Those you who train muay thai

[parkerbro1]

I have a question for you guys that don't throw the arm back. I'm trying to picture how you guys are doing it. Are you saying you keep both hands up by your chin as if you were still in your normal stance while throwing the kick?

Honestly I do it both ways, but for not dropping the hand: The same hand that you'd drop you throw at the opponent's face instead, an instant before the kick. It's like a feint (or is one), where you're trying to get the opponent to slip his head back to expose the torso or leg. The arm is just higher and somewhat blocking instead of down. Power is still there (maybe not as strong as arm-down, but still dam good, especially if you train it a lot).

great vids btw, Jager.

[JAGERBOY]

Honestly I do it both ways, but for not dropping the hand: The same hand that you'd drop you throw at the opponent's face instead, an instant before the kick. It's like a feint (or is one), where you're trying to get the opponent to slip his head back to expose the torso or leg. The arm is just higher and somewhat blocking instead of down. Power is still there (maybe not as strong as arm-down, but still dam good, especially if you train it a lot).

great vids btw, Jager.

Well I do that too for certain kicks, but I'm still somewhat throwing it "back" and using it as a counter balance. I was imagining people keeping both hands at the chin the entire time.

[joelz54_99]

you're in TX....do you train at Saekson Janjira's

I trained with him before.

[joelz54_99]

I was imagining people keeping both hands at the chin the entire time.

LOL

Why would anyone do that?

[King Baer]

I think it's funny that people are suggesting that you are wide open to getting punched in the face when you drop your hand while throwing a roundhouse.

Apparently Floyd Mayweather gets punched in the face alot too?

A huge part of protecting your chin is shoulder movement and positioning. The hand doesn't have to be up to be protected. Just something to think about.

A proper "muay thai" roundhouse with the arm thrown back has you tucking your chin into your shoulder, which is shrugged up. PLUS, a good kick has you moving at an angle so it is difficult to get tagged with a straight punch that way.

I manage to counter people more effectively off their punches than their kicks.. so for me, throwing certain punches have more inherent risks than a good body kick.

[drpurple]

I think it's funny that people are suggesting that you are wide open to getting punched in the face when you drop your hand while throwing a roundhouse.

Apparently Floyd Mayweather gets punched in the face alot too?

A huge part of protecting your chin is shoulder movement and positioning. The hand doesn't have to be up to be protected. Just something to think about.

A proper "muay thai" roundhouse with the arm thrown back has you tucking your chin into your shoulder, which is shrugged up. PLUS, a good kick has you moving at an angle so it is difficult to get tagged with a straight punch that way.

I manage to counter people more effectively off their punches than their kicks.. so for me, throwing certain punches have more inherent risks than a good body kick.

this. not only are you leaning back/away/around from your opponent; the weapon you are employing is a hell of a lot more damaging to your opponent than a punch, added to the fact that to "counter" this kick, they have to lean forward and/or over it, opening up the ribs as they do.

as a fighter whose primary weapons are his legs (knees first, kicks second), i often use kicks to deter an opponent from approaching as timed right, a well placed kick not only bruises, but can completely off-balance your opponent.

[JAGERBOY]

LOL

Why would anyone do that?

Because apparently thats what some people do.

[drpurple]

Because apparently thats what some people do.

like power rangers and buffy the vampire slayer, for example.

[JAGERBOY]

like power rangers and buffy the vampire slayer, for example.

Buffy is a perfect example. Keep both arms up and throw the kick. I'm pretty sure I've seen people say they literally do that.

[joelz54_99]

Well, its their face I guess.

[YesThatGuy]

Buffy is a perfect example. Keep both arms up and throw the kick. I'm pretty sure I've seen people say they literally do that.

I still think the people that say they do this don't train UFC in real life like they claim to.

[JAGERBOY]

I still think the people that say they do this don't train UFC in real life like they claim to.

Like CK?

[YesThatGuy]

Like CK?

CK's coach is holding him back and forcing him to look silly.

