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  1. #1501
    PHD in Broscience Tough92's Avatar
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    Is there any ways to gain muscle while losing fat if your not a beginner?or atleast what is the best thing todo to retain muscle?Best supps?


    im currently on EC which i hear helps with retaining muscle im gettin 1g of protein per pounds and taking amino acids and casein before bed.Is there anything else i can do?
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    In Trance We Trust Shangius's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by I Tough I View Post
    Is there any ways to gain muscle while losing fat if your not a beginner?or atleast what is the best thing todo to retain muscle?Best supps?


    im currently on EC which i hear helps with retaining muscle im gettin 1g of protein per pounds and taking amino acids and casein before bed.Is there anything else i can do?
    recomp diet. eat at maintence and lift hard. apparently its really slow going.

    just lean bulk and cut. its quicker.
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    I'm down from 189 to about 181 in 4 weeks.


    Will post pictures up later tonight.
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  4. #1504
    PHD in Broscience Tough92's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Shangius View Post
    recomp diet. eat at maintence and lift hard. apparently its really slow going.

    just lean bulk and cut. its quicker.
    Recomp diet meaning what?After i finsih my cut im all for a lean bulk but as of right now my goal is to have abs by summer so what ever it takes im gonna do,i still got my gut but i can see my whole body leaning out i figure another -10 pounds and my gut shouldnt be to big.I just started a new full body so im hoping i can increase my lifts a little and not loss alot of muscle.So far everything is working
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  5. #1505
    Engineer cncman's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Shangius View Post
    recomp diet. eat at maintence and lift hard. apparently its really slow going.

    just lean bulk and cut. its quicker.
    Recomp takes a really long time, but a noob can put on substantial meat while losing fat for sure. Lean bulking is whats hard to do...gets outta hand easy with what some people on this forum tell you when you are skinny.

    Yea man just get after the chocolate milk, pop tarts etc etc and they just get fat.
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  6. #1506
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    Originally Posted by Shangius View Post
    leptin dude. thats why cheating is essential.
    Hmm, cheating is essential? Even if it goes over the daily calorific limit? How often? Any extended info on this? Will rep. I ask as it seems to apply to me also, this may sound mad but yesterday I put bodyfat % pics up as you can see, I had cheated that day, prior to that, hadn't been cheating for a while (always within calorific limit). Today, swear to God, look like I'm in far better definition that yesterday.

    And if someone would be kind enough to answer my previous question on the bottom of the page, will appreciate and will rep.
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    Originally Posted by UltimateNonStop View Post
    Hmm, cheating is essential? Even if it goes over the daily calorific limit? How often? Any extended info on this? Will rep. I ask as it seems to apply to me also, this may sound mad but yesterday I put bodyfat % pics up as you can see, I had cheated that day, prior to that, hadn't been cheating for a while (always within calorific limit). Today, swear to God, look like I'm in far better definition that yesterday.

    And if someone would be kind enough to answer my previous question on the bottom of the page, will appreciate and will rep.
    i know many people that didnt measure calories. they ate chicken and rice 5 times a day and just controlled portions to determine what worked best. my friend lost 15 pounds but went from 11 percent to contest 3 percent in 20 weeks but only lost 15 pounds total. figure out your body and what works.
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  8. #1508
    In Trance We Trust Shangius's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by UltimateNonStop View Post
    Hmm, cheating is essential? Even if it goes over the daily calorific limit? How often? Any extended info on this? Will rep. I ask as it seems to apply to me also, this may sound mad but yesterday I put bodyfat % pics up as you can see, I had cheated that day, prior to that, hadn't been cheating for a while (always within calorific limit). Today, swear to God, look like I'm in far better definition that yesterday.

    And if someone would be kind enough to answer my previous question on the bottom of the page, will appreciate and will rep.
    Yep. I eat under maintenance 6 days out of the week and then sunday I go balls to the wall and eat 3500-4000 calories of junk.

    Monday-Tuesday I look fantastic.
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  9. #1509
    PHD in Broscience Tough92's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Shangius View Post
    Yep. I eat under maintenance 6 days out of the week and then sunday I go balls to the wall and eat 3500-4000 calories of junk.

