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  1. #1
    Registered User RobinKaplan's Avatar
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    Question Help ! I want a sports model body!

    Hi Ladies!
    My name is Robin I am new to Bodyduilding .com I am a mother of 2 and I will be turning 30 this year. I am determined that this is the year I will be in the best shape of my life. I am 5'10" and weigh 155. I have been working out hard for a few years and feel comfertable at the gym but I have always maintained the same body. My goal is to take my body to the next level...I want a sports model body but I need help.

    Starting Monday I am going to do the 12 week training plan that is mapped out on ths website. I totally understand and feel comfertable with the training portion of the plan. I am totally confused with the nutrition portion. Should I be eating more calories or cutting calories? I am afraid of eating more calories and gaiing weight. Ideally I want to shed additional fat and gain muscle. How do I trim down fat and gain muscle at the same time? Help? Should I be taking supplements. I currently do a protien shake before and after the gym. Is that right or should I be eating someting else? Any input is great. Thanks for the help!
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  2. #2
    Registered User FitnessCrush's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by RobinKaplan View Post
    Hi Ladies!
    My name is Robin I am new to Bodyduilding .com I am a mother of 2 and I will be turning 30 this year. I am determined that this is the year I will be in the best shape of my life. I am 5'10" and weigh 155. I have been working out hard for a few years and feel comfertable at the gym but I have always maintained the same body. My goal is to take my body to the next level...I want a sports model body but I need help.

    Starting Monday I am going to do the 12 week training plan that is mapped out on ths website. I totally understand and feel comfertable with the training portion of the plan. I am totally confused with the nutrition portion. Should I be eating more calories or cutting calories? I am afraid of eating more calories and gaiing weight. Ideally I want to shed additional fat and gain muscle. How do I trim down fat and gain muscle at the same time? Help? Should I be taking supplements. I currently do a protien shake before and after the gym. Is that right or should I be eating someting else? Any input is great. Thanks for the help!
    Hi and welcome to body building!

    First off, if you want to shed the fat, you definitely don't want to consume more calories. What you do want to do is eat clean and low fat -- meaning lots of lean protein (chicken, fish and egg whites), whole grains (brown rice, quinoa, oats), veggies and berries, efa's (almonds, avocado, olives) as little sugar as possible and a ton of water.

    Two protein shakes a day are good. Make sure they are low in sugar and calories (some pack a whollop) and mix with fat free milk or water.

    Your protein serving should be the size of your palm and the carbs (rice, sweet potato, etc.) the size of your fist.

    Eat six to eight small meals a day. Your protein shake can count as a meal.

    Those are the basics. Hope it helps!
    h
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  3. #3
    I Train to Bring You Pain kfisherx's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by FitnessCrush View Post
    Hi and welcome to body building!

    First off, if you want to shed the fat, you definitely don't want to consume more calories. What you do want to do is eat clean and low fat -- meaning lots of lean protein (chicken, fish and egg whites), whole grains (brown rice, quinoa, oats), veggies and berries, efa's (almonds, avocado, olives) as little sugar as possible and a ton of water.

    Two protein shakes a day are good. Make sure they are low in sugar and calories (some pack a whollop) and mix with fat free milk or water.

    Your protein serving should be the size of your palm and the carbs (rice, sweet potato, etc.) the size of your fist.

    Eat six to eight small meals a day. Your protein shake can count as a meal.

    Those are the basics. Hope it helps!
    ACCCCKKK!!! This is some of the worst advice I have read on this board for quite some time. Please, if you are going to be on a board and more importantly writing articles about fat loss and such then learn about how the human body works not just how it works for you. I got a hella skinny and fit back in the day eating low fat and clean and it was and still is a stupid way to do it.

    1. At 5'10" and 155lbs it is most likely the case that the OP doesn't want to cut nearly as much as she wants to recomp.
    2. There is NO SUCH THING as clean eating
    3. 2 protein shakes a day is HORRIBLE advice for anyone on a cut because they do not fill people up like real food does. If they do and they are convienent then fine but not a recommendation for any sort of plan otherwise.
    4. Low fat is a BAD IDEA if you are talking less than .5g per lb of bw or there about
    5. Eating 6 meals a day or 3 meals a day doesn't make a difference to your end goals. Nor does meal timing.

