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  1. #31
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    Originally Posted by NuSenseChild View Post
    yeah i was thinkin the same thing.. i seen an interview of him and he was 15.. he was huge then, didnt even look 15 at all

    how about the neck exercise in the video?
    Can I have a link to the interview?
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  2. #32
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    Originally Posted by gatovolador View Post
    Not really, your chin/durability is more of a god-given trait (like power) than anything else. You can and should strengthen your neck to take the force of blows and to not get sore during the duration of a match, but ultimately a guy like Mike or Foreman or Ali just happens to have gotten really lucky in the genetic lottery in terms of chin.
    Mike tyson's chin was average at best it just never really got tested that much as he was such an elusive fighter and saying your chin/durability is a god-given trait is really vague. I guess you could argue it's to do with neuronal firing along your jawline but realistically you train your neck to reduce the chances of getting knocked out. Lets remember he wasn't fighting for points as well, in this video he was training for his pro career which is not scored using an amateur system.

    Also power = speed x force... this is not a trait you are born with it is something you can develop.
    Last edited by SuperManSupps; 11-11-2011 at 03:32 AM.
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  3. #33
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    Originally Posted by txapn View Post
    what is ur post supposed to mean?
    non of those guys were elite boxers in the 80's, when i clearly said lifting weights started to become used by boxers!!

    ?= i think (very close to exact time line)
    Sugar Ray= retired in 1965
    Ali= retired in 1982 ish? but was pretty much done by 78
    louis=retired in 1950's?
    Charley Burley= retired in 1950's?
    Marcel Cerdan=died in 1950 or 51?
    Foreman=retired in 1977? came back in the late 80's and was horrible out of shape!!!!!

    those guys were great boxers but fought athletes that trained like they did!! if they were to train like they did back then and fight a boxer that train like today they would get the sh*t kicked out of them!

    im not saying they were no good! but athletes now days are better at every sport bc of the way science and training has evolved

    this argument is the same basketball players try to use! "the pros dont lift weights!" and thats BS!!! TODAY IF YOU WANT TO BE AN ELITE BOXER YOU BETTER LIFT WEIGHTS AT SOME POINT!!!!
    I take it you don't box?
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  4. #34
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    Originally Posted by SuperManSupps View Post
    Mike tyson's chin was average at best it just never really got tested that much as he was such an elusive fighter and saying your chin/durability is a god-given trait is really vague. I guess you could argue it's to do with neuronal firing along your jawline but realistically you train your neck to reduce the chances of getting knocked out. Lets remember he wasn't fighting for points as well, in this video he was training for his pro career which is not scored using an amateur system.

    Also power = speed x time... this is not a trait you are born with it is something you can develop.
    lol!

    first of all: Power= work/time.

    and yes, ones capacity for power certainly is affected by genetics!! training can help you reach your body's maximum potential, but your genes define exactly what that threshold is.
    Last edited by jorairdan; 11-11-2011 at 12:43 PM.
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  5. #35
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    Originally Posted by jorairdan View Post
    lol!

    first of all: Power= work/time.

    and yes, ones capacity for power certainly is affected by genetics!! training can help you reach your body's maximum but potential, but your genes define exactly what that threshold is.
    *power = speed x force... my bad (or force x velocity if you'd prefer). Are you referring to muscle fibre types and distribution?
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  6. #36
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    I love the guys who come in here and spout out crap about weightlifting making you slow. You listened to the 80 year old gym coach you had in grade school too much. Weight lifting and resistance training is a part of every professional athletes training regime. For christ sakes we are not talking about bodybuilding we are talking about resistance training. If you truely believe the old school athletes were better because they didnt lift weights, you are off your rocker. If you have no idea what youre doing and train like an amateur then yes it can be counter productive but lets be serious professional athletes train with professional trainers that have studied the science behind what makes you FASTER, and its not doing 5000 push ups a day.
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  7. #37
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    Originally Posted by SuperManSupps View Post
    *power = speed x force... my bad (or force x velocity if you'd prefer). Are you referring to muscle fibre types and distribution?
    im referring to the plethora of different genetic factors that dictate ones athletic predisposition; and sure, the type and distribution of muscle fibers plays a significant role.
    there's a 99.9% chance that I can jump higher than you.
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  8. #38
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    Originally Posted by jorairdan View Post
    im referring to the plethora of different genetic factors that dictate ones athletic predisposition; and sure, the type and distribution of muscle fibers plays a significant role.
    I agree... there are a plethora of factors that dictate ones athletic predisposition, however with power alone i'm not sure whether you can't train for this... especially in boxing which is so technical. For me, in this particular example, technique and practise will overcome a boxers predisposition to power. I train fighters... you always see the more powerful men coming from particular gyms... this is the way they train
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  9. #39
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    Smile you guys need to understand