    Monday-Tuesday I look fantastic.
    Yea pretty much the same thing i do im on about -700 deflict in cals and low carbs the whole week and saterday i usually have a big cheat meal and i still lose 2-3pounds a week.

    So i guess its not bad to have a cheat meal if were doing fine with it,And not gonna lie saterday usually turns into 2 or 3 cheat meals lol
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  10. #1510
    Registered User UltimateNonStop's Avatar
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    Interesting. One big old cheat meal per week is the way to go. I had lots yesterday (pint of ale, double cheeseburger with bacon and chips, 1 packet of crisps, 1 packet of pork scratchings) so strict for the rest of the week.

    Any thought as to whether hitting below 500cal reduction is fine?
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  11. #1511
    PHD in Broscience Tough92's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by UltimateNonStop View Post
    Interesting. One big old cheat meal per week is the way to go. I had lots yesterday (pint of ale, double cheeseburger with bacon and chips, 1 packet of crisps, 1 packet of pork scratchings) so strict for the rest of the week.

    Any thought as to whether hitting below 500cal reduction is fine?


    im doing -700 and it working great so far i feel if i increase my calls that i wont lose the weight im losing now
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  12. #1512
    Registered User UltimateNonStop's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by I Tough I View Post
    im doing -700 and it working great so far i feel if i increase my calls that i wont lose the weight im losing now
    Coolness.
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  13. #1513
    In Trance We Trust Shangius's Avatar
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    I'm only on a 300-400 deficit because I am terrified of losing muscle.

    So far all my lifts are the same and I'm still losing fat so I think its working.
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  14. #1514
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    dont cut too much, if your arms shrink sub 16" youll just look like a skinny twat with anorexia abs and other larger males will regard you as a bitch.

    but yah, get lean bro's just dont wither away in the process
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    PHD in Broscience Tough92's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by belmont316 View Post
    dont cut too much, if your arms shrink sub 16" youll just look like a skinny twat with anorexia abs and other larger males will regard you as a bitch.

    but yah, get lean bro's just dont wither away in the process
    Hope that doesn't happen to me lol,Nah i honestly dont think it will though but if i notice anything ill just up my cals more
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    Originally Posted by belmont316 View Post
    dont cut too much, if your arms shrink sub 16" youll just look like a skinny twat with anorexia abs and other larger males will regard you as a bitch.

    but yah, get lean bro's just dont wither away in the process
    15.5" cut > 16"+ fatceps
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    Registered User kpham's Avatar
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    Started not to long ago. I went from 164 to 156 in 3 weeks... feels good
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  18. #1518
    in haiti, cut is paused Insight's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Shangius View Post
    leptin dude. thats why cheating is essential.
    It can definitely help. At the very least it can trigger a huge drop in water. You can still get good results without cheating, but I think they'll just be better with the occasional refeed thrown in. It's like a "deload," but with diet.

    In this case I don't actually think it was the leptin, the primary effect of which seems to be to mediate hunger (less leptin = more hunger) - I think it was that the refeed triggered an abrupt drop in water the day after, and the water retention was masking the fat loss.

    Originally Posted by Shangius View Post
    I'm only on a 300-400 deficit because I am terrified of losing muscle.

    So far all my lifts are the same and I'm still losing fat so I think its working.
    You don't necessarily have to lose muscle on a higher calorie deficit. The whole point of the PSMF is to eat only like 600 cals a day and drop fat real f*cking quick, but to not lose muscle either.

    You'd be fine on a 500 cal deficit if you wanted.
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    Down from 200lb to around 187 from jan 1st... Gonna be doing some hardcore framing construction 60+ HRs for a next three weeks, expect to be 180 and shredded by the time we're done, already starting to see the abs... just hope my hotel has a decent gym and i got some energy left!!
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    Originally Posted by Shangius View Post
    15.5" cut > 16"+ fatceps
    depends on chest, trap and back development. if the chest is flatter than a 6th graders tits and you can see the spine in the back, and the traps are non existant, creating a varitable 90 degree angel in the shoulder/neck region, then 15.5" arms are not acceptable. 15.5" arms will be acceptable on a male 5'10-6'2 if there is adequate chest, shoulder, and back development, just my opinion.
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    Originally Posted by Insight View Post
    It can definitely help. At the very least it can trigger a huge drop in water. You can still get good results without cheating, but I think they'll just be better with the occasional refeed thrown in. It's like a "deload," but with diet.

