bests. The first set hasn't suffered, but the second set for bench/overhead press has bombed. I'm assuming it's from the cold, I've also been getting bad headaches and nausea after the squats and through the rest of the workout.

    Should I refrain from increasing the weight for another full cycle, or would there be another option? Maybe turning next week into another 12-rep week to see if my performance improves after fully recovered from the cold? I don't know if that would be too much or what, but I don't feel like this week has been representative of my capabilities on those lifts.
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  19. #379
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Destor View Post
    What would the experienced brahs recommend doing when you're sick during your 12-rep week?

    I picked up a bad head cold in the middle of last week and am just now getting over it. I've stuck to the regular routine, but my second-set performance has tanked on the lifts where I was ready to push personal bests. The first set hasn't suffered, but the second set for bench/overhead press has bombed. I'm assuming it's from the cold, I've also been getting bad headaches and nausea after the squats and through the rest of the workout.

    Should I refrain from increasing the weight for another full cycle, or would there be another option? Maybe turning next week into another 12-rep week to see if my performance improves after fully recovered from the cold? I don't know if that would be too much or what, but I don't feel like this week has been representative of my capabilities on those lifts.
    I would take 2 days off, do a 10 rep test with the new weights, if you pass you are gold, if you fail repeat the weights next cycle. You can do this any time before you start a new cycle, you could take weeks off if you want before the 10 rep test. However "test day" the 2 sets of 12 must be made without taking more than 2-3 days off from the last lifting session, or you will be too fresh and it will be a false test.
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  20. #380
    Registered User munichveteran's Avatar
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    Would a low cable row have the same effect (or close enough) as the inverted row/BOR? If so, which grip attachment is best and what form tips would you give?
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  21. #381
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by munichveteran View Post
    Would a low cable row have the same effect (or close enough) as the inverted row/BOR? If so, which grip attachment is best and what form tips would you give?
    Low cable row will work if you dont cheat by using the torso to get the weight going. You would wand a palms down grip, the opposite of your curl grip. You want it around the same grip width as your bench.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKAeU55CkVk
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  22. #382
    Registered User nature51's Avatar
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    I'm looking for some advice on where to go from here. A little background, I've always been skinny (6', 156lbs as of this morning) but I lifted a lot in my late teens and early twenties (I'm 33 now). Then I got lazy and only lifted on and off up until January of this year. I started out at 157lbs, bulked up to about 175lbs, then cut back to 150lbs. I'm back to bulking as of late September. I spent Jan-July on the "The 1 + 1 Skinny Guy Transformation Program" from this site. The progress was ok, but my diet wasn't always the best. In August I started on All Pro and really got my diet in check. I'm about to finish my third cycle next week, and I already feel like the progression is starting to become difficult.

    Now, here's the caveat, I work out at home and up until now I've only had a standard, really crappy dumbbell/barbell set and no rack. So, I have to squat/bench/shoulder press with dumbbells. On black Friday, I'm planning to order a rack, barbell, plates, etc. from Rogue. I already built myself a platform. My current numbers are the following:

    Squat (dumbbell) - 75lbs (in each hand so 150lbs total)
    Bench (dumbbell) - 75lbs
    Row (barbell) - 150lbs
    Shoulder press (dumbbell) - 45lbs
    SLDL (barbell) - 160lbs

    My question is, should I move on to an intermediate program right away (if so any suggestions?), or continue with All Pro beginner for a few more cycles since I'll be switching up at least 3 of the lifts to barbells?
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  23. #383
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nature51 View Post
    I'm looking for some advice on where to go from here. A little background, I've always been skinny (6', 156lbs as of this morning) but I lifted a lot in my late teens and early twenties (I'm 33 now). Then I got lazy and only lifted on and off up until January of this year. I started out at 157lbs, bulked up to about 175lbs, then cut back to 150lbs. I'm back to bulking as of late September. I spent Jan-July on the "The 1 + 1 Skinny Guy Transformation Program" from this site. The progress was ok, but my diet wasn't always the best. In August I started on All Pro and really got my diet in check. I'm about to finish my third cycle next week, and I already feel like the progression is starting to become difficult.

