Why LBJ is better than Kobe and MJ in two pictures.

[TexasMajor]

Pat Riley coaches the Heat, not Spoelstra.

[lovebbing]

Pat Riley coaches the Heat, not Spoelstra.

/facepalm.jpg

I dont see Pat Riley down on the court next to the bench every game, the way Spoelstra and Phil Jackson are and was.

[FGCHENG]

Bill Russel>>>>>>> Kobe and Lebron combined


5 mvps and 11 rings, best of both worlds

[Dano85]

So when people post a picture of Jordan and his rings all they think about is the rings on his finger? No.

They think about his career which is cemented by his rings.

It doesn't take a genius to figure it out. It's called common sense. Usually when people have a hard time understanding something you tell them if they need you to draw a picture for them. Clearly even a picture wouldn't help you.

SO post a picture of Jordan when he is 28....

arguments about GOAT should not include players who are mid career, and should not include arguments such as # of championships won by people who are retired....

[I OuTsiDeR I]

SO post a picture of Jordan when he is 28....

arguments about GOAT should not include players who are mid career, and should not include arguments such as # of championships won by people who are retired....

This I can somewhat agree with, which is why these type of threads are useless and never go anywhere. It is also why I said wait til Lebrons career is done before crowning him or disqualifying him from anything.

Yet Lebron fans and haters are equally ridiculous. On one side you have them crowning him as the GOAT at 28 years old with 4 MVP's and only 1 Championship. On the other he just sucks got carried, lechoke etc.

But making light of championships is also a mistake. It does make a difference but it also isn't the only thing to go by or else like people bring up Horry > Jordan. You look at the greats and they have all won alot. You look at the elite class that Lebron is in with MVP's and they have all won multiple rings. There is a reason that the greatest and rings have something to do with each other. To ignore this fact would be dumb.

[mgsmith93]

lol @ rings. That has nothing to do why one is better than the other one. People should know by now that rings are the weakest argument in the history of the universe when trying to defend your favorite player.

unless you carried the team. mj carried the fricken bulls, kobe the lakers. lebron couldnt carry cavs and on heat with bosh and wade still not on mj level.

[Dano85]

This I can somewhat agree with, which is why these type of threads are useless and never go anywhere. It is also why I said wait til Lebrons career is done before crowning him or disqualifying him from anything.

Yet Lebron fans and haters are equally ridiculous. On one side you have them crowning him as the GOAT at 28 years old with 4 MVP's and only 1 Championship. On the other he just sucks got carried, lechoke etc.

But making light of championships is also a mistake. It does make a difference but it also isn't the only thing to go by or else like people bring up Horry > Jordan. You look at the greats and they have all won alot. You look at the elite class that Lebron is in with MVP's and they have all won multiple rings. There is a reason that the greatest and rings have something to do with each other. To ignore this fact would be dumb.

I was not trying to make light of the championships I was saying they should not be used as the basis for a debate....

I was never trying to ignore it, I even posted that I think kobe and jordan are better....my only point was the 2nd poster posted pics of rings....he could of posted a list of achievements or anything else but he posted rings...

Championships are a team thing, gretzky is one of if not the best hockey player in history, only won 4 championships though....you would never see anyone post a pic of him with 4 cups to say that he is better than crosby since crosby has only won 1, they would talk about achievements that was all I was trying to say...

[mgsmith93]

/thread

[mgsmith93]

jordan didnt fail in the finals and then leave chicago to join other heavyweights for help

jordan took a year off while still in his prime and probably would have been 7-7

jordan routinely went up against bigs taking it to hole

lebron IS the big

this

[TexasMajor]

/facepalm.jpg

I dont see Pat Riley down on the court next to the bench every game, the way Spoelstra and Phil Jackson are and was.

HERRRRRRRRRPPP... I dont see Jerry Jones down on the sidelines next to the bench every game like Jason Garrett......DERRPPPPPPPPP

Erik Spoelstra is an extension of Pat Riley. Anybody with an ounce and a half of basketball knowledge would tell you the same. You must be new to the game of basketball.

[I OuTsiDeR I]

I was not trying to make light of the championships I was saying they should not be used as the basis for a debate....

I was never trying to ignore it, I even posted that I think kobe and jordan are better....my only point was the 2nd poster posted pics of rings....he could of posted a list of achievements or anything else but he posted rings...

Championships are a team thing, gretzky is one of if not the best hockey player in history, only won 4 championships though....you would never see anyone post a pic of him with 4 cups to say that he is better than crosby since crosby has only won 1, they would talk about achievements that was all I was trying to say...

