DMAA WARS: The Saga Continues.....Episode XIX

[LoudyRowdy]

According to PricePlow...

These got filed tonight.

Hi-Tech believes the Court got most of the ruling correct, but its final holding was erroneous and we should prevail on this reconsideration and the Court should vacate his previous ruling for two reasons. First, there is no requirement under DSHEA––in the statute, the legislative history, or the case law––that a substance only qualifies as dietary ingredient if it can be extracted in “usable quantities.”

In fact, DSHEA clearly states that the “constituents” of a botanical are considered a dietary ingredient and sets no quantitative threshold for what constitutes a constituent of a botanical. Importantly, the Government agreed with this interpretation of DSHEA. Simply put, the Court’s conclusion otherwise impermissibly interjected its policy opinions in place of statutory interpretation. The Court’s conclusion is thus reversible legal error.

Second, the Court entered summary judgment resolving a factual issue––whether DMAA can be extracted from geraniums in “usable quantities”––based on an incomplete record. The case law is clear: sua sponte entry of summary judgment on a factual issue that was not fully developed, which no party advocated, and which the losing party neither had been properly noticed nor provided an opportunity to present evidence regarding, is inappropriate as well as reversible error.

Moreover, this finding ignored certain evidence in the record, which Claimants are entitled to supplement, regarding the ability to extract DMAA from geraniums in “usable quantities.” The Court committed an error by relying on this incomplete factual record to grant summary judgment

— Jared Wheat, Hi-Tech Pharmaceuticals CEO

[VaughnTrue]

According to PricePlow...

These got filed tonight.

Hi-Tech believes the Court got most of the ruling correct, but its final holding was erroneous and we should prevail on this reconsideration and the Court should vacate his previous ruling for two reasons. First, there is no requirement under DSHEA––in the statute, the legislative history, or the case law––that a substance only qualifies as dietary ingredient if it can be extracted in “usable quantities.”

In fact, DSHEA clearly states that the “constituents” of a botanical are considered a dietary ingredient and sets no quantitative threshold for what constitutes a constituent of a botanical. Importantly, the Government agreed with this interpretation of DSHEA. Simply put, the Court’s conclusion otherwise impermissibly interjected its policy opinions in place of statutory interpretation. The Court’s conclusion is thus reversible legal error.

Second, the Court entered summary judgment resolving a factual issue––whether DMAA can be extracted from geraniums in “usable quantities”––based on an incomplete record. The case law is clear: sua sponte entry of summary judgment on a factual issue that was not fully developed, which no party advocated, and which the losing party neither had been properly noticed nor provided an opportunity to present evidence regarding, is inappropriate as well as reversible error.

Moreover, this finding ignored certain evidence in the record, which Claimants are entitled to supplement, regarding the ability to extract DMAA from geraniums in “usable quantities.” The Court committed an error by relying on this incomplete factual record to grant summary judgment

— Jared Wheat, Hi-Tech Pharmaceuticals CEO

[dazedncnfz]

In...

[Manowar11]

Jared Wheat is GOAT, which more supp company owners had a sack like him to stop the FDA BS.

[Big_Spaz]

Jared Wheat is GOAT, which more supp company owners had a sack like him to stop the FDA BS.

Agreed! I love to have someone fighting for our rights to CHOOSE. That's all we want, is a choice in Pre-Workout products. That shouldn't even be a question, but unfortunately in 2017 (even here in the United States of America), it unfortunately is





-Spaz

[VaughnTrue]

guys should we call someone? It's been 2 hours since this was posted...I'm worried about KDD

[LoudyRowdy]

guys should we call someone? It's been 2 hours since this was posted...I'm worried about KDD

settle down...am sure he is researching and getting his answer(s) in order

hold your britches

[dougefresh93]

in b4 KDD, in b4 nonsense, in b4 lock.

[BenBlue]

in b4 KDD who's likely been meticulously crafting his response for the last 2 hours

[HeavenBeyond]

Agreed! I love to have someone fighting for our rights to CHOOSE. That's all we want, is a choice in Pre-Workout products. That shouldn't even be a question, but unfortunately in 2017 (even here in the United States of America), it unfortunately is







-Spaz

I am inclined to agree with you; however, looking at the track record from most supplement companies... the FDA is a good thing.

[HeavenBeyond]

in b4 KDD who's likely been meticulously crafting his response for the last 2 hours

It's coming.

[Big_Spaz]

I am inclined to agree with you; however, looking at the track record from most supplement companies... the FDA is a good thing.

That's with anything man. Honestly.


I'm willing to sift through some weeds to find some good things if it means I am still legally able to do that. When they tell me I can't even go out in my front yard (and touch the weeds) is when I tend to get a bit bent out of shape.

This may be the wrong metaphor or context but you get the point. I've been using supplements for honestly 20+ years and the stuff that has come and gone is mind boggling. And not because it didn't work, mostly because it DID work and that's why it's gone. It's a shame.





