Belts - A Comprehensive Guide

[ferrychristian]

Hi,
Informative thread. I am a weightlifter and I use weightlifting belt. Its prevent injury to the low back during heavy lifts and can increase performance.
Thanks!!

[buddy0329]

Thanks cmarti063,

I've never lifted with a belt before but because of your thread I ordered my first one: Athlete belt from Best Belts.

[cmarti063]

Thanks cmarti063,

I've never lifted with a belt before but because of your thread I ordered my first one: Athlete belt from Best Belts.

Awesome, you made a great choice! Now you just have to patiently await it's arrival!

[BYOBB]

Does anyone know how the "Texas Belts" that Titan sells compares to leather belts like those sold by Pioneer? A search for "longhorn belts" results in reviews for the suede versions rather than the oiled leather versions.

http://www.andersonpowerlifting.com/...-prng-belt.htm

And has anyone tried the "hair on hide" belts before? I can no longer find them on Titan's site though they do post them on social media occasionally. What are the chances a material like this lasts long term? It's definitely a cool unique look but I wouldn't want to develop a receding hairline on my belt after a year
https://www.instagram.com/p/BFMWa1wJkHk/



It looks like Pioneer sells the same style belt
https://www.instagram.com/p/BHQq6jrg...by=pioneer_fit

[vitinhoamorim1]

Is there any advantage in using a belt with a different thickness (about 5mm in the front, 8-9mm in the sides and 13mm in the back) instead of a 10 or 13mm belt?
this would be the belt. loja.hpower. net .br/images/stories/cintos/super-treze-montado-design-medidas-300.jpg

[BackI00]

Cmarti thanks for the reviews and effort put into this thread. I'm looking to purchase a belt again (previously had an inzer lever) and your most recent treated and dyed pioneer belt is so beautiful I may look into getting a similar setup.

My only question is would you suggest a 10 or 13mm. I know it's a broad question but I don't see the 10mm treated option on their site, and with the comfortable broken in feel I wasnt sure if you would be quick to suggest the 13.

On the other hand without the suede I figured the 10 would be closer to the actual leather thickness of most 13mm belts.

Hopefully you can shed some advice and thanks again for the great thread.

[KoolDJVader]

Cmarti thanks for the reviews and effort put into this thread. I'm looking to purchase a belt again (previously had an inzer lever) and your most recent treated and dyed pioneer belt is so beautiful I may look into getting a similar setup.

My only question is would you suggest a 10 or 13mm. I know it's a broad question but I don't see the 10mm treated option on their site, and with the comfortable broken in feel I wasnt sure if you would be quick to suggest the 13.

You can get a 10mm treated, I actually ordered one. I never got it though... long story as to why that order went awry (totally my stupid mistake). When I inquired as to whether a 10mm treated could be ordered, what Matt told me to do was order the 13mm treated but put in the comment box that you want it to be 10mm instead.

[KoolDJVader]

Is there any advantage in using a belt with a different thickness (about 5mm in the front, 8-9mm in the sides and 13mm in the back) instead of a 10 or 13mm belt?
this would be the belt. loja.hpower. net .br/images/stories/cintos/super-treze-montado-design-medidas-300.jpg

I don't think it would have any advantage (well maybe comfort but not support). You want it to be thick in the front because you have to brace your abs against it and the thicker it is, the harder you can brace which would equal more support. Cardillo makes a belt that is tapered on the side so it won't dig into your ribs but the thickness is the same on the front and back. Personally I think even that is unnecessary because if you get a quality belt, the leather should break in to the point it wouldn't be that uncomfortable.

[PtReyesGreg]

Does anyone know how the "Texas Belts" that Titan sells compares to leather belts like those sold by Pioneer? A search for "longhorn belts" results in reviews for the suede versions rather than the oiled leather versions.

http://www.andersonpowerlifting.com/...-prng-belt.htm

I have the oiled buffalo version of that Titan Longhorn belt and ordered it from Anderson about 6 months ago. It is a great belt. I also have the 6.5mm treated leather EliteFTS belt which I believe is made by Pioneer. I have had it for a couple of years. The Elite belt is good but the Titan belt is in another league IMO. It is 10 mm and the extra thickness gives me much better support on my squats and deadlifts. The oiled buffalo also has a very nice feel to it and I'm sure the oiled leather is very similar. It is much heavier duty than the Elite belt with better stitching and larger rivets. I was tempted to buy the 13mm oiled leather Brahma belt but it was out of stock when I was looking. After receiving the 10mm Longhorn, though, I realized I don't need the 13mm...the 10mm is very supportive and comfortable as well. For some reason those belts are not listed on the Titan website anymore but I would recommend ordering from Anderson anyway. They are much easier to deal with than dealing with Titan directly. I ordered my belt from Anderson (in Dallas) on a Friday at noon and had it at the Post Office by Monday evening (in California).

