All Pro Intermediate programs 1-4

[all pro]

re: Workout #2

Do you go to failure or just shy?

Are you doing the same weight for the entire 5 week cycle? So if week one, I'm squating 250lb 4 reps x 4 sets, is the next week 250lb 5 x 4, then 250lb 6 x 4, etc....?

You don't intentionally go to failure. It may or may not happen depending on the total of everything. Sleep+diet+? The idea is if you don't get all of the reps on the final work out you repeat the cycle with the same weight until you do.

250lb 4 reps x 4 sets, is the next week 250lb 5 x 4, then 250lb 6 x 4, etc That's the general idea. Each week you're just trying to add 1 more rep. Oh it seems soooooo easy.

[all pro]

all pro, I know you've posted some ab work for peeps but I'm curious what your thoughts are concerning ab work.

I've seen the same old debate in these forums and between my dad's workout buddies. Some say NO ab work. Some say you don''t need to do upper & lower work because the abdominals are 1 muscle, blah blah blah

My dad doesn't do abs and his look great.

Personally, I've always done "upper & lower" & don't consider abs any different than the other muscles in my body. I feel they need some kind of work even though they are worked while doing other exercises. Maybe its just a mental thing with me.

I was using the high pulley w/tricep rope for years for upper and use adjustable 20lb ankle weights for lower. I did realize that it was killing my grip using the tricep rope so I bought a $6 pair of those "ab slings" you hang in for leg raises. They work well also to attach them to the high pulley to do weighted crunches.

So, what's your opinion ?

Necessary, not necessary or just personal preference?

Years ago Body by Jake made an ab bench that used bungee cords to adjust the resistance. With that cheap piece of junk you could work abs in any direction without having to worry about blowing out a disc. I haven't seen one like it in years. The problem with abs is that you've got to the side and up, that puts stress on the discs, you've got rotation and that can put stress on the discs. To me they are a no no with any kind of free weight that applies a downward force on the spine. Well that leaves chest to knees, knees to chest, with a twist to the left and the right. Are they required. Well that's a definite maybe. Some people do just fine without them. Some people fold over like a cheap jack knife doing squats. That's the person that needs some serious ab and spinal erector work.

[Max10]

Thanks, AP, for taking the time to set this up. I'll still plan to run your beginner's program for another cycle or two.

Is there any progression or cycling of these set ups that you'd recommend or just simply find one that you feels works best for you? I see you noted one of them for more of the mass goal, but I'm guessing each of these will add mass with a correct approach and, obviously, diet.

[all pro]

Thanks, AP, for taking the time to set this up. I'll still plan to run your beginner's program for another cycle or two.

Is there any progression or cycling of these set ups that you'd recommend or just simply find one that you feels works best for you? I see you noted one of them for more of the mass goal, but I'm guessing each of these will add mass with a correct approach and, obviously, diet.

The first one is the easiest to set up. It's just straight line linear progression. When it stops working or you get tired of it.....and you will try the next one. You could probably run a few cycles of #1, then a few of #2 then a few of #3 and then come back to number 1. Number 4 is for the truly insane. If you're playing football, flag foot ball, hockey, rugby or any other heavy contact speed, strength power sport that is the program for you.......provided of course you've already run the other 5x5s.
And it ain't to shabby at packing on mass and strength. It just might not look to pretty but then that's what the other programs are for.

[muscleman17]

Intermediate 1
Work out 1
squats, bench press and bent over rows for a total of 4 sets.
set 1 @ 25% of work set weight for 10 reps. Set 2 @ 50% of work set weight for 10 reps.
set 3 @ 100% for 5 reps. set 4 add the weight of set 1 and set 2 together and do 10 reps with it. Any assistance work you do 1 set of 8 reps then reduce the weight by

half and do 1 set of 20 reps. The assistance work can be ANYTHING that you think you need. I always include stiff leg dead lifts, shoulder press and curls.
Work out 2
Use the exact same weight that you used for work out 1 BUT do 3 sets of 5 instead of 1 set of 5 and don't do the 10 rep set. For the assistance work use the same

weight and go for 12 reps. Anytime that you can complete all of the assigned reps add 10 pounds for the next week. It's a big jump but more on this in a moment.