    To the OP... Do you know if you want to gain muscle or lose fat at this point? I cannot see from your AVI if there are some areas you are trying to adress or if you are skinny fat or...
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    Registered User FitnessCrush's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by kfisherx View Post
    ACCCCKKK!!! This is some of the worst advice I have read on this board for quite some time. Please, if you are going to be on a board and more importantly writing articles about fat loss and such then learn about how the human body works not just how it works for you. I got a hella skinny and fit back in the day eating low fat and clean and it was and still is a stupid way to do it.

    1. At 5'10" and 155lbs it is most likely the case that the OP doesn't want to cut nearly as much as she wants to recomp.
    2. There is NO SUCH THING as clean eating
    3. 2 protein shakes a day is HORRIBLE advice for anyone on a cut because they do not fill people up like real food does. If they do and they are convienent then fine but not a recommendation for any sort of plan otherwise.
    4. Low fat is a BAD IDEA if you are talking less than .5g per lb of bw or there about
    5. Eating 6 meals a day or 3 meals a day doesn't make a difference to your end goals. Nor does meal timing.

    To the OP... Do you know if you want to gain muscle or lose fat at this point? I cannot see from your AVI if there are some areas you are trying to adress or if you are skinny fat or...
    You have some interesting thoughts there I must say and although I disagree with them, we are all entitled to our opinions. That's what makes the world go round. And different things work for different people.

    I help people lose weight and build muscle and have for years. I won't defend my techniques, methods or beliefs to someone who is only out to slam people. I am trained and certified and I know of what I speak. I'll leave it at that.
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  5. #5
    I Train to Bring You Pain kfisherx's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by FitnessCrush View Post
    You have some interesting thoughts there I must say and although I disagree with them, we are all entitled to our opinions. That's what makes the world go round. And different things work for different people.

    I help people lose weight and build muscle and have for years. I won't defend my techniques, methods or beliefs to someone who is only out to slam people. I am trained and certified and I know of what I speak. I'll leave it at that.

    Not out to "slam" people but out to help. There is so much "crap" information about dieting like

    1. Meal timing is important (can't eat before bed, etc)
    2. Number of meals is important (have to eat more than 3 times a day)
    3. Food avoidance (avoid carbs, fat, whatever)
    Etc....

    ALL of it is debunked in the labs where things are put to the test. If you want to do youself and your clients a favor then read some of the writings from people who are educated in the workings of the human body. Layne Norton, Alan Aragon, Emma-Leigh, Jamie Hale and Kimm4 are all members from this board who you should read. Also go to Lyle Mcdonald's website while you are out there. These are all people who are educated in this field, use facts that are proven in the labs AND have client experience.

    I am certified and have trained people too. I still don't claim to know even a portion of what these folks know...

    When people come here who claim to be trainers/professionals and spew this "bro-science" it makes it hard for everyone.
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    Registered User egoatdoor's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by RobinKaplan View Post
    Hi Ladies!
    My name is Robin I am new to Bodyduilding .com I am a mother of 2 and I will be turning 30 this year. I am determined that this is the year I will be in the best shape of my life. I am 5'10" and weigh 155. I have been working out hard for a few years and feel comfertable at the gym but I have always maintained the same body. My goal is to take my body to the next level...I want a sports model body but I need help.

    Starting Monday I am going to do the 12 week training plan that is mapped out on ths website. I totally understand and feel comfertable with the training portion of the plan. I am totally confused with the nutrition portion. Should I be eating more calories or cutting calories? I am afraid of eating more calories and gaiing weight. Ideally I want to shed additional fat and gain muscle. How do I trim down fat and gain muscle at the same time? Help? Should I be taking supplements. I currently do a protien shake before and after the gym. Is that right or should I be eating someting else? Any input is great. Thanks for the help!
    I'm unsure as to whether this "plan" has a nutritional component to it or not? If it does, it would help for you to either outline the training and nutritional plan or else attach a link to it so we can look and then make educated answers.

    That aside, welcome to the board. One of the things the ladies here preach is patience.

    You want a sports model body.

