I know there are a lot of people in this science based section of the forums who don’t believe what they see and experience unless there is a study that backs their observations. So was hoping someone had a study that proved that we exist. My friend is trying to tell me that we don’t actually exist and I am telling him that we do, so just need to point to a peer reviewed study to prove to him that we do exist. thanks in advance!
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08-23-2021, 11:56 AM #1
Are there any studies that prove we exist?
2 time survivor of The Great Misc Outages of 2022
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08-23-2021, 11:57 AM #2
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08-23-2021, 11:58 AM #3
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08-23-2021, 12:12 PM #4
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08-23-2021, 12:20 PM #5
I think that's a bit of a low-blow, since epistemology is inherently a priori in a way that sports science is not; moreover a lot of the quest for and discussion of minutiae in studies seems to stem mostly from an enthusiasm or general interest, rather than an intent to upend universally accepted conclusions and their bearing on our daily life, even as people more conscious of and concerned with these factors in the first place.
EDIT: I do find it ironic though that Descartes is the direct genesis of these planar graphs which feature so heavily in references to said studies.Bench: 345
Squat: 405
Deadlift: 505
"... But always, there remained, the discipline of steel!"
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08-23-2021, 12:27 PM #6
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08-23-2021, 12:43 PM #7
Lol
Like Eli alluded to Descartes (Cogito Ergo Sum - I think, therefore I am) is the most well known argument
I personally don’t find this kind of philosophy very useful. One of the great american philosophers, Charles Sanders Peirce, said something like «do not doubt in your mind what you cannot doubt in your heart», meaning that we always have to start with some basic presuppositions, so pretending to doubt everything will necessarily lead you to leave something out. The most basic assumptions that you really take for granted will still slip through your arguments.
A good example is that Descartes tries to start from radical doubt - i.e. his method is to basically doubt everything and then start from scratch - but he doesn’t doubt the subject-predicate logic (I, the subject, is doing the thinking) which he inherits from previous thinkers...
Your friend does the same thing, just say «if we don’t exist, why are you talking to me?»Last edited by EiFit91; 08-23-2021 at 12:53 PM.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself—and you are the easiest person to fool.
- Richard Feynman
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08-23-2021, 12:44 PM #8
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08-23-2021, 01:08 PM #16
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Only if you want meaningful discussion to happen. I don't see how debating what is "knowable" or what "existence" is progresses human thought forward. There will never be a consensus.
While moralists can argue about what a "virtuous" life looks like because they already presupposed that "virtue" exists.
Spoiler!Last edited by LtGoose; 08-23-2021 at 01:15 PM.
Disclaimer: All posts made by [LtGoose] are works of satire. By reading this you agree to absolve the author of any and all liability.
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08-23-2021, 01:11 PM #17
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08-23-2021, 01:24 PM #22
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Slightly related and fascinating topic (IMO)...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Observer_effect_(physics)
"In physics, the observer effect is the disturbance of an observed system by the act of observation.[1][2] This is often the result of instruments that, by necessity, alter the state of what they measure in some manner. A common example is checking the pressure in an automobile tire; this is difficult to do without letting out some of the air, thus changing the pressure. Similarly, it is not possible to see any object without light hitting the object, and causing it to reflect that light. While the effects of observation are often negligible, the object still experiences a change."
So in essence, any kind of perception we have of any kind of matter immediately impacts it in some way, simply by knowing it is there.
Sound waves have to bounce off something to hear it... that effects the matter
Light has to reflect for us to see it or instruments to pick it up... that effects the matter
And of course touching something will alter it.
So as soon as matter of any kind of becomes perceptible, it is altered in some way.... pretty interesting to think of.
I've often found it fascinating that human being cannot truly experience any in our natural universe when it actually happens, due to our brains requiring some minute amount of time to processing before we can respond.
Everything you see, hear, touch... it already happened before you knew it did."When I die, I hope it's early in the morning so I don't have to go to work that day for no reason"
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08-23-2021, 01:32 PM #23
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08-23-2021, 01:36 PM #24
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08-23-2021, 02:20 PM #25
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08-23-2021, 02:23 PM #26
Yeah I remember that one study that measured time dilation. Where we don’t technically “live” in the present but we are seeing things that happened in the “past”, but it seems like its occurring in real time to us, but this allows our brains to “slow down” or skew time or how it seems to be passing.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/b...ain-stops-time2 time survivor of The Great Misc Outages of 2022
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08-23-2021, 03:38 PM #27
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08-23-2021, 09:58 PM #28
The more I research it, I end up building a case for my friends point of view if you put these two perspectives together:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19857000/
https://www.newscientist.com/article...-know-i-exist/2 time survivor of The Great Misc Outages of 2022
Survivor of PHP/API Outage of Feb 2023
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