Vick's Dating Log and Advice Thread v. 3.0 (that escalated quickly!)

[xvicknumber7x]

I think when you're dealing with someone who has severe mental health issues and has experienced trauma such as what you have described, there is really no point trying to over-analyze the way we are longing to do.

IMO, this is why relationships are less likely to work when one (or both) of the people involved begin the relationship in a place where they still need a significant amount of work to feel emotionally stable/healthy.

I've often thought it is appealing to date someone whom you can clearly "help" in life beyond just enjoying your time together as it gives you purpose as well but in reality the relationships that probably work best are those where neither of you "needs" the other, you just recognize you enjoy your life better with them as opposed to without them and are both understanding of their interests outside of your relationship and can communicate in a way where neither of you is resentful for the compromises you make within the relationship.

Perhaps your ex simply could not fathom why you went above and beyond for her well-being and the fact you poured so much time and effort into her when you could be doing things with your life that made you happier was subconsciously a turn off.

that could be it. this is such a self aware post, i really loved it. honestly man at the end of the day, my actions made me happy as well as hopefully her, and i can rest with that.

i'll probably have some new updates later. have two dates tomorrow and one thursday (so far.)

[alltrapbrah]

like I said, he's been my friend for like 15 years lol. i tend to leave a lot of people behind, but i'll always like him. he has an understanding of me that few people do. and he is tremendously smart.

Question:

Do you think your influence has contributed towards Jame's development of a rigid redpill mindset?

I ask, because, I recall that back in the day you and him were practically a double act. James would spew his "nothing matters but looks" rhetoric, and you would back him right up each and everytime.

Everyone, even idiots, know how important looks are in the dating game, but redpill philosophy takes this a step further by discarding objectivity and preaching a dogmatic belief that looks are the be all and end all of one's dating life. You, from what I recall, were a proponent of this belief, talked about it time and time again, and James was hanging off your every word.

On the whole, I thought you gave pretty good advice, but I always took issue with your stance on that chit. What use is it continually telling an objectively unattractive man that looks are everything? Your argument is probably, "well, the best way to help him is by telling him the truth". But it's not the truth, is it? As massively important as looks are, there's countless evidence out there in the world to suggest that looks are not the sole determining factor in men being able to date women. I would argue that the most therapeutic approach for such a case would be to look to develop his strengths and/or things he can change, rather than continually beating him over the head with what he's lacking and suggesting that he's doomed because of it.

Rather ironically James went on to get a girlfriend.

[Rebel012]

why is feminism to blame?

It's not, it's a scapegoat. Aside from militant separatists, even feminists enjoy sex. I suppose in his mind he believes that women acquiring more rights (ability to earn an independent wage) equals more independence, hence they don't have to settle for guys like him.

[BlackScorpio91]

It's not, it's a scapegoat. Aside from militant separatists, even feminists enjoy sex. I suppose in his mind he believes that women acquiring more rights (ability to earn an independent wage) equals more independence, hence they don't have to settle for guys like him.

Yeah a lot of beta males are mad because they don't really have an advantage as many of them are left in the dust. Sure beta males are still getting into relationships but they are gonna have to be the provider role or else they got no chance. And there are beta males that no one wants anything to do with at all and that's why they're mad.

Apparently James fits into the category of a beta male who women want nothing to do with.

In b4 I ain't no beta male, I went to Ivy League.
In b4 I make people laugh and I'm the life of the party.
In b4 I have a job that makes 60k a year.

I'm sorry but the reality is if you can't get laid then you're a sexual beta male. You might be "alpha" in other categories but in terms of relationships you're a beta male.

[Luc1fer]

BlackScorpio, you have a tendency to oversimplify these situations. It is a false dichotomy to categorize a man as either a "beta" or "alpha".

I used to tend to do that too, likely because we all sit somewhere on the autism spectrum, but it isn't a healthy mindset. You end up being paranoid about any behavior which might deem you a "beta male".

I see you've taken this to the extreme and even see dates as a risk for you for fear she might be fukking you for some reason other than your physical body. Anyway, I don't think it's a healthy mindset. Although I do agree obviously that men should be aware of gold diggers etc.

