2017-2018 Orders Part 4: 12 Scoops of Protein, Manlets and Sprinkled Doughnuts

[Farley1324]

What's this White Flash??

It's coming, just a little behind the Orange Brainwash timeline

[crpav]

And yesterday he was contemplating giving up supplements.

Well, I'm in this far so no going back. Key word was "contemplating".

[gbullock32]

Well, I'm in this far so no going back. Key word was "contemplating".

When you're in balls deep there is no pulling out.

[Misctake7]

I appreciate you sharing all of this man. I am always interested in folks cutting, reverse dieting, etc and following along because I always have a tough time determining what my calories should be... and sometimes trouble counting.

I've used the nutrition stickies to run calculations, and I've used the calculator on IIFYM. Typically always has me in the 2200 calorie range to cut. On the other side... I travel roughly 100 nights per year for work and while I often can find easily trackable food (bags of almonds, protein bars, etc), more often than not I am taking a client out to eat at a restaurant that doesn't have nutrition info.

I've got about 20lbs to lose (thanks Christmas Cookie season) and am striving for more consistent weight loss without totally killing my progress in the gym. That's why I was so interested earlier this week in KBayne's pre/post carb consumption. I've also cut out most of the alcohol (not a habitual drinker but LOVE craft beer).

All in all, just wanted to thank you for always sharing your plans and to everyone else who consistently offers great info on here. It's a big help.

Yea, I thought a lot about it last night during cardio and eating my post workout meal. If you're cutting like I am, volume in workouts are very high and cardio even gets high. Calories were still moderate until the last week or so when I completely cut out carbs. The plan in a reverse is to slowly decrease volume in both training and cardio. Diet wise, no magic number, just slowly adding more protein and carbs back into the diet. Fats usually shouldn't get that low, so they should be good for awhile at staying the same. The mistake a lot of people make is starting a completely new routine and increasing calories too fast. You don't jump immediately back to maintenance or bulk calories because that's not what your body currently requires.

Now I did change my programming of training around a little but, but volume is still high. I'll continue pulling back the number of sets over time. Cardio is still roughly 20mins after lifting. I legit almost went hypo last night while I was driving home because of how carb sensitive my body is right now. But sadly strength takes time to come back. It sucks because energy levels are super high with the more calories, but lifts will take time to build back up. Outside of deadlifts last night, everything increased weight and rep wise. Those compounds can be tough getting your strength back in at times. But it will come back. I'm basically planning on just taking 1 extra day off this coming week(so 2 rest days next week) and see how I feel. I can always add more rest days if needed but I prefer not since it is important to be still pushing your body when adding in the extra calories back in initially.

Trial and error man. Gets frustrating but I have my expectations dialed in right now.

[gbullock32]

So I had the Peanut Butter and Double Chocolate Quest cookies.

Pretty good, the peanut butter had more of a peanut taste rather than peanut butter if anything (odd to describe) and had a baked taste to it, almost a little burnt tasting.

The double chocolate was very chocalatey and had a strong cocoa taste to it, it was soft and chewy but at the same time quite dry really, needed some milk on the side.

So far I did enjoy both of them but think that I would say the equivalent flavors of L&L have an advantage in being more moist and having a slightly better flavor overall. Tried half as is and then microwaved the other half; microwaving was an improvement, made them softer and warm.




Having the Oatmeal Raisin and Chocolate Chip tonight.

[crpav]

I am having a tough time getting the feeling back in the gym ever since Christmas and the small break I took. It's a mind/muscle thing plus body and muscles are still not "clicking" but this morning was better. Used a packet of Nutrix Outlift Amped I had in the Fruit Candy flavor and enjoyed it. I decided to go with dumbbell bench today to work on improving my mind/muscle connection and switch it up as I have been doing barbell bench for a long time. With my knee and ankle bothering me a bit lately and am trying to slow back itno legs with the leg press I did very light squats to work on form, flexibility and using the muscles needed properly to slowly increase weight.

I am sitting at 2100 calories a day but might need to start increasing. Might be part of the "not feeling" and recovery issue.

