Cost No Object: Machines and Free Weights, the Best of the Best. PART 2

[atlas2199]

I have seen this machine a few times. It appears to be some form of pendulum squat/swing squat/plyo squat machine. It is found at LVAC in las vegas. The actual "carriage" of the machine says "COMPETITION". The font looks similar to that of the HQ LINE machines. If anyone could figure out what this machine is and let me know that would be great. I have found no information aside from images about this machine so this is truly a job for the Grand Master Historians of Gym Equipment. I do not need to know if it is for sale anywhere. Just what company and line of equipment it is from as well as the general time frame from when it was in production or from when that company was active.

It is present in this video (sorry cannot post links or images yet):
Youtube
Channel: Mountain Dog (John Meadows)
Video Title: "Brutal Quad & Calf Workout For Some Crazy "Mass""
It is the squat machine that they use from 15:00 - 18:00

[EricAtl]

I have seen this machine a few times. It appears to be some form of pendulum squat/swing squat/plyo squat machine. It is found at LVAC in las vegas. The actual "carriage" of the machine says "COMPETITION". The font looks similar to that of the HQ LINE machines. If anyone could figure out what this machine is and let me know that would be great. I have found no information aside from images about this machine so this is truly a job for the Grand Master Historians of Gym Equipment. I do not need to know if it is for sale anywhere. Just what company and line of equipment it is from as well as the general time frame from when it was in production or from when that company was active.

It is present in this video (sorry cannot post links or images yet):
Youtube
Channel: Mountain Dog (John Meadows)
Video Title: "Brutal Quad & Calf Workout For Some Crazy "Mass""
It is the squat machine that they use from 15:00 - 18:00

That is some version of a swing squat. I see the name Randy Coyle when I search. Some discussion here.
https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...62753&page=107
See post 3198.

[ArnoldHAMnEGGer]

For anyone wondering, the Randy Coyle Swing Squat is still being made. Here's a link https://swingsquat.com . I don't know if there's one still there but Strong & Shapely Gym in East Rutherford, NJ has or used to have one. I used it back in the day and it's a wonderful piece. Rumor is that their Swing Squat was one of the first ever produced.

BTW, that's not a Coyle Swing Squat in the John Meadows video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0L3Z9insW4) as far as I know. Definitely a Swing Squat but not a Coyle. Looks great though. I'm also curious who made it, as I've only seen Coyle's and then a bunch of Pendulums.

[nnclark11]

I have seen this machine a few times. It appears to be some form of pendulum squat/swing squat/plyo squat machine. It is found at LVAC in las vegas. The actual "carriage" of the machine says "COMPETITION". The font looks similar to that of the HQ LINE machines. If anyone could figure out what this machine is and let me know that would be great. I have found no information aside from images about this machine so this is truly a job for the Grand Master Historians of Gym Equipment. I do not need to know if it is for sale anywhere. Just what company and line of equipment it is from as well as the general time frame from when it was in production or from when that company was active.

It is present in this video (sorry cannot post links or images yet):
Youtube
Channel: Mountain Dog (John Meadows)
Video Title: "Brutal Quad & Calf Workout For Some Crazy "Mass""
It is the squat machine that they use from 15:00 - 18:00

That is a rare one! Nick in Miami is the only one I know personally that has this version of swing squat. Apparently it was made locally in NV area and only for a short time. Name of company was "Competition." Would love someone to remake this. I like the design more than Randy's.

[FitNick]

That is a rare one! Nick in Miami is the only one I know personally that has this version of swing squat. Apparently it was made locally in NV area and only for a short time. Name of company was "Competition." Would love someone to remake this. I like the design more than Randy's.

Best leg piece in my gym. Used it at LVAC and got lucky to get one. The company was out of LV and I think went out of business in the late 90s/early 2000s. They made some other pieces, one was a massive standing calf that I saw at Strong and Shapely gym.

[ArnoldHAMnEGGer]

Best leg piece in my gym. Used it at LVAC and got lucky to get one. The company was out of LV and I think went out of business in the late 90s/early 2000s. They made some other pieces, one was a massive standing calf that I saw at Strong and Shapely gym.

Nick, do you mind sharing the name of your gym? I ask not only out of curiosity but because I'd love to try the piece we're discussing and if I'm ever in Miami I'd hit up that gym just try the piece out.

About Strong & Shapely...it was one of, if not the best gym I've ever been to in terms of the equipment selection. When I was there Bob Bonham was the owner. Sadly, he's passed. I believe the gym has had two different owners since. I'm sure it's still great but I haven't been in years.

[HenryMaag]

Observe at time slot 4:42 thru 6:07 of the video below, how Jay Cutler’s and Mike Farnsworth’s deltoids “mound up” when contracting through the plane through their origin and insertion through a circular load path through the shoulder joints.