    It is probably going to take a lot of time. It is also going to take a lot of hard work. It is going to take probably totalling changing things up in very drastic ways, as you do say you have been working out for a bit but only maintained the body you have.
    "People listen to rich folks. People they pray for poor folks"- John Thompson, long time head basketball coach at Georgetown University.

    Passion doesn't pay the bills. G4P does.
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  7. #7
    Registered User Jen_K's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=kfisherx;435283231]ACCCCKKK!!!
    2. There is NO SUCH THING as clean eating
    QUOTE]

    What do you mean by this?
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    Banned Emma-Leigh's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Jen_K View Post
    Originally Posted by kfisherx View Post
    ACCCCKKK!!!
    2. There is NO SUCH THING as clean eating
    What do you mean by this?
    ^
    In the simplest of terms: If macronutrients, fiber and digestibility are accounted for, you will not get 'better' results from 'clean' v's 'dirty' food:
    100 calories from nutella
    v's
    100 cals from strawberries and peanut butter
    = 100 calories from food.
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  9. #9
    I Train to Bring You Pain kfisherx's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Emma-Leigh View Post
    ^
    In the simplest of terms: If macronutrients, fiber and digestibility are accounted for, you will not get 'better' results from 'clean' v's 'dirty' food:
    100 calories from nutella
    v's
    100 cals from strawberries and peanut butter
    = 100 calories from food.
    ^^^This, but to take it even further... There is no such thing as "clean eating" not only for the reason above but also because there is no single definition of what clean eating is. I started this discussion once on this board and each person had a completely different definition. So how does it make sense to describe the way you eat as "clean" if it doesn't mean the same thing to anyone else? I think it is a completely senseless adjective to describe your diet since it doesn't mean any one thing. Using this term also helps to perpetuate all the bro-science crap that goes on in this industry. The bber world is full of bros who think that the only way to get contest lean is to eat "clean" which equates to chicken and rice for many of them. Or how about all the chicks in this folder who eat tuna even though they don't like it because it is "clean"? Of course those things don't annoy me so much as when people talk food avoidance ESPECIALLY low fat. That irks me BIG TIME. FAT is so important to our bodies (especially our female bodies) and so essential to the whole picture for energy and hormone production. It is such an unhealthy piece of advice to give anyone.

    Dieting is pretty straightforward (either cut or bulk). You need to figure out your maintanace calories then adjust within a realistic range from that number to cut or bulk or maintain (whatever your goal). Fix macros to make sure that you are able to meet your goals and be within healthy ranges and then (drum roll please....) Eat the foods THAT YOU LIKE that fit within these prescribed calorie and macro guidelines.

    If a candybar fits in the guidelines for that day and you eat it, then you are going to reach your goal. Doughnut, piece of cake... whatever. It tastes good and it fuels your body and since you ate your correct macros and calories you are still 100% on track. All good stuff. Same goes for your proteins... If you don't like tuna eat a steak... Don't like eggs NO PROBLEM, eat turkey burger. The key is to eat the foods that you like. You can actually eat like this all the way to the stage. Before you get all freaky on me RE the doughnut, candybar, etc... Remember that the food you eat has to fit your guidelines for the day.... so you cannot eat 2k worth of candybars and call it a day because that would never fit within a reasonable macro setup. You have to somehow get the protein in and the fats too.
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    Originally Posted by kfisherx View Post
    ACCCCKKK!!! This is some of the worst advice I have read on this board for quite some time.
    I'm really glad you're on this forum, mate Straight talk is very useful in this industry full of teh broscience... or, um, sisscience.
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  11. #11
    Registered User FitnessCrush's Avatar
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    Smile

    Originally Posted by Emma-Leigh View Post
    ^
    In the simplest of terms: If macronutrients, fiber and digestibility are accounted for, you will not get 'better' results from 'clean' v's 'dirty' food:
    100 calories from nutella
    v's
    100 cals from strawberries and peanut butter
    = 100 calories from food.
    Clean Eating has many definitions and philosophies behind it. The easiest way to eat clean is to stay away from processed foods such as these:

    ?canned foods with lots of sodium
    ?white breads and pastas made with refined white flour, which are not as healthy as those
    made with whole grains
    ?packaged high-calorie snack foods, like chips and cheese snacks
    ?high-fat convenience foods, like cans of ravioli
    ?frozen fish sticks and frozen dinners
    ?packaged cakes and cookies
    ?boxed meal mixes
    ?sugary breakfast cereals
    ?processed meats

    They hold no nutrition to speak of (none that your body needs anyway) and are empty calories. Sugar poisons the body and is addictive -- so limit your sugar as much as possible.