[BenBlue]

I am having a tough time getting the feeling back in the gym ever since Christmas and the small break I took. It's a mind/muscle thing plus body and muscles are still not "clicking" but this morning was better. Used a packet of Nutrix Outlift Amped I had in the Fruit Candy flavor and enjoyed it. I decided to go with dumbbell bench today to work on improving my mind/muscle connection and switch it up as I have been doing barbell bench for a long time. With my knee and ankle bothering me a bit lately and am trying to slow back itno legs with the leg press I did very light squats to work on form, flexibility and using the muscles needed properly to slowly increase weight.

I am sitting at 2100 calories a day but might need to start increasing. Might be part of the "not feeling" and recovery issue.

Ya an increase might help. That seems pretty low to me, but I'm not sure your size/weight. Either way, an increase in calories can only help with performance.

[crpav]

Ya an increase might help. That seems pretty low to me, but I'm not sure your size/weight. Either way, an increase in calories can only help with performance.

I'm 5'8" and about 172. I struggle with my image and the scale which I know I shouldn't but it's how it is. Being a fat kid growing up plus my genetics it seems no matter what the extra calories turn right to fat in the midsection which for me mentally is just hard to get over.

[Misctake7]

I'm 5'8" and about 172. I struggle with my image and the scale which I know I shouldn't but it's how it is. Being a fat kid growing up plus my genetics it seems no matter what the extra calories turn right to fat in the midsection which for me mentally is just hard to get over.

Practicing the nutrient timing we talked about earlier can go a long way in helping you. From what I recall, you've been on very low calories for a long time. Most of us should be able to get by on 2300-2600 to maintain on training days depending on how hard and intense your workouts are. If you feel like you're going through the motions at the gym, you need to take your training a step up. If you're training super F-ing hard, your physique should display that and will need all those extra calories.

I think you have a couple options. Look at your training and improve it + nutrient timing(carbs only pre/intra/post workout, fats and protein for all other meals). Those things should be done regardless.
-Slowly bump up your calories and increase the intensity in your lifts as your strength increases.
-Or cut down until you hit the leanest you've ever been and build yourself back up. Insulin sensitivity will be very high and the calories you add back slowly will go towards lean body mass as long as you maintain training hard. It will be hard to gain fat unless you are eating a lot right away and have a crap diet, which I know you usually track or have somewhat of an idea of quality foods you should be eating.

Just my 2c


I was not comfortable when I bulked up last year but when cutting down, it seriously paid off. Sometimes you need to go through times of feeling uncomfortable with the end goal in mind. But a difference between uncomfortable and sloppy is very important. I didn't get sloppy, I got big and watery. I didn't have loads of fat to get rid of.

[BenBlue]

I'm 5'8" and about 172. I struggle with my image and the scale which I know I shouldn't but it's how it is. Being a fat kid growing up plus my genetics it seems no matter what the extra calories turn right to fat in the midsection which for me mentally is just hard to get over.

I know those feelz man. I was actually a fat kid growing up too, and that's a big reason why I got into weight training. Over the years I've managed to change my body composition quite a bit, but I've also realized I actually had decent genetics from the start, so I had that working in my favor. I've always loved food though, and fatty/carby foods in particular. It took me a long time to find a comfortable balance between training and nutrition. But when I started focusing on getting stronger vs looking good, everything kind of changed for me. Now I can eat really comfortably and walk around at 12-14% body fat and still feel fine with taking my shirt off at the beach because, well, I'm big and strong and not just fat lmao I remember 5-7 years ago I trained like crazy, ate very few carbs, was single digit body fat for the first and only time in my life. I looked amazing, but I just didn't find it sustainable. I felt guilty every time I had a few beers or ate out. That's not fun. Gotta strike a balance.

[BenBlue]

Practicing the nutrient timing we talked about earlier can go a long way in helping you. From what I recall, you've been on very low calories for a long time. Most of us should be able to get by on 2300-2600 to maintain on training days depending on how hard and intense your workouts are. If you feel like you're going through the motions at the gym, you need to take your training a step up. If you're training super F-ing hard, your physique should display that and will need all those extra calories.

