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  1. #1951
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    20lbs*5



    ROM looking better?


    and holy **** at how easy erick made that 585 look
    Last edited by themonkay; 11-15-2014 at 03:46 PM.
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  2. #1952
    Registered User cls91's Avatar
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    ^ much
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  3. #1953
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by cls91 View Post
    ^ much
    Awesome!

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  4. #1954
    F00D BR4H ErikTheElectric's Avatar
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    ^^ Hngggh

    Looks solid monkay (you make it look so easy).
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  5. #1955
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ErikTheElectric View Post
    ^^ Hngggh

    Looks solid monkay (you make it look so easy).
    Thx! I'm happy perpetualmotion called me out on it. Definitely felt lats working more as I got up higher. Still not sure if I see any point in dead hanging though lol
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  6. #1956
    Registered User cls91's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by themonkay View Post
    Thx! I'm happy perpetualmotion called me out on it. Definitely felt lats working more as I got up higher. Still not sure if I see any point in dead hanging though lol

    Tbh I feel it a lot more in my lats when I dead hang, pause for a second, and then do the next rep. That's how I always do them now.

    Haven't done weighted for a while but I tried today and hit 35lbs for 3 sets of 5 after a bunch of lower weight sets. New goal will be 45lbs for a set of 10.
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  7. #1957
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by cls91 View Post
    Tbh I feel it a lot more in my lats when I dead hang, pause for a second, and then do the next rep. That's how I always do them now.

    Haven't done weighted for a while but I tried today and hit 35lbs for 3 sets of 5 after a bunch of lower weight sets. New goal will be 45lbs for a set of 10.
    Its not that I don't think the lats aren't working in a dead hang. Its more about finding a balance between ROM and reps. Going to a dead hang will undoubtedly be more difficult, but is the amount of reps being sacrificed worth it from a hypertrophy standpoint? As an analogy, think of tng deadlifts vs dead stop.
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  8. #1958
    Registered User cls91's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by themonkay View Post
    Its not that I don't think the lats aren't working in a dead hang. Its more about finding a balance between ROM and reps. Going to a dead hang will undoubtedly be more difficult, but is the amount of reps being sacrificed worth it from a hypertrophy standpoint? As an analogy, think of tng deadlifts vs dead stop.

    I dead stop

    I get you though; do whatever you prefer... for me, I find going dead hang is worth the tradeoff; I don't feel like it limits my rep count by much, and definitely not enough to compensate for the greater ROM and isolation of the lats that I feel by doing so.
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  9. #1959
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by cls91 View Post
    I dead stop

    I get you though; do whatever you prefer... for me, I find going dead hang is worth the tradeoff; I don't feel like it limits my rep count by much, and definitely not enough to compensate for the greater ROM and isolation of the lats that I feel by doing so.
    I've been doing dead stop lately, but that's primarily because my whole small injury. TNG irritates it more. Generally I'll have one day where I do dead stop (power work) and another day for tng (hypertrophy work).
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  10. #1960
    Registered User cls91's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by themonkay View Post
    I've been doing dead stop lately, but that's primarily because my whole small injury. TNG irritates it more. Generally I'll have one day where I do dead stop (power work) and another day for tng (hypertrophy work).

    I've been doing neither recently, primarily because of my small injury. Month off all lower (including deads), and then I'll be on vacation for 2 weeks where I'll have a gym, but no proper equipment, so it will end up being closer to 2 months off.

    It's sad going to the gym and having a bro split and watching everyone else squat and dead
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  11. #1961
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    this DUP bandwaggon thing is getting on my nerves

    inb4 shut up you hipster
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  12. #1962
    lagging quads connorpat1995's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by themonkay View Post
    this DUP bandwaggon thing is getting on my nerves
    Dat 98%
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    nothing but the basics
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  13. #1963
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by connorpat1995 View Post
    Dat 98%
    Problem is my join date....

    I'm starting to feel like I've seen all the trends, and its starting to go full circle.
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  14. #1964
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    Originally Posted by themonkay View Post
    this DUP bandwaggon thing is getting on my nerves

    inb4 shut up you hipster
    Don't mind him, he's just having a little monkay tantrum
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  15. #1965
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    Originally Posted by themonkay View Post
    this DUP bandwaggon thing is getting on my nerves

    inb4 shut up you hipster
    I feel you.
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  16. #1966
    "showtime a-holes" DAaaMan64's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by themonkay View Post
    Problem is my join date....

    I'm starting to feel like I've seen all the trends, and its starting to go full circle.
    Can you summarize how we've come full circle? (I don't doubt it...)


    DUP's popularity seems to have all stemmed from this study. Show that Linear Periodization vs Undulating in equal level trainees got better gainz on undulation.
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  17. #1967
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    Didn't get the 190 x 5 bench that I wanted today, but managed to get the 80s up for four reps. Which made me think that it wasn't a completely mediocre session.. just going to have to keep trying.



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  18. #1968
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    what are your guys' thoughts? i'm still trying to get comfortable with this lift, thanks.
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  19. #1969
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DAaaMan64 View Post
    Can you summarize how we've come full circle? (I don't doubt it...)