[JAGERBOY]

CK's coach is holding him back and forcing him to look silly.

You think CK trains under Rupert?

[YesThatGuy]

You think CK trains under Rupert?

[LG155]

I still think the people that say they do this don't train UFC in real life like they claim to.

I have never heard of someone training "UFC". I do hear a lot of ignorant people call MMA this though.
I keep my hands up when i throw the roundhouse just as much as I don't, depending on the circumstance. I don't hold my arm "stiff", I jerk the elbow a little bit, but my hand remains by my chin for the most part. I have had lots of success with it in fights with guys who train MT, and in sparring sessions. Believe, or don't believe..doesn't matter as long as it works for me.

[Clark_Kent]

This.

[LG155]

The original post asked people that train Muay Thai what there thoughts are on throwing the hand back for kicks. I have trained Muay Thai for several years, and watched hundreds of Muay Thai fights and instructionals online. In the context of Muay Thai....you throw the hand back for round house kicks. I don't understand what you aren't getting.

The following are all screen shots taken from all of your videos just before halfway thrown(roundhouse). You can clearly see that in all of them the chin is almost completely wide open as well as the mid section. Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not dissing the Muay Thai. But If someone crashed in at this moment, these guys would be in trouble. Don't even say it's not possible. If you have ever sparred with someone who trains non-telegraphics, and interception..you know exactly what i'm talking about. This is why I keep my hand up in front of the chin in some situations(not all).

[LG155]

lol at the people who watch buffy the vampire slayer. I believe she holds her hands up like that, because it's supposed to be kempo. BTW, chuck liddel was a kempo practitioner. Not that he kept his hands up though..

[eazy e 123]

Once upon a time, I used to throw the round house and put my hands up in front of my face(sort of like crazy monkey except i can see). Some guys came into the gym and convinced me try throwing my rear arm/hand down for more power, although i was very against it. I have always worried about a strike getting through with my hand down. What is your view on this? I have been throwing the round house both ways for a long time and never been caught either way, but i'm not convinced that I won't get caught with my hand down.. i'm just curious to get the opinions of some guys who have trained muay thai exclusively, or anyone who has seen a lot of this.

that's the old way of throwing muay thai kicks, these days they push their back hands up

true story

[HardGainer82]

The following are all screen shots taken from all of your videos just before halfway thrown(roundhouse). You can clearly see that in all of them the chin is almost completely wide open as well as the mid section. Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not dissing the Muay Thai. But If someone crashed in at this moment, these guys would be in trouble. Don't even say it's not possible. If you have ever sparred with someone who trains non-telegraphics, and interception..you know exactly what i'm talking about. This is why I keep my hand up in front of the chin in some situations(not all).

I could be wrong, but it looks like three out of those four guys have a hand in front of their face...

[JAGERBOY]

The following are all screen shots taken from all of your videos just before halfway thrown(roundhouse). You can clearly see that in all of them the chin is almost completely wide open as well as the mid section. Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not dissing the Muay Thai. But If someone crashed in at this moment, these guys would be in trouble. Don't even say it's not possible. If you have ever sparred with someone who trains non-telegraphics, and interception..you know exactly what i'm talking about. This is why I keep my hand up in front of the chin in some situations(not all).

So don't do it that way if you feel its poor form, pretty simple.


Also, can you post an example of they way you kick? Thanks.

[parkerbro1]

Well I do that too for certain kicks, but I'm still somewhat throwing it "back" and using it as a counter balance. I was imagining people keeping both hands at the chin the entire time.

Agreed, mine do go a lil back, since my body leans away. But to me it's mostly a set up to sink the kick.
I've seen many newbies do what you're saying with their arms (even some experienced fighters too, which is scary). I think it's one of the worst things one can do, no matter the style. For one, you'd be way too stiff to execute the kick properly I think.

I think it's funny that people are suggesting that you are wide open to getting punched in the face when you drop your hand while throwing a roundhouse.

Apparently Floyd Mayweather gets punched in the face alot too?