I think you have a couple options. Look at your training and improve it + nutrient timing(carbs only pre/intra/post workout, fats and protein for all other meals). Those things should be done regardless.
-Slowly bump up your calories and increase the intensity in your lifts as your strength increases.
-Or cut down until you hit the leanest you've ever been and build yourself back up. Insulin sensitivity will be very high and the calories you add back slowly will go towards lean body mass as long as you maintain training hard. It will be hard to gain fat unless you are eating a lot right away and have a crap diet, which I know you usually track or have somewhat of an idea of quality foods you should be eating.

Just my 2c

Great advice and I am a believer these days in nutrient timing as well. Misctake posts actually played a big part in me rethinking it.

[crpav]

Practicing the nutrient timing we talked about earlier can go a long way in helping you. From what I recall, you've been on very low calories for a long time. Most of us should be able to get by on 2300-2600 to maintain on training days depending on how hard and intense your workouts are. If you feel like you're going through the motions at the gym, you need to take your training a step up. If you're training super F-ing hard, your physique should display that and will need all those extra calories.

I think you have a couple options. Look at your training and improve it + nutrient timing(carbs only pre/intra/post workout, fats and protein for all other meals). Those things should be done regardless.
-Slowly bump up your calories and increase the intensity in your lifts as your strength increases.
-Or cut down until you hit the leanest you've ever been and build yourself back up. Insulin sensitivity will be very high and the calories you add back slowly will go towards lean body mass as long as you maintain training hard. It will be hard to gain fat unless you are eating a lot right away and have a crap diet, which I know you usually track or have somewhat of an idea of quality foods you should be eating.

Just my 2c


I was not comfortable when I bulked up last year but when cutting down, it seriously paid off. Sometimes you need to go through times of feeling uncomfortable with the end goal in mind. But a difference between uncomfortable and sloppy is very important. I didn't get sloppy, I got big and watery. I didn't have loads of fat to get rid of.

Thanks for the input. I know it's mostly mental and I will be just fine. Last year I started slow and eventually took off. Slowly increased calories and for the most part was at 2700 all year. I only lift 3 days a week for an hour or so but pretty heavy and intense. Mostly the big lifts with a few accessories.

I know those feelz man. I was actually a fat kid growing up too, and that's a big reason why I got into weight training. Over the years I've managed to change my body composition quite a bit, but I've also realized I actually had decent genetics from the start, so I had that working in my favor. I've always loved food though, and fatty/carby foods in particular. It took me a long time to find a comfortable balance between training and nutrition. But when I started focusing on getting stronger vs looking good, everything kind of changed for me. Now I can eat really comfortably and walk around at 12-14% body fat and still feel fine with taking my shirt off at the beach because, well, I'm big and strong and not just fat lmao I remember 5-7 years ago I trained like crazy, ate very few carbs, was single digit body fat for the first and only time in my life. I looked amazing, but I just didn't find it sustainable. I felt guilty every time I had a few beers or ate out. That's not fun. Gotta strike a balance.

Yeah I'll be fine just got to get the groove back and not worry about the slow start to the year.

[Deadliftin]

Ya an increase might help. That seems pretty low to me, but I'm not sure your size/weight. Either way, an increase in calories can only help with performance.

I'm 5'8" and about 172. I struggle with my image and the scale which I know I shouldn't but it's how it is. Being a fat kid growing up plus my genetics it seems no matter what the extra calories turn right to fat in the midsection which for me mentally is just hard to get over.

Practicing the nutrient timing we talked about earlier can go a long way in helping you. From what I recall, you've been on very low calories for a long time. Most of us should be able to get by on 2300-2600 to maintain on training days depending on how hard and intense your workouts are. If you feel like you're going through the motions at the gym, you need to take your training a step up. If you're training super F-ing hard, your physique should display that and will need all those extra calories.