    DUP's popularity seems to have all stemmed from this study. Show that Linear Periodization vs Undulating in equal level trainees got better gainz on undulation.
    Full circle because it seems like every 6-12 months people are on a high about a new training protocol. When I joined this forum, a lot of people were into the typical splits (usually upper lower, or ppl). Going below 5 reps with a hypertrophy goal was blasphemy. Then, all of a sudden, the 531 craze happened. It was now acceptable to test your 1rm, even if your primarily lifting for physique goals. Madcows, TM, and everyone's spinoff version of them became popular. This pseudo-power building stuff eventually led to everyone wanting to compete in powerlifting....Then came the whole aesthetics movement: PPL, Upper Lower, PHAT, bro splits, etc. Somewhere a little after that everyone becomes a mobility guru, and they end up spending more time in the gym humping a foam roller and 10 fukin different styrofoam balls rather than actually lifting....but they will tell your they are a strength athlete. This DUP to me is just another version of the powerlifting craze.

    ...Again, I guarantee my summary above is all out of order and occurred in a different way to many other people's minds, but if you look at the big picture of what I described, I think most would agree.

    I do not think DUP is bad at all. In fact, I do believe it is a superior method of training. I just think "DUP" is a great way to overcomplicate a relatively simple concept that a monkey could understand (strong username to post content ratio).

    Consider this: I first heard of DUP 2 years ago from the N'misc Voldemort on his first channel lol.

    All DUP is saying is that you should be applying different training methods in order to reach your goal.........Well no shyt fuktard. Who the hell makes any gains (strength or hypertrophy) working in one rep range forever? This is like when Bros would debate against IIFYM (before that term got shredded to shyt) by asking if you can reach your macros with table sugar, olive oil, and whey.

    What irritates me even more is that DUP took a simple concept, made it sound sexy, but dumbed it down so much that people think it applies only to reps. 531 BBB protocol...is that not a form of DUP? Sure, the 5x10 sets are not the primary focus in your progression, but you do still want that to increase over time regardless. How about Madcows or TM? For squats you use a heavy 5x5 one day, a light 2-5 sets of 5 the next lifting day, and a heavy near max set on the third day. With Madcows you even throw in a set of 8 to stimulate further hypertrophy.

    Any program that has shown success for intermediate and advanced lifters, and wasn't constructed by a retard, employs some form of DUP.

    So yah...not hating on whoever coined the term, just getting irritated with the bandwaggoners acting like DUP is some new phenomenon.
    #hipster


    The study you posted was an interesting read. Funny it is from 2002. I can't put much faith in it though. They were measuring bench press. Sure, that sounds great initially from our perspective, but there's a reason most hypertrophy studies use leg extensions. People's techniques on bench press vary greatly, and that varies how everyone accumulates fatigue. Plus, reading it almost makes it seem like they set the LP group up to fail. BRB trying to get stronger attempting an 8rm on bench 3 days a week for 4 weeks straight. lol
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  20. #1970
    "showtime a-holes" DAaaMan64's Avatar
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    reps for life monkay. awesome post
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  21. #1971
    Registered User JHarden's Avatar
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    @monkay - I totally agree. DUP has become a buzzword and even a hashtag on Instagram and Twitter. The thing is, DUP isn't a protocol. It's simply a way of organizing training, but it can't be the only way structure your programming. You have to have some undulation and some linearity. You can change the rep range and intensity during the week (DUP) but you have to increase the weight eventually in order to progress (linearity). Even Mike Zourdos, who kinda started this whole thing, has said this on Lane's podcast.

    Mike Israetel really summed this up the best in his series of articles for Juggernaut. Anyone who is interested in reading further can see http://www.jtsstrength.com/articles/...initive-guide/
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  22. #1972
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DAaaMan64 View Post
    reps for life monkay. awesome post
    Always on spread with you. You know the right buttons to push with these topics to get me going lol

    Originally Posted by JHarden View Post
    @monkay - I totally agree. DUP has become a buzzword and even a hashtag on Instagram and Twitter. The thing is, DUP isn't a protocol. It's simply a way of organizing training, but it can't be the only way structure your programming. You have to have some undulation and some linearity. You can change the rep range and intensity during the week (DUP) but you have to increase the weight eventually in order to progress (linearity). Even Mike Zourdos, who kinda started this whole thing, has said this on Lane's podcast.

    Mike Israetel really summed this up the best in his series of articles for Juggernaut. Anyone who is interested in reading further can see http://www.jtsstrength.com/articles/...initive-guide/
    Agreed, its a structure not a protocol. What I fear, is that like always, people will take DUP to the extreme, and almost entirely neglect the linearity aspect of it. I know it seems foolish, but I really wouldn't doubt the plausibility.

