NOOBS! You are not a unique little snowflake!

[nondualism]

I'm tired of seeing every noob here posting one of two threads.

"New to cutting/where do I start?"

Where do you start? Gee, I dunno - maybe 'Fat Loss for Noobs'? That might be a good start! Do the three rules. If it doesn't work, THEN you ask how to tweak. (Hint: it always works!)

"Can you build muscle while burning fat?"

Wow. This only gets asked AT LEAST ONCE A DAY!! It's not a new question. If you just lurked for a moment or went three pages back, you'd find some other fuzznut asking this question.

Also...there's already a stickied 'Body fat estimate' thread. It gets a lot of responses. It's stickied. Why would you think you, in particular, need your own thread?

I think we should give any D-bag who posts this repetitive, unnecessary thread an automatic 22% body fat estimate. Or higher! 40%!

/rant

[Garlisk]

Rule #1: There is no bodybuilding.com

Anyway, while it does get annoying to see the same questions asked over and over, you have to remember this is a forum. Its the place where people are -supposed- to ask questions to be answered by their peers.

If people arn't asking stuff like that...this forum would be hella smaller, and we might as well just have a fat loss page, not a fat loss forum.

Just my opinion.

[mpipes]

I'm tired of seeing every noob here posting one of two threads.

"New to cutting/where do I start?"

Where do you start? Gee, I dunno - maybe 'Fat Loss for Noobs'? That might be a good start! Do the three rules. If it doesn't work, THEN you ask how to tweak. (Hint: it always works!)

"Can you build muscle while burning fat?"

Wow. This only gets asked AT LEAST ONCE A DAY!! It's not a new question. If you just lurked for a moment or went three pages back, you'd find some other fuzznut asking this question.

Also...there's already a stickied 'Body fat estimate' thread. It gets a lot of responses. It's stickied. Why would you think you, in particular, need your own thread?

I think we should give any D-bag who posts this repetitive, unnecessary thread an automatic 22% body fat estimate. Or higher! 40%!

/rant

It's always fun to vent a little bit, but don't worry, 90% of those repetitive threads are full of misinformation anyway.

[nondualism]

It's always fun to vent a little bit, but don't worry, 90% of those repetitive threads are full of misinformation anyway.

It's just....

I want to actually learn about what sorts of things people find when they get beyond the basic questions covered in two sticky threads and a bajillion 'Cut/gain' threads.

[drewott]

Its really all about attitude imo. If someone rolls in and demands a full meal plan, individualized macro breakdown and a go-ahead to eat fried cheese 50 times a day, that is not acceptable and they should be made aware of it.

If someone comes in, explains their situation and asks for advice, pointers, tips, etc. and isn't a total ass about it, then point them in the direction and move on. After a short time on the forum you know the toolbags who will post demands, troll a little and move on back to their bad habits and leave us to assist those who actually desire the advice.

-Drew

[iDrive]

Yes! Yes! Yes!

/end herbal essences commercial

5- Star thread.

Anyway, while it does get annoying to see the same questions asked over and over, you have to remember this is a forum. Its the place where people are -supposed- to ask questions to be answered by their peers.

A forum is: A public meeting or assembly for open discussion

It's a place to have a discussion about topics... a simple SEARCH would reveal similar discussions prior to the one some noob is about to ask where the question had already been asked. By asking a question that has already been answered you're preventing other more relevant topics from being discussed because they get pushed out of relevance.

I don't think I've ever started a thread on bb.com to ask a question... 10 seconds of your time can get you every opinion in the universe on the topic you want to know about.

If people arn't asking stuff like that...this forum would be hella smaller, and we might as well just have a fat loss page, not a fat loss forum.

I don't see a problem with this.

It's just....

I want to actually learn about what sorts of things people find when they get beyond the basic questions covered in two sticky threads and a bajillion 'Cut/gain' threads.

Agreed. I think the Advanced Fat Loss forum is supposed to be for that... but the difference between general and advanced fat loss is minimal to nil IMHO

[BlackMegatron]

Sometimes we want to hear different opinions, though. I understand your frustrations about us noobs but you have to understand why we would want more than just a couple opinions on different things. I wanted help with a cutting diet. I know i can search different stickies but i wanted to know what works for YOU..not just what the sticky tells me

[Garlisk]

I don't see a problem with this.

