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    Exclamation Starting a cutting diet after a whole year of bulking

    I've started a cut last week, but I strongly believe I'm doing it wrong. This would be my first cut, and I'd like some pointers.

    Some background: I was 66Kg/145lbs March 2010, and now I'm 81Kg/177lbs March 2011. It was a bulk, with both good and bad times, but I think I put on a considerable amount of weight. With this came fat gain too, and I believe I'm an endomorph (but I do not fuss myself over this).

    For my bulk I was eating around 3,000 calories, which I then bumped down to 2,700 calories because I was gaining weight too fast.

    My waist is 37.25" and my chest is 42", these two areas are my two primary areas where I hold the most fat.

    I've started a cut Monday of last week, and after weighing myself this Monday...I went down 300 grams, and this could be just due to other variables (water, et cetera). I've got to admit that my cutting diet is crap, I just decided to eat less of everything, but I don't think my macros fit in well.

    Can anyone help me come up with a good diet? No need for extreme detail, just an idea of the portions I should be eating and come up with good balanced macro ratios of P/F/C.

    Food that I'm able to afford: weetabix, milk, fruit, wholemeal pasta, chicken, meats, almonds and nuts, vegetables (carrots, potatoes, onions mostly) and tuna. And a protein shake.


    PS: I should add that on my last workout last week I also felt weaker. I lifted the same amount of weights but I could feel less strong. I believe this has to do with the fact that I lowered my carb intake.

    I'd like to come up with a diet where I keep my strength as much as possible. It was easy bulking, I just ate more. But eating less whilst getting rid of the cravings is proving to be difficult.

    Thank you for reading. If you need any more information I'd be happy to oblige.
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

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    Registered User TrueBDB's Avatar
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    You can eat the same things you ate on your bulk, just less of them. How many calories do you plan to cut on? Keep in mind you want to keep protein at least 1g/lb LBM so most likely you would cut down on carbs and fats.
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    Resident Malteser. xuerebx's Avatar
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    I'm thinking about starting a 500 calorie deficit. I "think" that maintenance would be around 2300 calories for me? Is there any semi-reliable calorie maintenance calculator I could use? (I realise the best way is through experience, but a rough estimate would help)

    This was my bulking diet for December to now:



    I used to deviate a bit from this naturally (eating other meats instead of chicken, eating weetabix instead of muesli etc).

    I was also planning on adding more almonds and nuts, is that a good idea?
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

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    awesome chart you made up there...i might do something like that cause it's just cool looking...

    I started at around maybe 1800kcal on my cut (but probably was closer to 2000 because of measuring wrong, etc.)...I was eating 5-6 meals per day, all weighed out (4 ounces meat, 100grams carb source)...found that eating that often meant I wasn't hungry even though it was fewer calories than I was used to.

    I just cut my calories down to 1400 today, and I'll be staying at this number for a few weeks...still managing to get 195grams of protein in as well, so big + there

    My log has daily diet stuff in it if you're curious what I'm eating, though it's incredibly boring, but I'm making good progress both in the gym and in the mirror (pg 42 of march-june diet contest has before and after from March 8 to March 29) and it's quite a good change w/o any loss of strength in the gym.

    I know it's not for everyone, but working for me quite well
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    figure out ur maintenance
    The Harris-Benedict formula (BMR based on total body weight)
    Men: BMR = 66 + (13.7 X wt in kg) + (5 X ht in cm) - (6.8 X age in years)

    Katch-McArdle formula (BMR based on lean body weight)
    BMR (men and women) = 370 + (21.6 X lean mass in kg)

    Then multiply the BMR with ur activity level

    Activity factor
    Sedentary = BMR X 1.2 (little or no exercise, desk job)

    Lightly active = BMR X 1.375 (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/wk)

    Mod. active = BMR X 1.55 (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/wk)

    Very active = BMR X 1.725 (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days/wk)

    Extr. Active = BMR X 1.9 (hard daily exercise/sports & physical job or 2 X day training, marathon, football camp, contest, etc.)

    then throw in the 500 cal defacit

    maintain a high protein diet 1-1.5g protein per lb, LEAN body mass
    work out and lift heavy
    and most importantly count your calories. i use my fitness pal on iphone and i love it.
    also u should look into glutamine and bcaas to help minimize muscle loss
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    Resident Malteser. xuerebx's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by luckducky433 View Post
    awesome chart you made up there...i might do something like that cause it's just cool looking...

    I started at around maybe 1800kcal on my cut (but probably was closer to 2000 because of measuring wrong, etc.)...I was eating 5-6 meals per day, all weighed out (4 ounces meat, 100grams carb source)...found that eating that often meant I wasn't hungry even though it was fewer calories than I was used to.

