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  1. #31
    ^^Damned Handsome^^ TE's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Manletbolic View Post
    road work is something that should be part of mma conditioning
    I think it has its part, but within 8 weeks of a fight, fatloss would be the only plus I can see. And as far as that's concerned you may as well just walk instead of jog so it won't take away from recovery from other, more intense training.
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  2. #32
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    Originally Posted by forcefedfreak View Post
    I think O lifting is great for grappling. So in a roundabout way...yeah ATG squats are good for grapplers. But, I wouldn't say it's the end of the world if you don't do them. A wider powerlifting type stance (low bar squat) going to just below parallel will develop the adductors quite a bit which is great for a strong guard.
    I think this is dead on. Nice post FF.
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  3. #33
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    Originally Posted by TE View Post
    I think this is dead on. Nice post FF.
    i started doing a lot of unilateral Olympic lifts and i have seen a lot of benefit
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  4. #34
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    Fuck upright rows too. Amirite?
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    Originally Posted by TE View Post
    I think it has its part, but within 8 weeks of a fight, fatloss would be the only plus I can see. And as far as that's concerned you may as well just walk instead of jog so it won't take away from recovery from other, more intense training.
    When is there a time in the cage/ring you're working at the same intensity you are when you do "road" work? There isn't. You're either well below it, or well above it.

    When is there a time in the cage/ring you simulate a motion like running? There isn't.

    When is there a time in the cage/ring you are strictly using your legs? There isn't.

    What's the benefit to having developed slow twitch fibers in MMA? I can't think of one.

    How bad do your joints get jacked up from training MMA? Why further joint impact and stress via "road work?"

    Running over develops hip flexors as well as tightens/shortens them, making throwing kicks difficult. Making certain submissions from guard difficult.

    "Road work" is an antiquated training technique, and anyone still using it for MMA is not only NOT reaching their full potential, but is also hindering their progress.

    If you're a football player, basketball player, or any other traditional sport which involves a great deal of running, than you must run. But the mixed martial artist has much more important things to spend his time doing.

    Originally Posted by ftwrestler View Post
    i started doing a lot of unilateral Olympic lifts and i have seen a lot of benefit
    I really like the DB snatch, it's one of the easier explosive movements to teach, develops power, unilateral strength, and can easily be used in a circuit to get heart rate up.

    Originally Posted by Clark_Kent View Post
    Fuck upright rows too. Amirite?
    Yes. Placing a load on the shoulder while it's maximally internally rotated is probably the worst thing you can do for your shoulder. Think of a kimura...why does it damage the shoulder? Because it internally rotates it to a severe degree. An upright row may not bring the shoulder past it's normal ROM for internal rotation, but it brings it to the limit while under load. Bad idea.
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  6. #36
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    Originally Posted by Clark_Kent View Post
    Fuck upright rows too. Amirite?
    nosir
    Originally Posted by forcefedfreak View Post
    When is there a time in the cage/ring you're working at the same intensity you are when you do "road" work? There isn't. You're either well below it, or well above it.

    When is there a time in the cage/ring you simulate a motion like running? There isn't.

    When is there a time in the cage/ring you are strictly using your legs? There isn't.

    What's the benefit to having developed slow twitch fibers in MMA? I can't think of one.

    How bad do your joints get jacked up from training MMA? Why further joint impact and stress via "road work?"

    Running over develops hip flexors as well as tightens/shortens them, making throwing kicks difficult. Making certain submissions from guard difficult.

    "Road work" is an antiquated training technique, and anyone still using it for MMA is not only NOT reaching their full potential, but is also hindering their progress.

    If you're a football player, basketball player, or any other traditional sport which involves a great deal of running, than you must run. But the mixed martial artist has much more important things to spend his time doing.



    I really like the DB snatch, it's one of the easier explosive movements to teach, develops power, unilateral strength, and can easily be used in a circuit to get heart rate up.



    Yes. Placing a load on the shoulder while it's maximally internally rotated is probably the worst thing you can do for your shoulder. Think of a kimura...why does it damage the shoulder? Because it internally rotates it to a severe degree. An upright row may not bring the shoulder past it's normal ROM for internal rotation, but it brings it to the limit while under load. Bad idea.
    i love upright rows

    also high pulls but those are different for obvious reasons, but i digress. I love upright rows. i never get shoulder issues and i feel like it helps me develop a strength to resisting a kimura if i get caught. i also have insanely flexible shoulders. you could touch my elbow to my head and i would not tap. lol
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  7. #37
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    Originally Posted by ftwrestler View Post
    nosir


    i love upright rows

    also high pulls but those are different for obvious reasons, but i digress. I love upright rows. i never get shoulder issues and i feel like it helps me develop a strength to resisting a kimura if i get caught. i also have insanely flexible shoulders. you could touch my elbow to my head and i would not tap. lol