    Now, here's the caveat, I work out at home and up until now I've only had a standard, really crappy dumbbell/barbell set and no rack. So, I have to squat/bench/shoulder press with dumbbells. On black Friday, I'm planning to order a rack, barbell, plates, etc. from Rogue. I already built myself a platform. My current numbers are the following:

    Squat (dumbbell) - 75lbs (in each hand so 150lbs total)
    Bench (dumbbell) - 75lbs
    Row (barbell) - 150lbs
    Shoulder press (dumbbell) - 45lbs
    SLDL (barbell) - 160lbs

    My question is, should I move on to an intermediate program right away (if so any suggestions?), or continue with All Pro beginner for a few more cycles since I'll be switching up at least 3 of the lifts to barbells?
    Id "call" around before i go rogue, and even "call" rogue. You normally can save 20-30% with a phone order. My goto is christiansfitnessfactory, they will knock $200-300 off racks easy.


    This program starts running out of steam around 10 reps for bw bench and 10 reps for 1.5x bw squats. At that point volume is too low and progression is too fast. AKA medium day no longer feels like the hardest day of the week.

    You have 3 choices at that point:
    novice which is switching up to the first 3 lifts to 3 sets of 4-8 reps with the same 90 second or less rest
    Switch to auto regulated
    Switch to one of the intermediate routines, v2 is the closest to allpro beginner, its a 4 day upper/lower split.
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  24. #384
    Registered User nature51's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Id "call" around before i go rogue, and even "call" rogue. You normally can save 20-30% with a phone order. My goto is christiansfitnessfactory, they will knock $200-300 off racks easy.


    This program starts running out of steam around 10 reps for bw bench and 10 reps for 1.5x bw squats. At that point volume is too low and progression is too fast. AKA medium day no longer feels like the hardest day of the week.

    You have 3 choices at that point:
    novice which is switching up to the first 3 lifts to 3 sets of 4-8 reps with the same 90 second or less rest
    Switch to auto regulated
    Switch to one of the intermediate routines, v2 is the closest to allpro beginner, its a 4 day upper/lower split.
    Thanks for the tip. I already have a Rogue flat bench that I love, so I kind of have my heart set on them, but I will give them a call to see if I can save a few bucks.

    My bench is certainly there but I've always neglected my legs in the past so they're still playing catch up. And heavy day feels significantly harder to me at this point than medium day.

    I'm thinking about switching to novice for cycle or two just to get a better feel for the new equipment, then moving to v2 intermediate.

    Thanks again for the help and everything you provide to this thread!
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  25. #385
    Registered User Beginner95's Avatar
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    Thanks for the workout.
    Are their any alternatives to the stiff legged deadlifts?
    I've had stress fractures in my lower back in the past and don't feel that my form is great for this exercise as it is very difficult to monitor whether you are doing it correctly.
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  26. #386
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Beginner95 View Post
    Thanks for the workout.
    Are their any alternatives to the stiff legged deadlifts?
    I've had stress fractures in my lower back in the past and don't feel that my form is great for this exercise as it is very difficult to monitor whether you are doing it correctly.
    The only alt is a good morning.
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  27. #387
    Registered User Destor's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    I would take 2 days off, do a 10 rep test with the new weights, if you pass you are gold, if you fail repeat the weights next cycle. You can do this any time before you start a new cycle, you could take weeks off if you want before the 10 rep test. However "test day" the 2 sets of 12 must be made without taking more than 2-3 days off from the last lifting session, or you will be too fresh and it will be a false test.
    Thanks for the insight man.

    I've decided to let bench and overhead press remain the same for this next cycle and to really focus on perfecting form for the first few weeks while it's easier.

    My squat needs to catch up to bench/row/press anyways, this cycle will afford that opportunity.
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  28. #388
    Registered User Beginner95's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    The only alt is a good morning.
    Great, thanks! I only have dumbbells, is the version of it on youtube called "FIRE- Dumbbell Good Morning" ok?
    (I can't post links as I haven't posted 50 times)
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  29. #389
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Beginner95 View Post
    Great, thanks! I only have dumbbells, is the version of it on youtube called "FIRE- Dumbbell Good Morning" ok?
    (I can't post links as I haven't posted 50 times)
    That would work, this makes the exercise harder with the same weight since the weight is further out.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQ33ie-bTjs
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  30. #390
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    hey man I saw a way to measure body fat percentage using measurement tape. how acurate is it (since i have no calipers)
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