Continue to push it for 3 weeks. Week 4 is a deload week. On week 4 reduce the work set weight to 75% of what you've been using and do just 1 work set. No 10 rep

set and no assistance work. To start the next cycle if you were failing to complete every set of a given exercise then you reduce the weight by 30 pounds for week 1

for work out 2 only. You should never be failing to complete the reps on work out 1. If you're an athlete then power cleans are the first exercise of every work out. I set

them up with 4 sets. 25%/50%/75%/100% for 3 reps on work out 1, then use the same weight for work out 2 and push it for 5 reps.
What I've just laid out is Soviet dual factor, mixed qualities training. It's confusing to read and that's why I've been avoiding writing it up.
A quick example of the 3 core exercises.
Work out 1
50 pounds x 10, 100 pounds x 10, 200 pounds x 5, 150 pounds x 10
Work out 2
50 pounds x 10, 100 pounds x 10, 200 pounds x 5 x 3
Deload week
Work out 1
50 pounds x 10, 100 pounds x 10, 150 pounds x 5
Work out 2
50 pounds x 10, 100 pounds x 10, 150 pounds x 5
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ________________________________________
Intermediate 2
All Pro Split
5 week cycle
A
Bench Presses do 4 work sets rep scheme 4-5-6-7-8 Do 2 warm up sets. 25% of the work set weight for 15 reps and 50% of the work set weight for 10 reps.
Bent-Over Rows do 4 work sets rep scheme 4-5-6-7-8
Overhead Barbell Presses do 2 work sets rep scheme 6-7-8-9-10
Barbell Curls do 2 work sets rep scheme 8-9-10-11-12
Tricep press do 2 work sets rep scheme 8-9-10-11-12
Hammer grip dumb bell press do 2 work sets rep scheme 8-9-10-11-12
Pull down do 2 work sets rep scheme 8-9-10-11-12

B
Squats do 4 work sets rep scheme 4-5-6-7-8 Do 2 warm up sets. 25% of the work set weight for 15 reps and 50% of the work set weight for 10 reps.
Leg extensions do 2 work sets rep scheme 8-10-12-15-20
Stiff-Legged Deadlifts do 2 work sets rep scheme 8-9-10-11-12
Leg curls do 2 work sets rep scheme 8-9-10-11-12
Calf Raises do 2 work sets rep scheme 8-10-12-15-20
Seated calf press do 2 work sets rep scheme 8-10-12-15-20
Add ab work
If you get all of the reps on week 5 add 5%
That should get you started. I would do this A/B/A then B/A/B until you come up to speed. Then try 4 work outs per week. A-B off. A-B off off.
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ________________________________________
Intermediate 3

Recreational lifters and athletes

Two work outs per week
Three core lifts. Squat, bench press and rows. The following percentages are based on your current 5 rep maximums for each lift.
Do two warm up sets for these three lifts. Do the first set at 35% for 15 reps. Do the second set at 65% for 10 reps. Rest one minute between the warm up sets. Rest
1:30 seconds between the 10 rep work sets. Rest Two minutes between the 5 rep work sets.

Week one, work out one, 70%, 1x15. Work out two, 75%, 1x15.
Week two, work out one, 80%, 2x10. Work out two, 85%, 2x10.
Week three, work out one, 90%, 3x5. Work out two, 95%, 3x5.
Week four, work out one, 100%, 1x5. Work out two, 105%, 1x5

Now for the assistance work. No warm ups. One set each to start with.

Stiff leg dead lift *required*
Optional, leg curl, leg extension, calve press, dead lift.

Hammer grip dumb bell incline bench bench press or over head bar bell press *required*
Optional, tricep press.

Standing rows *required*
Optional, bar bell curl, EZ bar curl, dumb bell curl, lateral raises, front raises.