    And that's why you've never had any issues. Most people aren't so lucky brah.
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  8. #38
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    Originally Posted by forcefedfreak View Post
    Yes. Placing a load on the shoulder while it's maximally internally rotated is probably the worst thing you can do for your shoulder. Think of a kimura...why does it damage the shoulder? Because it internally rotates it to a severe degree. An upright row may not bring the shoulder past it's normal ROM for internal rotation, but it brings it to the limit while under load. Bad idea.
    I think they really come down to the individual because I have been doing them for years and they have been nothing but good to me.
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  9. #39
    Sexual Tyrannosaurus ftwrestler's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by forcefedfreak View Post
    And that's why you've never had any issues. Most people aren't so lucky brah.
    i have had my clients do it, but we do it light weight high reps. i am not a fan of doing to upright rows heavy. you might as well do a high pull
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  10. #40
    The shawma of manlets Manletbolic's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TE View Post
    I think it has its part, but within 8 weeks of a fight, fatloss would be the only plus I can see. And as far as that's concerned you may as well just walk instead of jog so it won't take away from recovery from other, more intense training.
    Good point, it also great for active recovery and building great cardiac output (how much blood your left ventricle pumps) and good in maintaining that aerobic base, with combination of threshold work (hill sprints, sprints ect) and muscular endurance (explosive drills, plyometrics ect) work so that your body is building more mitochondria so the blood getting pumped get's utilize and you won't have to go lactic.

    Someone mentioned here running is bad for the knees and I agree, long slow distance cardio doesn't necessarily have to be done just running. You can use machines like versaclimber, jaccobs ladder, ube, spin bike, and to prevent monotony switch every 10 mins or so from machine to machine. The main thing is to have your heart rate between 130-150bpm and to get the heart pumping

    With that in combination with explosive drills and sparring (mimicing fight pace, having fresh partners each round, adding extra rounds) your good.

    Getting ready for a fight, you basically want to be explosive for as fast as you can for aslong as you can. You need to have that aerobic base, work on strength and explosive drills, and the closer you are to fight, you need to keep it very specific (bag work, pads, grappling drills, tons of sparring)

    But all in all, mma conditioning should also be specific for an individual. If one has always had problems being strength but great endurance, they should focus on strength, the same go's for the other way around.

    Long slow distance cardio like some one mentioned is just part of training, but not all of it. But If you look at muay thai fighters or boxers, they've been doing this as part of their training since the sport began, and these athletes are well known to have great endurance. It shouldn't be deemed useless
    Last edited by Manletbolic; 11-16-2010 at 08:35 AM.
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    Sexual Tyrannosaurus ftwrestler's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Manletbolic View Post
    Good point, it also great for active recovery and building great cardiac output (how much blood your left ventricle pumps) and good in maintaining that aerobic base, with combination of threshold work (hill sprints, sprints ect) and muscular endurance (explosive drills, plyometrics ect) work so that your body is building more mitochondria so the blood getting pumped get's utilize and you won't have to go lactic.

    Someone mentioned here running is bad for the knees and I agree, road work doesn't necessarily have to be done just running. You can use machines like versaclimber, jaccobs ladder, ube, spin bike, and to prevent monotony switch every 10 mins or so from machine to machine. The main thing is to have your heart rate between 130-150bpm

    With that in combination with explosive drills and sparring (mimicing fight pace, having fresh partners each round, adding extra rounds) your good.

    Getting ready for a fight, you basically want to be explosive for as fast as you can for aslong as you can. You need to have that aerobic base, work on strength and explosive drills, and the closer you are to fight, you need to keep it very specific (bag work, pads, grappling drills, tons of sparring)

    But all in all, mma conditioning should also be specific for an individual. If one has always had problems being strength but great endurance, they should focus on strength, the same go's for the other way around.

    Road work like some mentioned is just part of training, but not all of it. But If you look at muay thai fighters or boxers, they've been doing this as part of their training since the sport began, and these athletes are well known to have great endurance.
    but then it is not road work

    road work is a vague term that you angle around when some one disproves your point
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    Originally Posted by ftwrestler View Post
    but then it is not road work

    road work is a vague term that you angle around when some one disproves your point
    I agree, i should've just kept it cardiac output or lsd cardio (long slow distance).

    i should re-edit what i meant
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    Misc Nihilist forcefedfreak's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Manletbolic View Post

    Road work like some one mentioned is just part of training, but not all of it. But If you look at muay thai fighters or boxers, they've been doing this as part of their training since the sport began, and these athletes are well known to have great endurance. It shouldn't be deemed useless

    And there it is. The age old anecdotal reasoning. Did it ever occur to you that these people had excellent endurance due to the large amounts of practice in their sport, despite the running?