I think you have a couple options. Look at your training and improve it + nutrient timing(carbs only pre/intra/post workout, fats and protein for all other meals). Those things should be done regardless.
-Slowly bump up your calories and increase the intensity in your lifts as your strength increases.
-Or cut down until you hit the leanest you've ever been and build yourself back up. Insulin sensitivity will be very high and the calories you add back slowly will go towards lean body mass as long as you maintain training hard. It will be hard to gain fat unless you are eating a lot right away and have a crap diet, which I know you usually track or have somewhat of an idea of quality foods you should be eating.

Just my 2c


I was not comfortable when I bulked up last year but when cutting down, it seriously paid off. Sometimes you need to go through times of feeling uncomfortable with the end goal in mind. But a difference between uncomfortable and sloppy is very important. I didn't get sloppy, I got big and watery. I didn't have loads of fat to get rid of.

I know those feelz man. I was actually a fat kid growing up too, and that's a big reason why I got into weight training. Over the years I've managed to change my body composition quite a bit, but I've also realized I actually had decent genetics from the start, so I had that working in my favor. I've always loved food though, and fatty/carby foods in particular. It took me a long time to find a comfortable balance between training and nutrition. But when I started focusing on getting stronger vs looking good, everything kind of changed for me. Now I can eat really comfortably and walk around at 12-14% body fat and still feel fine with taking my shirt off at the beach because, well, I'm big and strong and not just fat lmao I remember 5-7 years ago I trained like crazy, ate very few carbs, was single digit body fat for the first and only time in my life. I looked amazing, but I just didn't find it sustainable. I felt guilty every time I had a few beers or ate out. That's not fun. Gotta strike a balance.

All great posts... has me wondering (as I was before I read this) if the 2100-2200 calories I'm taking in is simply too low. Is it possible that it's actually hindering my weight loss? I'm 6' and 235lbs and the calories feel low... but if I go much higher the scale seems to go up as well.

[Farley1324]

All great posts... has me wondering (as I was before I read this) if the 2100-2200 calories I'm taking in is simply too low. Is it possible that it's actually hindering my weight loss? I'm 6' and 235lbs and the calories feel low... but if I go much higher the scale seems to go up as well.

I'm 6' and when I ate 2,100 calories a day for my last real cut a year ago, in the 210-220 range I lost 1.5-2 lbs of bodyweight per week

[Misctake7]

Great advice and I am a believer these days in nutrient timing as well. Misctake posts actually played a big part in me rethinking it.

I hope it's been working out in your favor! I know it has played a huge role in me changing my body for the better and training as well.

Thanks for the input. I know it's mostly mental and I will be just fine. Last year I started slow and eventually took off. Slowly increased calories and for the most part was at 2700 all year. I only lift 3 days a week for an hour or so but pretty heavy and intense. Mostly the big lifts with a few accessories.



Yeah I'll be fine just got to get the groove back and not worry about the slow start to the year.

Only lifting for 3 hours a day I think it going to be your biggest drawback no matter what you do. Because then 4 days a week, you need to be strict to protein/fat meals and lowering calories on those days. Even on the training days you cannot go very high because you're only lifting for an hour. I know when I'm training with all out intensity and the goal of progression, I maybe have 2-3 exercises done in that time. Maybe just 2 since you're taking into account stretching and warming up.

All great posts... has me wondering (as I was before I read this) if the 2100-2200 calories I'm taking in is simply too low. Is it possible that it's actually hindering my weight loss? I'm 6' and 235lbs and the calories feel low... but if I go much higher the scale seems to go up as well.

Training intensity and volume will play a huge role in it. If you're doing cardio and how active you are during the day also plays a role. It's winter and I have a desk job, so I'm not moving as much as I want at work and cannot really go on walks with how cold it is outside. So cardio to make up steps after my training, at least a mile or 20mins a day regardless.

But some of us require very low calories to cut on. No matter what, when I want a full set of abs with veins showing around the abs and everywhere, I need to get down to around 2k or less calories by the end. Likely closer to 1800 with high volume. My cuts are different every year. Sometimes I gotta go super low, sometimes calories need to stay higher.

