A Guide to Ketosis

[mannythe13]

I've been wanting to follow this diet for a couple weeks, but I'm a little scared. I don't wanna have to start over after drinking a few beers for my buddy's wedding and a birthday (I know, lame excuse to drink alcohol), and I don't want to be in a pissy mood for a couple weeks while doing it. I do have some questions tho.. Where would avocados fit into this keto diet? I love avocados, and they're a great source of fat, but I'm afraid of the carbs in it. Also, I was reading somewhere on here that gummy bears are great to eat after a workout. I try to get about 20g of carbs from them after I workout, but how would that fit in with this diet? Would it be possible to do? Or should I only limit them to a re feed day? I'm thinking pizza with ice cream and gummy bears? I've read so much about it, and I really wanna try it, but I'm not sure how to put it into practice

[Riktheimpaler]

Please only answer this if you know it as fact not conjecture.
When using ketone strips to test urine, won't the amount of consumed fluid and frequency change the results via dilution? Also do the strips measure burned body fat or total burned fat (including consumed fat). If so, then does that mean all these people saying that coconut oil really starts the ketone juices flowing. In actuality, they are not burning body fat, but increased burning of consumed fat?????

[samira858666]

Thank you, that was a very good read.

[JonBana]

Please only answer this if you know it as fact not conjecture.
When using ketone strips to test urine, won't the amount of consumed fluid and frequency change the results via dilution? Also do the strips measure burned body fat or total burned fat (including consumed fat). If so, then does that mean all these people saying that coconut oil really starts the ketone juices flowing. In actuality, they are not burning body fat, but increased burning of consumed fat?????

Urine test strips are a toy , they do not give an accurate reading this have been proven over and over ,
one of the main factors is hydration , if you are really hydrated it will read low , if you are dehydrated it will read high ,
another problem is when you're body adapts to ketosis you will not be wasting ketones you will be burning them for energy so it can and will show zero no little trace and you will be full blown keto ,

I use a blood glucose meter and always will , I can have the piss strips show dark purple 15+ , and my blood meter only show 1.0 anything above 0.5 is nutritional ketosis ,

with a fast google search from reliable sources you will find the ketonix piss strips are a waste of money and don't get by them at anytime they test ketones being extracted not beta in the blood which what matters

[nicholina]

Urine test strips are a toy , they do not give an accurate reading this have been proven over and over ,
one of the main factors is hydration , if you are really hydrated it will read low , if you are dehydrated it will read high ,
another problem is when you're body adapts to ketosis you will not be wasting ketones you will be burning them for energy so it can and will show zero no little trace and you will be full blown keto ,

I use a blood glucose meter and always will , I can have the piss strips show dark purple 15+ , and my blood meter only show 1.0 anything above 0.5 is nutritional ketosis ,

with a fast google search from reliable sources you will find the ketonix piss strips are a waste of money and don't get by them at anytime they test ketones being extracted not beta in the blood which what matters

Do you think body fat factors into this? Do people with low body fat like you and I waste very little ketones in urine since they are being used for energy due to the lack of fat stores to draw on? I have never tested + on ketostix

[JonBana]

Do you think body fat factors into this? Do people with low body fat like you and I waste very little ketones in urine since they are being used for energy due to the lack of fat stores to draw on? I have never tested + on ketostix

No it doesn't factory into it from what I know , but what I know is when you're body gets fat adapted , the longer you are in ketosis , you're body will use ketones for energy aka , muscles , liver , organs , brain function etc, so it will not waste ketones through urine and use them for you're body because it becomes efficient as using them once you are adapted ,

when you're not adapted , you're body isn't quit sure what to do with the extra ketones so I will extract them as needed , they will always be extracted through urine but as you get adapted there will be less , but like I said before hydration plays a big role in those stupid test urine samples ,

they are nice to play around with but never rely on them , if you are serious about ketosis long term it doesn't hurt to get blood ketone meter like many of us use or a ketone breath tester , this way you can raise you're protein and carbs and test you're limits on how high you can go on carbs and proteins and still stay in ketosis

Even at low BF percentages we still have enough amounts of calories as fat that can be used I think a person with 5% body fat still has 70,000 calories of fat cells the body can use so low BF has nothing to do with it , I think im wrong on this number Im just to lazy to check the exact number in my book my McDonald going to bed

hope this helped

[danfleysher]

Urine test strips are a toy , they do not give an accurate reading this have been proven over and over ,
one of the main factors is hydration , if you are really hydrated it will read low , if you are dehydrated it will read high ,
another problem is when you're body adapts to ketosis you will not be wasting ketones you will be burning them for energy so it can and will show zero no little trace and you will be full blown keto ,

I use a blood glucose meter and always will , I can have the piss strips show dark purple 15+ , and my blood meter only show 1.0 anything above 0.5 is nutritional ketosis ,

with a fast google search from reliable sources you will find the ketonix piss strips are a waste of money and don't get by them at anytime they test ketones being extracted not beta in the blood which what matters

Whats the blood meter that you use to test for ketosis?