[BlackScorpio91]

BlackScorpio, you have a tendency to oversimplify these situations. It is a false dichotomy to categorize a man as either a "beta" or "alpha".

I used to tend to do that too, likely because we all sit somewhere on the autism spectrum, but it isn't a healthy mindset. You end up being paranoid about any behavior which might deem you a "beta male".

I see you've taken this to the extreme and even see dates as a risk for you for fear she might be fukking you for some reason other than your physical body. Anyway, I don't think it's a healthy mindset. Although I do agree obviously that men should be aware of gold diggers etc.

I've never said I didn't want to go on dates because I was afraid of gold diggers. I just never really liked the concept of going on a date and talking about trivial bs I could care less about when I just wanted to fuk her and that's it. It took me til last year to figure it out. Thus I don't have my time wasted doing something I really don't want to do or with a woman that may or may not like me.

I'll only go on a date if I see that woman as girlfriend material (after vetting her for a period of time for example), not some random woman I just met on the street and I barely know. You ain't gonna really know if a woman is girlfriend material or wife material even after 3 dates. Now if a fuk buddy/FWB does things for you and cooperates without you always asking her, yes maybe.

I'm just never been a going on a date type of guy.

[xvicknumber7x]

Question:

Do you think your influence has contributed towards Jame's development of a rigid redpill mindset?

I ask, because, I recall that back in the day you and him were practically a double act. James would spew his "nothing matters but looks" rhetoric, and you would back him right up each and everytime.

Everyone, even idiots, know how important looks are in the dating game, but redpill philosophy takes this a step further by discarding objectivity and preaching a dogmatic belief that looks are the be all and end all of one's dating life. You, from what I recall, were a proponent of this belief, talked about it time and time again, and James was hanging off your every word.

On the whole, I thought you gave pretty good advice, but I always took issue with your stance on that chit. What use is it continually telling an objectively unattractive man that looks are everything? Your argument is probably, "well, the best way to help him is by telling him the truth". But it's not the truth, is it? As massively important as looks are, there's countless evidence out there in the world to suggest that looks are not the sole determining factor in men being able to date women. I would argue that the most therapeutic approach for such a case would be to look to develop his strengths and/or things he can change, rather than continually beating him over the head with what he's lacking and suggesting that he's doomed because of it.

Rather ironically James went on to get a girlfriend.

not at all. and i still think looks are like 50-60% of this whole equation. if you're just trying to get laid, looks are everything. they are supremely important. but i dont think anything about my experience or mindset has influenced james at all.

its so weird calling him james. his name isnt even james, wtf.

It's not, it's a scapegoat. Aside from militant separatists, even feminists enjoy sex. I suppose in his mind he believes that women acquiring more rights (ability to earn an independent wage) equals more independence, hence they don't have to settle for guys like him.

i see. interesting tie-together.

Yeah a lot of beta males are mad because they don't really have an advantage as many of them are left in the dust. Sure beta males are still getting into relationships but they are gonna have to be the provider role or else they got no chance. And there are beta males that no one wants anything to do with at all and that's why they're mad.

Apparently James fits into the category of a beta male who women want nothing to do with.

In b4 I ain't no beta male, I went to Ivy League.
In b4 I make people laugh and I'm the life of the party.
In b4 I have a job that makes 60k a year.

I'm sorry but the reality is if you can't get laid then you're a sexual beta male. You might be "alpha" in other categories but in terms of relationships you're a beta male.

i cant believe alphas and betas are still a thing.

BlackScorpio, you have a tendency to oversimplify these situations. It is a false dichotomy to categorize a man as either a "beta" or "alpha".

I used to tend to do that too, likely because we all sit somewhere on the autism spectrum, but it isn't a healthy mindset. You end up being paranoid about any behavior which might deem you a "beta male".

I see you've taken this to the extreme and even see dates as a risk for you for fear she might be fukking you for some reason other than your physical body. Anyway, I don't think it's a healthy mindset. Although I do agree obviously that men should be aware of gold diggers etc.

i actually enjoy dates tbh, even if we dont get physical. because its still fun and i dont mind spending some money.