Here are some pics of the 2 belts so you can see how they compare visually (note the extra stitching and larger rivets on the Titan Longhorn):

[cmarti063]

Lots of great questions and discussion in here!

@byobb Titan makes a fine belt. I haven't used a hair-on-hide belt to be able to answer that question, unfortunately.

@Vitim, no there is no benefit to that. Vader has you sorted out.

@Back, the hand dyed/oiled belts are legit. If you wanted a 10mm treated belt, it will be 2 pieces of sole leather split to 5mm each and laminated together. That would be very similar support to a 13mm double suede belt, which is around 9-10mm of sole leather.

The Titan belt posted by Greg (good looking belt!) looks like the inside layer is suede, which means it should be roughly 8.5mm of support, which is again very similar to a 13mm double suede belt, and obviously more supportive than a 6.5mm belt (which is about the same as a 10mm double suede belt), but wouldn't be as supportive as a 10mm treated without any suede at all.

And yes, the EliteFTS belts are made by Pioneer. They've improved their manufacturing process a good bit since that one was made. Heck, even since my first review of them.

For the record, if you want more than a single row of stitching from Pioneer, all you have to do is request it. The belts are 100% customizable. Also, I think about 11mm of sole leather is where you reach diminishing returns on support.

[KoolDJVader]

There are a couple of issues I wonder about treated vs untreated belts.

Say you have a 10mm treated and untreated, since the treatment makes the leather a bit softer, will the untreated belt give more support?

Also, after some time has passed (say 6 months), will the untreated leather belt eventually get broken in to the same level as a treated belt or due to no oil being added to condition the leather, it will never quite get that broken in?

[cmarti063]

There are a couple of issues I wonder about treated vs untreated belts.

Say you have a 10mm treated and untreated, since the treatment makes the leather a bit softer, will the untreated belt give more support?

Also, after some time has passed (say 6 months), will the untreated leather belt eventually get broken in to the same level as a treated belt or due to no oil being added to condition the leather, it will never quite get that broken in?

Well I don't have a perfect apples-to-apples comparison, but I have a 13mm treated and a 13mm single suede (11mm untreated).

They both feel similar in support, but the treated belt is much more comfortable. The untreated will never be as broken in as the treated felt on day 1. The treated belt is comfortable and supportive while keeping the grain in tact. For an untreated to get this comfortable/broken in, you would have to roll and beat up an untreated belt, which tears the grain up and makes the belt less supportive.

Stiffer doesn't necessarily = support, but it can sometimes. An example, the camo material is stiffer than suede or even no laminated materials, but doesn't offer any more support, just makes the belt stiffer. However, if a belt is so soft it deforms when using it, it's not as supportive as a belt that doesn't deform.

I think I'm going to use my single suede on squats again now that my thigh rehab has me squatting decent numbers again, to see if the untreated/stiffer belt feels better than the treated belt now that I've spent some more time with the treated belt.

Either way, a 10mm treated or untreated plain leather belt is the same support as a 13mm suede belt. It should be about the same price as a 13mm plain leather though, with more support than a 10mm, so I don't know why you wouldn't just get that if you're looking for maximum support out of the belt.

[KoolDJVader]

Well I don't have a perfect apples-to-apples comparison, but I have a 13mm treated and a 13mm single suede (11mm untreated).

They both feel similar in support, but the treated belt is much more comfortable. The untreated will never be as broken in as the treated felt on day 1. The treated belt is comfortable and supportive while keeping the grain in tact. For an untreated to get this comfortable/broken in, you would have to roll and beat up an untreated belt, which tears the grain up and makes the belt less supportive.

Stiffer doesn't necessarily = support, but it can sometimes. An example, the camo material is stiffer than suede or even no laminated materials, but doesn't offer any more support, just makes the belt stiffer. However, if a belt is so soft it deforms when using it, it's not as supportive as a belt that doesn't deform.

I think I'm going to use my single suede on squats again now that my thigh rehab has me squatting decent numbers again, to see if the untreated/stiffer belt feels better than the treated belt now that I've spent some more time with the treated belt.