Just as Chrysler’s hemispherical combustion chambers were inherently more efficient than their competitors ‘wedge’ shaped combustion chambers, so to the circular load paths introduced to the industry by Cross Axes Tech are inherently more efficient at loading the upper body pressing and pulling movements. It might be added that they also yield a greater total range of motion too.

While many manufacturers are now introducing this technology on their new machines (just as other car manufacturers started building ‘hemi’ engines once Chrysler’s patents had expired), Cross Axes Tech still remains, not only the original, but far and away, the heaviest in construction.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KsyCpOiufY&t=359s

[cstung]

hey HealthNutMD
I'm wondering what you think about the Panatta's plate-loaded leg compound machines if you had to choose one to supplement leg curl and leg extension? I'm trying to decide between the Panatta's Super Pendulum squat, Power Squat, Hack and Leg Press Bridge. Not sure if you had a chance to try the Pendulum yet? The linkage system seems very promising

[HenryMaag]

Don't be deceived by the "CROSS AXES TECH" label on this seated leg press, the machine is actually a "LAMB Bodybuilding Machines L-4000RB" seated leg press machine. You can tell be the heavy walled tubular moving parts. All of the old Lamb machines used 2.5" diameter pipe for their effort arms. Back in about the year 2000 I broke my 2.5" pipe bending machine, since that time I redesigned the moving parts on the machines which I moved from the old LAMB line to the CROSS AXES TECH line.

This machine was the last configuration of the LAMB L-4000RB seated leg press (there were four different configurations over its 15 year history). This machine was built for personal use, and has been in my basement since it was built back then. Just last year I built a number of smaller lighter machines for use in our basement gym (one of which was a seated leg press). I just sold this machine to a collector named Arthur Barrios.

At his request it was finished in red upholstery on a chrome bronze frame.

I appologize for the upside down pictures, I have tried 10 times to correct it, but the software will not let me. Perhaps they can be ‘downloaded’ and rotated.

[HenryMaag]

Don't be deceived by the CROSS AXES TECH label on this B-5000 Pullunder machine, this is an original LAMB Bodybuilding Machines B-5000 Pullunder. Recently sold to Arthur Barrios (a collector in California).

Once again, I apologize in advance for the random orientations of the pictures placed through the "Postimages" hosting services. Perhaps the images can be "downloaded and rotated".

[gym62richard]

Bump.

This thread is such a valuable resource, please Mods make it a sticky.

[blakeswan]

Can anyone compare/contrast the Panatta Super Incline Bench Press 1HP533 with the Prime PL Incline Chest press? I have an opportunity to get a used Panatta for the same price as a new Prime. Havent had a chance to try the Prime machine but had favorable memories of the Panatta when I got to use it overseas a year ago. Trying to decide between the two

[Camarija]

Can anyone compare/contrast the Panatta Super Incline Bench Press 1HP533 with the Prime PL Incline Chest press? I have an opportunity to get a used Panatta for the same price as a new Prime. Havent had a chance to try the Prime machine but had favorable memories of the Panatta when I got to use it overseas a year ago. Trying to decide between the two

You really need to try it out yourself and make adjustments to see if you like it or not.

I know some people love both of those machines.

I personally prefer much more convergence, or at least the ability to finish with my hands closer to the mid line of my body, pushing with elbows fully tucked. For example the classic Hammer Strength Plate Loaded Iso-Lateral Incline Press, or the Gymleco Incline Press.

If you're tall enough, the neutral grip on the panatta has the type of convergence I like, but you won't get that level of convergence with the Prime. For this reason I'm not a fan of the Prime. Having said that, because there isn't as much convergence on the prime, it's more of a straight forward pushing motion, easier on the wrists and you can load it up heavy. Definitely feel it on the upper chest easily.

It's just personal preference, and I prefer the Hammer Strength or Gymleco incline over Panatta / Prime / Atlantis / Nautilus versions

[blakeswan]

You really need to try it out yourself and make adjustments to see if you like it or not.

I know some people love both of those machines.

I personally prefer much more convergence, or at least the ability to finish with my hands closer to the mid line of my body, pushing with elbows fully tucked. For example the classic Hammer Strength Plate Loaded Iso-Lateral Incline Press, or the Gymleco Incline Press.

If you're tall enough, the neutral grip on the panatta has the type of convergence I like, but you won't get that level of convergence with the Prime. For this reason I'm not a fan of the Prime. Having said that, because there isn't as much convergence on the prime, it's more of a straight forward pushing motion, easier on the wrists and you can load it up heavy. Definitely feel it on the upper chest easily.

It's just personal preference, and I prefer the Hammer Strength or Gymleco incline over Panatta / Prime / Atlantis / Nautilus versions

Appreciate the insight. I'm 6'2" so machines are sometimes really hit or miss with me. I went with the Panatta since I was able to demo it and remember liking it. Really what Im after is something similar to a dumbbell press. Strangely the Hammer Incline never worked well for me. Always hit my shoulders no matter the adjustments I did. I also just demoed the Atlantis Incline and that was not a good machine for me. I like having my hands on the upper grips and doing so my shoulders hit the saftey stops of the machine and was crazy uncomfortable. On my next trip I'll see if I can find a gym with some Prime equipment to demo as there is literally nothing in the upper Midwest for Prime.

