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Thread: NESTA or ISSA?

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    NESTA or ISSA?

    Both of these have a lot of online study which I like.

    What would you say between the two?

    Which has better learning material (I believe NESTA's material is all digital)?
    Last edited by copypaste; 04-22-2015 at 06:14 PM.
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    Originally Posted by copypaste View Post
    Both of these have a lot of online study which I like.

    What would you say between the two?

    Which has better learning material (I believe NESTA's material is all digital)?
    Makes no difference. These are both sub-par certifications.
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    Originally Posted by RamsdenF View Post
    Makes no difference. These are both sub-par certifications.
    Oh I see. Kind of like your website.
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    Originally Posted by copypaste View Post
    Oh I see. Kind of like your website.
    Got a chuckle out of me...

    But that basic website still makes me money. So what are you looking to do pal? Why are these your only two options? As someone that owns a business, your resume gets thrown in the trash with either of those two certs.
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    Originally Posted by RamsdenF View Post
    Got a chuckle out of me...

    But that basic website still makes me money. So what are you looking to do pal? Why are these your only two options? As someone that owns a business, your resume gets thrown in the trash with either of those two certs.
    And someone with an attitude like yours gets the job, right? figures.

    Not only does your egotism teem from the few sentences you can form here, but you set yourself up to be some sort of "expert" or "scientist" on your website with no credible research. Not to mention you have no authority to make the dietary suggestions you do, unless you have an RD after your name.

    If your website is any indication of how you instruct your clients, not only are you doing them a disservice, it's downright dangerous.
    Last edited by copypaste; 04-23-2015 at 07:03 PM.
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    Originally Posted by copypaste View Post
    Both of these have a lot of online study which I like.

    What would you say between the two?

    Which has better learning material (I believe NESTA's material is all digital)?
    NESTA is the bottom and ISSA is close to the bottom because there is no way you can fail, it's all at home testing. What is the point in pretending that these are high quality credentials from which you must seek advice as to which is better? No one is going to care if you are ISSA certified or NESTA certified. They will shrug their shoulders at both. Just pick one and be done with it.
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    Originally Posted by copypaste View Post
    And someone with an attitude like yours gets the job, right? figures.
    No I actually created my business pal.
    Not only does your egotism teem from the few sentences you can form here, but you set yourself up to be some sort of "expert" or "scientist" on your website with no credible research. Not to mention you have no authority to make the dietary suggestions you do, unless you have an RD after your name.

    If your website is any indication of how you instruct your clients, not only are you doing them a disservice, it's downright dangerous.
    Ok....your in obvious need of an enlightenment pal. Not only are you embarrassing yourself all over the internet(luckily for you, you are doing it anonymously), but you are just plain wrong. In the state of PA, there are no standards of who can and can not give dietary advice you dummy. Take 5 seconds and google it. So actually I DONT need to be an RD. Second....every single article I write I link to my studies and cite sources. Maybe click the red words genius.

    NOW....you sit here and make all these accusations without a shred of evidence. Make 1 specific instance where I am saying something without any science to back it up. Go ahead I'll wait. I figure you won't be back....

    Get lost pal. Go get your NESTA or ISSA and have fun working at a chain gym. Don't ever say no one tried to help you.
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    Op don't get upset cause someone spoke to you as an adult and told you the truth.

    Unfortunately what these guys said was the truth.

    Those certs are garbage. This doesn't mean you are a crappy trainer, or bad person.
    it just means the certificate is.
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    Can't speak for NESTA, but ISSA has solid information. They have a unique testing program in which, you must create a training program for a person and then explain why you made the choices. The essay pages are graded strictly. You can fail by not meeting the word count, not creating an effective fitness plan, or not explaining why you made those decisions for the client. People like to make the claim that it doesn't send you to take a proctored exam(at an airfield like mine) like NASM and others, but you will walk away knowing more about fitness and training than any other cert. Of course, it depends on you to do the work. They also help you learn the business side of things. They have online support to answer business question as well as training and nutrition questions even after you are certified. If you want to own your own business I recommend them.
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    Originally Posted by Endevorforever View Post
    it doesn't send you to take a proctored exam(at an airfield like mine) like NASM and others, but you will walk away knowing more about fitness and training than any other cert.
    That is the boldest claim I have seen in a long time.