    And when I say "low-fat," I am referring to saturated and trans fats. Your body needs good fats that come from fish, nuts, olives and oils.

    Your daily intake needs to be a healthy mix of complex carbs, protein and fats. Pretty simple really.

    You don't have to live on tuna, chicken and egg whites. I sure don't!! And a donut or cookie once in a while won't kill ya...just don't make them part of your daily intake or it will take you a lot longer to see measurable results (weightwise and healthwise).

    If people want to call me a bro (don't know what that is since I'm a girl??) they can, but there is no way that anyone in their right mind could say that eating healthy foods is crazy or bad. Eating this way will not only help you lose weight over time but boost your immune system, lower your cholesterol, help your blood pressure, give you more energy, etc. etc. etc.
    h
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  12. #12
    Registered User FitnessCrush's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Jen_K;436775681]
    Originally Posted by kfisherx View Post
    ACCCCKKK!!!
    2. There is NO SUCH THING as clean eating
    QUOTE]

    What do you mean by this?
    Clean Eating has many definitions and philosophies behind it. The easiest way to eat clean is to stay away from processed foods such as these:

    -canned foods with lots of sodium
    -white breads and pastas made with refined white flour, which are not as healthy as those
    made with whole grains
    -packaged high-calorie snack foods, like chips and cheese snacks
    -high-fat convenience foods, like cans of ravioli
    -frozen fish sticks and frozen dinners
    -packaged cakes and cookies
    -boxed meal mixes
    -sugary breakfast cereals
    -processed meats

    They hold no nutrition to speak of (none that your body needs anyway) and are empty calories. Sugar poisons the body and is addictive -- so limit your sugar as much as possible.

    And when I say "low-fat," I am referring to saturated and trans fats. Your body needs good fats that come from fish, nuts, olives and oils.

    Your daily intake needs to be a healthy mix of complex carbs, protein and fats. Pretty simple really.

    You don't have to live on tuna, chicken and egg whites. I sure don't!! And a donut or cookie once in a while won't kill ya...just don't make them part of your daily intake or it will take you a lot longer to see measurable results (weightwise and healthwise).

    If people want to call me a bro (don't know what that is since I'm a girl??) they can, but there is no way that anyone in their right mind could say that eating healthy foods is crazy or bad. Eating this way will not only help you lose weight over time but boost your immune system, lower your cholesterol, help your blood pressure, give you more energy, etc. etc. etc.
    __________________
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  13. #13
    Carbs are my friend... vandalgirl59's Avatar
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    I'm going to have to give my nonexpert opinion, and agree with kfisherx and emma-leigh here. I don't think our body cares where those cals are coming from, as long as they fit into the day's macros. I've 'eaten clean' and i've 'eaten dirty' while sticking to a certain macronutrient ratio. My rate of fat loss seemed about the same, and I think I looked about the same.

    Sure. If someone WANTS to eat natural foods everyday forever, thats cool. Definitely healthy. But who can do that? Sometimes we just GOTTA have that junky piece of food. I never feel guilty if I know I'm still at my ratios and in a deficit. No reason to....

    I also have recently decided that the 'eat several small meals' and 'don't eat late at night' ideas are crap. Cals are cals. I don't think my body cares when it gets them, so long as it does....

    To the OP: cut cals (but still eat enough to supply ur body) and bust your ass in the gym Thats really it! I don't think supps are necessary exactly, but things like vitamins can't hurt, and your protein of course Which 12 week program are you doing? In any case, good luck!
    Last edited by vandalgirl59; 01-18-2010 at 10:47 AM.
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    Da fuk is this. Echo814's Avatar
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    ^^^^^^^^
    Your digestive system and metabolism does not magically turn off at night or any other time of the day. With me its hard to get in six meals, so three does me good with a couple of snacks if I can fit them in. I eat what I like and for the most part I keep it 80% clean and natural, but I keep my indulgences as well. Stay in your calorie and macro range that's all that matters, calorie in calorie out.
    If this were easy, everyone would walk around ripped.