    I just cut my calories down to 1400 today, and I'll be staying at this number for a few weeks...still managing to get 195grams of protein in as well, so big + there

    My log has daily diet stuff in it if you're curious what I'm eating, though it's incredibly boring, but I'm making good progress both in the gym and in the mirror (pg 42 of march-june diet contest has before and after from March 8 to March 29) and it's quite a good change w/o any loss of strength in the gym.

    I know it's not for everyone, but working for me quite well
    Thank you. How do you ratio your P/F/C exactly? I'm taking a look at your log right now.

    Originally Posted by jdies View Post
    figure out ur maintenance
    The Harris-Benedict formula (BMR based on total body weight)
    Men: BMR = 66 + (13.7 X wt in kg) + (5 X ht in cm) - (6.8 X age in years)

    Katch-McArdle formula (BMR based on lean body weight)
    BMR (men and women) = 370 + (21.6 X lean mass in kg)

    Then multiply the BMR with ur activity level

    Activity factor
    Sedentary = BMR X 1.2 (little or no exercise, desk job)

    Lightly active = BMR X 1.375 (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/wk)

    Mod. active = BMR X 1.55 (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/wk)

    Very active = BMR X 1.725 (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days/wk)

    Extr. Active = BMR X 1.9 (hard daily exercise/sports & physical job or 2 X day training, marathon, football camp, contest, etc.)

    then throw in the 500 cal defacit

    maintain a high protein diet 1-1.5g protein per lb, LEAN body mass
    work out and lift heavy
    and most importantly count your calories. i use my fitness pal on iphone and i love it.
    also u should look into glutamine and bcaas to help minimize muscle loss
    When using the first method I got a maintenance calorie of 1910 calories.

    When using the second method I got 1840 calories. I assumed I am around 15% body fat, I'm probably fatter though.

    However if I multiply with 1.55 and deduct the 500 calorie deficit...I end up at 2400 calories, and I was bulking with a bit more than this amount (and I did in fact put on weight).

    I always count calories when I start a new diet, then it becomes natural to know how much I'm eating without counting anything.

    Thank you both.
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

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    Registered User jdies's Avatar
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    No problem, thanx for the rep! I'm almost green now

    I would try to lose about a lb a week which will minimize muscle loss. Take it nice and slow. That maintenance is a good place to start. Adjust accordingly
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    Resident Malteser. xuerebx's Avatar
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    Cheers.

    So I'm trying to come up with a diet plan from scratch now. What P/F/C ratio would be adequate for cutting?
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

    "But it ain't about how hard you can hit - it's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done!"

    "Get up, and don't ever give up".
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    Resident Malteser. xuerebx's Avatar
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    So, I tried to come up with the foods I ate today, and....



    (I made a mistake with weetabix, should have been 60g)

    Totals: 2370calories - 222g protein | 180g carbs | 80g fats

    That's still a lot, and I have no idea what I'm going to cut more. I still feel very hungry eating just those, not to mention all of those are just breakfast | lunch | dinner | shake, that's like a meal and a half less than my bulk (and that's a lot, for me).

    What should I cut? Is the P/F/C ratio adequate? Also, does the chicken leg and thigh value look off? 580calories for that seems a lot.
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

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    I just cut my calories down to 1400 today, and I'll be staying at this number for a few weeks...still managing to get 195grams of protein in as well, so big + there
    Curious to your diet as i feel im not getting enough protein in at the moment and im eating around the same cals as you.
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    I have been doing 40/40/20 for the past two months and staying about 500-600 under maintainence and it has worked pretty well for me. Also something else that may help is that you mentioned you were still hungry with your previous cut plan, did you try adding in a small meal with around a 20 min Cardio walk to negate those few calories you'd consume?
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    Resident Malteser. xuerebx's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Sumiit View Post
    I have been doing 40/40/20 for the past two months and staying about 500-600 under maintainence and it has worked pretty well for me. Also something else that may help is that you mentioned you were still hungry with your previous cut plan, did you try adding in a small meal with around a 20 min Cardio walk to negate those few calories you'd consume?
    According to that table I made, my ratio of P/C/F is:

    46/37/17

    So that's a bit more focus on protein.