Rings are an achievement. It is the greatest of achievements and it is the #1 goal for EVERY ATHLETE. Everyone plays the game to win championships in any sport. You think Tom Brady is happy winning the MVP then staying at home in the Super Bowl? No.

So posting up some one with more rings is posting up someone who accomplished more. You are coming down so hard on someone posting up a picture of rings but have not put in the same amount of time or energy saying how ridiculous it is to compare Lebron to Jordan in the first place.

Every single achievement is a team thing MVP's, DPY, etc. It's a team thing because if your team don't win games usually you won't be considered to win those awards, because your team winning and having success affects your status. Lebron could put up these same exact MVP numbers but if his team was 19-63 he wouldn't it win it. Which is why people don't consider Kevin Love as being all that great.

Clearly you are a Lebron fan or else you wouldn't have put in such a defensive effort about a picture of rings. Then saying championships are a team thing as if they don't really count as an accomplishment when comparing individuals.

[Dano85]

Rings are an achievement. It is one the greatest of achievements and it is the #1 goal for EVERY ATHLETE. Everyone plays the game to win championships in any sport. You think Tom Brady is happy winning the MVP then staying at home in the Super Bowl? No.

So posting up some one with more rings is posting up someone who accomplished more. You are coming down so hard on someone posting up a picture of rings but have not put in the same amount of time or energy saying how ridiculous it is to compare Lebron to Jordan in the first place.

Every single achievement is a team thing MVP's, DPY, etc. It's a team thing because if your team don't win games usually you won't be considered to win those awards, because your team winning and having success affects your status. Lebron could put up these same exact MVP numbers but if his team was 19-63 he wouldn't it win it. Which is why people don't consider Kevin Love as being all that great.

Clearly you are a Lebron fan or else you wouldn't have put in such a defensive effort about a picture of rings. Then saying championships are a team thing as if they don't really count as an accomplishment when comparing individuals.

So then Horry has accomplished more right??

and you are right I should of put up more of an argument for how stupid it is to compare lebron to kobe or jordan than I did for the championships things....

and I actually dont care for James at all, just trying to debate some sports.....

we have both agreed now is not the time for this debate....but its going to happen and will continue for the rest of James career...

for the record I am agreeing with your post, I am just debating the other side as well....

[thexingguard]

I am not arguing either way, but by your logic Robert Horry is better than Michael Jordan....

and from a hockey perspective Henri Richard is the best player to ever play the game (when in reality he is not even the best Richard)

Unable to differentiate between a role player and a superstar...

I always lol @ people who try to pull that card.

[travellingbrah]

Why Jordan and Kobe are better than Lebron in 2 pictures.

/of discussion. It took one comment to destroy OP. LOL

[broboma2012]

mj is not kobe. he has the stats and the rings. and performs in the finals/post season. it's a shame that young jordan was unfairly passed over for mvp's in favor of the established prime larry bird and prime magic johnson.

[RogerSterling]

lol @ rings. That has nothing to do why one is better than the other one. People should know by now that rings are the weakest argument in the history of the universe when trying to defend your favorite player.

so you are saying a players coach is a better indicator?

lol

[I OuTsiDeR I]

So then Horry has accomplished more right??

You miss the entire point.

A picture tells you a million words. Yet the ONLY thing you get out of that picture is you can count rings. I've stated many times that when you see a picture like that you think of the player and what he accomplished and it is cemented by the rings. All this talk about Horry is just a weak debate of all the Lebron fans because that is the only thing they can come up with. If that is the best debate you can come up with comparing a role player to the leading GOAT, then guess what you lose the debate. You said post about their accomplishments, guess what Championships are an accomplishment and one of if not the highest and most important one. I can say Jordan won 6 Finals MVPs, but guess what that led to 6 Championships, those things kinda go together if you know what I mean.

Since you say Kobe is better than Lebron, take away the rings and tell me how his achievements are greater than Lebron without the Championships? Because Lebron is about to win his 4th MVP.

[montecarlo]

Lebron never needed Phil.

[montecarlo]

mj is not kobe. he has the stats and the rings. and performs in the finals/post season. it's a shame that young jordan was unfairly passed over for mvp's in favor of the established prime larry bird and prime magic johnson.

How's jordans dick taste?

[tandcrumpets]

I like how rings don't matter yet LeBron could never reach GOAT territory without one

[its50]

lebron didn't need phil but he sure needed these boys

[I OuTsiDeR I]

Lebron never needed Phil.