[SMXTraining]

Please pardon me if my posting method is incorrect (I want to engage in this thread but only see a "reply" option)

I am about to replace some MedX equipment with some Panatta or Panatta "and" Atlantis pieces (I have some Pantta and Atlantis at my other studio).

Would love some input on these selections. Considerations that must be kept in mind
1) must function in a very "satisfying" manor
2) must have great "wow" factor for marketing purposes
3) must be able to maneuver through 41" door or be able to disassemble to do so
4) start weight and size must be able to easily accommodate smaller females without much lifting experience

Short list:
Panatta Circular Row to replace MedX Row
Pantta Super Middle or Upper Chest Flight replacing MedX Arm Cross (already sold)
Panatta Leg Extension Replacing MedX Leg Extension
Panatta Standing Leg Curl 1FE084 replacing Medx prone Leg Curl (Panatta St. leg curl looks super cool/instagram wow, but how does it feel?)
Pantta Triceps Machine 1FE053
Atlantis Biceps Curl B157 (I hear it is awesome and is a safe bet) or Pantta Ulitmate Arm Curl 45 1FE456 (visually more Wow factor but never heard from anyone how it feels)

May add a Pantta Super Power Row or Prime Row (10 month build time though) at other studio (no door size restriction)

Any input would be greatly appreciated!

I do have some questions regarding Paatta and Atlantis Abdominal machines but I'll save it or another post as to not dilute this one with too many different questions.

[Camarija]

Panatta Circular Row to replace MedX Row

MedX Row is superior due to the resistance curve, but do whatever you want.
Prime Plate Loaded Seated Row would be better.
If you want to keep everything selectorized, Prime Evolution Seated Row would be good as well.
The Panatta circular row isn't bad, in fact it's quite good, but the rows from Prime are better due to the resistance curve.

Pantta Super Middle or Upper Chest Flight replacing MedX Arm Cross (already sold)

Personally, the Arsenal Strength Reloaded Incline Fly is better than the options above.

Panatta Leg Extension Replacing MedX Leg Extension

It's a fine leg extension, but even with the heavy stack you can only reach 220 lbs. So it's fine as long as your clients are small or weak.
The Prime Fitness Hybrid Leg Extension is accommodating to more users with a weight stack of 265 lbs, but what I really like about is the central adjustable shin cushion. The reason this is important is because in many leg extension designs, you may find that over time the shin cushion will tilt due to the design fixing the shin cushion from the side rather than from the center.

Panatta Standing Leg Curl 1FE084 replacing Medx prone Leg Curl (Panatta St. leg curl looks super cool/instagram wow, but how does it feel?)

The new study on leg curls is a hot topic right now. Basically seated leg curls are the best type of leg curl. The panatta seated leg curl is very comfortable and probably has enough weight even for your stronger gym members.
*EDIT* Ask for the version of the seated leg curl with the pad on top of the thighs, not the pad over your shin *EDIT*
Otherwise the Prime Hybrid seated leg curl is a good option.

Pantta Triceps Machine 1FE053

If you're only going to have one Tricep machine, I would choose either the Atlantis T162 Overhead Triceps, or the classic Hammer Strength MTS Iso-Lateral Triceps Extension

Atlantis Biceps Curl B157 (I hear it is awesome and is a safe bet) or Pantta Ulitmate Arm Curl 45 1FE456 (visually more Wow factor but never heard from anyone how it feels)

They work different parts of the bicep. The first is a classic preacher curl machine. I prefer the Panatta Monolith Preacher Curl machine 1MTH051, or the Gymleco 350.
The second machine you selected is an incline curl, it's not a bread and butter bicep movement. If you wanted an accessory bicep movement, I'd recommend a movement where you place your arm higher up, like in the Hammer Strength MTS Iso-Lateral Biceps Curl.

May add a Pantta Super Power Row or Prime Row (10 month build time though) at other studio (no door size restriction)

Both great rows, but I much prefer the Prime Seated Row. If you're talking about the Prime Extreme Row, it's not a very good machine. There needs to be more pre-stretch, and the ability to change both the height of the chest pad and the angle of chest pad separately.

I do have some questions regarding Paatta and Atlantis Abdominal machines but I'll save it or another post as to not dilute this one with too many different questions.

The Panatta free weight abdominal crunch is better than the selectorized versions because oddly they're different builds. The free weight version places the upper backpad roller further back, allowing for abdominal stretch. The selectorized version places the backpad roller further forwards, not allowing abdominal stretch. It's baffling that they build the selectorized versions this way. It makes no sense.

Cheers.

[SMXTraining]

Thank you for your insight!