If you're dropping 1lb a week at your current food intake, I wouldn't change it. While the scale doesn't mean much to me, it's at least a good indication you're going in the right direction. One day you'll be able to use the mirror as a better gauge of progress.

[mccyjcb]

Man, with all this training and nutrition part, I'll vent what has been going on with me and I guess "realizations" I made. I last competed in USAPL comp in December, and have training somewhat differently. I was doing Layne Norton PH3 up to the comp, then switched to a Upper/Lower split with a dedicated arm day on Saturdays. Still going heavy on deadlift and bench, but adding it more higher rep/lower weight on accessory lifts, and not doing squats as of right now (been doing leg press instead). I have a nagging something going on in my left hamstring, and squats flare it up. I've kept calories at 2600. I've noticed losses in leg size, which I attribute to the decrease in volume and intensity the PH3 program has you doing. I tried to match volume in that program, but clearly I did it wrong in my programming. I set a new years goal to just bulk throughout the whole year, with a goal weight of 190lb. Current weight is ~173lb, so roughly 1.5lb to 2lb per month. It's so hard to tell if 2600 calories is enough, just because of fluctuations in weight everyday. I want to continue my Upper/Lower split, but it definitely needs improvement from what I've realized.

[gbullock32]

I'm 5'8" and about 172. I struggle with my image and the scale which I know I shouldn't but it's how it is. Being a fat kid growing up plus my genetics it seems no matter what the extra calories turn right to fat in the midsection which for me mentally is just hard to get over.

Had the same problem mentally for a long time, obese as a teen then lost the weight and had a hard time convincing myself to gain. Saw the best progress ever over the last year and a half or so just eating more (enough to keep progressing on lifts) and training more consistently.

[holl0309]

So I had the Peanut Butter and Double Chocolate Quest cookies.

Pretty good, the peanut butter had more of a peanut taste rather than peanut butter if anything (odd to describe) and had a baked taste to it, almost a little burnt tasting.

The double chocolate was very chocalatey and had a strong cocoa taste to it, it was soft and chewy but at the same time quite dry really, needed some milk on the side.

So far I did enjoy both of them but think that I would say the equivalent flavors of L&L have an advantage in being more moist and having a slightly better flavor overall. Tried half as is and then microwaved the other half; microwaving was an improvement, made them softer and warm.




Having the Oatmeal Raisin and Chocolate Chip tonight.

I need to find the PB and Oatmeal Raisin. I had the CC and the CCC, I thought they were ok but nothing great. I got a box of the CC over a year ago when they were available through quest labs and didn't think much of them. I was thinking since they were released this much later they would have improved, but they tasted about the same to me. I did eat have my CC after having it in the freezer and I enjoyed it better that way, will grab another one and try in the microwave.

[Misctake7]

Man, with all this training and nutrition part, I'll vent what has been going on with me and I guess "realizations" I made. I last competed in USAPL comp in December, and have training somewhat differently. I was doing Layne Norton PH3 up to the comp, then switched to a Upper/Lower split with a dedicated arm day on Saturdays. Still going heavy on deadlift and bench, but adding it more higher rep/lower weight on accessory lifts, and not doing squats as of right now (been doing leg press instead). I have a nagging something going on in my left hamstring, and squats flare it up. I've kept calories at 2600. I've noticed losses in leg size, which I attribute to the decrease in volume and intensity the PH3 program has you doing. I tried to match volume in that program, but clearly I did it wrong in my programming. I set a new years goal to just bulk throughout the whole year, with a goal weight of 190lb. Current weight is ~173lb, so roughly 1.5lb to 2lb per month. It's so hard to tell if 2600 calories is enough, just because of fluctuations in weight everyday. I want to continue my Upper/Lower split, but it definitely needs improvement from what I've realized.

What does your week look like? Example: upper, lower, rest, upper, lower, arms, rest?
Depending on frequency, that lower volume might be important depending on how many rest days you take. My legs absolutely exploded in strength when I did an upper/lower split, however programming needs to be flawless so you recover before your next day. I was usually doing the method of upper, lower, upper, rest, lower, upper, lower, rest. Not squatting is not a big deal. Try it every couple week at low weight to see when you can incorporate it again. I feel a lot of my leg mass came from leg press and using a wide stance 1 session, close stance the next session, and keep switching. Heavy, and then pyramid down and finish with a all out burnout or dropset. Absolutely killer but legs WILL GROW.