    What you guys need to undetstans is that mike Tyson didn't train with weights in his prime (except for shrugging 30kg barbells to strengthen his shoulders)
    You guys BODYBUILD to look good.
    Tyson trained to become stronger and faster without weights.

    weights have as much resemblance to punching power as a cheesecake , - Tyson said this when he was asked 'what do you think about frank brunos bodybuilder training.
    Weights reduce your ability to punch, that's why the boxers of the past didn't use them.
    To throw constant knockout punches you need to throw them with speed
    - speed = power ,, without speed your punch becomes a PUSH so there's no power. using weights slows you down because it strains the arms and builds unnecessary muscle which isn't as flexible... Lifting weights makes you strong but only gives you the ability to lift heavy things (it doesn't improve punches)
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  10. #40
    Registered User RubenOlivares's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by adotd93 View Post
    What you guys need to undetstans is that mike Tyson didn't train with weights in his prime (except for shrugging 30kg barbells to strengthen his shoulders)
    You guys BODYBUILD to look good.
    Tyson trained to become stronger and faster without weights.

    weights have as much resemblance to punching power as a cheesecake , - Tyson said this when he was asked 'what do you think about frank brunos bodybuilder training.
    Weights reduce your ability to punch, that's why the boxers of the past didn't use them.
    To throw constant knockout punches you need to throw them with speed
    - speed = power ,, without speed your punch becomes a PUSH so there's no power. using weights slows you down because it strains the arms and builds unnecessary muscle which isn't as flexible... Lifting weights makes you strong but only gives you the ability to lift heavy things (it doesn't improve punches)
    Bodybuilding is bad for boxing, weight training is not.
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  11. #41
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    Smile

    Originally Posted by RubenOlivares View Post
    Bodybuilding is bad for boxing, weight training is not.
    Extensive weight training is !
    If your lifting light weights then it's not as bad, but look at it this way What are the few things all these fighters have in common --- Ali,Dempsey, Marciano, foreman, Frazier , Tyson, jack Johnson, joe Louis and tommy hearns ... They are all classed as the greatest fighters ever ,,
    None of them touched weights ,,, and they all hit hard....
    People only disagree with using weights in boxing because they all ready do this and they are gutted !!
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  12. #42
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    Yeah...okay boxers don't lift weights. Roy Jones Jr, Manny Paquiao, Floyd Mayweather Jr. They went up in multiple weight classes by running and eating more. YUP makes sense. Roy Jones jr was a middleweight-160 lbs and then became a heavyweight- 199 lbs when he won the title from Ruiz he gained all that weight by doing "pushups". Manny paquiao 115 lbs to 145 lbs. etc. etc. Boxers lift weights.
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  13. #43
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    Originally Posted by Wwchamp View Post
    Yeah...okay boxers don't lift weights. Roy Jones Jr, Manny Paquiao, Floyd Mayweather Jr. They went up in multiple weight classes by running and eating more. YUP makes sense. Roy Jones jr was a middleweight-160 lbs and then became a heavyweight- 199 lbs when he won the title from Ruiz he gained all that weight by doing "pushups". Manny paquiao 115 lbs to 145 lbs. etc. etc. Boxers lift weights.
    You know the whole idea behind weight class sports? You starve yourself down to the smallest weight class you can, and then starve yourself down some more. Running keeps the weight off too. Bernard Hopkins is not a small guy, but fought his entire career emaciated with a 28" waist. He finally said **** and it and got much heavier- how? not starving himself.

    Boxers are diet fanatics (wrestlers/judo guys too, but boxers most of all I think). When I boxed my trainer tore everybody a new ******* for liking instant noodles because they had too much sodium and made you fat. That's the mentality.