Me neither, but thats not what it is.

[drewsedg]

This is a discussion forum not a list of howto articles. People come here to discuss weight loss. No one forces you to open newbie threads. If you won't want to help them out you can choose not to read their thread and if you don't know what it is going into it you can stop reading when you find out. If it weren't for newb posts this forum and every other would stall out. I know these threads get a lot less exciting once you have learned all you can from them but no one forces you to keep reading them.

[csb5731]

Sometimes we want to hear different opinions, though. I understand your frustrations about us noobs but you have to understand why we would want more than just a couple opinions on different things. I wanted help with a cutting diet. I know i can search different stickies but i wanted to know what works for YOU..not just what the sticky tells me

Understandable. But it seems that a LOT of newbies have some impression that losing fat is way more complicated than it really is, and dwell on relatively unimportant minutiae often BEFORE THEY EVEN START "DIETING". Dwelling on these things actually seems to cloud the big picture, which is simply eating less, and getting adequate nutrition and exercise for health and muscle sparing purposes. All covered in the sticky.

And everybody will have a different take on dieting, depending on what has worked for them, or even the last book that they read. Oftentimes, there is additionally a lot of misinformation. Combine many different “takes” on losing fat, throw in a good dose of misinformation, and you just get a more confused newb. Honestly, we've seen it before. There was recently a guy posting nearly daily, apparently confused as hell, hadn't started dieting yet (had been planning to "start Monday" for MONTHS), and kept changing up his plans. Getting a bunch of different and often adamant opinions didn't help, though ultimately I think it was his fear of getting started is what hurt him most. I bet he's still getting fatter.

But the big thing, like a previous poster suggested, is ATTITUDE. If the guy/gal doesn’t want to put any thought or mental energy into his own diet, based on what he/she likes, or at least can tolerate, afford, etc., then it’s unlikely they can stick to a program that some random guy on the internet throws out to them. They aren’t serious about it. So it’s just a waste of time for all parties involved.

[williamshane]

I'm tired of seeing every noob here posting one of two threads.

"New to cutting/where do I start?"

Where do you start? Gee, I dunno - maybe 'Fat Loss for Noobs'? That might be a good start! Do the three rules. If it doesn't work, THEN you ask how to tweak. (Hint: it always works!)

"Can you build muscle while burning fat?"

Wow. This only gets asked AT LEAST ONCE A DAY!! It's not a new question. If you just lurked for a moment or went three pages back, you'd find some other fuzznut asking this question.

Also...there's already a stickied 'Body fat estimate' thread. It gets a lot of responses. It's stickied. Why would you think you, in particular, need your own thread?

I think we should give any D-bag who posts this repetitive, unnecessary thread an automatic 22% body fat estimate. Or higher! 40%!

/rant

Have to keep in mind that the people asking the newbie questions are just that—newbies.
While it would be great if they were experts, chances are they don't realize yet how common their questions are.

[mosdel]

although i know a lot more now than when i first joined the forum, i know what noobs are thinking.

one thing i noticed when i started out is when you do use the search feature, you get tons of contradictory advice from reading those threads. so as a newbie, its very overwhelming and you're basically like "forget it, i'll just post a thread and ask"

even now, i could do a search on whether or not i should be including healthy fats in my post workout shake, and i'll get many different opinions on both sides. so its hard to tell which advice to follow.


and also, as mentioned above, as a newb you're looking to get as many opinion as you can

[Pennyw1se]

Its funny that most of the people defending noob threads have registered in 2010. I'd like to see what they think in a few months.

No one is saying that NO noob threads should be started. Yes, there are some threads that should be posted but the bigger issue is when someone starts a thread and asks:
1. I am new and don't know what to do.
2. Give me a diet plan.
3. Tell me how many calories to eat.
4. Shut up. Tell me how many calories to eat.
5. I don't like that plan. Give me another one.
6. Should I work out?

These are the threads that drive me crazy.

[drewsedg]

Its funny that most of the people defending noob threads have registered in 2010. I'd like to see what they think in a few months.