Either way, a 10mm treated or untreated plain leather belt is the same support as a 13mm suede belt. It should be about the same price as a 13mm plain leather though, with more support than a 10mm, so I don't know why you wouldn't just get that if you're looking for maximum support out of the belt.

Thanks, great info as usual.

I just used 10mm as an example because I have a double suede 13mm from Pioneer and it was fairly comfortable from almost day one (no manual breaking in other than the tongue area to.help put on/take off the belt). So basically just wondering since I don't think the suede belts are treated if my belt will ever get as broken in had the leather been treated and also if the support is the same or different had it been treated.

If I were to get another belt I would probably get the 13mm treated since it would be a different belt. Or a single side suede but maybe ask for the leather to get treated. I do want to try the Best Belt Prime Cut belt but I think that's basically the same belt as the 13mm double sided suede from Pioneer. Also would love to try a Bob's Belt as well but again if I get the 13mm from them, probably the same as the belt I have now. Don't think I can ever go back to a 10mm double suede as much as I loved The Athlete belt now that im so use to the thicker belt.

[BYOBB]

I have the oiled buffalo version of that Titan Longhorn belt and ordered it from Anderson about 6 months ago. It is a great belt. I also have the 6.5mm treated leather EliteFTS belt which I believe is made by Pioneer. I have had it for a couple of years. The Elite belt is good but the Titan belt is in another league IMO. It is 10 mm and the extra thickness gives me much better support on my squats and deadlifts. The oiled buffalo also has a very nice feel to it and I'm sure the oiled leather is very similar. It is much heavier duty than the Elite belt with better stitching and larger rivets. I was tempted to buy the 13mm oiled leather Brahma belt but it was out of stock when I was looking. After receiving the 10mm Longhorn, though, I realized I don't need the 13mm...the 10mm is very supportive and comfortable as well. For some reason those belts are not listed on the Titan website anymore but I would recommend ordering from Anderson anyway. They are much easier to deal with than dealing with Titan directly. I ordered my belt from Anderson (in Dallas) on a Friday at noon and had it at the Post Office by Monday evening (in California).

Here are some pics of the 2 belts so you can see how they compare visually (note the extra stitching and larger rivets on the Titan Longhorn):

Just what I was looking for! Is there a suede lining on the underside of the Titan? If so, is that common on all the treated leather belts or did you request it?

Lots of great questions and discussion in here!

@byobb Titan makes a fine belt. I haven't used a hair-on-hide belt to be able to answer that question, unfortunately.

Unfortunately the few people I've seen with those hairy belts on social media haven't had them long enough to give a long term review.

[cmarti063]

Or a single side suede but maybe ask for the leather to get treated.

To the best of my knowledge, treated belts can't have suede/condura/garment leather because, apparently, the adhesive doesn't stay adhered well between the surfaces.

After looking at the Titan belt, it appears the oiled belt linked above is only oiled on the surface for the cosmetic difference, just like Pioneer does the dyed belts.

[BYOBB]

To the best of my knowledge, treated belts can't have suede/condura/garment leather because, apparently, the adhesive doesn't stay adhered well between the surfaces.

After looking at the Titan belt, it appears the oiled belt linked above is only oiled on the surface for the cosmetic difference, just like Pioneer does the dyed belts.

What is the difference between treating and oiling leather in this context? I was under the impression that oiling is treating and provides a visual difference as well as water resistance and a more pliable feel.

[PtReyesGreg]

Just what I was looking for! Is there a suede lining on the underside of the Titan? If so, is that common on all the treated leather belts or did you request it?

It was what I was looking for too. I have been very happy with it. Actually I am tempted to buy the 13mm oiled leather belt too now that it is available although I don't really need it. The 10mm provides me very good support and is very comfortable.

There is a suede lining on the underside of the belt. It came that way and wasn't something I requested. You could probably call Titan and order one custom without that. I originally was going to order a custom belt but the lead time was several months so I just went with the standard belt from Anderson.

To the best of my knowledge, treated belts can't have suede/condura/garment leather because, apparently, the adhesive doesn't stay adhered well between the surfaces.

After looking at the Titan belt, it appears the oiled belt linked above is only oiled on the surface for the cosmetic difference, just like Pioneer does the dyed belts.

What is the difference between treating and oiling leather in this context? I was under the impression that oiling is treating and provides a visual difference as well as water resistance and a more pliable feel.