    Thx for the link. Will check it out
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  23. #1973
    Registered User Siobahn's Avatar
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    Monkay, your comment just made me like "stfu go and lift" and actually had a pr deadlift. Thanks!
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  24. #1974
    100% Delirious themonkay's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Siobahn View Post
    Monkay, your comment just made me like "stfu go and lift" and actually had a pr deadlift. Thanks!
    Haha awesome!
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  25. #1975
    F00D BR4H ErikTheElectric's Avatar
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    Hit 260lbs... 5x5 today. Pretty happy with +5lbs. Not looking to jump 10-15lbs per week, like I did last time and potentially injure myself. Really liking the 5x5 work, but it's pretty taxing.. especially after 15,000 ft of climbing. Will probably cut it to 3x5

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  26. #1976
    I'm VitaminVendetta PerpetualMotion's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by themonkay View Post
    531 BBB protocol...is that not a form of DUP? SHow about Madcows or TM?
    None of those are DUP, though. Those are really more basic linear periodization.

    I agree with the overall theme of your post. People just have to find what's good for them. I never really did well on linear periodization, even as a beginner. It's when I stopped listening to generalized advice that I made most of my progress. Everyone has their own thing. And the research behind DUP is meh. There's no research that states one kind of training is best. If anything, block may come out with the slightest edge, but, really, it's all equal.
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  27. #1977
    Registered User rgauthier20420's Avatar
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    Hey guys, monkay told me to post a question regarding my proposed routine in this thread for additional critiques and advice. Be gentle.

    The original goal was to do a full body 3 x week. But, with my lunch schedule only being 35 minutes in the gym, I'm restricted and can't do what I want in that time frame. So, I'm breaking up a full body workout into 2 days and doing that 2 x week. Essentially, I'm wanting to do Monday (Legs, Chest, Triceps), Tuesday (Back, Biceps, Shoulders), Wed (off), Thu (same as Monday), Friday (same as Tuesday), Sat/Sun (off). This is a rep to fail type program (with good form and a spot on all big lifts). I don't plan on hurting myself, but I intend to push myself hard.

    Here's the full routine:

    Monday/Thursday:
    Squat: 2 x 8-12
    Calf Raise: 2 x 8-12
    Bench: 2 x 8-12
    Incline DB Fly: 2 x 8-12
    Tricep Extensions: 2 x 8-12
    Reverse Tricep Pull Down: 2 x 8-12

    Tuesday/Wed:
    Dead Lifts: 2 x 8-12
    OHP: 2 x 8-12
    Lateral Shoulder Raise: 2 x 8-12
    Standing Barbell Curl: 2 x 8-12
    Preacher Curl: 2 x 8-12
    Seated/Bent Over Row: 2 x 8-12
    Back Flys: 2 x 8-12
    Shrugs: 2 x 8-12

    The progression plan is this. If I can get more than 12 reps on the 1st set, add 5 lbs more. I would continue this until I can get more than 12 reps at the new weight, then add another 5 lbs to the lift. The 2nd set of each lift is a 10% drop from the 1st. There would be no de-load with this plan because of the rep range that's included. I'm looking at this as a 10 week program looking to build size and strength (mainly size). The lifting scheme is sort of built at Mark's THT program.

    Current stats are:
    Bench: 155 x 10
    Squat: 195 x 12
    DL: 135 x 12

    These are sort of from memory.

    Thanks!
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  28. #1978
    lagging quads connorpat1995's Avatar
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    too much overlap, too much fluff for a short routine.

    here's a simplified push/pull:

    Push

    Pull


    OHP

    Deadlift or DL variant

    squat or front squat

    chins

    bench

    seated row

    tipcep/lat raises superset

    curls/rear delt superset



    that's the best I can do to create an evenly spread out 2-day split. 2 sets for everything, 1 set for deadlifts if it beats you up
    OHP is ahead of squats because it would eat into your bench too much otherwise

    I'd advise progression through reps. Start with 5 and add a rep each time until you hit 8, then add 5lb (10 for squat and DL) and start over again. If you fail to hit the required reps, take 5lb off the bar.
    Last edited by connorpat1995; 11-19-2014 at 02:34 PM.
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  29. #1979
    Lifting Vicariously Domicron's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by rgauthier20420 View Post
    Hey guys, monkay told me to post a question regarding my proposed routine in this thread for additional critiques and advice. Be gentle.

    The original goal was to do a full body 3 x week. But, with my lunch schedule only being 35 minutes in the gym, I'm restricted and can't do what I want in that time frame. So, I'm breaking up a full body workout into 2 days and doing that 2 x week. Essentially, I'm wanting to do Monday (Legs, Chest, Triceps), Tuesday (Back, Biceps, Shoulders), Wed (off), Thu (same as Monday), Friday (same as Tuesday), Sat/Sun (off). This is a rep to fail type program (with good form and a spot on all big lifts). I don't plan on hurting myself, but I intend to push myself hard.
    i mean, 5/3/1 is 4 lifts per week and you could just squeeze in whatever accessory work you have time for...maybe that's an idea?

    also, i'm guessing from the lack of replies that my sumo deadlifts are 100% perfect and there's zero room for improvement, right?
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  30. #1980
    F00D BR4H ErikTheElectric's Avatar
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    Deads from today.. was pretty dissapointed to not hit another new 5RM. (Would've been 385 x 5).

    Got four reps, felt like I could've gotten 5 if I was fresh. Yesterday was definitely the most taxing day in ages. There's always next week I guess.

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    385 x 4 (+5lbs)
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