A Guide to Ketosis

[jasonwilks]

I like your article, but I have to disagree with one thing you mentioned. With the CKD diet (cycling carbs in), you said your body has to first break down the wall of glycogen before it starts to tap back into bodyfat for fuel. I disagree with this. If you are well adapted into ketosis, then your body will only use the glycogen for strenuous muscle movements, your brain and heart will still function solely on ketones (from dietary fat or bodyfat). Thus you can be full of glycogen and still burn fat just as fast, if not even faster thanks to the increase thyroid activity from the carb loading. Carb loading also increases IGF-1 and testosterone. So in my mind it should be done. And from personal experience, I managed to still quickly decrease bodyfat %, while maintaining my muscles.

I personally carb load once every 5 days, and I do it for the first half of the day, and eat 6-8 cups of oats.

Hope this helps and I hope the original article does not steer people away from doing CKD diets.

[sprig]

I love how ranch dressing is listed as an ideal food

[yokeybear]

this is my 2nd keto session. I only lasted about 30 days last time only because after moving it was difficult eating the right foods and my new job at same time. I lost a good 20 lbs but gained it all back 4 months in time.

so as of 5 of weeks ago after listening to someone I met at a party saying he was a vegetarian and just talking with him about it I decided to challenge my self. I wanted fish in my diet though so I've been a pescatarian for 5 weeks now. As of last Monday I started my keto diet while being a pesc. I feel I've been able to do great with my diet so far.

Im currently at 235 lbs now and already fit in my large sized shirts again lol

Anyone else try keto while being a veg or pesc?

[kaizersoze]

Thank you. Good guide.

[nick4174]

shadowwalker thanks for making keto easy to understand (after a couple re-reads... my slow brain needs keto as much as my grampa tits do)

You said "ah, that is true. insulin is handy when dealing with muscle-growth. you are also correct when you say that there are different ways to spike insulin without the ingestion of sugars; for example, coconut oil spikes insulin levels, so perhaps drinking a post workout shake of coconut oil and protein powder after weight training is your best bet on a ketogenic diet (it would also be pretty tasty). "

but in the Lyle's book, in the TKD summary, he says no dietary fats post workout as it could slow digestion.

what are your thoughts on this?

i was going to do "intense" training in the gym and do a pre-workout ON Whey shake with 25 g dextrose and a post with 25 g dextrose and 1 TB coconut oil.

[nick4174]

After I adapt and move on to a Cyclical Ketogenic Diet do I still need to supplement dextrose before and after my workouts in the gym. I'll do intense workouts M,W,F.

Also for my Tu and Th cardio, would Yoga be considered a light to medium workout?

[becketmcginn]

Superb guide. Thank you

[skymagic]

Very cool, thanks.

[shadowwalker021]

Hello shaddowwalker. I have tried computing my macros for CKD diet using your guide but I feel something is wrong with respect to fat intake.

I am 57 inches, 165 lbs. Using the tape measurement method and the online calculator, I got 24% bodyfat. (1-0.24)*165 = 125 lbs LBM. I multiply this by 1 since I am moderately active, which gives me 125 g protein daily.

165 lbs*16 = 2640 calories. Since I want to gain muscle, I multiply this by 1.2, which give me 3168 calories daily. 3168*0.05 = 158 cals from carbs, which is 40 g carbs daily. Finally, 3160-158-(125*4) = 2510 cals from fat. 2510/3168*100 = 80% of total cals from fat. This seem very high to me.

Maybe my bodyfat is wrong?

the general ratios of ~65/30/5 are just that: general and non-personal. it's based on a 2000 kcal diet assuming 150 g of which are protein. obviously not everyone fits into this exactly so it's best to figure out exactly what you need yourself.

After I adapt and move on to a Cyclical Ketogenic Diet do I still need to supplement dextrose before and after my workouts in the gym. I'll do intense workouts M,W,F.

Also for my Tu and Th cardio, would Yoga be considered a light to medium workout?

the idea of a CKD is to be glyc. depleted when you carb up so no. i have no idea about the yoga

[Atavis]

The Yoga shouldn't be considered a workout at all. No dextrose needed or warranted unless you have a workout planned later in the same day.

[Ash159]

Hey everyone,

I am new to adapting my diet so I build more and I'm only 16 do you think I should do a ketosis diet or just stick to the diets in the Nutrition section, am I too young to be doing this I really don't want to destroy my body?

Please any advice on this would be awesome thanks alot

[DMurph51]

Hey everyone,

I am new to adapting my diet so I build more and I'm only 16 do you think I should do a ketosis diet or just stick to the diets in the Nutrition section, am I too young to be doing this I really don't want to destroy my body?