Rowing: I will likely purchase a Prime plate loaded row or a Pantta Super Power Row for my other studio. I have no experience with the circular line of Panatta, and was worried that the circular path was not a natural or desirable path so I am glad you included the statement "in fact it is quite good", although it is clearly not at the top of your list. Any comments on the circular line in general?

Chest Fly: I have been having my eye on the Arsenal Strength Fly for quite some time. When I saw videos of the Panatta Super Flight machines I was wowed by the fit and finish, cool factor, and the engagement pedal (particulary for some of my older clients). I don't know anyone who has used one though. If the feel sucks, than to me it is not worth the extra money and space it takes up. But if the movement is really good, I could potentially justify over the less expensive and smaller Arsenal Strength fly.

Leg Curl: I am well versed in the research comparing seated vs. prone leg curl, however for multiple reasons the seated leg curl is not on the table for this purchase. My studios are small boutique studios. I can't go "head to head" with the big gyms. Therefore part of my studio's draw is the unique equipment that I offer. So for this leg curl I was hoping for something with some visual appeal for marketing etc (Panatta Standing Leg Curl 1FE084) Of course if it looks cool but sucks, I need to keep looking. Research findings aside......is this a well liked piece?

Biceps: Actually the Panatta 45 Alternate Arm culr 1FE454 is not the type of incline bicep curl where your shoulders are flexed (shoulders raised with elbows forward of torso). This unit actually has your shoulders extended (elbows behind torso) in an attempt to theoretically bias the Long head of the bicep. You are still correct though, not your bread and butter bicep station, but like mentioned earlier, I need unique pieces. I can't even find a decent video on this one though. Any expericene???

AB Machines: I almost purchased a used Pannatta plate loaded crunch. Then I saw a video of a guy using one, loving it, but also struggling with piddly weight. When I asked the seller about the start weight, she was very upfront and told me that they sometimes remove the weight horn (which weighs 8lbs) to make it more doable for some. Now granted her clientele are not big lifters, but I serve a wide range of demographics myself. I am always careful with my purchases as I have an Atlantis Pivot Press and an Arsenal Strength Power Squat, both of which has start weights that can be problematic for a percentage of our clients. Also, when I try similar "style" abdominal machines in other gyms, I feel like I am pulling with my arms as much as I am through my adominals. This added to my reluctance to puchase. However, so many people on this forum swear it is the best around. Are my doubts unfounded?

thanks so much, I really want to learn all I can and not have buyers remorse
FYI I am almost finished building a counter balance retrofit for the power squat. If it turns out to be worth sharing with the group I will do so.

[Afo3]

I just got back from visiting Panatta in Apiro for a day and own a bunch of Prime and was at the showroom again in Jan so I think I'm in a good position to give some pretty direct feedback.

I would agree with others that the Panatta circular row isn't a good 1:1 replacement for the Medx. To me I'd go with the Prime Hybrid Row if I had to pick but there's not a great 1:1 replacement for that Medx row in Prime, Panatta or Atlantis lines. That's one reason you'll find gyms like DMV Iron Gym that have plenty of Panatta and Atlantis still have a Medx row but I get the space and image issues. The Panatta Super Power Row (1FW102) is a bit similar in feeling but its big and plate loaded.

I used and liked the Panatta lying, middle and upper chest pieces and plan to order at least two out of three. That said, I'm not sure I'd be quick to give up the floor space for them and they are also pretty heavy in the bottom position even with minimal weight if you have older clients.

On the leg extension, there is no way I'd pick Panatta over Prime for that unless you specifically want the unilateral capability of the Panatta Alternate Leg Extension. For bilateral leg extension, Prime is king. I am buying the Prime Plate Loaded Leg Extension, which I find feels the best but in a training environment the Hybrid (selectorized) one is understandable. The point made before about the adjustable shin pad is spot on.

Leg curl - I don't know why you'd go with a standing leg curl over seated or lying. If I could only have one, I'd get the Prime Hybrid Seated Leg Curl. Has the cool factor of the smartcam and feels great. That Panatta standing leg curl is great, however.

Arm curl - that Panatta alternate arm curl is awesome, get it. The monolith version is even cooler looking and dependign what else you buy from Panatta and your facility lay-out, you might be able to have a cool, connected monolith setup with the 4 station in 1 square meter approach they have. I'm personally not a fan of that Atlantis B157 piece but I'm obviously weird as everyone else loves it. I think the Prime Hybrid Curl is better.

Triceps - I can't seem to do behind the head tricep stuff without elbow flare ups so I can't give you good feedback on the piece you asked about. That said, the Panatta Monolith Alternate Arm Extension (1MTH057) was awesome. A bit tough to really load up but for gen pop training I think you'd like it.

Abs - the Freeweight Abdominal Crunch (1HP565) was every bit as good as HealthNut said it was. I've used the FitEvo selectorized version and don't recall being that impressed but the plate loaded one was amazing. Don't recall trying the Atlantis one when I was in their gym in Laval and don't think I've seen any in US gyms so I'm guessing its not special enough to be worth importing.