-Spaz

[AfroPope]

I am inclined to agree with you; however, looking at the track record from most supplement companies... the FDA is a good thing.

Agreed. I think they're overreaching in this particular case but generally tend to side with them on a lot of "supplement" issues.

[El Conquistador]

According to PricePlow...

These got filed tonight.

Hi-Tech believes the Court got most of the ruling correct, but its final holding was erroneous and we should prevail on this reconsideration and the Court should vacate his previous ruling for two reasons. First, there is no requirement under DSHEA––in the statute, the legislative history, or the case law––that a substance only qualifies as dietary ingredient if it can be extracted in “usable quantities.”

In fact, DSHEA clearly states that the “constituents” of a botanical are considered a dietary ingredient and sets no quantitative threshold for what constitutes a constituent of a botanical. Importantly, the Government agreed with this interpretation of DSHEA. Simply put, the Court’s conclusion otherwise impermissibly interjected its policy opinions in place of statutory interpretation. The Court’s conclusion is thus reversible legal error.

Second, the Court entered summary judgment resolving a factual issue––whether DMAA can be extracted from geraniums in “usable quantities”––based on an incomplete record. The case law is clear: sua sponte entry of summary judgment on a factual issue that was not fully developed, which no party advocated, and which the losing party neither had been properly noticed nor provided an opportunity to present evidence regarding, is inappropriate as well as reversible error.

Moreover, this finding ignored certain evidence in the record, which Claimants are entitled to supplement, regarding the ability to extract DMAA from geraniums in “usable quantities.” The Court committed an error by relying on this incomplete factual record to grant summary judgment

— Jared Wheat, Hi-Tech Pharmaceuticals CEO

You should be negged for giving KDD another platform...

[LoudyRowdy]

You should be negged for giving KDD another platform...

[Rushie]

Agreed. I think they're overreaching in this particular case but generally tend to side with them on a lot of "supplement" issues.

Agreed.

[compan]

Let the record show Vaughn still maintains all of his points

[HeavenBeyond]

That's with anything man. Honestly.


I'm willing to sift through some weeds to find some good things if it means I am still legally able to do that. When they tell me I can't even go out in my front yard (and touch the weeds) is when I tend to get a bit bent out of shape.

This may be the wrong metaphor or context but you get the point. I've been using supplements for honestly 20+ years and the stuff that has come and gone is mind boggling. And not because it didn't work, mostly because it DID work and that's why it's gone. It's a shame.





-Spaz

Nah, I completely hear what you're saying Spaz. I get it. It's frustrating for sure, especially for somebody like you who is more educated on supplements and specific ingredients. I just think a lot of supplement companies would use that to their advantage, which may not be in the best interest of society.

[AfroPope]

Nah, I completely hear what you're saying Spaz. I get it. It's frustrating for sure, especially for somebody like you who is more educated on supplements and specific ingredients. I just think a lot of supplement companies would use that to their advantage, which may not be in the best interest of society.

It was the FDA who shut down Matt Cahill both times (His pesticide-containing fat burner that was killing people and Craze), and they're the ones who got the stuff we can't talk about here pulled off the market (which is whatever, but you could buy them off the shelf at any GNC/Vitamin Shoppe as "muscle builders").

[customshopkv1]

In and subbed

[RVAPump]

tried some sketchy looking pre called Kracked Out by Pharma Legal...Purple Drank flavor

I haz no need for DMAA anymore

[OT2000]

I would rather have a WS response than Kdd. He reads the law better than almost anyone on here I have seen.

[HeavenBeyond]

tried some sketchy looking pre called Kracked Out by Pharma Legal...Purple Drank flavor

I haz no need for DMAA anymore

LOL some of these companies crack me up. It was probably a stim bomb packed with cough syrup.

[LoudyRowdy]

tried some sketchy looking pre called Kracked Out by Pharma Legal...Purple Drank flavor

I haz no need for DMAA anymore

[carguy123]

I would rather have a WS response than Kdd. He reads the law better than almost anyone on here I have seen.

Yeah that guy really surprised me with his knowelege, had some really good posts.

[COUNTRYMIKE]

Just deleted a post in here pertaining to drugs, please don't post that again and please read the forum rules so this thread doesn't get locked.

[BenBlue]

Dat durr Ephedra will do it.

[AfroPope]

Just deleted a post in here pertaining to drugs, please don't post that again and please read the forum rules so this thread doesn't get locked.

Sorry Mike, I've edited my other post to be more compliant as well

[El Conquistador]

Just deleted a post in here pertaining to drugs, please don't post that again and please read the forum rules so this thread doesn't get locked.

I'd prefer it does get locked, as it's just a matter of time before....

[eatyourspinach]

I'm confused is Hi Tech claiming that they extracted "usable quantities" or that they aren't able to?