    I like eating, it helps with the not dying.

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    Horticulturist/Pet Sitter georgiehopper's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Echo814 View Post
    ^^^^^^^^
    Your digestive system and metabolism does not magically turn off at night or any other time of the day. With me its hard to get in six meals, so three does me good with a couple of snacks if I can fit them in. I eat what I like and for the most part I keep it 80% clean and natural, but I keep my indulgences as well. Stay in your calorie and macro range that's all that matters, calorie in calorie out.
    I thought the thinking behind the multiple meals is keep the metabolism stoked. If one goes more than 3 or 4 hours between meals, then the body's metabolism will start to slow.

    The 6 meals per day works great for me...otherwise, I am starving in between meals. Multiple meals keep me on an even keel.
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    Originally Posted by georgiehopper View Post
    I thought the thinking behind the multiple meals is keep the metabolism stoked. If one goes more than 3 or 4 hours between meals, then the body's metabolism will start to slow.

    The 6 meals per day works great for me...otherwise, I am starving in between meals. Multiple meals keep me on an even keel.
    That's really the whole idea behind it...also, if you wait four hours to eat, you may be starving and eat a lot more than you need (or can burn). Also, it often isn't six "meals," but three plus snacks in-between. I always eat a complex carb snack prior to working out and have a protein shake after --- I count each of these as one of my six.
    h
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    Originally Posted by FitnessCrush View Post
    That's really the whole idea behind it...also, if you wait four hours to eat, you may be starving and eat a lot more than you need (or can burn). Also, it often isn't six "meals," but three plus snacks in-between. I always eat a complex carb snack prior to working out and have a protein shake after --- I count each of these as one of my six.
    One thing about the shakes though, I had recently read that they do not have the metabolism boosting affect that regular food does since they are more easily digested. I don't know if that's bs or not.
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    Originally Posted by vandalgirl59 View Post
    I'm going to have to give my nonexpert opinion, and agree with kfisherx and emma-leigh here. I don't think our body cares where those cals are coming from, as long as they fit into the day's macros. I've 'eaten clean' and i've 'eaten dirty' while sticking to a certain macronutrient ratio. My rate of fat loss seemed about the same, and I think I looked about the same.

    Sure. If someone WANTS to eat natural foods everyday forever, thats cool. Definitely healthy. But who can do that? Sometimes we just GOTTA have that junky piece of food. I never feel guilty if I know I'm still at my ratios and in a deficit. No reason to....

    I also have recently decided that the 'eat several small meals' and 'don't eat late at night' ideas are crap. Cals are cals. I don't think my body cares when it gets them, so long as it does....

    To the OP: cut cals (but still eat enough to supply ur body) and bust your ass in the gym Thats really it! I don't think supps are necessary exactly, but things like vitamins can't hurt, and your protein of course Which 12 week program are you doing? In any case, good luck!
    The way I manage it is to eat healthy six days a week. On the 7th day I have a cheat meal and it can be as dirty as I like. Sometimes I don't even want it though...the healthier foods you eat the more you crave them and less of the junk. That may not apply to everyone, but it does to many people.

    What you said to the OP about busting your ass in the gym...I couldn't agree more. It is the absolute best way to lose weight.
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    But what about eating to prevent disease??? Diabetes, high blood pressure, high cholesterol etc. So if its all calorie for calorie and a bunch of crap food fits into your macros, it won't help you lower your blood pressure, get your blood sugars under control----it will all catch up to you. Sure, maybe you will be the weight you want, but you won't feel, look or be as healthy as someone that chooses the healthy foods.
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    Originally Posted by georgiehopper View Post
    One thing about the shakes though, I had recently read that they do not have the metabolism boosting affect that regular food does since they are more easily digested. I don't know if that's bs or not.
    That is somewhat true, but we really shouldn't count the protein shake as a metabolism boosting food anyway.