    I mean I know it's hard to wrap your head around the fact that someone that spends a lot of time each day punching and kicking will have great endurance for punching and kicking.
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    Originally Posted by forcefedfreak View Post
    And there it is. The age old anecdotal reasoning. Did it ever occur to you that these people had excellent endurance due to the large amounts of practice in their sport, despite the running?

    I mean I know it's hard to wrap your head around the fact that someone that spends a lot of time each day punching and kicking will have great endurance for punching and kicking.
    brah, I said it was part of their training. Ofcourse you need to be specific to be well conditioned in building local muscular endurance in shoulders (punching),hips(kicking) and core and the whole body in general. Muay thai fighters train up to 8 hours a day, why would the majority of their training just be running?

    That's just one piece of the puzzle to build a great combat athlete, obviously there are more work to be done then just running.
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    Originally Posted by Manletbolic View Post
    I agree, i should've just kept it cardiac output or lsd cardio (long slow distance).

    i should re-edit what i meant
    you have been placed on ignore copy/paste troll
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    U R TEH GHEY!!!!!


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    Originally Posted by ftwrestler View Post
    you have been placed on ignore copy/paste troll
    ?!?! ok....
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    After watching the videos in this thread I have decided that I should start doing more of this stuff. So I have signed up at Planet Fitness and will be doing some Crossfit there since the real Crossfit place near here is way too expensive.
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    ^^Damned Handsome^^ TE's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by forcefedfreak View Post
    When is there a time in the cage/ring you're working at the same intensity you are when you do "road" work? There isn't. You're either well below it, or well above it.

    When is there a time in the cage/ring you simulate a motion like running? There isn't.

    When is there a time in the cage/ring you are strictly using your legs? There isn't.

    What's the benefit to having developed slow twitch fibers in MMA? I can't think of one.
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    Originally Posted by ftwrestler View Post
    i started doing a lot of unilateral Olympic lifts and i have seen a lot of benefit
    cool. I'll add some into my routines.

    I'm cool w/ upright rows as long as the grip isn't too close together. yes, I have shoulder issues.
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    Originally Posted by ftwrestler View Post
    nosir

    i also have insanely flexible shoulders. you could touch my elbow to my head and i would not tap. lol
    that's pretty kinky brah. you should share this info with the relationship forum.
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    Originally Posted by Jeremy90 View Post
    That makes sense. Unless you are really good with your recovery I can imagine it would be very difficult to roll that much and lift heavy 3 days a week
    I lift on days where I roll 2-3 hours, not days where I go 5-6. Makes it a lot easier. Also constantly using recovery techniques. Oddly when I add yoga into the mix, thats when I start dying of cardio issues.

    I run SS a little different, not too much different though.

    Workout A

    Squat 3x5
    Military Press 3x5
    Ghetto GHR 3x5
    Neutral Grip Pull-ups 3 x Max

    Workout B

    Squat 3x5
    Bench Press 3x5
    Deadlift 1x5
    Pronated Grip Pull-ups 3 x Max
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    Originally Posted by TheStender View Post
    After watching the videos in this thread I have decided that I should start doing more of this stuff. So I have signed up at Planet Fitness and will be doing some Crossfit there since the real Crossfit place near here is way too expensive.
    Which one were you looking at? I've only seen a few of them in the general area of the cities and was not terribly impressed with any of them.
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    Originally Posted by TE View Post
    Kalib Starnes/thread

    damnit, I just got pwn3d
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    Originally Posted by HardGainer82 View Post
    Which one were you looking at? I've only seen a few of them in the general area of the cities and was not terribly impressed with any of them.
    http://revdefenseandfitness.com/wordpress/

    Or did you mean Planet Fitness?
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    Any one have a typical week outline for mma conditioning?
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    nice
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    Originally Posted by thecolminator View Post
    Any one have a typical week outline for mma conditioning?
    ^^^

    This would be cool.


    Maybe just general guidelines to follow? Like for someone who trains 10-15 hours a week. Whenever I have trained for a fight or hard I feel I end up overtraining or something.
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    What do you think of this guy's cheeseburger eating form? Is it similar to yours? Could you do better? Please provide us with another informative critique.

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    Originally Posted by Ajuice72 View Post

    Maybe just general guidelines to follow? Like for someone who trains 10-15 hours a week. Whenever I have trained for a fight or hard I feel I end up overtraining or something.
    I think that's the case for most fighters. It probably stems from the idea of a "fight camp" in my opinion a fight camp should be for fine tuning your game plan/skills for a particular match-up, not to blitz yourself as hard as you can in the gym.

    Any one of my guys can be in peak conditioning in 3 weeks, even if we're in the middle of a strength phase. The key is to reach a baseline of conditioning, and then just maintain it until you need to wick it up a bit just before fight time.
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