Pull downs or pull overs. One of them is required. The other is optional. You choose.
The following percentages are based on your current 10 rep maximums for each assistance lift that you plan to do.
Week one, work out one, 70%, 1x15. Work out two, 75%, 1x15.
Week two, work out one, 80%, 1x15. Work out two, 85%, x15.
Week three, work out one, 90%, 1x10. Work out two, 95%, 1x10.
Week four, work out one, 100%, 1x10. Work out two, 105%, 1x10
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ________________________________________
Intermediate 4
Athletic performance and mass and strength gain
Two work outs per week. The first work out is based on Bill Starr's infamous 636 NFL program.
The heart and soul of this program is 3 sets of 3 followed by 3 sets of 6. It starts with 3, 6 rep warm up sets, hence the name 636.
The weight does not change for 3 weeks. Week 4 is a deload week. This set up slowly grinds you into powder!
Three core lifts. Squat, bench press and rows.
Set 1 at 25% of your 5 rep max for 6 reps.
Set 2 at 50% of your 5 rep max for 6 reps.
Set 3 at 75% of your 5 rep max for 6 reps.
Sets 4-5-6 at 100% of your 5 rep max for 3 reps.
Sets 7-8-9 at 90% of your 5 rep max for 6 reps.
On week four do just the first 3 sets! That's your deload. DO IT!
Work out 2
Week one. 75%, 1x15
Week two 85%, 2x10
Week three 95%, 3x5
Week four, 105%, 1x5
All assistance work goes on work out two. Percentages are based on your current 10 rep max.
Week 1 75% 1x15
Week 2 85% 1x15
Week 3 95% 1x10
Week 4 105% 1x10

So what does an athlete do on Wednesday?
Stretch, cardio, mobility, speed!
If you're a recreational lifter you only need the first 2, stretching and cardio.
If you're an athlete there are scores of mobility drills to choose from. You will also need dynamic effort, speed. Speed x strength = power.
Power cleans and hang cleans set up on a 5 sets of 3 format working in 20% increments. Set one at 20%, set 2 at 40%, set 3 at 60%, set 4 at 80% set 5 at your top

weight. This is all about speed and power. So if your rep speed drops noticeably or your form degrades, terminate the set. Rep speed is more important than the

weight on the bar. You aren't training for the olympics! These will produce power and improve mobility. Also true dynamic effort work. That's done with squats,

bench press and dead lift by loading 50% of your 1 rep maximum on the bar and attaching chains to each side of the bar. When you add up all of the weight it should

be between 90% and 100% percent of your 1 rep max. Do at least 5 sets of 3 reps lifting the weight as fast as possible. When speed slows down noticeably or form breaks down, terminate the set.

http://www.naturalphysiques.com/18/o...max-calculator
Use the second estimate.

the fourth workout is only 2 days a week? well thats a 5 day break muscle starts to deteriorate at 3 day i think. where is the deadlifts and the shoulder presses? which one is the best one for building all around mass and stregnth?
ohh i see. never mind ill preolly end up doing a cycle of 1 2 and 3 like u said.

[all pro]

the fourth workout is only 2 days a week? well thats a 5 day break muscle starts to deteriorate at 3 day i think. where is the deadlifts and the shoulder presses? which one is the best one for building all around mass and stregnth?
ohh i see. never mind ill preolly end up doing a cycle of 1 2 and 3 like u said.

O.K. I don't want to have to write a book. BUT it takes about 72 hours for a muscle to recover. Recover means it can repeat the effort. It hasn't supercompensated yet and therefore it hasn't gained strength yet. Also the muscle isn't the only thing that has to recover. Joints and tendons. That will be a few more days. Bones, that will be maybe another day. The CNS, well in the 3-6 rep range....that could take 3-5 days easy. At Dr Squat's, Fred Hatfeild's site he's got a list of this stuff. But you might want to pick up a copy of Supertraining. and Neuromechanics of Human Movement and Science and Practice of Strength Training and Periodization Breakthrough and.......oh nevermind. That will take you about a year to get through, digest and understand.