    The whole idea behind the shakes is that after a work out your muscles have depleted their glycogen stores and (hopefully) are injured slightly and needing to repair themselves. Research has shown that if you drink a protein shake 30-60 min. after a work out, your muscles get the most benefits from the protein in the shake. Without proper protein muscles will not respond to training as well as with it...many trainers suggest 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight per day. I believe that for women 1 gram per is plenty...
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    Originally Posted by FitnessCrush View Post

    Clean Eating has many definitions and philosophies behind it. The easiest way to eat clean is to stay away from processed foods such as these:

    -canned foods with lots of sodium
    -white breads and pastas made with refined white flour, which are not as healthy as those
    made with whole grains
    -packaged high-calorie snack foods, like chips and cheese snacks
    -high-fat convenience foods, like cans of ravioli
    -frozen fish sticks and frozen dinners
    -packaged cakes and cookies
    -boxed meal mixes
    -sugary breakfast cereals
    -processed meats

    They hold no nutrition to speak of (none that your body needs anyway) and are empty calories. Sugar poisons the body and is addictive -- so limit your sugar as much as possible.

    And when I say "low-fat," I am referring to saturated and trans fats. Your body needs good fats that come from fish, nuts, olives and oils.

    Your daily intake needs to be a healthy mix of complex carbs, protein and fats. Pretty simple really.

    You don't have to live on tuna, chicken and egg whites. I sure don't!! And a donut or cookie once in a while won't kill ya...just don't make them part of your daily intake or it will take you a lot longer to see measurable results (weightwise and healthwise).

    If people want to call me a bro (don't know what that is since I'm a girl??) they can, but there is no way that anyone in their right mind could say that eating healthy foods is crazy or bad. Eating this way will not only help you lose weight over time but boost your immune system, lower your cholesterol, help your blood pressure, give you more energy, etc. etc. etc.
    __________________
    That is YOUR PERSONAL definition of what clean eating is BUT if you ask 10 other people.... You will get 10 other answers and guess what??? They will all be right for that person. Thus the reason why the term is silly to use on a forum like this.

    You can eat however you want to eat but DON'T force your definintion upon other people because your definition of "clean" eating does not match theirs and shouldn't.

    I am not saying that eating WHOLE foods (I assume that is what you mean by "healthy" above) is a bad idea. But I am saying that this whole FOOD AVOIDANCE thing such as "stay away from sugar", "stay away from fats", has NO scientific evidence to support the claims that people who do them seem to think exist. Sugar is not Poison and studies prove that eating a small amount of sugar does NOTHING bad to anyone... Also if you are an endurance runner or (like me) do hours and hours of training for sport than sugar is a GOOD thing. Pretty much any food you avoid, I can make work in my plans AND still meet my physique as well as my performance goals even if I have a cookie every single day!!!

    Originally Posted by FitnessCrush View Post
    That's really the whole idea behind it....
    Again shows your lack of education on the recent actual data RE nutrition. This has been proven to be complete garbage. Eating every few hours does not keep your metabolism more roaring than eating 3 times a day. You have a lot of "bro-science" information in your data-banks is the problem. Doesn't matter if you are a girl or boy. It means you are listening to latest "fad" nutritional information without questioning the source or science behind that data.

    This is where I have to step in because you call yourself a professional, training people and are writing articles on this stuff YET you haven't even done the basic research on the stuff you are spouting as facts...

    Spend a few hours reading from these folks and you will be forever enlightened...

    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showpo...91&postcount=5
    Last edited by kfisherx; 01-18-2010 at 12:55 PM.
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    Originally Posted by georgiehopper View Post
    I thought the thinking behind the multiple meals is keep the metabolism stoked. If one goes more than 3 or 4 hours between meals, then the body's metabolism will start to slow.

    The 6 meals per day works great for me...otherwise, I am starving in between meals. Multiple meals keep me on an even keel.
    same here, once I eat less often, I starving, and then make much worse food choices...
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    Originally Posted by georgiehopper View Post
    I thought the thinking behind the multiple meals is keep the metabolism stoked. If one goes more than 3 or 4 hours between meals, then the body's metabolism will start to slow.