If you are ordering from Panatta, you are missing some really good pieces - the Super High Row is amazing, and the Prime 2.0 Kas Pulldown is the Prime version of it. The Freeweight Vertical Chest or Decline Chest are both great (I'm partial to the Vertical). The Incline Bench is also very good. Also the Freeweight Leg Press Bridge and Dual Leg Press are both amazing leg pieces.

Please pardon me if my posting method is incorrect (I want to engage in this thread but only see a "reply" option)

I am about to replace some MedX equipment with some Panatta or Panatta "and" Atlantis pieces (I have some Pantta and Atlantis at my other studio).

Would love some input on these selections. Considerations that must be kept in mind
1) must function in a very "satisfying" manor
2) must have great "wow" factor for marketing purposes
3) must be able to maneuver through 41" door or be able to disassemble to do so
4) start weight and size must be able to easily accommodate smaller females without much lifting experience

Short list:
Panatta Circular Row to replace MedX Row
Pantta Super Middle or Upper Chest Flight replacing MedX Arm Cross (already sold)
Panatta Leg Extension Replacing MedX Leg Extension
Panatta Standing Leg Curl 1FE084 replacing Medx prone Leg Curl (Panatta St. leg curl looks super cool/instagram wow, but how does it feel?)
Pantta Triceps Machine 1FE053
Atlantis Biceps Curl B157 (I hear it is awesome and is a safe bet) or Pantta Ulitmate Arm Curl 45 1FE456 (visually more Wow factor but never heard from anyone how it feels)

May add a Pantta Super Power Row or Prime Row (10 month build time though) at other studio (no door size restriction)

Any input would be greatly appreciated!

I do have some questions regarding Paatta and Atlantis Abdominal machines but I'll save it or another post as to not dilute this one with too many different questions.

[SMXTraining]

Thank you!

Let me approach this a different way, as I see that there is much I do not know due to my lack of hands on experience with these pieces that have my attention.
I don't want to simply sell a "Better Piece" to get a "Worse Piece."
Here is my situation....I have been operating one of my fitness studios since 1996. It has always featured MEDX and Nautilus equipment. My newer studio features Panatta, Arsenal Strength, Booty Builders, Glueator, Atlantis, Gym 80, etc. I am actually bored to death training on the same basic pieces that I have used for so many years at the older studio. I plan to Rebrand the older studio into a division (Private Training Division) of the newer studio. I would like to re-ignite the studio with some fresh equipment. I would like to sell about 5 or 6 pieces and purchase about 6 or so pieces for the older studio (and maybe purchase 1 more for the newer studio-probably a plate loaded row).

These are the MEDX pieces that I would consider selling:

Prone Leg Curl-Definitely want to replace
Leg Extension
Compound Row
Torso Arm (pulldown with rotating handles)
OverHead Press
Bicep Curl-Definitely want to replace
Chest Press (can't seem to find one that offers as much convergence as I like or the natural stroke. I did modify mine to provide a few more inches of convergence and also sometimes use a removable back pad to close the gap. Would a removable back pad interfere with any of the selectorized Panatta presses or incline presses? )
Possibly Abdominal
Seated Dip

Sold Arm Cross (chest fly)-looking at Arsenal Strength incline fly, Gymleco fly, Panatta super flight line. I'd like something different than the standard Pec dec/rear delt machine. These all just happen to be plated loaded, but need mostly selectorized for this studio. Not looking to sell Medx Leg Press, Lateral Raise, or Low back unless there is some stunning replacement.

So given the pieces that I am willing to ditch, I would love to hear input on which ones to sell and replace with what.

FYI from last post....It is not the Panatta Alternate Arm Curl that has my interest. It is the Alternate arm curl 45 (1FE456), this one is new and puts your shoulders into extension (elbows behind torso). Any experience?
The Panatta Plate Loaded Abdominal....so you don't think the start weight is too heavy for smaller weaker users? (think skinny college girl who has formerly only done pilates and is new to weight training).

I look forward to hearing some suggestions! I don't want buyer's remorse!
thank you.

[HenryMaag]

Thank you!

Let me approach this a different way, as I see that there is much I do not know due to my lack of hands on experience with these pieces that have my attention.
I don't want to simply sell a "Better Piece" to get a "Worse Piece."
Here is my situation....I have been operating one of my fitness studios since 1996. It has always featured MEDX and Nautilus equipment. My newer studio features Panatta, Arsenal Strength, Booty Builders, Glueator, Atlantis, Gym 80, etc. I am actually bored to death training on the same basic pieces that I have used for so many years at the older studio. I plan to Rebrand the older studio into a division (Private Training Division) of the newer studio. I would like to re-ignite the studio with some fresh equipment. I would like to sell about 5 or 6 pieces and purchase about 6 or so pieces for the older studio (and maybe purchase 1 more for the newer studio-probably a plate loaded row).