Please any advice on this would be awesome thanks alot

Keto won't hurt you at all. The diet is perscribed as a treatment for infants with certain diseases, so it will certainly be safe for you.

At your age tho, simply trying to gain mass can be accomplished easily simply by eating more and lifting heavy. Your're growing and need to support the growth by eating more food.

[neginfluence04]

A+ thread will finish it when i get home

[BackToBasicks]

Man this is a great guide from what I can tell... Thanks heaps for putting in the effort of compiling all this info into an easy to read reference . Wish I had proper rep to give haha.
Useful as I'm lookin at starting keto next week .

I grabbed some keto sticks and the doctor had a go at me about kidneys packin in on low carb, anything else apart from adequate hydration to help this?

[Trevor1900]

What about calculations of veggies and other carbohydrates with the mixing of fiber? Are these counted as 0 net carbs, given carbs = 10, fiber = 10.
Are there any stipulations on types of fibers with types of carbs?

Thanks

[stelladivine11]

Great thread!! Sums it all up in one place!! I haven't been in a keto in a few months, can't wait for the next two days!! I love the energy!

[gigahertz123]

So I'm on day 3 or so of the keto diet, very strict, down to around 14 net carbs/day. *Chicken, tomatoes, pickles, eggs, bacon, protein powder, flax (oh so much flax) etc. *I'm planning on buying the ketostix to see where I am but as of right now my god I am feeling fatigued. *Fell asleep on my lunch break and probably calling it an early night tonight. *Tried working out, wasn't happening. *I'm hoping once my body enters the full ketogentic state this will lift but it's tough right now! *I'm doing the EC stack at the same time now and that seems to temporarily relieve the brain fog a bit but I'm really just hoping to get through this so I can start working out again. *Also, any thoughts on alcohol while on keto? *Low/no carb stuff like wine and spirits. *Will they kick you out of keto?

[JMac370]

I am still a bit confused on pre/post workout shakes. you do or do not want to consume extra carbs with these shakes?


*edit* this is based on staying in Ketosis the whole time, the main goal is fat burning but obviously if the opportunity for muscle growth exists then game on. I was reading on your blog about coconut oil, would a whey shake and coconut oil suffice post workout only? Workouts will be pretty intense.

[gigahertz123]

I feel great today and I just realized that my fatigue and headache were probably because i got a tetanus shot the day before lol! Feeling fine now!

[paloabs]

hey man good work on this thread its really helpful but i have a few questions that would appreciate everyone help with please.

1: if i want to make my keto diet, i understand that the ratio is 60/35/5 f/p/c but is the ratio of my MAINTENANCE CALORIES?? or is it the ratio of a calorie deficit of my maintenance??

2: say i get my fats from almonds as one of the main sources, i know that majority of the macros in it is fats but it also contains quite a bit of carbs, does that affect the keto??

thanx in advance!

[DMurph51]

1) the keto diet ratios can fluctuate, but the main thing is to keep fats higher than 55%. the ratios you choose make no difference whether you're cutting, maintaining, or bulking. cutting, maintaining, and bulking is determined by caloric surplus or deficit.

2) as long as you're consuming less than 10g of non-fiber carbs in one sitting, your ketosis will not be effected.

some other things for you to consider:

- almonds and other nuts are not the most satiating sources of fats. a serving of nuts is nutrient dense, and as such, is tiny. you could be eating a lot more food with the same macro totals as 2 servings of nuts.

- better sources of fat and protein can be had than nuts. steak is a higher quality of protein (dat leucine....) and, in my opinion is much better tasting.

- it is the caloric deficit, not being in ketosis, which effects your weight loss. being in ketosis spares your muscles from being broken down to provide fuel for your body.

[paloabs]

1) the keto diet ratios can fluctuate, but the main thing is to keep fats higher than 55%. the ratios you choose make no difference whether you're cutting, maintaining, or bulking. cutting, maintaining, and bulking is determined by caloric surplus or deficit.

2) as long as you're consuming less than 10g of non-fiber carbs in one sitting, your ketosis will not be effected.

some other things for you to consider:

- almonds and other nuts are not the most satiating sources of fats. a serving of nuts is nutrient dense, and as such, is tiny. you could be eating a lot more food with the same macro totals as 2 servings of nuts.

- better sources of fat and protein can be had than nuts. steak is a higher quality of protein (dat leucine....) and, in my opinion is much better tasting.