Calorie wise, hard to say man. Even though you're at maintenance or bulking, your weight shouldn't be jumping like crazy if you have a consistent macro split and consistent food sources you're using. Weigh yourself once a week, right away in the morning after using the bathroom. Try and make sure you cut off eating roughly the same time as the previous week.....I usually make sure I get at least 7-9 hours sleep without any food or water before weighing myself. Should be more consistent weight then. 2600 does sound lower BUT like I mentioned above in my previous posts, training intensity and volume means a lot in how much you can eat.

Out of curiosity, what division do you compete in? Bodybuilding, physique, classic physique?

[crpav]

I hope it's been working out in your favor! I know it has played a huge role in me changing my body for the better and training as well.


Only lifting for 3 hours a day I think it going to be your biggest drawback no matter what you do. Because then 4 days a week, you need to be strict to protein/fat meals and lowering calories on those days. Even on the training days you cannot go very high because you're only lifting for an hour. I know when I'm training with all out intensity and the goal of progression, I maybe have 2-3 exercises done in that time. Maybe just 2 since you're taking into account stretching and warming up.


Training intensity and volume will play a huge role in it. If you're doing cardio and how active you are during the day also plays a role. It's winter and I have a desk job, so I'm not moving as much as I want at work and cannot really go on walks with how cold it is outside. So cardio to make up steps after my training, at least a mile or 20mins a day regardless.

But some of us require very low calories to cut on. No matter what, when I want a full set of abs with veins showing around the abs and everywhere, I need to get down to around 2k or less calories by the end. Likely closer to 1800 with high volume. My cuts are different every year. Sometimes I gotta go super low, sometimes calories need to stay higher.

If you're dropping 1lb a week at your current food intake, I wouldn't change it. While the scale doesn't mean much to me, it's at least a good indication you're going in the right direction. One day you'll be able to use the mirror as a better gauge of progress.

Had the same problem mentally for a long time, obese as a teen then lost the weight and had a hard time convincing myself to gain. Saw the best progress ever over the last year and a half or so just eating more (enough to keep progressing on lifts) and training more consistently.

I think it's also the ups and downs anyone goes through. Take last year. I finally got over the fear of upping calories and finally got up to the 2700 range. Same training as I always have done and still do which is heavy 3 days a week. I stayed at about 172 all year and looked and felt great. Strength went up quite a bit and through summer and softball all was good. End of summer came and knee surgery then winter comes and then the holidays and that was when the same diet seemed to not work as well. Thus the decrease in calories which I will slowly start increasing and be at above the 2700 soon enough and probably be fine. I really should add another day at the gym though.

[Misctake7]

Had the same problem mentally for a long time, obese as a teen then lost the weight and had a hard time convincing myself to gain. Saw the best progress ever over the last year and a half or so just eating more (enough to keep progressing on lifts) and training more consistently.

^Very important right there. No need to get sloppy!

[danielmoo]

^Very important right there. No need to get sloppy!

Truth. I think we've all made that mistake before

[Deadliftin]

I'm 6' and when I ate 2,100 calories a day for my last real cut a year ago, in the 210-220 range I lost 1.5-2 lbs of bodyweight per week

That’s helpful thanks man!

[mccyjcb]

What does your week look like? Example: upper, lower, rest, upper, lower, arms, rest?
Depending on frequency, that lower volume might be important depending on how many rest days you take. My legs absolutely exploded in strength when I did an upper/lower split, however programming needs to be flawless so you recover before your next day. I was usually doing the method of upper, lower, upper, rest, lower, upper, lower, rest. Not squatting is not a big deal. Try it every couple week at low weight to see when you can incorporate it again. I feel a lot of my leg mass came from leg press and using a wide stance 1 session, close stance the next session, and keep switching. Heavy, and then pyramid down and finish with a all out burnout or dropset. Absolutely killer but legs WILL GROW.