These are the MEDX pieces that I would consider selling:

Prone Leg Curl-Definitely want to replace
Leg Extension
Compound Row
Torso Arm (pulldown with rotating handles)
OverHead Press
Bicep Curl-Definitely want to replace
Chest Press (can't seem to find one that offers as much convergence as I like or the natural stroke. I did modify mine to provide a few more inches of convergence and also sometimes use a removable back pad to close the gap. Would a removable back pad interfere with any of the selectorized Panatta presses or incline presses? )
Possibly Abdominal
Seated Dip

Sold Arm Cross (chest fly)-looking at Arsenal Strength incline fly, Gymleco fly, Panatta super flight line. I'd like something different than the standard Pec dec/rear delt machine. These all just happen to be plated loaded, but need mostly selectorized for this studio. Not looking to sell Medx Leg Press, Lateral Raise, or Low back unless there is some stunning replacement.

So given the pieces that I am willing to ditch, I would love to hear input on which ones to sell and replace with what.

FYI from last post....It is not the Panatta Alternate Arm Curl that has my interest. It is the Alternate arm curl 45 (1FE456), this one is new and puts your shoulders into extension (elbows behind torso). Any experience?
The Panatta Plate Loaded Abdominal....so you don't think the start weight is too heavy for smaller weaker users? (think skinny college girl who has formerly only done pilates and is new to weight training).

I look forward to hearing some suggestions! I don't want buyer's remorse!
thank you.

Because you are bored of the old technology and want to be educated as to what is out there in the muscle-building field, why don't you investigate "CROSS AXES TECH"?

Here is their website: http://www.crossaxestech.com/products.html

[EricAtl]

Thank you!

Let me approach this a different way, as I see that there is much I do not know due to my lack of hands on experience with these pieces that have my attention.
I don't want to simply sell a "Better Piece" to get a "Worse Piece."
Here is my situation....I have been operating one of my fitness studios since 1996. It has always featured MEDX and Nautilus equipment. My newer studio features Panatta, Arsenal Strength, Booty Builders, Glueator, Atlantis, Gym 80, etc. I am actually bored to death training on the same basic pieces that I have used for so many years at the older studio. I plan to Rebrand the older studio into a division (Private Training Division) of the newer studio. I would like to re-ignite the studio with some fresh equipment. I would like to sell about 5 or 6 pieces and purchase about 6 or so pieces for the older studio (and maybe purchase 1 more for the newer studio-probably a plate loaded row).

These are the MEDX pieces that I would consider selling:

Prone Leg Curl-Definitely want to replace
Leg Extension
Compound Row
Torso Arm (pulldown with rotating handles)
OverHead Press
Bicep Curl-Definitely want to replace
Chest Press (can't seem to find one that offers as much convergence as I like or the natural stroke. I did modify mine to provide a few more inches of convergence and also sometimes use a removable back pad to close the gap. Would a removable back pad interfere with any of the selectorized Panatta presses or incline presses? )
Possibly Abdominal
Seated Dip

Sold Arm Cross (chest fly)-looking at Arsenal Strength incline fly, Gymleco fly, Panatta super flight line. I'd like something different than the standard Pec dec/rear delt machine. These all just happen to be plated loaded, but need mostly selectorized for this studio. Not looking to sell Medx Leg Press, Lateral Raise, or Low back unless there is some stunning replacement.

So given the pieces that I am willing to ditch, I would love to hear input on which ones to sell and replace with what.

FYI from last post....It is not the Panatta Alternate Arm Curl that has my interest. It is the Alternate arm curl 45 (1FE456), this one is new and puts your shoulders into extension (elbows behind torso). Any experience?
The Panatta Plate Loaded Abdominal....so you don't think the start weight is too heavy for smaller weaker users? (think skinny college girl who has formerly only done pilates and is new to weight training).

I look forward to hearing some suggestions! I don't want buyer's remorse!
thank you.

Because you are bored of the old technology and want to be educated as to what is out there in the muscle-building field, why don't you investigate "CROSS AXES TECH"?

Here is their website: http://www.crossaxestech.com/products.html

When you write “here is their website” you should be clear that the equipment is your own. I’m not saying your equipment isn’t really good, but telling another member to check it out without letting them know it’s your equipment almost feels like spam. Maybe time to make your own thread and leave this thread for the OP..

[1651Naismith]

Maybe time to make your own thread and leave this thread for the OP..

I second this idea.

[Afo3]

I have trouble picturing the feel on that Panatta curl you posted. It seems like it wouldn't be that effective without something to rest the elbow against - is it really better than just using a dumbbell on a bench? I suppose it has the benefit of a cam though. But for me its Prime Selectorized for a typical curl and then Panatta Alternate and Alternate 120 for the others. Or maybe the Atlantis counterparts if you were ordering other stuff from them but I'd want to validate whether the ones at DMV Iron Gym are the standard model or if Leo moved the pads a few inches for more pre-stretch.