I've never said I didn't want to go on dates because I was afraid of gold diggers. I just never really liked the concept of going on a date and talking about trivial bs I could care less about when I just wanted to fuk her and that's it. It took me til last year to figure it out. Thus I don't have my time wasted doing something I really don't want to do or with a woman that may or may not like me.

I'll only go on a date if I see that woman as girlfriend material (after vetting her for a period of time for example), not some random woman I just met on the street and I barely know. You ain't gonna really know if a woman is girlfriend material or wife material even after 3 dates. Now if a fuk buddy/FWB does things for you and cooperates without you always asking her, yes maybe.

I'm just never been a going on a date type of guy.

i guess the difference between you and I is that i steer the conversation toward the shiit I actually wanna talk and joke about. but i def get your position.

[xvicknumber7x]

Update:

So, tomorrow I have two dates. I also have one Thursday. Tomorrow, I am meeting a chick from Tinder at a coffee shop next door from my counseling office. She lives a few minutes away so it's super convenient. I've been talking to her since Sunday, and she is ridiculously funny. However, she has 2 kids. I am still really interested in meeting her because I really like her personality. And from what she told me, the ass is fat. So I guess we will see where it goes. She seems to have a very self-depricating style of humor, which is pretty good tbh. Self-awareness is key. Name is Miranda.

Then, after work I'm meeting some other Tinder chick that I mentioned last week at a restaurant near my house. This one seems the most heavily interested of all the girls I have been talking to so far. She texts a lot, tells me I look good, all that lovey dovey ****. I told her I move hyper slow and she seems on board with that, but out of all of the girls she seems most keen on finding a relationship, so this is a date I'll probably just cut my teeth on for a bit for a few weeks if she is cool with it. I plan on being open and honest about where I am at, and to let things fall where they may. She is 25. Name is Emily.

Then on Thursday, I am meeting a 22 year old for some food after I get some stuff done Thursday. I am pretty excited about meeting this one, as well. She seems pretty into things as well, and I believe she would be an excellent candidate to do cool fall stuff with. Seems down for whatever, likes to drink, makes me feel a little younger again, haha. Openly compliments me, texts back fast, all the good signs are there. I plan on taking her to eat sushi because I like sushi and so does she. I've been dying for it. Name is Erika.

My plan for these three is just to see if I still got the juice, be open, and be funny. That's really all. I have no intentions of moving quickly with any of these women, unless it is unavoidable or if I'm just really feeling it. To be honest, relationships are not on my mind, and I am just looking to get some experience back and see what things have grown to be like in my absence. Class girl has been blowing me up too, and even did an entire assignment for us because she knows I have a lot on my plate. She is really great. I think I'll try to see her next. Name is Alyssa.

Matched with a BBer chick from just over the border in Canada, honestly hhhnnnnggggg to me. Not ripped, thick af, and dedicated to fitness. I might make a quick trip to Canada to see what's up. She would be one I'd be aiming to smash, but maybe she wins me over. Or not. More on that in a few days, probably.

[MediocreGains]

I just don't think these things happen overnight.

Agreed. The signs are always there. Even in the off-chance that the person is a sociopath, the signs of sociopathy reveal themselves sooner rather than later. Of course, actually noticing those signs are a different story. Most men are oblivious.

That said, OP is right in that the past isn't worth dwelling on.

[Luc1fer]

Gotta admit it's somewhat brutal to see Vick's easy success on the dating apps. I can go weeks without a date.

[xvicknumber7x]

Agreed. The signs are always there. Even in the off-chance that the person is a sociopath, the signs of sociopathy reveal themselves sooner rather than later. Of course, actually noticing those signs are a different story. Most men are oblivious.

That said, OP is right in that the past isn't worth dwelling on.

well I diagnose sociopaths weekly and i have seen her cry over deaths and hardship before so that is certainly out the window. but yeah it's over and I have my plate full again so

Gotta admit it's somewhat brutal to see Vick's easy success on the dating apps. I can go weeks without a date.

damn I didnt really know it was like that. is there anything you wanna see that I am doing? texts, intros, etc? i mean to be fair i live in a smaller town and a lot of girls here aren't hard to get tbh. i think it is purely a product of where I live and the way I text and engage. it does help that i have a cute face though.