Yes he just needed to leave his hometown, join with a top 4 NBA player and one of the top PF's in the game all in their primes to create a super team to win. When things get hard take the easy way out. He was good enough to stay in his hometown and eventually win one, they weren't that far away he just needed a good sidekick.

[montecarlo]

Yes he just needed to leave his hometown, join with a top 4 NBA player and one of the top PF's in the game all in their primes to create a super team to win. When things get hard take the easy way out. He was good enough to stay in his hometown and eventually win one, they weren't that far away he just needed a good sidekick.

Exhausted argument /10. Lebron played with a ****ty franchise in a small market that wanted to pinch pennies and win a ship at the same time. Lebron was expected to win a ship with a team of d leaguers. Name me the best player lebron played with? Mo williams? aged out jamison, and shaq? Get out with that poverty ****. Cavs never acquired 1 and 2 hall of famers like jordan and kobe had. Lebron wasn't gifted a PRIME SHAQ, who has 3 or the 5 finals mvps of that laker era. This argument is so incredibly beyond invalid.

[Strizzz]

lebron didn't need phil but he sure needed these boys

Except those "boys" got you into the playoffs this year(only to get swept), and have been helping you out for ages. See circa 2002. Lets not even mention the David Stern quote in 2008 on what his dream match-up would be, which was the Lakers vs the Lakers.

As a Laker fan, unless you want to look like a complete moron granted it's incredibly easy for you lot to do nowadays, you might not wanna ever bring up the refs again since you're the absolute LAST fan-base who can do it.

[DasWunderBrah]

Finals MVPs>MVPS># of Rings

[bking10]

Finals MVPs>MVPS># of Rings

so media voted awards are more important than actually winning?

[FGCHENG]

so media voted awards are more important than actually winning?

opinions >> facts

this is the sport's misc bro, that's how it works.

[montecarlo]

so media voted awards are more important than actually winning?

He's only saying that's the importance in player comparisons.


Name me one finals mvp or one regular season mvp (all time nba) who is less of a player than robert horry. (7 rings)

[Daewoo_Lanos]

/thread

lol lebron did that in a game





camerman went full potato switching the angle but take-off foot position is almost identical to jordan's. just a few inches closer. no need for a poverty empty court to get that done.

[I OuTsiDeR I]

Exhausted argument /10. Lebron played with a ****ty franchise in a small market that wanted to pinch pennies and win a ship at the same time. Lebron was expected to win a ship with a team of d leaguers. Name me the best player lebron played with? Mo williams? aged out jamison, and shaq? Get out with that poverty ****. Cavs never acquired 1 and 2 hall of famers like jordan and kobe had. Lebron wasn't gifted a PRIME SHAQ, who has 3 or the 5 finals mvps of that laker era. This argument is so incredibly beyond invalid.

As I stated he needed a few more pieces namely a good sidekick. His teams weren't trash he had decent role players, Lebron didn't win 60 gms and get 1 seeds by himself no matter how bad you try to make his team look.

Playing for the city you lived in ever since you were growing up and having a chance to win the ship is rare. He was good enough to win one there he just needed a real #2 option. Now if he was constantly losing and not making the playoffs etc, then yes I can see someone getting frustrated and then wanting to leave. But he was in the mix every year. He is a once in a lifetime talent, you don't think someone as rare as he is couldn't eventually get a decent sidekick and put a team on his back and win? Outside of Pippen, Jordan had Bill Wennignton, Jud Buchler, Hansen, Williams, Cartwright, Grant(decent), Armstrong, Paxson, nothing really to write home about.

Why couldn't he entice players to go to Cleavland instead of leaving? Wouldn't everyone want to play with the best player in the league? Now ppl will just say Cleavland sucks as a place to live especially compared to Miami. So in essence all Lebron has done is told everyone in his home city that it sucks and will never win anything, so I'm going to leave. Some kind of home town pride. So when Lebron retires does he retire as a Heat? Or when Wade gets old does Lebron look to join with Durant next? It would have been much more satisfying even if he stayed in his hometown city and won 2 championship rings, then bolting to join other players making super teams and winning 5-7 championships.

I think Lebron is a beast of a player but I give more respect to Dirk winning his first ring even though it took long than Lebron winning his first.

Finals MVPs>MVPS># of Rings

Finals MVPS lead to Rings so they actually go together or make a stronger case. Which is why majority of everyone has Jordan>Kobe