No one is saying that NO noob threads should be started. Yes, there are some threads that should be posted but the bigger issue is when someone starts a thread and asks:
1. I am new and don't know what to do.
2. Give me a diet plan.
3. Tell me how many calories to eat.
4. Shut up. Tell me how many calories to eat.
5. I don't like that plan. Give me another one.
6. Should I work out?

These are the threads that drive me crazy.

I have been active on forums for something like 10 years now. Just because I have recently joined here doesn't make me new to the game. Every forum complains about newbie questions overlooking the fact that they are what drive discussion forums.

[hankst]

I have been active on forums for something like 10 years now. Just because I have recently joined here doesn't make me new to the game. Every forum complains about newbie questions overlooking the fact that they are what drive discussion forums.

I would not call poo flinging discussions.

This is how it usually goes:

A: "What shall I do?"
B: "Do <something that works> and eat 6 small a day!"
C: "You don't need 6 meals per day."
B: "You don't know ****, Chris Aceto said so."
C: "You're a retard, and so is he. Lyle and all the others say meal frequency doesn't matter a lot."
B: "**** you, *******; have fun staying a fatty."

etc.

I'm just sick of this bull****.

5 star thread, Chet.

[Pennyw1se]

I have been active on forums for something like 10 years now. Just because I have recently joined here doesn't make me new to the game. Every forum complains about newbie questions overlooking the fact that they are what drive discussion forums.

I don't disagree with you. All I did was state fact. From my post up, are all defenders of noob threads from 2010? Yes, they are.

And I also stated that not all noob threads are unnecessary, but I gave a VERY specific example of those that are truly unnecessary. What is the result of someone posting those threads? Usually someone will say "read the stickies" or, even more specifically, "read the How To Lose Fat for Noobs sticky". If you've read that stick you will know that EVERY single one of the 6 topics are answered there.
I do take the time to respond to those unnecessary threads. With what response? Read the sticky because that's where all noobs should start. ALL NEWBIES!!!!

[saiyandide]

I am a noobie myself I have only posted one thread that was asking a question about myself and what I am doing. Thing is I did that after using the search feature and reading similar post but none that were actually what I wanted to know. I found 99% of anything I wanted to find out. I still think there is plenty of reasons to ask questions like when someone is making progress starts to have trouble and wants others opinions on their diet and what they might be doing wrong, but that again is "after" they have already done something on their own.


I like helping people out by giving them advise but most the time its just typing eat less calories then your BMR to lose weight and it goes unheard.

[drewsedg]

I would not call poo flinging discussions.

This is how it usually goes:

A: "What shall I do?"
B: "Do <something that works> and eat 6 small a day!"
C: "You don't need 6 meals per day."
B: "You don't know ****, Chris Aceto said so."
C: "You're a retard, and so is he. Lyle and all the others say meal frequency doesn't matter a lot."
B: "**** you, *******; have fun staying a fatty."

etc.

I'm just sick of this bull****.

5 star thread, Chet.

Any time you have people spreading misinformation like that it is good that the thread got posted because it allows someone with proper knowledge to correct and explain.

[drewsedg]

I don't disagree with you. All I did was state fact. From my post up, are all defenders of noob threads from 2010? Yes, they are.

And I also stated that not all noob threads are unnecessary, but I gave a VERY specific example of those that are truly unnecessary. What is the result of someone posting those threads? Usually someone will say "read the stickies" or, even more specifically, "read the How To Lose Fat for Noobs sticky". If you've read that stick you will know that EVERY single one of the 6 topics are answered there.
I do take the time to respond to those unnecessary threads. With what response? Read the sticky because that's where all noobs should start. ALL NEWBIES!!!!

Sticky threads are ignored on every forum. There is a reason we have a super popular thread that gets bumped every few days. No one wants it stickied and ignored.

[csb5731]

Any time you have people spreading misinformation like that it is good that the thread got posted because it allows someone with proper knowledge to correct and explain.

Not really. Newbs seldom know who to believe, which is understandable, and in general the most adamant, insistent folk are often the most wrong.

[Gusthebus]

Op u mad ? Don't answer the noobs easy as that? I ignore dumb questions

[Pennyw1se]

sticky threads are ignored on every forum. There is a reason we have a super popular thread that gets bumped every few days. No one wants it stickied and ignored.

ok.