[golfwolf]

You don't intentionally go to failure. It may or may not happen depending on the total of everything. Sleep+diet+? The idea is if you don't get all of the reps on the final work out you repeat the cycle with the same weight until you do.

250lb 4 reps x 4 sets, is the next week 250lb 5 x 4, then 250lb 6 x 4, etc That's the general idea. Each week you're just trying to add 1 more rep. Oh it seems soooooo easy.

Sorry for all the questions, but what's a good way to determine your work set weight? Do you start with a weight you feel you can do 4 x 4 for the first week, but know you couldn't do 4 x 8 the first week?

[all pro]

Sorry for all the questions, but what's a good way to determine your work set weight? Do you start with a weight you feel you can do 4 x 4 for the first week, but know you couldn't do 4 x 8 the first week?

Choose the middle of the rep range for each lift. 4-8 the middle is 6.

[G8GXP]

Choose the middle of the rep range for each lift. 4-8 the middle is 6.

Would this correspond to a % of max? or better yet if you know your 2x12 workout weight, is there a ball park formula to get your 4x6 workout weight?

[Akos1712]

Wow it 's sticky after 3 days

[all pro]

Would this correspond to a % of max? or better yet if you know your 2x12 workout weight, is there a ball park formula to get your 4x6 workout weight?

http://www.naturalphysiques.com/18/o...max-calculator
Use the second set of numbers.
6 reps is approximately 83%. I would probably default to 80% for the first cycle.

Bookmark this site people. It will make the set up a lot easier.
http://www.naturalphysiques.com/18/o...max-calculator

[all pro]

At this point I thought it might be a good idea to point out that you can't get bigger, stronger, leaner, faster or improve at all unless you are using a bodybuilding program that you got out of a bodybuilding magazine Athletic type programs will never get you were you want to be.









[IMG]

[all pro]

How's that working for you Mr Weider?

[gerryh777]

Wow it 's sticky after 3 days

When AllPro posts a workout schedule it is an automatic sticky. And I am totally fine with that

[pumplikecuming]

How's that working for you Mr Weider?

Mmmm I wouldn't say that. I know alot of decently strong people at my gym (305+ lb bench presses)...

and I would ponder why am I bigger than all of these people, and my max bench is less than what they rep.

I see their form, they are targeting the pecs, they have good volume...it boggled me.

One day I went over to the guy I saw repping 305 (he was tall, lanky, skinny fat, small triceps, no shoulders, flat chest....I was confused). I asked him what his diet was:

McDonalds, pizza, and donuts.

You can get as beastly strong as you want, but you won't really start adding muscle till you are eating right.

[Akos1712]

Mmmm I wouldn't say that. I know alot of decently strong people at my gym (305+ lb bench presses)...

and I would ponder why am I bigger than all of these people, and my max bench is less than what they rep.

I see their form, they are targeting the pecs, they have good volume...it boggled me.

One day I went over to the guy I saw repping 305 (he was tall, lanky, skinny fat, small triceps, no shoulders, flat chest....I was confused). I asked him what his diet was:

McDonalds, pizza, and donuts.

You can get as beastly strong as you want, but you won't really start adding muscle till you are eating right.

true
diet come as important as exercising. u can't lose fat without diet, u can't gain mass without diet

[Jordn93]

All pro, i am unsure on what the progression is in program 1 from cycle to cycle. Do you start the next cycle with the weights you used in week 3 of the previous cycle? Thanks

[muscleman17]

true
diet come as important as exercising. u can't lose fat without diet, u can't gain mass without diet

do not question all pros authority....(different topic than quotes)

[Deviant Motive]

Now that I've finished the first week of the workout #3, I have a question.

When I start adding the optional exercises, I'm not sure how this works out.

For example, add in deadlifts, do I do those for a cycle or two, drop those, add in calf raises for a while, etc.

[thedogdidit]

Thank you! I've been running the Beginner Program for many cycles now and am ready for a change (just a psychological thing, not that I'm lifting any huge numbers yet!). This should keep me going for a while.