The oiled leather (or buffalo in my case) is on the outward facing portion of the belt. From the info I got from Titan it is done as a treatment for all of the reasons you mention (visual look, pliability, and water resistance) as well as to keep the leather from drying or cracking. The belts have a lifetime warranty and one of the things they mentioned was the recommendation to re-oil the belt every once in a while. The feel of the oiled leather is similar to an oiled baseball glove. Mine is about ready for some more oil...it was darker when I first got it and it has lightened up a little through use, storage in my hot garage, and coming into contact with chalk. Fwiw, I like the feel of the oiled leather much better than the treated leather from Pioneer, although IMO both are much preferred to the untreated leather belt I used to have which dried out and cracked over time.

[cmarti063]

What is the difference between treating and oiling leather in this context? I was under the impression that oiling is treating and provides a visual difference as well as water resistance and a more pliable feel.

The oiled leather (or buffalo in my case) is on the outward facing portion of the belt. From the info I got from Titan it is done as a treatment for all of the reasons you mention (visual look, pliability, and water resistance) as well as to keep the leather from drying or cracking. The belts have a lifetime warranty and one of the things they mentioned was the recommendation to re-oil the belt every once in a while. The feel of the oiled leather is similar to an oiled baseball glove. Mine is about ready for some more oil...it was darker when I first got it and it has lightened up a little through use, storage in my hot garage, and coming into contact with chalk. Fwiw, I like the feel of the oiled leather much better than the treated leather from Pioneer, although IMO both are much preferred to the untreated leather belt I used to have which dried out and cracked over time.

Perfect. So the difference is that with the treated belt, the entire strip of leather is submerged in the tannen bath while the oiled belt will have the oil rubbed on the outside surface. The treated will have a deeper penetration of the oils, leading to a greater magnitude of the effect that the application has than just applying it to the surface.

@Greg, I'm willing to bet that it's actually the leather that you prefer, since buffalo will have a different grain to cattle. I haven't used a buffalo skin belt to comment, but I have used non-cattle hides that I didn't like (water buffalo) and have heard exceptional things about other non-cattle leather (elephant).

[PtReyesGreg]

Perfect. So the difference is that with the treated belt, the entire strip of leather is submerged in the tannen bath while the oiled belt will have the oil rubbed on the outside surface. The treated will have a deeper penetration of the oils, leading to a greater magnitude of the effect that the application has than just applying it to the surface.

@Greg, I'm willing to bet that it's actually the leather that you prefer, since buffalo will have a different grain to cattle. I haven't used a buffalo skin belt to comment, but I have used non-cattle hides that I didn't like (water buffalo) and have heard exceptional things about other non-cattle leather (elephant).

That sounds right in terms of the treatment. That's likely why they recommend to reapply oil periodically. Because only the surface is oiled it wears off after a while. One thing they do with the Titan belt is apply that black material to the edge of the belt. I'm guessing that this adds some strength to the belt as well plus it probably helps seal against moisture getting into the different layers of leather. I saw this option available on the Pioneer site for the suede belts and am guessing maybe you could call and add it to the treated leather belt as well (if you contact them) since the 13mm involves multiple layers.

I think you're probably right about the preference for leather. I do like the feel and texture of the buffalo too and am happy with the belt, but I do think I prefer the grain of cattle leather.

In all honesty it was a tough decision between my Oiled Buffalo Titan Longhorn and getting a 13mm Treated Leather Pioneer belt. When EliteFTS runs their periodic sales and offers their 13mm leather belt for $92 the temptation comes back each time. I think if I had to choose one or the other now I'd go with the Titan Brahma Oiled Leather but the 13mm Pioneer Treated is an excellent option too.

[KoolDJVader]

To the best of my knowledge, treated belts can't have suede/condura/garment leather because, apparently, the adhesive doesn't stay adhered well between the surfaces.

Makes sense that the adhesive may not take to the oil. I thought maybe a suede belt can be treated because I assumed that maybe Best Belts treats their belts to get the broken in feel but maybe they do something else.

[KoolDJVader]

That sounds right in terms of the treatment. That's likely why they recommend to reapply oil periodically. Because only the surface is oiled it wears off after a while. One thing they do with the Titan belt is apply that black material to the edge of the belt. I'm guessing that this adds some strength to the belt as well plus it probably helps seal against moisture getting into the different layers of leather. I saw this option available on the Pioneer site for the suede belts and am guessing maybe you could call and add it to the treated leather belt as well (if you contact them) since the 13mm involves multiple layers

As far as General Leathercraft is concerned, my understanding is the black edging option is cosmetic. I chose that option when I bought my belt but actually not super happy with it as it is already starting to strip and the belt is only 5 months old.