[drewsedg]

Not really. Newbs seldom know who to believe, which is understandable, and in general the most adamant, insistent folk are often the most wrong.

It is pretty easy for a layman to notice who is educated and who isn't. If someone cannot explain the hows and whys and instead sticks to "XXX said so" they obviously don't know what they are talking about.

[csb5731]

It is pretty easy for a layman to notice who is educated and who isn't. If someone cannot explain the hows and whys and instead sticks to "XXX said so" they obviously don't know what they are talking about.

The whole weight-loss industry is chock full of very educated folk (many PhD's) and they often beg to differ with each other. But many are just trying to sell you books, supplements, videos, etc. Many of these guys get a little creative with the truth, and if newbs were so discerning, these guys wouldn't be as rich as they are. And moreover, the people with the most misleading if not erroneous information also tend to have the best websites/propaganda/marketing (read: most awesome transformation pics and hottest chicks, pervasiveness in the interweb). Their livelihood depends on it.

And, perhaps unfortunately, the straightest-shooters out there, not naming-names, have comparitively bland websites and marketing for their books. Newbs by and large typically aren't all that interested in reading their stuff.

Really, for the most part, simpler is better. No need to keep retyping what's been written in the sticky. If a newb has a question about it, somebody will be glad to help. That's why that thread still get's significant traffic.

I agree that this sites search feature is not the best, and the results can be impossible to screen through, but I question the need to ask the same question that is asked and answered just three or four posts beneath.

[drewsedg]

The whole weight-loss industry is chock full of very educated folk (many PhD's) and they often beg to differ with each other. But many are just trying to sell you books, supplements, videos, etc. Many of these guys get a little creative with the truth, and if newbs were so discerning, these guys wouldn't be as rich as they are. And moreover, the people with the most misleading if not erroneous information also tend to have the best websites/propaganda/marketing (read: most awesome transformation pics and hottest chicks, pervasiveness in the interweb). Their livelihood depends on it.

And, perhaps unfortunately, the straightest-shooters out there, not naming-names, have comparitively bland websites and marketing for their books. Newbs by and large typically aren't all that interested in reading their stuff.

Really, for the most part, simpler is better. No need to keep retyping what's been written in the sticky. If a newb has a question about it, somebody will be glad to help. That's why that thread still get's significant traffic.

I agree that this sites search feature is not the best, and the results can be impossible to screen through, but I question the need to ask the same question that is asked and answered just three or four posts beneath.

And none of those people are here on this forum. We are group of individuals with a common goal. If someone cannot state the basic biology of what causes fatloss to a reasonable degree of accuracy they don't know what they are talking about.

No one says you have to retype what is in the sticky or even respond to threads with questions answered there.

Simple is best but as I said before this discussion forum not a collection of articles put up for someone to read. People come here to talk about themselves. They have likely heard or read some of the misinformation from people trying to sell them something so when they come here and read "eat less, move more" they are going to have some questions and be skeptical.

[csb5731]

And none of those people are here on this forum. We are group of individuals with a common goal. If someone cannot state the basic biology of what causes fatloss to a reasonable degree of accuracy they don't know what they are talking about.

The thing is, these "experts" don't need to post here. They have gotten enough people to believe them, and their explanations as well. And they have plenty of (on the surface, at least) very legit-sounding information available as ammunition. And it's why there is so much misinformation.

The simple fact is that plenty of people DO USE THE STICKY. I've been to the Post Your Pics section (and, ahem, even the MISC) on BB.com and have seen some pretty amazing examples, guys who'd seldom if ever posted in this subforum. They get asked, "How'd you lose the weight?". Answer: "Wavelength method, Lossing Fat For Newbs Sticky" I've seen it. These guys took what they had to and ran with it. If that sticky didn't exist, I bet the problem would be way worse. It's a good thing, that sticky.

There are still plenty of reasons for Newbs to ask questions, and they should ask them. But it really shouldn't be a vague one like "How do I lose fat?". If they missed the sticky, point it out to them. They can read it, and then ask more specific question(s), providing adequate details.

Honestly, when I go to say a motorcycle or car-type forum to try and figure out to make a specific repair or modification, the first thing I look for is a sticky. Not only is the advice going to be typically far more complete than what some guy is going to be willing to type out specifically for me, I don't have to wait for a reply or have to look like an asshat bumping it all the time.