[JonBana]

Whats the blood meter that you use to test for ketosis?

free style precision neo

[marclandon001]

Overall good read, really excited to try this. I have a couple concerns though..

As per cyclic glycogen refeeds, you say to lose body fat it is counterproductive to have glycogen refeeds every weekend. The article you linked for mass gains, by lyle Mcdonald, claims that his article is strictly for body fat loss and not mass gains. His article recommends refeeds every Saturday. I was just wondering if you could clear any misconceptions up about both yours and his opinions on refeeds for body fat loss, and maybe when you think the best time to reefed is for body fat loss.

Also, to transition into ketosis more quickly you recommended HIIT in the mornings of day 1 and 2. Lyle Mcdonald seems to say that low intensity is better?

Hope you can clear these concerns up, thanks!

[danfleysher]

As per cyclic glycogen refeeds, you say to lose body fat it is counterproductive to have glycogen refeeds every weekend. The article you linked for mass gains, by lyle Mcdonald, claims that his article is strictly for body fat loss and not mass gains. His article recommends refeeds every Saturday. I was just wondering if you could clear any misconceptions up about both yours and his opinions on refeeds for body fat loss, and maybe when you think the best time to reefed is for body fat loss.

Also, to transition into ketosis more quickly you recommended HIIT in the mornings of day 1 and 2. Lyle Mcdonald seems to say that low intensity is better?

Hope you can clear these concerns up, thanks!

I know this question isn't directed to me but I wanted to provide some information from what I've learned going through Keto. I have not read Lyle McDonalds book, and maybe I should have, but I've been reading, discussing, and implementing ketosis for over a month.

As for your first question about refeeds, if your goal is strictly body fat loss, I wouldn't do a refeed. Some claim that it's a good way to "revamp" your metabolism by shocking it into over drive. I simply don't believe our bodies work like that. If you eat 5000 calories on one day, your body doesn't just start working extra hard. Similar to Ketosis, if you stop eating carbs for one day, your body doesn't just start using ketones all of the sudden.

As for the question regarding HIIT/Low Intensity - I think it depends on your daily activity. Low intensity will reduce glycogen in the blood stream with very little coming from muscle storages whereas HIIT will deplete both, but not as much will come from blood stream. This is a similar concept to how low intensity will burn more FAT calories while HIIT will burn more TOTAL calories. Interestingly enough, glycogen stored in your muscles will not flow back into your blood stream. If you're pretty active throughout the day or regularly engage in physical activity or weight lifting, HIIT would probably be better while if you're sedentary, low intensity is probably better.

[robizeratul]

One thing doesn't make much sense to me...I need to eat 200g of fat each day. I need 120g of Polyunsaturated fat. and 40/40 of the others. There is no way for me to actually get that without either eating too much carb, or too much of the other fats... I spent 20 minutes calculating stuff and it doesn't make sense to me. How do you guys do it?

[tramn1982]

Thank you for this informative post.

I'm on day#2 and I'm keeping track of it all through MyFitnessPal. Still new to this but I'm tracking it to make sure I don't go over the 30g of carbs allowed in a day. Not sure if it is best to hit my macros. I'm going to keep going over the keto contents on this forum.

[PrimalPerk]

Very Informative! Thank you!

Repped!

[Isaacroths123]

Lol, polyunsaturated superior to saturated? Based on that line of reasoning, the absolute best way to be in ketosis should be diabetic ketosis. Starvation also increases ketones pretty good, why not? You have no understanding of the human metabolism and the multiple ways polyunsaturated fat screws it up. Hyperlipid.com is an infinitely better resource for ketosis related science.

[ForScienz]

Sorry if this has been addressed in this thread already. Great post from OP. The only thing I dont understand is promoting PUFAs and MUFAs over SFAs.

I just watched a lecture by a leading keto guy and he said MUFAS should be 55%, SFAs 35% and PUFAs 10%. He said that PUFAs should be seen more as a micro supplement rather than a macro.

This to me makes more sense as vegetable oils are unnatural, dont exist in nature and our ancestors would have only eaten small amounts of seeds compared to the large amount of saturated fats from meat and dairy. I dont see how PUFAs can be considered healthy or how a natural diet can be made out of high PUFAs without drinking oil which is obviously not natural.