    Also, people get heavier as they age.

    And nowadays, sure, some guys life weights, but there's also tons of juicy juicy, and the technical level of boxers is far lower than it was 20 years ago, and those guys were far below the guys before them, up until before the world wars, when the talent pool in boxing was massive (biggest sport before tv came on).
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  14. #44
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    well...first off...Mike Tyson is not Human. lol but seriously. His work ethic along with routines and training programs he was put through were very difficult but when you have that kind of motivation nothing will stop you
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  15. #45
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    Smile Exactly

    Originally Posted by Wwchamp View Post
    Yeah...okay boxers don't lift weights. Roy Jones Jr, Manny Paquiao, Floyd Mayweather Jr. They went up in multiple weight classes by running and eating more. YUP makes sense. Roy Jones jr was a middleweight-160 lbs and then became a heavyweight- 199 lbs when he won the title from Ruiz he gained all that weight by doing "pushups". Manny paquiao 115 lbs to 145 lbs. etc. etc. Boxers lift weights.
    Of course you gain weight from push ups, chin ups, heavy bag work, sparring etc
    You my friend have nothing to train for.... These guys were all training 6 hours a day for months to fight in front of the world.... Not a lot of people do pushups because they are hard -- so people lift weights because it's easier....
    And sure lots of boxers these days lift weights ... But they aren't ever going to be hall of famers or they arent going tO be remembered as killers.
    And Roy jones only lifted weights at the end of his career
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  16. #46
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    Smile Exactly

    Originally Posted by HitmanDG View Post
    well...first off...Mike Tyson is not Human. lol but seriously. His work ethic along with routines and training programs he was put through were very difficult but when you have that kind of motivation nothing will stop you
    Mike Tyson already could hit very hard !!!
    But when he first came to cus he was a short fat kid that weighed 190 pounds
    He trainer yearly for like 8 years with the same camp that's why he was unstoppable
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    definitely hit the 10,000 hours of mastery mark

    (bump)
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  18. #48
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    Bump - I'm a big Mike Tyson fan. Insane power, speed, and conditioning. Watching his old videos, his power and speed were mind-blowing. Faster than Bruce Lee chit.

    Anyone have any thought about weightlifting for boxing/MMA - without sacrificing speed and agility?
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  19. #49
    Registered User KrnxMan86's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by txapn View Post
    mike tyson lifted weights on a regular basis!!!

    the comment above about boxers dont lift weights is ridiculous! resistance exercises are done by every elite athlete period!

    weight lifting slowing you down is what was thought by idiots. weight lifting was getting very popular by boxers in the early 80's and it showed in the look and performance of the boxers!

    just look at the movies "rocky", if you notice he was only running and boxing in the first one but then it slowly started to change as the next movies came out, rocky was starting to do some hard core weight lifting!

    mike tyson most definitely lifted weights! dont believe all you hear on training of athletes, GSP said he never does weight training yet there is 100's of videos on-line showing his workouts WITH HEAVY WEIGHTS!!!!!
    Don't talk rubbish. Lifting heavy weights won't significantly benefit fighters and is certainly not necessary. It takes up time and energy which could better be used for running and boxing training. Also heavy lifting causes fatigue which carries over into the next day meaning you won't get the most out of running or boxing. Trust me it happened to me.

    Fighters aren't bodybuilders or strongmen so shouldn't train like them. It's far more beneficial for fighters to use weights for functional training rather than heavy compounds.
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    Originally Posted by KrnxMan86 View Post
    Don't talk rubbish. Lifting heavy weights won't significantly benefit fighters and is certainly not necessary. It takes up time and energy which could better be used for running and boxing training. Also heavy lifting causes fatigue which carries over into the next day meaning you won't get the most out of running or boxing. Trust me it happened to me.

    Fighters aren't bodybuilders or strongmen so shouldn't train like them. It's far more beneficial for fighters to use weights for functional training rather than heavy compounds.
    Wow you put him in his place. I mean, without you this would have never been resolved. His fear of your coming is what caused him to stop posting 5 years ago. I'm glad you necroed this to share your amazing insight.
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