[PtReyesGreg]

As far as General Leathercraft is concerned, my understanding is the black edging option is cosmetic. I chose that option when I bought my belt but actually not super happy with it as it is already starting to strip and the belt is only 5 months old.

That's interesting. I assumed it would have some sort of sealing effect as well. Here is a closer up image of the black edging on my Titan belt:



Hopefully you can see from the picture how thick the coating is. As a frame of reference you can see how the oiled buffalo is lightening up in areas (on the belt loop in the pic) but the edging still looks like it was the day I got it. This pic also shows a little of the difference in the grain of the buffalo vs the leather Pioneer/Elite belt above it.

[cmarti063]

Black edging is indeed purely cosmetic. It's just leather paint. You can cheaply reapply it with a foam paintbrush if you're having issues with it.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0196...HNL&ref=plSrch

[BYOBB]

Thanks @PtReyesGreg and @cmarti063, there's great information in this thread. In your opinions, is it ever necessary to "condition" a leather lifting belt? Or is that the same as oiling? The descriptions sound the same but there are oil-less conditioners which make it sound like oil is harmful to the leather somehow. I'm trying to learn about leather but there's a lot of information (and misinformation) out there.

[cmarti063]

Thanks @PtReyesGreg and @cmarti063, there's great information in this thread. In your opinions, is it ever necessary to "condition" a leather lifting belt? Or is that the same as oiling? The descriptions sound the same but there are oil-less conditioners which make it sound like oil is harmful to the leather somehow. I'm trying to learn about leather but there's a lot of information (and misinformation) out there.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BJJyNBEgFbQ/

Matt over at Pioneer recommends conditioning once or twice a year for the treated/oiled/untreated belts. If you read the comments, he mentions getting a conditioning product and that Bickmore is his favorite brand.

[PtReyesGreg]

https://www.instagram.com/p/BJJyNBEgFbQ/

Matt over at Pioneer recommends conditioning once or twice a year for the treated/oiled/untreated belts. If you read the comments, he mentions getting a conditioning product and that Bickmore is his favorite brand.

@cmarti063 Thanks for posting that info. That is useful to me as well. I already have some Lexol which I use on my boots but maybe I'll give the Bickmore a try on my belts. Here is a link to a small bottle of it on Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/Bickmore-Bick.../dp/B001CS2Q4M

[Camaro76350]

Havent logged in or posted in a long time, but this guide was exactly what I needed, thanks a ton Cmarti. Like the dude above, I'm going to grab an Athlete belt from Best in the next few days. Hopefully they give you some royalties or sponsorship, ha

[cmarti063]

Havent logged in or posted in a long time, but this guide was exactly what I needed, thanks a ton Cmarti. Like the dude above, I'm going to grab an Athlete belt from Best in the next few days. Hopefully they give you some royalties or sponsorship, ha

I'm really glad it helped you out! And no, I don't get any royalties or anything, haha! That would be sweet though...

[vitinhoamorim1]

Here in Brazil i can only find local suppliers with buffalo leather w/ 10mm.
these would be the options

1- 9mm single prong belt $68
www youtube com/watch?v=1WuDyivJ5Ds

2- 10mm quick release belt also $68 (have heard a few good reviews about this one)
loja.hpower net br/components/com_virtuemart/shop_image/product/532b2168c8700d370760916b8c7d0166.jpg

3- 10mm quick release and most expensive $102
http2.mlstatic com/cinturo-para-musculaco-murphy-D_NQ_NP_324521-MLB20792260887_062016-F.jpg

and 4� option would be buy a 13mm inzer forever ($201) or a titan brahma 13mm ($217) but they're just expensive.

all the three belts claim they're a double layer of buffalo leather.

[KoolDJVader]

Havent logged in or posted in a long time, but this guide was exactly what I needed, thanks a ton Cmarti. Like the dude above, I'm going to grab an Athlete belt from Best in the next few days. Hopefully they give you some royalties or sponsorship, ha

I've ordered 4 types of belts from General Leathercraft thanks to the info by cmarti here and over at Starting Strength. As much as I love Best Belts, I just can't wait that long to receive my stuff.