[ForScienz]

lol, turns out the last post on this thread was about the very same issue. Considering that was 4 months ago i'm guessing you all disagree :P

[Deepamot]

gr8 information

[vlad11]

Hello guys/gals,

I am currently reading Lyle's book "The Ketogenic Diet" and something bugs me: Why do we need protein on this diet? (The goal is fat loss only on a SKD * )

He states that the brain/body needs 100grams of glucose per day for energy while not in ketosis.

He also states that from the first few days of very low carb to the 3 week mark, the brain uses energy from 100% glucose (100 grams, 0 from ketones) down to 25% glucose (40 grams, rest from ketones).

He says that the body can only produce 18grams of glucose from fats, so the rest will be created via gluconeogensys/protein breakdown at the rate of 58% , and this is what we want to avoid (loss of body protein). He says that for the first days up to the 3 week mark we need to be consuming 150g down to 50g ( at the 3 week mark our glucose needs are lowered a lot) of protein so that the body doesn't convert body protein to fill that glucose requirement gap.

My question is, why not consume carbs/glucose at a 100% conversion rate (into glucose) to fill this gap? Why do we need massive amounts of protein at conversion rate (into glucose) of 58% to fill this glucose deficit?

Maybe i am misunderstanding this, ty in advance for replies !

[ankita0101]

The keto diet is rapidly gaining popularity with individuals struggling to lose weight and also with bodybuilders. Ketosis is a process in which the body burns fat deposits for energy, instead of carbohydrates, and this is the main goal of the keto diet; hence the name. The keto diet may be the latest fad, but the idea is not really new. It’s been around for a while now, often referred to as the low carb diet, low carb high fat (LCHF), ketogenic diet, and so on.

Ketosis is a process in which the body burns fat deposits for energy, instead of carbohydrates, and this is the main goal of the keto diet; hence the name.
Keto Diet Is Restrictive Not Extreme
The keto diet is restrictive in the sense that it requires you to limit carbohydrate intake. The key here is limitation, not elimination. This is why it is not an extreme or starvation diet, unlike many unhealthy diets that advocate complete elimination of certain nutrients that advocate complete elimination of certain nutrients and food groups. In this diet, you need to lower your carb intake, while consuming higher amounts of fat and adequate protein. By doing so, your body will no longer be able to create glucose from carbohydrates for energy. Instead, the liver begins breaking down fat cells to release energy, while also creating fatty acids and ketones.

Is The Keto Diet Sustainable?
Contrary to popular belief, you will find that restricting your caloric intake is fairly easy with the keto diet. The main feature of the diet is that you will be getting the bulk of your calories from fats and protein, rather than carbohydrates. This gives you plenty of delicious food options, which can be very filling. Once you’ve filtered out most of the carb-rich foods, specifically those with refined sugars and simple carbohydrates, you will find that there’s plenty of food you can add to your diet to reach your required caloric intake (around 2000 calories). In fact, you may find it tough to consume enough food each day to reach the required daily caloric intake! Yes, it’s a diet plan that will never leave you hungry.

Keto Diet Simplified
What’s great about the keto diet is that you will have plenty of food options for your diet and you don’t have to endure the torture of picking the same restrictive meal plans for months on end. The goal is keep your net carbohydrate intake within the range of 20 and 40 grams. Ideally, you should keep it below 30 grams for the diet to be most effective. If you’re confused about net carbs, it’s a pretty simple concept. A net carb is simply the figure you get by deducting fiber from carbs ingested. Still confused? Here’s how it works:

If you consume a single sliced raw carrot, you will ingest 4 grams of fiber against the total of 12 grams of carbohydrates. Your net carbs would be 12 total grams – 4 grams of fiber = 8 net carbs

What Do I Eat?
The keto diet breaks up your caloric intake into three broad macronutrient groups. Your food intake will be divided into 65-75% fats, 20-30% protein, and 5% or less of carbohydrates.

Carbohydrates:
As your carb intake is limited, you will need to get trace carbs from foods like vegetables, nuts, and dairy products. You can include vegetables like radish, cucumber, cauliflower, cabbage, squash and eggplant, as well as a variety of nuts. Dairy products like milk and cheese can also add to your carb intake. Just make sure to avoid foods rich in simple carbs and sugar like bread, pasta, pastries, fried foods, cereals, legumes, potatoes, and fruits.

Fat & Protein:
If you’re a meat eater, the keto diet gives you plenty to rejoice for. The majority of your macronutrients in this group will come from meats, as well as green leafy vegetables, and healthy fats like olive oil or organic butter. You can include meats like pork, beef, chicken, mutton, and seafood, while also consuming eggs. Your choice of leafy greens is also quite wide, as you can include broccoli, spinach, lettuce, and parsley, to name a few.