    Any exam that only requires a 75% pass rate for what is essentially a "TAKE HOME EXAM".....will never be considered as a serious qualification. What you have here is a trainer certified by ISSA, so obviously he supports them.
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    You have to understand the many different 'unintended' scenarios when implementing a 'take home exam' (something ISSA undoubtedly now understands after decades utilizing this format). Once they realize what they are and they fail to address them then they become 'intended'. Meaning, they don't care they only want the money. This is why ISSA is crap.

    One of those scenarios involves people getting certified who never took the exam. Here's how it works: You pay, you have your 'academically more talented' buddy take the exam on your behalf...he/she passes but they send the certificate to you under your name.
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    Originally Posted by RamsdenF View Post
    That is the boldest claim I have seen in a long time.

    Any exam that only requires a 75% pass rate for what is essentially a "TAKE HOME EXAM".....will never be considered as a serious qualification. What you have here is a trainer certified by ISSA, so obviously he supports them.
    If by "pass rate" you mean passing score, I thought it was more along the lines of 80% for the multiple choice/TF. The essays and mock clients are worth more points total than the multiple choice T/F stuff. I know NASM doesn't demand a very high score to pass for a proctored exam. I earned a cert from NASM and ISSA, so I believe I am in a unique position to critique both certs. It has been said many times on the forum that the cert doesn't really mean as much as the trainer knowing, and caring to know, how to do the job. ISSA will teach you more of what a trainer should know, if you study the material, better than some certs with a proctored exam.

    Originally Posted by Ronin4help View Post
    You have to understand the many different 'unintended' scenarios when implementing a 'take home exam' (something ISSA undoubtedly now understands after decades utilizing this format). Once they realize what they are and they fail to address them then they become 'intended'. Meaning, they don't care they only want the money. This is why ISSA is crap.

    One of those scenarios involves people getting certified who never took the exam. Here's how it works: You pay, you have your 'academically more talented' buddy take the exam on your behalf...he/she passes but they send the certificate to you under your name.
    No offense Ronin but with the way education is going, you have to put a BA, BS, MA, etc to your list of crap certs too. There will always be people who cheated to get where they are. People even cheat proctored exams all the time. Google can bring you wikiHows with pictures and everything. Not even the medical field is exempt from unqualified cheaters. I know you've heard of fake doctors getting caught after years of "practice". I will give the OP the benefit of the doubt and assume he wants to earn his cert. Else, why would he even bother comparing them?
    Last edited by Endevorforever; 04-29-2015 at 01:29 AM.
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    Originally Posted by Endevorforever View Post
    If by "pass rate" you mean passing score, I thought it was more along the lines of 80% for the multiple choice/TF. The essays and mock clients are worth more points total than the multiple choice T/F stuff. I know NASM doesn't demand a very high score to pass for a proctored exam. I earned a cert from NASM and ISSA, so I believe I am in a unique position to critique both certs. It has been said many times on the forum that the cert doesn't really mean as much as the trainer knowing, and caring to know, how to do the job. ISSA will teach you more of what a trainer should know, if you study the material, better than some certs with a proctored exam.



    No offense Ronin but with the way education is going, you have to put a BA, BS, MA, etc to your list of crap certs too. There will always be people who cheated to get where they are. People even cheat proctored exams all the time. Google can bring you wikiHows with pictures and everything. Not even the medical field is exempt from unqualified cheaters. I know you've heard of fake doctors getting caught after years of "practice". I will give the OP the benefit of the doubt and assume he wants to earn his cert. Else, why would he even bother comparing them?
    All true. However, the real question is why consider a sub par cert when there are certs that are more respected? There are only two reasons I can think of:
    1) The idea that one could more easily 'pass' because answers can be freely researched during exam administration with no risk of being labeled a cheat.
    2) Less expensive.