[Luc1fer]

damn I didnt really know it was like that. is there anything you wanna see that I am doing? texts, intros, etc? i mean to be fair i live in a smaller town and a lot of girls here aren't hard to get tbh. i think it is purely a product of where I live and the way I text and engage. it does help that i have a cute face though.

Not sure, could be a mix of things - standards might be too high etc. I do okay, but nothing like the instant activity you have. My face and body are okay, my height isn't.

Are you gonna post pics?

[xvicknumber7x]

Not sure, could be a mix of things - standards might be too high etc. I do okay, but nothing like the instant activity you have. My face and body are okay, my height isn't.

Are you gonna post pics?

i am direly afraid of misc detectives. i will send them to trusted members, though.

i dont think these girls are 10s by any stretch, but they arent 5s.

[MediocreGains]

Gotta admit it's somewhat brutal to see Vick's easy success on the dating apps. I can go weeks without a date.

To be fair, you're really picky.

And a young, good-looking guy is naturally going to do well.

[xvicknumber7x]

To be fair, you're really picky.

And a young, good-looking guy is naturally going to do well.

in a city full of baby mommas and lame-duck dudes, as well.

i'm not too picky tbh. if shes funny, has a cute face, and seems to not be boring, i'm on board.

[BlackScorpio91]

Not sure, could be a mix of things - standards might be too high etc. I do okay, but nothing like the instant activity you have. My face and body are okay, my height isn't.

Are you gonna post pics?

You're also judgmental....women don't like that and even if you don't overtly say it, they can pick up on it. You're never truly be successful with women if you're too judgmental.

[BlackScorpio91]

So since most of us are in our 20s and 30s here, what is the minimum age you look for in a woman?

Me:

Hooking up: 20-21 (maybe 18-19 in certain situations but I honestly don't like being around teenagers so maybe, maybe not).
Serious relationship: (if I were to start dating again): 24.

[xvicknumber7x]

You're also judgmental....women don't like that and even if you don't overtly say it, they can pick up on it. You're never truly be successful with women if you're too judgmental.

i guess thats a thing i have going for me. i'm a counselor so i cant be judgmental. it just aint in me.

[MediocreGains]

So since most of us are in our 20s and 30s here, what is the minimum age you look for in a woman?

Me:

Hooking up: 20-21 (maybe 18-19 in certain situations but I honestly don't like being around teenagers so maybe, maybe not).
Serious relationship: (if I were to start dating again): 24.

When I was single, 18, though in practice I never went below 19. The maximum age I put for dating apps was 26-27, but in real life I dated/hooked up with women my age as well.

My wife was 23 when we met.

[xvicknumber7x]

So since most of us are in our 20s and 30s here, what is the minimum age you look for in a woman?

Me:

Hooking up: 20-21 (maybe 18-19 in certain situations but I honestly don't like being around teenagers so maybe, maybe not).
Serious relationship: (if I were to start dating again): 24.

hooking up - 19 and up. honestly dont hook up a lot anymore but if i did, i wouldn't care much about age as long as its legal obv.
relationship - 22 and up. outta college and i'm good with it. the personality traits matter much more than age to me.

[BlackScorpio91]

i guess thats a thing i have going for me. i'm a counselor so i cant be judgmental. it just aint in me.

Yeah I'm not really judgmental when it comes to woman's true sexual nature. I guess that's why a lot of women have came on to me (in some cases pretty strongly) because they were both attracted to me and that they could see I wasn't gonna call them a ho or a thot.

Of course there are plenty of women that put up that "anti slut" defense to keep themselves from being too forward and easy but those are ones you have to break down.

[Luc1fer]

You're also judgmental....women don't like that and even if you don't overtly say it, they can pick up on it. You're never truly be successful with women if you're too judgmental.

Judgemental in terms of deeming promiscuous women as non-wife material, sure. The girl I’m dating right now for example is very open about her experiences. She’s young though and probably doesn’t realize it devalues her yet.