I know you've been dreading making an official post out of this, since you'll get tons of questions, but .....
I've got some questions ....

1) I'm kinda thinking option 1 is not really a great one for people who aren't lifting all that heavy yet. I know this is an intermediate program, so you would hope that people can lift some serious weight, but what about us females For instance, my overhead press is pretty weak at 40lb. Doing the add 10 lb. a week and then subtracting 30 lb. if you fail seems perhaps not the best thing??
So, my question -- are there adjustments we can make for that??

2) I'm loving option 2 because I want to workout 4 days a week. Crazy I know ...
Do you start each exercise at the mid-rep -- so for bench press, use 6RM and for barbell curls, use 10RM? Also, it is exactly as written? so no warmups after the first exercise?

Thanks again All Pro!

[muscleman17]

Thank you! I've been running the Beginner Program for many cycles now and am ready for a change (just a psychological thing, not that I'm lifting any huge numbers yet!). This should keep me going for a while.

I know you've been dreading making an official post out of this, since you'll get tons of questions, but .....
I've got some questions ....

1) I'm kinda thinking option 1 is not really a great one for people who aren't lifting all that heavy yet. I know this is an intermediate program, so you would hope that people can lift some serious weight, but what about us females For instance, my overhead press is pretty weak at 40lb. Doing the add 10 lb. a week and then subtracting 30 lb. if you fail seems perhaps not the best thing??
So, my question -- are there adjustments we can make for that??

2) I'm loving option 2 because I want to workout 4 days a week. Crazy I know ...
Do you start each exercise at the mid-rep -- so for bench press, use 6RM and for barbell curls, use 10RM? Also, it is exactly as written? so no warmups after the first exercise?

Thanks again All Pro!

if the lift has
4-8 reps, 6 rep max
6-10, 8 rep max
8-12, 10 rep max

its always the middle number.
source: same question i PMd all pro for

as far as the warm ups go ide imagine they would be before every lift. but thats a good question.

[dbjorn]

Testing for workout 3 tomorrow.

[dbjorn]

Now that I've finished the first week of the workout #3, I have a question.

When I start adding the optional exercises, I'm not sure how this works out.

For example, add in deadlifts, do I do those for a cycle or two, drop those, add in calf raises for a while, etc.

Hey deviant. I'm actually starting this workout tomorrow. And only speaking from how i understood it, the additions are pretty much at your discretion. And judging on how it affects your ability to do certain lifts you can always customize it. i.e. adding deads and other grip taxing exercises will most likely affect the rows.

I personally cant make it to the gym more than 2 days a week so i'm gonna try with quite a few optionals, and the days will be thursday and sunday. What are your days? Just so i can get a feel for if i spaced them properly. Thanks.

[muscleman17]

Try it but be warned the 636 is no joke. It just looks simple.

unrelated to quote.

soo adding 5% to each lift after a 5 week cycle is like starting at 100 and then adding 5% then its 105? and 200 is 210? 300 is 315? ect.

and do i add 5% to just each separate lift if i get the reps? or if i get all the reps except one do i not add any weight to any of them??

[Deviant Motive]

Hey deviant. I'm actually starting this workout tomorrow. And only speaking from how i understood it, the additions are pretty much at your discretion. And judging on how it affects your ability to do certain lifts you can always customize it. i.e. adding deads and other grip taxing exercises will most likely affect the rows.

I personally cant make it to the gym more than 2 days a week so i'm gonna try with quite a few optionals, and the days will be thursday and sunday. What are your days? Just so i can get a feel for if i spaced them properly. Thanks.

I'm doing Mon/Thur. all pro said that would be fine. Throwing in some ab work on Tue/Fri.

I'd like to do all of the optional exercises in one workout

Seriously, I'm just trying to figure out the best way to incorporate them without over working certain muscles and causing me to stall.

all pro told me I'd probably like this workout because of the variety since I get bored quickly.