    In this case I don't actually think it was the leptin, the primary effect of which seems to be to mediate hunger (less leptin = more hunger) - I think it was that the refeed triggered an abrupt drop in water the day after, and the water retention was masking the fat loss.



    You don't necessarily have to lose muscle on a higher calorie deficit. The whole point of the PSMF is to eat only like 600 cals a day and drop fat real f*cking quick, but to not lose muscle either.

    You'd be fine on a 500 cal deficit if you wanted.
    Excellent, won't be afraid to cheat once a week then. Personally am on a 500cal reduction 4 days a week, 700cal reduction once a week, and 600cal reduction twice a week. Going pretty well so far.
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  22. #1522
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    Originally Posted by UltimateNonStop View Post
    Interesting. One big old cheat meal per week is the way to go. I had lots yesterday (pint of ale, double cheeseburger with bacon and chips, 1 packet of crisps, 1 packet of pork scratchings) so strict for the rest of the week.

    Any thought as to whether hitting below 500cal reduction is fine?
    I go WAY under 500. like 1000-1200 some days.

    I do a cheat day whenever I feel like it. about a week or so sounds good.

    You can go much more extreme during shorter cutting periods. I don't recommend going that low long term....
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    Originally Posted by vipergq View Post
    I go WAY under 500. like 1000-1200 some days.

    I do a cheat day whenever I feel like it. about a week or so sounds good.

    You can go much more extreme during shorter cutting periods. I don't recommend going that low long term....
    Same here last two weeks... probably 4 days a week around 1200-1400 calories, felt like $hit but definetly lost some fat and no muscle.
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    Originally Posted by UltimateNonStop View Post
    Excellent, won't be afraid to cheat once a week then. Personally am on a 500cal reduction 4 days a week, 700cal reduction once a week, and 600cal reduction twice a week. Going pretty well so far.
    Nice, you should lose fat really quick.
    Don't be disappointed when your lifts all plateau
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    Originally Posted by vipergq View Post
    I go WAY under 500. like 1000-1200 some days.

    I do a cheat day whenever I feel like it. about a week or so sounds good.

    You can go much more extreme during shorter cutting periods. I don't recommend going that low long term....
    Cool. Well, what I'm doing seems to be working well, I think I'll have a cheat day on Mondays (healthy breakfast, eat what I want rest of the day), and take it from there. Plan to be around 11% by the time I bulk up.

    Originally Posted by AlmightyJad View Post
    Nice, you should lose fat really quick.
    Don't be disappointed when your lifts all plateau
    Thanks, well, at the moment been doing high volume work with pull-ups, dips, press-ups, as well as big weighted exercises such as bent-over rows, squats, and KB Swings/Deadlifts. Then switching over to this. Would be great to hear what you think.
    Last edited by UltimateNonStop; 03-02-2010 at 05:06 PM.
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    Originally Posted by RoyalSampler View Post
    have dropped 29 pounds so far since beginning of december or so.. feels good man =]

    from 220 to 191.. feels good man =]
    down to 187 since then.. doesn't seem like a lot now that I think about it but after 2 weeks of heavy drinking I'm delighted with the result =]


    edit- actually, 2lb per week is standard, right? feel even better about it now haha
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    Originally Posted by RoyalSampler View Post
    down to 187 since then.. doesn't seem like a lot now that I think about it but after 2 weeks of heavy drinking I'm delighted with the result =]


    edit- actually, 2lb per week is standard, right? feel even better about it now haha
    1-2lbs is standard, so 2lbs is the max, you did well.
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    Originally Posted by vipergq View Post
    I'm down from 189 to about 181 in 4 weeks.


    Will post pictures up later tonight.
    Lookin forward to the pics man...the last cut I saw of yours was impressive.

    Jw, you posted that you've been having whatever for carbs on this cut (cakes, chips, etc), have you always eaten that way or were you more strict in the past?
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    hey vipergq why no fruit?
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