[BlackScorpio91]

Judgemental in terms of deeming promiscuous women as non-wife material, sure. The girl I’m dating right now for example is very open about her experiences. She’s young though and probably doesn’t realize it devalues her yet.

How old is she?

[Rebel012]

Judgemental in terms of deeming promiscuous women as non-wife material, sure. The girl I’m dating right now for example is very open about her experiences. She’s young though and probably doesn’t realize it devalues her yet.

It doesn't necessarily devalue her in the eyes of everyone (even in terms of wife material). Some women will experiment with that stuff when they're that age and then shift their mindset to one of monogamy in the context of an ltr, and never look back. Different contexts can bring out, or magnify, certain traits in people, but it doesn't necessarily define them. Ultra promiscuity, with zero standards, would concern me because it's often a symptom of other emotional or mental health problems, but it doesn't even sound like the girl you're dating is at that level.

[Krackerjacked]

i am direly afraid of misc detectives. i will send them to trusted members, though.

i dont think these girls are 10s by any stretch, but they arent 5s.

I know I haven't been here nearly as long but I 100% can be trusted. Prime Minister me to talk more.
Gotta live vicariously through someone and my bros irl are too shy to do that lol

[xvicknumber7x]

I know I haven't been here nearly as long but I 100% can be trusted. Prime Minister me to talk more.
Gotta live vicariously through someone and my bros irl are too shy to do that lol

maybe I'll start to circulate them soon.

anyway, lunch girl bailed on me. apparently she got called into work. no big deal. got a dinner date with the girl who is probably most enthusiastic about meeting, and then another dinner thing tomorrow with the one i probably like the most. and then maybe i'll try to get at class girl this weekend around hanging around doing homework and gaming.

[Briisk]

Definitely remember you, it seems like just last couple months you were posting here, has it really been years? You along with a couple other names stick out.

I'm getting together w an ex of 6 weeks (mutual break up over moving states) this weekend. Seems like theres a high chance of getting back together. Should I offer to pick her up to talk over dinner, or just meet at the location instead?

[FastBack6]

so as far as how i viewed the relationship goes, i largely viewed myself as both an emotional manager and a boyfriend as time went by. obviously the first year or so was really good, and then some significant depression and anxiety issues began to hit. combine that with a tough work situation, and i went into a role of boyfriend and emotional crutch. i did not mind this, and had plenty of opportunities to leave. however, i justified staying for the following reason: in my past relationships, I have always done things that were not good in secret. i just have. not proud of it, but i havent been the best boyfriend in the past. in this relationship, i resolved to do the right thing always, hang tough for my chick, and let things fall where they may, even when they got very difficult, which they did frequently. but i wanted to see both if i was capable of this, and what it would lead to.

if you go back over our history, i'm sure there were small things that i attributed to anxiety and depression that were probably indicators of some sort of strange thinking, but nothing that ever indicated to me that we were on borrowed time. there is literally not a single saying, event, attitude, mood, anything i can say "yep, there it was." there just wasn't. we had our routine, i took her out, i took care of her when she was laying in bed all day, i left nothing there that i could have probably ignored. in the end, that got me burnt badly, and after being kicked to the curb, i realize how much i was doing and how much effort i was putting in that just wasnt as often reciprocated. the thing was that i just did not care. i was obsessed with the idea of doing things "right" for myself and for her, not just for her. in doing so, i learned a ton about myself and what i am capable of.

it hurt to be dumped. big time. especially when i worked so hard and put so much emotional energy into the relationship. but now, just a day shy of 14 days later, i'm fine with it all because i regret nothing and learned so much about myself, and lastly, i am happy with my actions. since getting back out there, it is now clear to me that my value has somehow risen. so even though it went bad, overall, there is no event or anything i can really look back on and say 'yep, shoulda seen it' based on the things she was telling me about the future and present and stuff. i was always there, i did the right things, and i know i can do that for someone who has the same ideas as me. it just sorta happened, and i always knew it was a possibility because not many good things last forever, but i am far enough removed from it to know that i probably couldnt carry that forever. that is another thing i have learned.

she was a chronically terrible communicator. she got anxious about everything. she was molested when a child. there were a lot of issues there i wanted to hang in there with. i did my job. i do think something went wrong in the last week or so, and i happen to believe that something her friends said or did or whatever made her do this. but i dont think about it. it is what it is tbh. and that is okay.

tldr; no signs, no anything, always tried to do the right thing, knowledge of self gained, feel great about it all now, things fall apart.