- it is the caloric deficit, not being in ketosis, which effects your weight loss. being in ketosis spares your muscles from being broken down to provide fuel for your body.

thanx man!
but im still unsure about what your really saying,. im only having nuts as a fat source i also mix it up and have steak together on the same day.

so how much of a calorie deficit should i do when using the keto ratios?? is it still 500?
when i was doing dave palumbos keto i didnt have to alter the deficit and i was losing 1-2 pounds constantly a week so i doubt id have to change the calorie deficit if i made my own keto but its just i dont know how much of a deficit i should do.

also, are you saying im aloud to have carbs that contain fiber like broccoli and the ones listed in this thread? is there a limit as to how much fibrous carbs i eat? or are they meant to fill up the 5 percent of the keto ratio?

thanx

[DMurph51]

thanx man!
but im still unsure about what your really saying,. im only having nuts as a fat source i also mix it up and have steak together on the same day.

nuts just arent a good food to eat while dieting. they're calorie dense and not filling. this is a deadly combination that can lead to over-consumption of nuts, and thus, excess caloric intake. what i was trying to get at is that you should substitute your nut intake for a more satiating food (i suggested more steak, which is more filling and less calorie dense).

i understand that you are consuming the nuts for their fat content, but that fat content can be found in other sources of food which is more satiating and has a higher quality of protein (once again, a fatty cut of steak).

so how much of a calorie deficit should i do when using the keto ratios?? is it still 500?

i would go no further than a caloric deficit of 500 per day. imo, cutting any number up to 500 calories per day is fine.

when i was doing dave palumbos keto i didnt have to alter the deficit and i was losing 1-2 pounds constantly a week so i doubt id have to change the calorie deficit if i made my own keto but its just i dont know how much of a deficit i should do.

you're correct. your ratio's can change from the palumbo keto ratio, but as long as you maintain the same caloric deficit, your weight loss should be the same.

also, are you saying im aloud to have carbs that contain fiber like broccoli and the ones listed in this thread? is there a limit as to how much fibrous carbs i eat? or are they meant to fill up the 5 percent of the keto ratio?

you are allowed and encouraged to consume carbs that are fiber (broccoli and the others listed). fiber not only keeps you regular, but eating high-fiber veggies (like broccoli) allows you to consume nutrients that you otherwise would have to supplement (with something like a multi-vitamin) to get.

carbs from fiber do not count towards your carb total of your ratio. fiber is not used by the body the way a carb such as fructose or glucose is.

thanx

my responses in bold

brb, im off to carb-load and be a fat-ass
brb, 4k+ calories and pancakes....

[A.S.T.09]

I'm thinking about starting Keto next month, but have a couple questions. All this month I've been eating around 2000 calories (at a deficit) and doing SS and have lost about 2-3 pounds a week for a 5lb total loss so far. Been eating around 160g of protein, but not sure about carbs or fats. Can I still cut at 2000c on Keto? I used one of the calculators in the OP and it said I should be eating like 2600c a day, and I just can't do that.

[DMurph51]

I'm thinking about starting Keto next month, but have a couple questions. All this month I've been eating around 2000 calories (at a deficit) and doing SS and have lost about 2-3 pounds a week for a 5lb total loss so far. Been eating around 160g of protein, but not sure about carbs or fats. Can I still cut at 2000c on Keto? I used one of the calculators in the OP and it said I should be eating like 2600c a day, and I just can't do that.

you can still cut on keto at 2000 calories. the only difference will be that you'll be getting 60-70% of those calories from fat

[A.S.T.09]

you can still cut on keto at 2000 calories. the only difference will be that you'll be getting 60-70% of those calories from fat

So I'll be taking in less protein... is that, er, healthy? Would I lose muscle or anything by taking in less protein?

[DMurph51]

So I'll be taking in less protein... is that, er, healthy? Would I lose muscle or anything by taking in less protein?

you'll be fine.

[A.S.T.09]

I did some calculations and came out with this for my numbers: Total calories: 2000/day
Protein: 175g -- 700 calories
Fats: 133g -- 1200 calories
Carbs: 25g -- 100 calories

Do these numbers look good?

[DMurph51]

Do these numbers look good?

looks correct.

[CDQ109]

III. The Basics of the Ketogenic Diet

If you are unsure whether or not you should undergo a glycogen refeed, then simply ask yourself what your primary fitness goal is.

Is your primary goal to increase muscle-mass, to decrease body-fat, or to simply maintain your current body composition and health?

If your answer was to decrease body-fat, then a glycogen refeed would only be counterproductive to your goals.

If your answer was simply to maintain your body composition and health, then either choice is perfectly acceptable; i would personally opt for no refeeds as that is simpler and easier.

I am interested in starting a keto diet. My goal is to lose body fat. Just to be clear this is recommending that I never include any sort of glycogen re-feed or carb ups? If this is correct it would make things simpler; not having to try to do a clean carb load and not worrying about adjusting my diet for a few days. However it seems that everyone else says that the "re-feed" is essential for preserving lean muscle.