    I do cardio 3x a week, however that's a good idea now that you mention it, thank you.
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

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    if you want drop protein to around 180 grams and increase both fats and carbs, you will feel fuller and have more energy for your workouts...
    200+ grams of protein at your weight is really not needed
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    Resident Malteser. xuerebx's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by noaddedhormones View Post
    if you want drop protein to around 180 grams and increase both fats and carbs, you will feel fuller and have more energy for your workouts...
    200+ grams of protein at your weight is really not needed
    I actually never aimed for 200+ g in protein intake, they just sort of built up when I was choosing food. I actually thought I was taking less than 150g. I don't always eat tuna so I guess that puts it down to 190g for most days. Although you make a good point.
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

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    Originally Posted by xuerebx View Post
    Thank you. How do you ratio your P/F/C exactly? I'm taking a look at your log right now.
    Sorry this took a while to get back to you, I've been bogged down with an injury and a dead laptop

    I don't do a p/f/c type setup, though I do generally know what I'm eating; instead I weight what I'm eating, knowing that certain foods offer XX calories, XX protein, etc.

    Just 4oz. chicken 3-4x a day with carb source if I desire it (now no more than 50grams a serving)

    Red meat source for dinner (little bigger, 5oz. or so) and some almonds to add to my fat macro...also, fat is needed for testosterone production (or so I've been told) so I eat it with my last meal so that during REM sleep when you release testosterone, I've got it available...not sure if it matters but I do it because it seems logical to me

    This last week I've been off my diet because of unrelated problems that have affected my ability to get out and shop (damn near broke my ankle), but I'll be back on the diet today as I can kinda walk-ish (it's more like a hobble). When I counted this up, it was 1386kcal (but I say 1500 because we all make mistakes and I add a TSP of mayo sometimes when I cook the steak) while still getting me 195grams of protein...pretty good for such a deficit




    P.S. Didn't see you're from Malta...I loved that island! Rented a moto for 4 days and just cruised
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    Hope you recover soon from your injury. I hate it when I have to set aside my workout schedule even just for once; the last time I had to stop for 2 weeks killed me!

    I believe I'm eating around 1300 calories (now that you mention it, I forgot to add the red sauce I usually put on my pasta). I've went down 4.4lbs in 2 weeks (could be water weight too) so I'll wait a couple of more weeks and see where this diet takes me!

    Glad you loved our small country.
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    come check out our beaches in summer, you want be disappointed ^_^

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    Glad to see another Malteser ( ) running around!
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    ahah yes.. finally there are maltese, i remember back in 2006 and there was what?... only a handful of pple, me being the only one active. same for all the other major BBing boards, (MD, Rx, Tnation, musclemayhem etc..) Now its nice to see some active people... you and a few other guys (i wish i could add girls but not in a million years would i be able to incl girls in that sentence)
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  20. #20
    Resident Malteser. xuerebx's Avatar
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    I do know of one Maltese woman bodybuilder ( http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/jessicaghi/ ).
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

    "But it ain't about how hard you can hit - it's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done!"

    "Get up, and don't ever give up".
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  21. #21
    Wasted Potential mikill's Avatar
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    Ijja i know her, she is also very good friends with http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/caqawoman/ they are perhaps the only 2 who are productively active
    She has competed a few times before Nabba & at the Nabba Universe i believe.

    There are some pictures of them @ their competitions over here http://maltabodybuilding.com/index.php , a few local competitors post there, competitors which include the
    current top 2 bbers in Malta! I`m also active
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  22. #22
    Resident Malteser. xuerebx's Avatar
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    So...4 full weeks have passed now:

    Start of Week 1: 176.44lbs - Waist: 37.25"
    Start of Week 5 (today): 173.58lbs - Waist: 37"

    This is not good. I guess I'll drop the calories down to 2000 then, since 2200-2300 isn't working for me.

    I should note that I resumed my creatine intake after 2 weeks into my cut (I took a 2 week break from taking 5g daily) on Week 3, so I guess I could have some water retention now. I was also down to 171.82lbs Monday of last week (Week 4).

    It's a bit frustrating because I'm actually sticking to my diet. I have not noticed any strength loss, in fact, although this does not make much sense, I increased some of my lifts which I had sort of plateaued in.
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

    "But it ain't about how hard you can hit - it's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done!"

    "Get up, and don't ever give up".
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  23. #23
    Registered User crussell's Avatar
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    Let's rip that body geo
    ** If the Bar ain't bendin, stop pretendin! **
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  24. #24
    Resident Malteser. xuerebx's Avatar
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    An update...

    I've lost 10lbs in 12 weeks. I've been trying to minimise or negate muscle loss as much as possible. I was aiming at 1lb per week, but I didn't always manage, hence I'm 2lbs behind schedule.

    Anyway, once I finish my exams I'll start incorporating cardio during the week. It'll help.
    "Pain is temporary. It my last for a minute, an hour, or a day. Or even a year. But eventually - it will subside, and something else will take its place. If I quit however, it will last forever."

    "But it ain't about how hard you can hit - it's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done!"

    "Get up, and don't ever give up".
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