    The 6 meals per day works great for me...otherwise, I am starving in between meals. Multiple meals keep me on an even keel.
    Originally Posted by FitnessCrush View Post
    That's really the whole idea behind it...also, if you wait four hours to eat, you may be starving and eat a lot more than you need (or can burn). Also, it often isn't six "meals," but three plus snacks in-between. I always eat a complex carb snack prior to working out and have a protein shake after --- I count each of these as one of my six.
    This is incorrect and just another 'myth' that will not die. There is no evidence to suggest that more frequent meals 'stoke' the metabolism at all.

    The thermogenic effect of feeding is related to calorie load and macronutrient intake and is expressed as a % of total calorie intake for a given period. Thus: 3 x 600 cal meals = the same effect on metabolism as 6 x 300 cal meals.

    The only effect more frequent eating has is it can help SOME people from snacking between meals (thus decreases excess calorie consumption and helps people stick to their diets)... HOWEVER - some small females actually do better on LESS meals - as it allows their meal intakes to be LARGER and helps with satiety BETTER than 'bird meals' of 200-300 cals each.

    There is a stack of info in the ADVANCED NUTRITION section of the main nutrition forum.
    You can also read info on www.leangains.com < Martin has done a stack of research into feeding frequency and helped develop a concept of dieting based on IF....
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    Originally Posted by Emma-Leigh View Post
    This is incorrect and just another 'myth' that will not die. There is no evidence to suggest that more frequent meals 'stoke' the metabolism at all.

    The thermogenic effect of feeding is related to calorie load and macronutrient intake and is expressed as a % of total calorie intake for a given period. Thus: 3 x 600 cal meals = the same effect on metabolism as 6 x 300 cal meals.

    The only effect more frequent eating has is it can help SOME people from snacking between meals (thus decreases excess calorie consumption and helps people stick to their diets)... HOWEVER - some small females actually do better on LESS meals - as it allows their meal intakes to be LARGER and helps with satiety BETTER than 'bird meals' of 200-300 cals each.

    There is a stack of info in the ADVANCED NUTRITION section of the main nutrition forum.
    You can also read info on www.leangains.com < Martin has done a stack of research into feeding frequency and helped develop a concept of dieting based on IF....
    Those of you who are against what we are saying about the more frequent meals are missing a huge point here --- if we are using protein to supplement for muscle growth and repair purposes, each time a shake is consumed it is counted as a meal.

    I don't know about you, but if I tried to drink a protein shake with, say lunch, I'd be so full and bloated I think I might explode. Having one in the AM (sometimes it is my breakfast) and one post-workout works quite well and again, counts as one of the so-called meals I am eating.

    Also, a mid-morning or mid-afternoon snack of an apple and peanut butter counts as a meal to me.

    Lastly, breakfast, lunch and dinner consist of more than 200 - 300 calories. But they are relatively light because I skip the fat-laden sauces, dressings, corn-syrup infused foods and instead fill up on lean proteins, complex carbs and mono-unsaturated fats.
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    Originally Posted by kfisherx View Post
    That is YOUR PERSONAL definition of what clean eating is BUT if you ask 10 other people.... You will get 10 other answers and guess what??? They will all be right for that person. Thus the reason why the term is silly to use on a forum like this.

    You can eat however you want to eat but DON'T force your definintion upon other people because your definition of "clean" eating does not match theirs and shouldn't.

    I am not saying that eating WHOLE foods (I assume that is what you mean by "healthy" above) is a bad idea. But I am saying that this whole FOOD AVOIDANCE thing such as "stay away from sugar", "stay away from fats", has NO scientific evidence to support the claims that people who do them seem to think exist. Sugar is not Poison and studies prove that eating a small amount of sugar does NOTHING bad to anyone... Also if you are an endurance runner or (like me) do hours and hours of training for sport than sugar is a GOOD thing. Pretty much any food you avoid, I can make work in my plans AND still meet my physique as well as my performance goals even if I have a cookie every single day!!!



    Again shows your lack of education on the recent actual data RE nutrition. This has been proven to be complete garbage. Eating every few hours does not keep your metabolism more roaring than eating 3 times a day. You have a lot of "bro-science" information in your data-banks is the problem. Doesn't matter if you are a girl or boy. It means you are listening to latest "fad" nutritional information without questioning the source or science behind that data.

    This is where I have to step in because you call yourself a professional, training people and are writing articles on this stuff YET you haven't even done the basic research on the stuff you are spouting as facts...