[csb5731]

Sticky threads are ignored on every forum. There is a reason we have a super popular thread that gets bumped every few days. No one wants it stickied and ignored.

Problem: My bike won’t start. I know the battery was fully charged when I put it in last week.

Which solution, of the two below, is faster and easier? For all parties involved?

Solution A
1) Find forum on interweb specific to my make/model year of bike.
2) Go to forum
3) Find sub-forum specific to electrical problems
4) Holy crap, there’s a sticky for diagnosing the most common electrical problems! I’ll read that first.
5) Read sticky. Sticky shows exactly which bodywork to remove, which connectors to check, voltage specifications, and exactly how to determine what’s messed up. Freaking A, this is great!
6) Do what’s said in sticky. Viola! Find offending part, a blown regulator.
7) Order new part
8) Put part in. Bike fixed.

Solution B
1) Find forum on interweb specific to my make/model year of bike.
2) Go to forum
3) Find sub-forum specific to electrical problems
4) Holy crap, there’s a sticky for diagnosing the most common electrical problems! Screw that, reading is a lot of work! I want to talk about it and bitch some. I like to bitch.
5) Post: “My Bike Won’t Start – HELP!”
6) Wait 15 minutes. No replies. “Bumpity.”
7) Wait another 30 minutes. No replies. Fargin’ Iceholes! “BUMP”
8) A reply!: “Did you check the battery connections?” You: “Nah. I really want to ride my bike, though! Should I check them?”
…….
19) “I know my connections are good! I checked them. Getting off the seat sure was a hassle, though. I had to use tools. What do I do now, it’s summer and I want to ride my bike?!”
…….
26) “Bump! Come on guys, I REALLY want to ride my bike and look cool for chicks!”
…….
33) “Jones666, you didn’t do a very good job of telling me how to get the rear plastic off. I scratched it with my putty knife and know it looks like s%^t! Thanks a lot! Now how do I check voltage? Which connectors? The green or the clear one?”
…….
38) “By black and white do you mean the black wire with the white stripe, or the white wire with the black stripe? You guys are confusing me. I really want to ride my bike! Will chicks mind that I have a scratch in my rear plastic? Jones666 is such an a%^hole! Could you guys suggest to me a cool sticker that would cover it up?”
…….

[nondualism]

How about this one?

"I'm new to fat loss, suggest a diet, a fat burner, etc. Also, how many calories should I get (while offering no info on weight, body fat, age, height, etc)?

"I'm 400lbs and need to lose fat, should I use Animal Cuts?"

"Here's my daily diet (already a fail, since you can't eat the same thing everyday and not get bored stupid), please evaluate it even though I have no idea how many calories it is."

And then there's the broscience, almost all of which can be Avoided by reading the stickies.

Here's an analogy: I'm am American thinking about moving to Sweden. Maybe I should learn some Swedish first? Maybe I should read some ex-pat blogs, books, etc.

What I should not do is move there unprepared and get upset that those damned Swedes insist on speaking...Swedish - of all things!

Hey Noobs! The people most likely to respond to myriad absolutely similar threads are the broscientists! So you'll get crap info (when everything you need to start is in the first pages of the stickies). Then you'll fail and never realize how psychotically easy it really is.

So in a way, this is also a failure-prevention thread.

[JayAllen20]

LOL @ csb5731

I think that was a dead on example of what goes on!

I think the whole point of this thread isn't that people are negative to 'Noob' questions. We've all started out at one point or another and had to go through that 'annoying' phase (as we call it) once before as well

I think it's just the noticeable lack of initiation that some people take to do the work themselves in finding the answers to some of those questions that gets to people. Asking for HELP is one thing. Asking someone else to do the work for you because you don't feel like doing it yourself is something entirely different.

Honestly, I think what's more annoying to me is the lack of profile pictures and general information people tend to leave out of their profiles. Especially when they start spouting off nonsense while trying to sound credible and like they know what they're talking about. But that's a whole other topic. HAHA.

~

[amazongb]

I'm tired of seeing every noob here posting one of two threads.

"New to cutting/where do I start?"
/rant

It's even worse when they get solid advice, but it's not what they want to hear