College kid asks university ring theorist about 48 � 2(9+3)

[Softworn]

Some of you say PEMDAS is absolute. I never heard of that until now, I was taught BEDMAS in elementary school. The person holding the camera made a reference to both methods.
One says do Multiplication first. The other says do Division first.

The problem is not clearly written anyways.

8 * 7 / 14 = 4

It doesn't matter which one you do first in that case. Neither of them are absolute. The equation isn't solvable unless it is specified. Ask any math professor.

Proof:
8 * 7 = 56
56 / 14 = 4

or

7/14 = 0.5
8 * 0.5 = 4

Anyone who is good at Math will tell you to consider all possibilities before determining whether an answer is right or wrong.

[krazykarl]

48/2*12 for some reason you're grouping 2*12 together then doing 48 divided by that instead of grouping 48/2 and then multiplying by 12. Why?

nothing about math is a toss-up, which is why math is so powerful: math is absolutely absolute for ALL instances, there is never a toss-up. In equations you do addition and multiplication before any division and subtraction because multiplication and addition are commutative.

What I underlined is the key. Again, most people don't think about math in this way, but what makes math special, and a PITA, is that math is totally, undeniably, unarguably absolute. Math is cold as ice, more dead inside and devoid of emotion than a russian hooker. If there is any room for a mistake in a theorem/law it's called science, not math.

[Muckle_Ewe]

no, it cannot. any other way than how i described is wrong in the most absolute authoritative way. the universe is on my side here, trust me; planets would fall from their orbits. cats and dogs would be living together.

After calculating the rate of precession of mercury, assuming the answers 288, I agree with you. We would all be dead.

[Cell-Tech]

nothing about math is a toss-up, which is why math is so powerful: math is absolutely absolute for ALL instances, there is never a toss-up. In equations you do addition and multiplication before any division and subtraction because multiplication and addition are commutative.

Ok then...

EDIT: Nevermind thought you meant commutative with each other.

[freetiago]

Thank you for this. Even a professional will tell you that it needs to be specified and a problem written as 48 � 2(9+3) is technically written INCORRECTLY due to leaving room for error.

48�2(9+3)=288
48�[2(9+3)]=2

You can't put incorrect math into a calculator or it'll error up.


My calculator doesn't error up, therefore it's correct math.


come at me

[Cell-Tech]

What I underlined is the key. Again, most people don't think about math in this way, but what makes math special, and a PITA, is that math is totally, undeniably, unarguably absolute. Math is cold as ice, more dead inside than a russian hooker. If there is any room for a mistake in a theorem/law it's called science, not math.

Ok so I guess you know a decent amount of math. Multiply these two vectors together for me.

<1,2,3> and <1,2,3>

What's the answer?

[Softworn]

You can't put incorrect math into a calculator or it'll error up.


My calculator doesn't error up, therefore it's correct math.


come at me

Age: 18

You have no idea.
You will find out about calculators being capable of error if you ever study Trigonometry.

[Ricky116]

Its an ambiguous equation. He said convention, but convention =/= rule.

[CompleXion]

Thank you for this. Even a professional will tell you that it needs to be specified and a problem written as 48 � 2(9+3) is technically written INCORRECTLY due to leaving room for error.

48�2(9+3)=288
48�[2(9+3)]=2

This. Parentheses makes all the difference.

[TakeYourMulti]

Didn't watch

[Softworn]

Its an ambiguous equation. He said convention, but convention =/= rule.

Winrar!

Rule for ambiguous equations:
Solve for all possible answers, and separate answers with "OR."

[Deevious]

48/2(9+3)
PEMDAS
(9+3)=12
48/2(12)
PEMDAS
48/24
= 2

This is my first ever contribution to a 48/2(9+3) thread.

I got 2, not sure why people are getting 288 since PEMDAS says you gotta handle the 2(9+3) before you hit division.

By your own accord (solving in the manner that you did and citing PEMDAS) you would divide 48 by 2 then multiply, but then you failed to follow that step correctly, lol.


The entire discussion of this topic is fruitless. The fact of the matter is the equation is meant to be solved in a linear (left to right) method. Were it to be solved in a more conventional fashion (numerator/denominator) either the problem would be written in that manner or there would be an extra pair of parenthesis/brackets containing 2(9+3).

The problem as it stands now is ambiguous at best. And you're all retarded for giving such definitive answers.

[krazykarl]

Ok so I guess you know a decent amount of math. Multiply these two vectors together for me.

<1,2,3> and <1,2,3>

What's the answer?

dot, cross, perp-dot, direct ?

[dogandbroom]

the answer is 2. this is simple ****ing algebra. FOIL.
48 � 2(9+3) = 48 � 2(12) = 48 � 24 = 2

/thread

[Cell-Tech]

dot, cross, perp-dot, direct ?