    Spend a few hours reading from these folks and you will be forever enlightened...

    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showpo...91&postcount=5
    Do you realize that the women on this site are normal women and not athletes like you? They cannot eat sugar and crap every day and still meet their goals. If they could they would not be here in the first place!!

    And

    I do research every single day. I guess you don't think that published studies in medical journals are accurate?
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    Originally Posted by FitnessCrush View Post
    Do you realize that the women on this site are normal women and not athletes like you? They cannot eat sugar and crap every day and still meet their goals. If they could they would not be here in the first place!!

    And

    I do research every single day. I guess you don't think that published studies in medical journals are accurate?

    Of course I realize that there are some fitness women on here as well as compeition and pro athletes. But it isn't true that they cannot eat sugar and crap and still meet their fitness, fat loss, strength goals.

    Goodie that you do research every single day and are willing to discuss things at this level! Please show me the studies that prove that eating 5-6 meals a day revs the metabolism!
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    Originally Posted by FitnessCrush View Post
    Those of you who are against what we are saying about the more frequent meals are missing a huge point here --- if we are using protein to supplement for muscle growth and repair purposes, each time a shake is consumed it is counted as a meal.
    No YOU are missing the point. You are claiming (and advising people) that in order to rev the metabolism (keep it moving) you have to eat 6 meals a day. It doesn't matter if that is a protein shake or a hamburger. In your data-bank there is some rule that exists that if I only ate 3 times a day that my metabolism would burn slower than if I ate 6 times a day. Let's assume that calories and macros and foods are the same by the end of the day. You are telling me that if I ate 6 times versus 3 (same foods) I would have better results.

    Please show us where the studies are that prove this.
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    I must say just one little thing... 95% of the articles on this site, that related to nutrition states this princible of many small meals douring the day...
    I don't have enough supporting facts to eather way, I know it works best for me..
    but still,, considering the fact that this site is my most reliable source, and from hundreds of transformation stories I read here, they all say 5-6 meals douring the day is one of the important things in your diet...and sugar is a big no no...huge no no...
    I was very very surprised to read that its not 100% true statment for all..
    so I just curious to read the rest of the discussion and to learn a thing or 2...
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    Originally Posted by power.mom View Post
    I must say just one little thing... 95% of the articles on this site, that related to nutrition states this princible of many small meals douring the day...
    I don't have enough supporting facts to eather way, I know it works best for me..
    but still,, considering the fact that this site is my most reliable source, and from hundreds of transformation stories I read here, they all say 5-6 meals douring the day is one of the important things in your diet...and sugar is a big no no...huge no no...
    I was very very surprised to read that its not 100% true statment for all..
    so I just curious to read the rest of the discussion and to learn a thing or 2...
    This is exactly what it is important that we do not allow this thread to go where it started. Sad that 95% of the people believe it when it isn't true. You are reading the wrong theads.

    That said, the whole "eating every few hours" thing does work well for some people to fight against the hunger pangs. Other people it absolutely kills which is why professionals REALLY need to be aware of the facts and not just make blanket statements. So if it works for you personally, there is nothing wrong with it. The wrong is advising it because it helps your metabolism.

    Please refer to post 5 on this thread and the people I suggested as real experts in nutrition. Alan, Lyle and Jamie have AWESOME websites with articles on them for you to read to get a REAL education.
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    georgiehopper is offline
    Originally Posted by kfisherx View Post
    Of course I realize that there are some fitness women on here as well as compeition and pro athletes. But it isn't true that they cannot eat sugar and crap and still meet their fitness, fat loss, strength goals.

    Goodie that you do research every single day and are willing to discuss things at this level! Please show me the studies that prove that eating 5-6 meals a day revs the metabolism!

    If this is bunk, then why is it that many people have a harder time losing fat if they eat all of their calories in one of two meals a day?

    My sister used to weigh 205. She used to eat 2 meals a day...her calories were probably around 1700 per day at the time. She was running 3 miles daily and doing resistance training 4 times per week. Then she went on a 6 meal per day program which took her up to 2200 calories a day..her workouts stayed the same. She now weighs 126. The multiple meals works for her.

    Just sayin
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