I need to do some more pondering and come up with something. I just like to plan out everything ahead of time and keep track of what I do so I can get the most out of the program. I think I get too technical sometimes and make things more difficult than what they should be. At least that's what my husband has been telling me for 22 years...................... I'm too detailed oriented.

[all pro]

All pro, i am unsure on what the progression is in program 1 from cycle to cycle. Do you start the next cycle with the weights you used in week 3 of the previous cycle? Thanks

For program 1, the first work out you do 1x5. On work out 2 you use the same weight and try to do 3x5. When you can, add 10 pounds. Use the same simple set up for all of the assistance work. If you run this program long term then after the deload week start the next cycle with 10 pounds less. So at week 1 you're at -10, week 2 your even, week 3 at +10, week 4 deload. You'll know when you need to start doing this because the lift will stall even after the deload.

[all pro]

Mmmm I wouldn't say that. I know alot of decently strong people at my gym (305+ lb bench presses)...

and I would ponder why am I bigger than all of these people, and my max bench is less than what they rep.

I see their form, they are targeting the pecs, they have good volume...it boggled me.

One day I went over to the guy I saw repping 305 (he was tall, lanky, skinny fat, small triceps, no shoulders, flat chest....I was confused). I asked him what his diet was:

McDonalds, pizza, and donuts.

You can get as beastly strong as you want, but you won't really start adding muscle till you are eating right.

That was just me venting. The kids are getting ready for football camps. The dad walks in with several muscle mags in his back pocket and proceeds to tell me that I don't know what I'm doing. And then proceeds to tell me how I'm going to prepare his kid for football.


It didn't end well for him.

[all pro]

Now that I've finished the first week of the workout #3, I have a question.

When I start adding the optional exercises, I'm not sure how this works out.

For example, add in deadlifts, do I do those for a cycle or two, drop those, add in calf raises for a while, etc.

You don't have to drop anything that you add....ever. But if something doesn't seem to be helping then drop it. That's why the few that I listed I listed as optional. I'm not sitting in the weight room with you, measuring you, or monitoring every facet of everything. YOU made a comment about having a 'white girls butt'. For you dead lifts should work out well. If they do then the rest of the leg work should help even more. But if they don't seem to help.......I've got a lot more in my bag of tricks.

[all pro]

Thank you! I've been running the Beginner Program for many cycles now and am ready for a change (just a psychological thing, not that I'm lifting any huge numbers yet!). This should keep me going for a while.

I know you've been dreading making an official post out of this, since you'll get tons of questions, but .....
I've got some questions ....

1) I'm kinda thinking option 1 is not really a great one for people who aren't lifting all that heavy yet. I know this is an intermediate program, so you would hope that people can lift some serious weight, but what about us females For instance, my overhead press is pretty weak at 40lb. Doing the add 10 lb. a week and then subtracting 30 lb. if you fail seems perhaps not the best thing??
So, my question -- are there adjustments we can make for that??

2) I'm loving option 2 because I want to workout 4 days a week. Crazy I know ...
Do you start each exercise at the mid-rep -- so for bench press, use 6RM and for barbell curls, use 10RM? Also, it is exactly as written? so no warmups after the first exercise?

Thanks again All Pro!

Yup you start in the middle of the rep range weight wise. And you shouldn't need warm ups after the first 3 exercises.
4-8 starts at 6
6-10 starts at 8
8-12 starts at 10
8-20 starts at 12
Work out 1 can be rough when your numbers are less than 100 pounds. You can still run it but you have to reduce the progression to 5 pounds. I'm not sure how well that would work out.

[all pro]

unrelated to quote.

soo adding 5% to each lift after a 5 week cycle is like starting at 100 and then adding 5% then its 105? and 200 is 210? 300 is 315? ect.

and do i add 5% to just each separate lift if i get the reps? or if i get all the reps except one do i not add any weight to any of them??

Yup. The other option is to rep till failure on the final work out and use the rep calculator to re-figure your weight. That will accelerate your progress but it's damn tough to do that every cycle.