Are you saying the way I told you to solve it is ambiguous? Not possible bro... nothing's a toss up in math. Just solve it the way I told you.

[krazykarl]

Gonna answer this dude?

waiting for your answer, dude.

[Cell-Tech]

waiting for your answer, dude.

Yeah just saw that after I posted... deleted it.

[krazykarl]

Are you saying the way I told you to solve it is ambiguous? Not possible bro... nothing's a toss up in math. Just solve it the way I told you.

there are several types of vector multiplication. pick one or use proper annotation.

[me.]

Thank you for this. Even a professional will tell you that it needs to be specified and a problem written as 48 � 2(9+3) is technically written INCORRECTLY due to leaving room for error.

48�2(9+3)=288
48�[2(9+3)]=2

this.

[Cell-Tech]

there are several types of vector multiplication. pick one or use proper annotation.

That's my point.

48/2*12

There are two ways to interpret that. Pick one or use proper annotation.

[Icicle]

lol at people saying /thread thinking they're right

[krazykarl]

That's my point.

48/2*12

There are two ways to interpret that. Pick one or use proper annotation.

I figured you were using that angle. The issue is with the 48/2*12 equation you have a proper and complete equation - the vector question you provided is not well-formed and missing the operator.

[Cell-Tech]

I figured you were using that angle. The issue is with the 48/2*12 equation you have a proper and complete equation - the vector question you provided is not well-formed and missing the operator.

That's where we disagree though. I think we have 48/2 and the 12 can be either in the numerator or the denominator. I don't know what part of math tells you where 12 should be.

EDIT: and apparently neither does a university professor. I also remember reading a thread where a miscer asked his dad who was a PhD in mathematics who also said ambiguous.

[tacubaya]

Civil Engineer: Sir, my calculations indicate the critical load for this column is 48�2(9+3) kN.

Chief Engineer: OH NOOOOOO, WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO?!?!??!?!?!

[westbigballin]

The answer is 2, idk why this is so difficult.

a. 48/2 (9+3) (parens are ALWAYS first)
b. 48 / 2(12) (commutative on the denominator)
c. 48 / 24 (reduce)
d. 2 / 1
e. 2




There is no other possible answer. Even when you do left-to-right mult/add comes before division/sub. wtf is the big deal? (yes, CS degree. come at me algo bros)

You are so phucking dumb holy sh*t.

MULTIPLICATION DOES NOT TAKEN PRECEDENCE OVER DIVISION

WHY DO YOU THINK ITS PEMDAS FOR SOME, AND BEDMAS FOR OTHERS? M/D ARE DONE FROM LEFT TO RIGHT, NO PRECEDENCE.

the different tiers of order of operations
terms inside brackets
exponents and roots
multiplication and division
addition and subtraction

[CompleXion]

As written in the title, the equation 48 � 2(9+3) = 288

48 � 2(9+3)
48 � 2(12)

Now you do the math from left to right

24(12) = 288.

If the equation was written as
48 � (2(9+3)), then the answer would be 2

48 � (2(12))
48 � (24)
48 � 24 = 2.

[Erevan]

Seems like a cool and really smart guy. He says both answers are ok, I'm gonna go with that.

[slippa]

Do the parentheses need to be eliminated before moving on to any other step?

[Muckle_Ewe]

Do the parentheses need to be eliminated before moving on to any other step?

Deal with parenthesis first.

The question is fawking stupid though. If this kinda thing ever came up in an actual equation/proof then either;

The person who wrote it like that is an idiot or, more likely,

It's obvious what to do from the context.

[VaginaHater]

48/2(9+3)

PEMDAS

(9+3)=12

48/2(12)

PEMDAS

48/24

= 2

This is my first ever contribution to a 48/2(9+3) thread.

I got 2, not sure why people are getting 288 since PEMDAS says you gotta handle the 2(9+3) before you hit division.

think again

A common technique for remembering the order of operations is the abbreviation "PEMDAS", which is turned into the phrase "Please Excuse My Dear Aunt Sally". It stands for "Parentheses, Exponents, Multiplication and Division, and Addition and Subtraction". This tells you the ranks of the operations: Parentheses outrank exponents, which outrank multiplication and division (but multiplication and division are at the same rank), and these two outrank addition and subtraction (which are together on the bottom rank). When you have a bunch of operations of the same rank, you just operate from left to right.

^ http://www.purplemath.com/modules/orderops.htm

P
Parentheses first
E
Exponents (ie Powers and Square Roots, etc.)
MD
Multiplication and Division (left-to-right)
AS
Addition and Subtraction (left-to-right)

^ http://www.mathsisfun.com/operation-order-pemdas.html



The question is poorly written, but the answer is 288

dealwithit.jpg