    Now ask yourself what those who are enticed by these reasons would do if these types of certs were not options? They would have no choice but to take the harder exam (some would pass and some would rightfully fail). The serious ones who could not afford the pricier cert would save their money (remember the good old days when people saved their money to earn the things they wanted). The others (now this is the key...) would go away and try some other short cut in some other industry (probably finance or mobile detailing or something). In short, if ISSA and NESTA were not options, we would have fewer under-qualified trainers. There would always be some losers but the industry could do itself a favor by implementing some basic codes of ethics like the collegiate industry.

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    Originally Posted by Ronin4help View Post
    All true. However, the real question is why consider a sub par cert when there are certs that are more respected? There are only two reasons I can think of:
    1) The idea that one could more easily 'pass' because answers can be freely researched during exam administration with no risk of being labeled a cheat.
    2) Less expensive.

    Now ask yourself what those who are enticed by these reasons would do if these types of certs were not options? They would have no choice but to take the harder exam (some would pass and some would rightfully fail). The serious ones who could not afford the pricier cert would save their money (remember the good old days when people saved their money to earn the things they wanted). The others (now this is the key...) would go away and try some other short cut in some other industry (probably finance or mobile detailing or something). In short, if ISSA and NESTA were not options, we would have fewer under-qualified trainers. There would always be some losers but the industry could do itself a favor by implementing some basic codes of ethics like the collegiate industry.

    Help preserve the integrity of your profession or the hacks will come in and destroy it.
    Amen.

    The change must happen from within. Every time you recommend a sub par cert you do more harm to this industry. We should focus on demanding nothing but the best from fitness professionals.
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    Originally Posted by Ronin4help View Post
    All true. However, the real question is why consider a sub par cert when there are certs that are more respected? There are only two reasons I can think of:
    1) The idea that one could more easily 'pass' because answers can be freely researched during exam administration with no risk of being labeled a cheat.
    2) Less expensive.

    Now ask yourself what those who are enticed by these reasons would do if these types of certs were not options? They would have no choice but to take the harder exam (some would pass and some would rightfully fail). The serious ones who could not afford the pricier cert would save their money (remember the good old days when people saved their money to earn the things they wanted). The others (now this is the key...) would go away and try some other short cut in some other industry (probably finance or mobile detailing or something). In short, if ISSA and NESTA were not options, we would have fewer under-qualified trainers. There would always be some losers but the industry could do itself a favor by implementing some basic codes of ethics like the collegiate industry.

    Help preserve the integrity of your profession or the hacks will come in and destroy it.
    First, who are all these unqualified trainers you are talking about? If it is commercial gym trainers, then you should target the big certs because, that is who the gym wants first(especially NASM. See below). Second, NCCA is not recognized by the U.S. Department of Education to grant accreditation. ISSA is. Because of this, the military will pay for it. So the OP could be military and want to get his cert through them like many ISSA trainers. ISSA is respected and accepted because, the trainers from ISSA know their stuff. The sad part is, some trainers pass the proctored exam with flying colors, but they still can't train because all they have are facts, without understanding of application. Sometimes the "why" is missing.

    So you are saying that in order for a cert to not be sub par, it must have a proctored exam? NESTA is a proctored exam. So why is it sub par to you? Because it is not a big name? I will tell you that NASM had a partnership with the largest commercial gyms in the USA. (Its how they can guarantee a job at a commercial gym FYI). That is probably why they are so respected. So because they are connected like that, does that make them the best cert? Tough exam /= great trainer. Better /= always more expensive.
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    Try to quit being a mouthpiece for ISSA and use the rational part of your brain.
    Originally Posted by Endevorforever View Post
    First, who are all these unqualified trainers you are talking about?
    If one has to ask.....one should wonder if he/she is within the group in question. This is a pretty blatantly obvious issue.
    If it is commercial gym trainers, then you should target the big certs because, that is who the gym wants first(especially NASM. See below).
    I don't care about NASM. We are talking about ISSA. I have my issues with NASM, but they still are widely recognized. It is better than ISSA.
    ISSA is respected and accepted because, the trainers from ISSA know their stuff.
    Excellent evidence. Outstanding testimony based in fact huh?