Leg curl - I have a Bodymasters CX and love it as it has a fairly 'shallow' V angle for how you lie on it. The Prime pieces have a steeper angle that some folks like but doesn't feel good to me with sciatica. You could also consider the Prime Leg Curl/ Leg Extension combo piece.

Leg Extension - Easy. Prime.

Overhead Press - Panatta Free Weight Shoulder or Prime Hybrid Shoulder Press are both great.

Panatta ab machine - I have a very weak core and didn't a problem with starting weight. But I also didn't try to go into full spinal flexion because sciatica. I suspect a weaker person can still get the top of the movement and just not go as deep in the ROM, which is probably ok.

Seated dip - the Panatta plate loaded one unfortunately has too much inertia build up being just a long lever. Maybe if you added chains or something but the Prime Hybrid Dip is pretty good or go nuts and get a TKstar flying dip, its amazing.

Chest - the Panatta decline chest is very convergent and the vertical is fairly convergent as well. Agree with the other poster Prime is a bit less convergent. Lots of people like the Atlantis P443 but its more of an incline bench press than a chest press. I'm not aware of a super convergent chest press other than Panatta really. The Panatta Monolith Circular Chest Press was also pretty good and a converging circle. It would be even better if you could slide the seat forward or back to control where in the convergence path you start and end. I.e. like you can on the MedX Avenger Converging Chest press. That would of course be other obvious piece that fits the bill for lots of convergence but I'm not sure if MedX can even still make them and it isn't a winner in the looks department.

Thank you!

These are the MEDX pieces that I would consider selling:

Prone Leg Curl-Definitely want to replace
Leg Extension
Compound Row
Torso Arm (pulldown with rotating handles)
OverHead Press
Bicep Curl-Definitely want to replace
Chest Press (can't seem to find one that offers as much convergence as I like or the natural stroke. I did modify mine to provide a few more inches of convergence and also sometimes use a removable back pad to close the gap. Would a removable back pad interfere with any of the selectorized Panatta presses or incline presses? )
Possibly Abdominal
Seated Dip

Sold Arm Cross (chest fly)-looking at Arsenal Strength incline fly, Gymleco fly, Panatta super flight line. I'd like something different than the standard Pec dec/rear delt machine. These all just happen to be plated loaded, but need mostly selectorized for this studio. Not looking to sell Medx Leg Press, Lateral Raise, or Low back unless there is some stunning replacement.

So given the pieces that I am willing to ditch, I would love to hear input on which ones to sell and replace with what.

FYI from last post....It is not the Panatta Alternate Arm Curl that has my interest. It is the Alternate arm curl 45 (1FE456), this one is new and puts your shoulders into extension (elbows behind torso). Any experience?
The Panatta Plate Loaded Abdominal....so you don't think the start weight is too heavy for smaller weaker users? (think skinny college girl who has formerly only done pilates and is new to weight training).

I look forward to hearing some suggestions! I don't want buyer's remorse!
thank you.

[HealthNutMD]

Hope all is well with everyone.

I have to say it has been a brutal 2 years. The GC and trying to build has been absolutely insane. This area is full of criminals to say the least.

Hoping to finally move the gym inside at the end of this month.

Working 4 jobs to offset costs.

Looking forward to take videos and resume where I left off a few years ago. Also looking to go to Panatta and make another order.

Talk soon. The next 2 months are going to be about moving in and getting settled, but look forward to participating here again shortly.

[William929]

Cost No Object List, Version 1.8:

This thread is not meant to be a free weights vs machines thread, and I think we got that out of the way early in the thread. This thread is simply about discussing all the choices of various free weights and machine choices on the market that people feel represent the best choice, regardless of cost. Certainly best bang for the buck is always relevant as well, but the thread is primarily focused on what is the best product available.

No company makes all of the best equipment, not even close. This thread is about discussing the best available individual machines. While some extreme body types (very short, very tall, very large, etc..) might work better with some equipment rather than others, a machine that is voted best of best is most often very adjustable and can be used with the widest variety of body types and still retain the best biomechanics (most importantly under maximum weight/effort).

Ultimately, when it comes to machines, biomechanics and how a machine 'feels' is by far the critical factor in determining what machine is best. One of the best ways to determine the quality of a machine's biomechanics, is the ability of a machine to allow perfect form when using a maximum amount of weight (effort). Additionally, the ideal machine will also have adequate starting position (pre-stretch) and a very large range of motion.

Another strength of this thread is the discussion on rare and unique specialty benches: autospot benches, skull crushers, dumbbell pullover benches, curved benches, etc...

Hi everyone

[1651Naismith]

Looking forward to take videos and resume where I left off a few years ago. Also looking to go to Panatta and make another order.

Talk soon. The next 2 months are going to be about moving in and getting settled, but look forward to participating here again shortly.

Eagerly awaiting videos of the build!

[Afo3]

Some other thoughts on best of the best. Just got back from visiting Panatta two weeks ago and I had the opportunity to visit Prime back around the holidays.