Calorie wise, hard to say man. Even though you're at maintenance or bulking, your weight shouldn't be jumping like crazy if you have a consistent macro split and consistent food sources you're using. Weigh yourself once a week, right away in the morning after using the bathroom. Try and make sure you cut off eating roughly the same time as the previous week.....I usually make sure I get at least 7-9 hours sleep without any food or water before weighing myself. Should be more consistent weight then. 2600 does sound lower BUT like I mentioned above in my previous posts, training intensity and volume means a lot in how much you can eat.

Out of curiosity, what division do you compete in? Bodybuilding, physique, classic physique?

Yep, you nailed it on the layout: upper, lower, rest, upper, lower, arms, rest. For upper, as my main lift, I do DUP for bench (3x9 one day, then 4x7, then 5x5, reset and add weight), and same goes for deadlift and barbell rows on back. I track all my lifts using Jefit, so I'm always sure to use the same weight on accessory lifts, and if not getting the top of rep range, then stick with that weight and try to get more reps than last workout. I like to think I know how to progress, but perhaps I don't. I typically track weight a few times per week and take a moving average.

I compete in powerlifting, so none of those LOL. I can tell from my body and how my muscles take form that I would have somewhat of an unbalance physique, so I don't even try for that.

[Misctake7]

Yep, you nailed it on the layout: upper, lower, rest, upper, lower, arms, rest. For upper, as my main lift, I do DUP for bench (3x9 one day, then 4x7, then 5x5, reset and add weight), and same goes for deadlift and barbell rows on back. I track all my lifts using Jefit, so I'm always sure to use the same weight on accessory lifts, and if not getting the top of rep range, then stick with that weight and try to get more reps than last workout. I like to think I know how to progress, but perhaps I don't. I typically track weight a few times per week and take a moving average.

I compete in powerlifting, so none of those LOL. I can tell from my body and how my muscles take form that I would have somewhat of an unbalance physique, so I don't even try for that.

Your avi made it look like you did contest shows and I was thinking physique or classic physique. I bet powerlifting is funner. I have to step back on recommendation on this one then. Becki, Farley and Ben are the regulars with the power lifting backgrounds. I lift heavy but bodybuilding progression is what I'm much better at.

Best of luck man!

[DASBUNKER]

Heavy (for me) one arm DB rows might be my new fave back exercise, always did something else since didn't "feel" much from DB rows, but tried them out again and lats popped out more, great for grip too and indirect bis work.

https://www.t-nation.com/training/kroc-rows-101

I don't go as high reps as kroc rows but the intent is there hhnnggggg

[mccyjcb]

Your avi made it look like you did contest shows and I was thinking physique or classic physique. I bet powerlifting is funner. I have to step back on recommendation on this one then. Becki, Farley and Ben are the regulars with the power lifting backgrounds. I lift heavy but bodybuilding progression is what I'm much better at.

Best of luck man!

Ah that makes sense..I can never seem to get too many pics at my comps. I'll take that as a complement thanks for the info nonetheless!

[BenBlue]

Heavy (for me) one arm DB rows might be my new fave back exercise, always did something else since didn't "feel" much from DB rows, but tried them out again and lats popped out more, great for grip too and indirect bis work.

https://www.t-nation.com/training/kroc-rows-101

I don't go as high reps as kroc rows but the intent is there hhnnggggg

Love heavy DB rows/Kroc rows. I used to be the same and never really felt them in the back until recently. Pendlay rows and heavy deadlift grip bent over rows are two newer staples in my regime too.

[YouMadOrMirin]

Buff Bake Cookie < L&L Cookie

But their new sandwich cookies are the bees knees.

[DASBUNKER]

Love heavy DB rows/Kroc rows. I used to be the same and never really felt them in the back until recently. Pendlay rows and heavy deadlift grip bent over rows are two newer staples in my regime too.

Pendlay was my go to but can't finish all my sets with 135lbs+ yet lol so eliminating lower back stabilizers with DB rows on a bench was nice.