A huge part of protecting your chin is shoulder movement and positioning. The hand doesn't have to be up to be protected. Just something to think about.

A proper "muay thai" roundhouse with the arm thrown back has you tucking your chin into your shoulder, which is shrugged up. PLUS, a good kick has you moving at an angle so it is difficult to get tagged with a straight punch that way.

I manage to counter people more effectively off their punches than their kicks.. so for me, throwing certain punches have more inherent risks than a good body kick.

This is what I said earlier. You can still protect yourself while dropping the hand. It's the lack of this part of the technique that can get ya in trouble with counters.

this. not only are you leaning back/away/around from your opponent; the weapon you are employing is a hell of a lot more damaging to your opponent than a punch, added to the fact that to "counter" this kick, they have to lean forward and/or over it, opening up the ribs as they do.

as a fighter whose primary weapons are his legs (knees first, kicks second), i often use kicks to deter an opponent from approaching as timed right, a well placed kick not only bruises, but can completely off-balance your opponent.

Agreed, this. It can also cause them to pause-lock, opening them up to more attacks as they try and recover. You don't need much power to set it up either, it just needs to be timed right.

[King Baer]

Sort-of-LOL when people criticize Buakaw's form.

I mean, IF ANYTHING, don't you think the fact that Buakaw and Kaman DON'T have their chins extremely tucked suggests that, OVERALL, it's pretty SAFE to throw the kick and drop the hand?

These are world-class fighters. Whatever they are doing, it works.

[LG155]

Sort-of-LOL when people criticize Buakaw's form.

I wasn't criticizing anyone's form. All the video's displayed proper technique as far is MT goes. I wasn't saying that at all. I was just pointing out a vulnerability that other's believe is not there.There are pro's and cons in all techniques. And you open yourself up somewhere, in someway any time you are attacking.

jager, I am still trying to get a hold of something recent. No way am I posting something from 3 years ago and getting my ass reamed.

[LG155]

I could be wrong, but it looks like three out of those four guys have a hand in front of their face...

replace face, with forehead.

[HardGainer82]

replace face, with forehead.

Forehead is part of the face...it's not RIGHT on the chin, but it's not like it's at the waist...

[drpurple]

Sort-of-LOL when people criticize Buakaw's form.

I mean, IF ANYTHING, don't you think the fact that Buakaw and Kaman DON'T have their chins extremely tucked suggests that, OVERALL, it's pretty SAFE to throw the kick and drop the hand?

These are world-class fighters. Whatever they are doing, it works.

indeed. i think a fighter with hundreds of fights who has only ever been knocked out a handful of times, despite fighting world class competition is a pretty safe person to emulate. and this doesnt apply to buakaw exclusively; kaoklai, orono, sakmonkol, mot-ek muang, ek-ubon, songchai-lek, rambo, nungubon, neungtrakarn.....etc etc etc.

pretty much all of them throw the same kick, with minor alterations for body shape, size etc...and its not like these guys are getting knocked out left right and centre.

[tabloid]

you don't need 2 hands to block a punch

[LG155]

indeed. i think a fighter with hundreds of fights who has only ever been knocked out a handful of times, despite fighting world class competition is a pretty safe person to emulate. and this doesnt apply to buakaw exclusively; kaoklai, orono, sakmonkol, mot-ek muang, ek-ubon, songchai-lek, rambo, nungubon, neungtrakarn.....etc etc etc.

pretty much all of them throw the same kick, with minor alterations for body shape, size etc...and its not like these guys are getting knocked out left right and centre.

that's very untrue. Just because someone else is successful with something, doesn't mean you will be. People like this win because of timing, strategy, and a lot of hard work. You are giving all the credit to what time of martial art they study. I never said there was anything wrong with training Muay thai in the first place anyway. I just showed you an opening that you swore wasn't there. These guys don't get hit, because they time it perfectly, and there is nothing wrong with that. I'm really not sure why everyone is taking offense to be honest. All I did was take a screen shot. If you are having trouble understanding, read the whole thread.