    You are a joke. Nothing but a mouthpiece for a crap cert. ISSA is neither respected or accepted. And all ISSA trainers know their stuff soooooo well, that they have to have an open book exam.
    So you are saying that in order for a cert to not be sub par it must have a proctored exam?
    Its a good start. There are many factors but this atleast rules out the ability to google every answer.
    Tough exam /= great trainer.
    This right here.......is one of the major issues in our industry. You are discouraging education. Time and time again a GOOD SOLID EDUCATION gets SLAMMED. Why? I'm guessing envy and jealousy. Somebody has something that you do not. So therefore you slam someone for their success and achievement.

    WE NEED TOUGHER EXAMS NOT EASIER YOU JERK. We already have a low entry barrier to this field. And you want to make it even easier.
    Better /= always more expensive.
    Finally, a rational point.
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    Originally Posted by RamsdenF View Post
    Try to quit being a mouthpiece for ISSA and use the rational part of your brain.

    If one has to ask.....one should wonder if he/she is within the group in question. This is a pretty blatantly obvious issue.

    I don't care about NASM. We are talking about ISSA. I have my issues with NASM, but they still are widely recognized. It is better than ISSA.

    Excellent evidence. Outstanding testimony based in fact huh?

    You are a joke. Nothing but a mouthpiece for a crap cert. ISSA is neither respected or accepted. And all ISSA trainers know their stuff soooooo well, that they have to have an open book exam.

    Its a good start. There are many factors but this atleast rules out the ability to google every answer.

    This right here.......is one of the major issues in our industry. You are discouraging education. Time and time again a GOOD SOLID EDUCATION gets SLAMMED. Why? I'm guessing envy and jealousy. Somebody has something that you do not. So therefore you slam someone for their success and achievement.

    WE NEED TOUGHER EXAMS NOT EASIER YOU JERK. We already have a low entry barrier to this field. And you want to make it even easier.

    Finally, a rational point.
    I have been objective and stated fact after fact to answer the OP's question and put to shame you and your ignorance. All you have done is spew rhetoric and silliness. Toughness of the exam is a matter of personal taste as no exam is truly tough if you know the material. NASM is used as an example because, it has the proctored exam by which you are judging ISSA. So it is relevant. The "ISSA trainers know their stuff" comment is based on testimony from another trainer not certified by ISSA. Testing is not teaching. If you had to teach 100 students calculus and your life depended on them knowing it, would you just give them a bunch of test or would you make sure they had practical grasp of the information? I am saying ISSA's test might not be the pinnacle of testing methods according to some, but they have very solid information. They have this solid information because, they compiled research from the well respected ACSM and other research organizations, along with their own. So if they use solid info like ACSM(who is tied in my book with NSCA), you are getting quality info. It is sad that you have such a strong stance on one of the most minuscule parts of the profession. You get a cert to get the job, you keep learning to provide the best service. Try to be more objective.

    Oh and you can google answers for proctored exams. Just look at how many threads are on this site for NASM study guides and test questions.
    Last edited by Endevorforever; 04-29-2015 at 04:38 PM.
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    It doesn't matter how great the material is. You are focused on the wrong component. ISSA cannot verify they are providing certificates to the people who took the exam. They can only know that they are providing certificates to the name on the sales order form. The name itself could be fake for that matter.

    Seriously, what is that? Is this really what you are so proud of?

    The manner and the associated premise in which you are provided the credential are the problem, not the material provided.
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    ... NESTA sucks because they were created for monetary ambitions only. At the time this company was created, there were several accepted certifications on the market. The ONLY time you should enter a marketplace is for the sole purpose of providing something the market is lacking or to improve on what is out there. This grows the marketplace in a positive way. NESTA did neither. It only added to the problem by lowering the bar. It made it easier to become a certified personal trainer by making it cheaper and by extending the validity expiration.

    Also, when they first came out, they were an at home exam. They later found that this was a problem to their credibility so they partnered with a third party proctor. This is a very inexpensive way to have your exams proctored because the third party proctor proctors tons of different exams for different industries. You can do this yourself and pay a nominal fee. Its a tricky way to say your exam is 'proctored'. The actual 'proctor' however could care less if your cheating during exam administration. He is making his ten dollars an hour and gets paid either way.