It’s just the natural progression of things. Relationships end. It’s life, the way that it was actually designed to be.

Everyone needs to repeat after me. Stand in front of a mirror and say this to yourself about 10 times, and you will feel better about your future relations with women.

HUMANS. ARE. NOT. MONOGAMOUS.

We were never designed to be. There are very few animals in the world that mate for life. Humans decided to do it to try to stabilize society, and it worked for a really long time. However, biology always gets its due, and before you know it we are back to caveman hindbrain behavior.

Look around you. Look at the rate of failed relationships, failed marriages, cheating, all of that. It’s because we aren’t wired to be attracted to just one person for the rest of our lives, not even for 5 years or more. I’ve done most of the breaking up in realtionships, and I’ve also been broken up with. Eventually you just get sick of someone else. It’s the same old day in day out routine and you start to crave that variety.

Now add in the modern woman. Today they have more variety than they have ever had at any point in history. Snapchat, instagram, ********, Twitter. Twerking their ass on the internet for all the world, and all the men they want to sleep with, to see. Men are in a tight spot here if they are hoping for the fantasy “happy wife, happy life” picket fence happily ever after story because less than one percent of modern relationships are going to be capable of that. Women don’t need no man, they’ve got daddy, daddy corporate, and daddy government to take care of their every need and provide them with whatever they want. Take 2 and subtract 2, and you have zero. When she needs more she goes and uses some random dude for his cash, and he happily obliges for a chance to get up in it. It’s completely out of control. Ask any guy about marriage, that is either successful in it or has been divorced. It’s red pill on hard mode. Basically another full time job just to keep some average, aging woman happy for a few extra years until she divorces you anyway. Na, I’m good.

Just enjoy it for what it is. You have a girl for a while, it’s over, then you go find another one. There’s really no other option at this point and it’s not going to improve.

[BlackScorpio91]

It’s just the natural progression of things. Relationships end. It’s life, the way that it was actually designed to be.

Everyone needs to repeat after me. Stand in front of a mirror and say this to yourself about 10 times, and you will feel better about your future relations with women.

HUMANS. ARE. NOT. MONOGAMOUS.

We were never designed to be. There are very few animals in the world that mate for life. Humans decided to do it to try to stabilize society, and it worked for a really long time. However, biology always gets its due, and before you know it we are back to caveman hindbrain behavior.

Look around you. Look at the rate of failed relationships, failed marriages, cheating, all of that. It’s because we aren’t wired to be attracted to just one person for the rest of our lives, not even for 5 years or more. I’ve done most of the breaking up in realtionships, and I’ve also been broken up with. Eventually you just get sick of someone else. It’s the same old day in day out routine and you start to crave that variety.

Now add in the modern woman. Today they have more variety than they have ever had at any point in history. Snapchat, instagram, ********, Twitter. Twerking their ass on the internet for all the world, and all the men they want to sleep with, to see. Men are in a tight spot here if they are hoping for the fantasy “happy wife, happy life” picket fence happily ever after story because less than one percent of modern relationships are going to be capable of that. Women don’t need no man, they’ve got daddy, daddy corporate, and daddy government to take care of their every need and provide them with whatever they want. Take 2 and subtract 2, and you have zero. When she needs more she goes and uses some random dude for his cash, and he happily obliges for a chance to get up in it. It’s completely out of control. Ask any guy about marriage, that is either successful in it or has been divorced. It’s red pill on hard mode. Basically another full time job just to keep some average, aging woman happy for a few extra years until she divorces you anyway. Na, I’m good.

Just enjoy it for what it is. You have a girl for a while, it’s over, then you go find another one. There’s really no other option at this point and it’s not going to improve.

This man deserves a medal. FACTS

[Luc1fer]

This man deserves a medal. FACTS

Cherry picked FACTS