The Panatta showroom experience was really fantastic. Probably close to 400 machines all there, every single thing from the catalog I had been interested in was there to try. I'm interested in placing an order but not going to do it through a US reseller, so if others are interested in a group buy type thing I probably am too. Below I'll try to share some observations on particular pieces.

Panatta Free Weight Vertical Chest - I continue to think this is a fantastic piece. Definitely on my list, has a bit of a decline and I think I would personally pick this over the decline. That said, I'm a fairly compact, short (5'7") person so keep that in mind.

Other chest presses - the FW Incline Bench is great. I regret not spending more time with the FW Incline Chest press but my impression is the felt weight on the new Super Incline Chest is lower than the old one due to the pivot point where the pantograph connects. I also tried the Monolith Circular Chest and Incline. The Incline felt off to me, too wide of a starting point (again, I'm not a wide guy) but the Circular Press was pretty good, quite convergent.

Chest flies - I was not a fan of the decline fly, too tricepy but it is definitely unique. Was surprisingly fond of all other 3 FW chest flies (flat, incline and upper chest) but they are pretty specialized pieces. I wouldn't give up my Nautilus 10 degree fly given how compact it is.

Panatta FW Leg Press Bridge - this is awesome. Much better than the Atlantis Pivot leg press in my view. It comes in both a Super or Special version (big with more plate storage) and a more compact version with curved frame, I would get the smaller version unless you really need a big foot plate.

Panatta FW Dual Leg Press - I'm really a fan of this one. I've used this and the Atlantis linear leg press back to back. The Atlantis one is probably slightly smoother but I prefer the lumbar support of the Panatta pad. The ability to use unilaterally is interesting, not sure how valuable it really would be.

FW Special Viking/ Calf - I really liked this piece. Love the fact you can disconnect the two sides and use unilaterally as I have some weakness in one calf due to sciatica. I'd personally get this over the selectorized one, and then I'd get a 30 degree calf like Atlantis or Icarian to go with it.

FW Abdominal Crunch - those of you from Bodybuilding,com will remember Chris (HealthnutMD) saying this piece was great. He isn't kidding. It's great and its compact and I believe even available as bolt together to get down stairs.

FW Circular Lat Pulldown - I've now used this in Fit Evo, Monolith and FW versions. I prefer the free weight as I think it is a bit smoother (and cheaper) and just as good as selectorized.

Other back stuff - the FW Super High Row continues to be my favorite with the handle options but I regret not using both versions back to back while I had the chance in the showroom. I played around with the FW Super Lat Convergent quite a bit and its Monolith cousin. It is a really good piece but I found that the tension dropped of a bit at the end on the free weight one. I think this would be easy to fix by attaching chains. The Monolith version definitely had better tension at the end of the movement but I still prefer to get the plate loaded ones.

Monolith Alternate Arm Curl - this piece is awesome. I've used the Atlantis B-160 version and the Nautilus one, I think the Panatta is the best one I've tried.

Alternate Arm Curl 120 - another great one.

Other stuff of note - the Pendulum squat is an interesting approach with a counterbalance you can easily add weight to. However, the safety catch on the Atlantis one is in a much better position for most users.

There are some new pieces coming out for FIBO I was also able to play with but I'll write about those post-FIBO as I'm unclear whether or not those were meant to be secret until then.

[Afo3]

I'm not sure where to post anymore since this isn't stickied but I think its the best equipment thread. I had a chance to train at X-Force in Philadelphia this weekend with the X-Force machines that provide 40% more resistance on the negative phase. It was a very interesting experience and the facility and owners are very like minded with the equipment heads here. Mostly X-Force stuff but also older Nautilus pieces, some MedX, Dynavec, Ironcore etc.

On the X-Force machines themselves, its very hard to describe but at the top of the rep, there is about a 1 second transition as the stack tilts to vertical and quickly gets heavier. It works very well. I thought it was particularly impressive in the pullover, chest presses, pec arm cross pieces. Unfortunately I just did not go heavy enough on the leg pieces to get a real sense of the capability. The leg press with floating footplate was very interesting though, seemed to turn the movement into a much more posterior dominated movement (normally I find everything is too quad oriented). I believe I tried every piece in the lineup but I'd need more time with the back and arm pieces and probably need to start with them earlier in the workout to really have a full opinion. I do plan to go back soon.

Overall it was an impressively challenging workout for a first session with a trainer who was clearly being conservative selecting weights for a first session. I will say that I don't usually do such a slow (5 sec) negative tempo so it is hard to sort out which part of the effect was from that vs the 40% weight increase on the negative but I definitely felt it was a solid set of machines. My understanding from older sources was they are in the $10-14K range so that is quite steep compared even to top of the line Prime, Atlantis etc but in a commercial environment for 1:1 training, I could see some value.


http://x-force.se/index.php/products

[HealthNutMD]

Finally the gym moving in tomorrow.

[blakeswan]

Looks amazing! Congratulations. Can't wait to see it with the gym operational. Very exciting