For mid-meal snacks, you can fill up on nuts and nut butters, cheese, and protein shakes.

While the keto diet is a great option, with a fair trade off of desserts and pastries for steaks and burgers, make sure to consult a nutritionist and your doctor before going on any diet plan that requires drastic modifications to your current plan. It would also be best to avoid this diet if you suffer from conditions like diabetes or hypercholesterolemia.

[LethalX]

Anyone else having an issue loading the first page. Getting a 500 error every time on all devices

[Puloma]

If you want to rid yourself of body-fat and LDL cholesterol, then you must follow the ketogenic diet. Under a normal glycolytic metabolism, fat is there only as last source of fuel. When your body needs energy under a glycolytic metabolism, it firsts resorts to your blood-stream for glucose. If not much blood-glucose is found, then your body will go to the liver to convert its stored glycogen into glucose. There if not much glycogen is found either, then your body will breakdown muscle and fat. Under ketosis, fat is the very first option to provide energy instead of anything else.

[iLiRaM]

thank you for the food list. i really really like how it hyperlinks to nutritional data. thank you thank you.

[AndMac]

Just read through all the info. (Okay, I skimmed through the scientific parts with the molecules, etc.) Very interesting read.

Thanks for taking the time to put this information together!

[SofiaCally]

Such a good read! Thanks for sharing!

[SkinnyBeast24]

I support keto for weight-loss, but when your goal is to gain strength + muscle + weight...i have no idea why you'd even consider a keto diet. Fat oxidation doesn't even ramp up to its maximum capacity for ATP production until 60 minutes.

Some key points:
First 30 min at 60-80%, glycogen main fuel
Fat oxidation limited by delay in mobilization of FA from adipose tissue
Glycerol taken up by liver and used as gluconeogenic precursor.

A well-balanced diet with CHO's at around 50-60% will yield in satisfied liver glycogen, muscle glycogen, and blood glucose levels to allow for optimal rapid glycolysis which is essential for providing the best performance when it comes to training.

I am not as educated as I would like to be when it comes to bioenergetics...but I ****ing love the topic. If somebody can explain to me how does the TCA cycle function optimally if pyruvate is lacking then i'd like to understand what is happening there on a high-keto diet.

This image shows the importance of pyruvate (from glycolysis) with oxaloacetate for complete oxidation of a fatty acid acetyl-COA.

[KetoCarol]

I really appreciate the effort that you put into this guide. Thank you!

[MRTHAWK]

Please forgive me if this has been asked. I have been trying to look for this question. I am knew to the keto family. I am currently 354lbs right now. If my overall goal is to be around 230, is that the total calories I take in or do I just do like 1200-1500 with the proper macros and let the weight come off. Thank you.

[Spald1ng]

I have a couple of questions, being new to it all here, but first of all thank you for putting this information up (albeit years ago now). So my questions;

1- We are recommended to eat a lot of leafy green veg as in lettuce and spinach however they are all amber in the food ratings. Wouldn't the sugar knock us out of keto?
2- Where do mushrooms come in on the scale (appreciate that there is a character limit)?

[Vet2Chemist]

Hey SkinnyBeast24,

I'll try my best to answer. When pyruvate is lacking, first consider that this is when gluconeogenesis is on. Conditions supporting gluconeogenesis slow the TCA cycle, but it can still turn because acetyl-CoA is oxidized from fatty acids, as you mentioned. (Beta-oxidation pathway yields lots and lots of acetyl-CoA.) The cycle depends on several things, including acetyl-CoA [IN] and oxaloacetate [IN].

Oxaloacetate is an intermediate (product of last TCA cylce reaction) which is combined with acetyl-CoA to produce citrate, continuing the cycle. Consider again that gluconeogenesis slows the TCA cylce, and this is because oxaloacetate is siphoned almost exclusively by gluconeo for the purposes of keeping healthy brain glucose levels.

Another thing to keep in mind is beta-oxidation requiring free-CoA for oxidizing fatty acids. Considering a body that operates under these conditions for a period of time, eventually all free-CoA and oxaloacetate are exhausted. This finally leads to the liver producing ketone bodies, avoiding the metabolic paradox of not being able to use fatty acids as fuel. Summarizing all of this in a short diagram.

prolonged period of low carb intake ----> rapid glycolysis + glycogen stores depleted ----> fatty acid catabolism = gluconeogenesis


prolonged fatty acid catabolism + gluconeogenesis = formation of ketone bodies

Hope this helps! Cheers!

[Ginaathletic]

Ketosis is a great way of life, if you want to make the commitment. Great thread!