    I can go on and on. Simply ask me another question relating to why these programs suck and I'll provide many more well thought out reasons.
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    Originally Posted by Ronin4help View Post
    It doesn't matter how great the material is. You are focused on the wrong component. ISSA cannot verify they are providing certificates to the people who took the exam. They can only know that they are providing certificates to the name on the sales order form. The name itself could be fake for that matter.

    Seriously, what is that? Is this really what you are so proud of?

    The manner and the associated premise in which you are provided the credential are the problem, not the material provided.
    Actually I answered the OP's question which was, based on the quality of the material. I shared my experience and then you came in with your opinion(which you have rights to). Then you proceeded to bring up your arguments to me about how flawed distance education is. Obviously, I have nothing against distance education. Its a cert not a degree(many of both types are available through distance education). If you want to debate the validity of distance education, take it up with the US department of education and the powers that be, otherwise stay on topic.
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    Originally Posted by Endevorforever View Post
    Actually I answered the OP's question which was, based on the quality of the material. I shared my experience and then you came in with your opinion(which you have rights to). Then you proceeded to bring up your arguments to me about how flawed distance education is. Obviously, I have nothing against distance education. Its a cert not a degree(many of both types are available through distance education). If you want to debate the validity of distance education, take it up with the US department of education and the powers that be, otherwise stay on topic.
    The topic is ISSA or NESTA. The answer is neither. They both suck.

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    Just thought I'd add my opinion.
    I took reps in the UK. It was something like 12 weeks in house/facility study and classes and a few thousand £ to take.
    It was sit down exams for both nutrition and training. More than 3.

    I then came to the US and go figure... Was not accepted. I had to get certified quick, so chose ISSA.

    You know what? Although certainly not as in depth as in house study for 12 weeks, I felt I was relearning most of which I already knew. The format was similar and I felt it was an effective program and made a lot of sense.

    Yes, the online aspect is suspect and is laughable its recognized over my REPS certification (which makes Nasm and the like look like toilet paper to wipe ass with)... But I felt it was a good certificate.

    I ended up passing with a 90 something percent.

    I worked at golds gym Venice based on experience and not my certificate (I have over 10 years)


    So... It's my opinion that most US certificates mean jack. In fact, most anywhere... I'll take he guy with ISSa over a guy fresh out of college with a degree if he has trained for years and knows how to treat clients and actually be a 'personal and professional' trainer.
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    Critically acclaimed statements never begin like this...'I had to get certified quick, so chose ISSA.'

    It's like saying, 'I was starving so I had to get some food quick... went to Taco Bell. Their food is pretty good.'

    Nothing acquired quickly or fast is any good. Absolutely nothing.
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    Originally Posted by JamerJay View Post
    So... It's my opinion that most US certificates mean jack. In fact, most anywhere... I'll take he guy with ISSa over a guy fresh out of college with a degree if he has trained for years and knows how to treat clients and actually be a 'personal and professional' trainer.
    I'd like to challenge something you said, if you'd be up for it.

    Why exactly would you take someone with a certification (like you said, they don't mean anything) with some years of experience over a college graduate in an exercise related field? From a business owners perspective, why would you not want a young, intelligent, essentially a "blank slate" that you could mentor and groom?

    I, personally find "years of experience" overrated. As Tim Ferriss (I think) put it.....it's not 10 years of job experience. It's one year of job experience doing the same ****ty work year after year.
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    Originally Posted by Ronin4help View Post
    Critically acclaimed statements never begin like this...'I had to get certified quick, so chose ISSA.'

    It's like saying, 'I was starving so I had to get some food quick... went to Taco Bell. Their food is pretty good.'

    Nothing acquired quickly or fast is any good. Absolutely nothing.
    Very good and rational point Ronin.
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    Originally Posted by RamsdenF View Post
    I'd like to challenge something you said, if you'd be up for it.

    Why exactly would you take someone with a certification (like you said, they don't mean anything) with some years of experience over a college graduate in an exercise related field? From a business owners perspective, why would you not want a young, intelligent, essentially a "blank slate" that you could mentor and groom?

    I, personally find "years of experience" overrated. As Tim Ferriss (I think) put it.....it's not 10 years of job experience. It's one year of job experience doing the same ****ty work year after year.
    because, at times, I have see those blank slates fail in the business side of the game.

    I am not suggesting higher education or in class exam certifications are not better than a certification process done online.. What I am saying is that I would hire the person with the experience and the knowledge of successfully bringing in clients, retaining those clients, providing fantastic training.. With a fantastic personality.


    Who says the experience is working the same &)&" work (as you call it).

    Most non commercial gyms I have trained independent clients want to see how I train clients, how long I have been doing it, how I bring in clients, etc...
    The type of certification has rarely mattered. Only that I have insurance and I have experience and know how to train.
    They kick out most fresh out of school trainers that are training clients who want to simply gain lean muscle or Lose fat by sticking them on a bosu with a kettle bell or doing some random crap on a Trx.


    also, when I said I needed a certification in the US quickly.. Please note I said that because I had just previously been working for and gotten certified under the register exercise professionals of Europe for half that year combining trainer, nutrition, and massage therapist. Many exams and a lot of money.

    Issa would have taken a lot more time and study had I not already had a good background in anatomy and training for 6 years prior (10 years training now, 15 working out) and also having just gotten certified in the UK.

    I am not saying that ISSA is a glorious certification... But from a business and financial point of view .. Why would you want to spend your life working for a chain gym or small gym anyway? You won't make any real money... Regardless of it being A high end gym in a big city or 24 hours in friggin' inglewood.

    It is certainly not going to hurt getting these certifications. It tells people you are legally able to work. Certified, first aid trained and, hopefully, insured.

    You can get a foot in the door with a money machine of clients like Equinox, you can work at a David Barton's or a golds, most gyms.

    Once those chain gyms start paying you, take seminars, lectures, etc.

    Some gyms have continued education where they bring in experts for on site seminars. I had a great one with kettlebell expert pavel tsatsouline without paying a dime.

    The only way you will make money as a trainer is by working for yourself.

    OP, you may not have the time to go back to school, or finances.. Etc
    So then pick a certification you can afford. Nests or Issa? Cool. Just make sure the gyms you're looking at accept them (most do).

    Read, learn, workout, learn some more.

    If it's your passion and you keep at it, the certification won't hold you back. It won't define you. Get experience. Learn from the best. Get experience and start thinking long term - independent.

    You can get a different cert later, if you wish.

    Read up and ask questions from successful trainers on building business, learn to be a good people person, learn to get a long with ALL personalities and walks of life (you would be surprised just how many trainers have bad personalities or cannot develop a professional relationship with clients) develop your training, make yourself a walking advertisement along side all of this.

    Keep your head up OP and much successful to ramsden for his business. nothing but respect.

    The other posters aren't wrong in suggesting that a degree is a huge help but please don't think it will hold you back from becoming a successful business owner when it comes to training.
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    JJ- Good response brother.
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    Originally Posted by copypaste View Post
    Both of these have a lot of online study which I like.

    What would you say between the two?

    Which has better learning material (I believe NESTA's material is all digital)?
    I studied with Issa my first CFT and I liked it. So professional, great support and good book about the basics of training, nurition and supplements.
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    Originally Posted by Ronin4help View Post
    You have to understand the many different 'unintended' scenarios when implementing a 'take home exam' (something ISSA undoubtedly now understands after decades utilizing this format). Once they realize what they are and they fail to address them then they become 'intended'. Meaning, they don't care they only want the money. This is why ISSA is crap.

    One of those scenarios involves people getting certified who never took the exam. Here's how it works: You pay, you have your 'academically more talented' buddy take the exam on your behalf...he/she passes but they send the certificate to you under your name.
    WOW! I never thought of that. Excellent point. They don't know who took the exam.
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    Originally Posted by copypaste View Post
    And someone with an attitude like yours gets the job, right? figures.

    Not only does your egotism teem from the few sentences you can form here, but you set yourself up to be some sort of "expert" or "scientist" on your website with no credible research. Not to mention you have no authority to make the dietary suggestions you do, unless you have an RD after your name.

    If your website is any indication of how you instruct your clients, not only are you doing them a disservice, it's downright dangerous.
    The man gave you an honest answer that you didn't like and you attack him. You don't have what it takes to be a PT with that attitude. try another field.
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