Formastat VS 6oxo

**Dedicated1** · 10-09-2002, 01:02 PM

From Bills website - Formastat� contains the suicide aromatase inhibitor formestane (4-hydroxyandrostenedione), a clinically proven anti-estrogen exceedingly more potent than any supplement to come before it. 6-oxo-androstenedione, chrysin, indole-3-carbinol, calcium d-glucarate, trihydroxystilbene, not even our old Viratase (5-alpha-androstanedione) can't come close. All of them combined in one capsule still wouldn't even have a shot. Formastat� is such a revolutionary advance in the area of estrogen suppression because it contains the only agent backed by not one but numerous placebo-controlled human medical studies, and so effective it is actually a prescription breast cancer drug in other countries.
Anyone wanna comment on this??

**w_llewellyn** · 10-09-2002, 01:18 PM

Originally posted by Dedicated1
From Bills website - Formastat� contains the suicide aromatase inhibitor formestane (4-hydroxyandrostenedione), a clinically proven anti-estrogen exceedingly more potent than any supplement to come before it. 6-oxo-androstenedione, chrysin, indole-3-carbinol, calcium d-glucarate, trihydroxystilbene, not even our old Viratase (5-alpha-androstanedione) can't come close. All of them combined in one capsule still wouldn't even have a shot. Formastat� is such a revolutionary advance in the area of estrogen suppression because it contains the only agent backed by not one but numerous placebo-controlled human medical studies, and so effective it is actually a prescription breast cancer drug in other countries.
Anyone wanna comment on this??

Yes, I made a typo. That sucks..

**windwords7** · 10-09-2002, 01:27 PM

Oh well Bill. Life goes on!

Nice to see your new products. There pretty ritzy for my blood but I'll certainly give Formastat a run at some point.

**Bobo** · 10-09-2002, 01:54 PM

So what is the big difference bewteen the two and what would warrant people from using one over the other?

**w_llewellyn** · 10-09-2002, 02:20 PM

Originally posted by Bobo
So what is the big difference bewteen the two and what would warrant people from using one over the other?

It all boils down to one being signficantly more potent and cost effective that the other.

**Dedicated1** · 10-09-2002, 02:41 PM

LOL, i wasnt refering to the typo. Last I heard about 4-hydroxy was a huge arguement between U and your best friend Jeff M (whom U plan to marry one day). Im not debating the notion that it wouldnt be great for post cycle on estrogen, but I believe U and Jeff had a huge debate over other matters. I believe in regards to androgens (cant remembet the specifics), and whether or not it would be beneficial post cycle. I posted it, to get some feedback from others who might be educated on this. Of course anyone selling their stuff, is going to make it sound like the greatest thing ever. Im not accusing U of doing that here, I just want feedback from other regarding theroretical pros/cons. Another thing that comes to mind, it was no secret U were in the process of making this stuff, which make me wonder why people like Par, PA, and others are selling it as well. Obviously they have the ability to do so, so if its the best post cycle stuff out there, then why isnt anyone else making it?? Must be a reason...... I just want to make an "educated" decision in regards to products I purchase. Sound reasonable? Im not saying U are being defensive Bill, but dont be either, ive bought plenty of your products too with great results. I was hoping someone could inform me of the possible negative reasons for taking this post cycle. There has to be some.

**Dedicated1** · 10-09-2002, 02:52 PM

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...threadid=60493
This is why I was asking. Bill, Pat, and Jeff had a very interesting debate regarding this. Im not trying to stir the pot, but I think we would be better off if we got a clear cut understanding of where everyone stood on this and why. Even for an oral, if this stuff is as powerful as U claim, then I think it would be wise for us all to have a better understanding of what we are shoving down our throats. Not all of us have the knowledge and understanding of this stuff in the same light as those of U who are selling it. I think we would all appreciate the experts to explain where they stand on this. Like I said before, if it seems to be great stuff, with minimal problems, then ill be first in line to order some.

**w_llewellyn** · 10-09-2002, 02:57 PM

Originally posted by Dedicated1
LOL, i wasnt refering to the typo. Last I heard about 4-hydroxy was a huge arguement between U and your best friend Jeff M (whom U plan to marry one day). Im not debating the notion that it wouldnt be great for post cycle on estrogen, but I believe U and Jeff had a huge debate over other matters. I believe in regards to androgens (cant remembet the specifics), and whether or not it would be beneficial post cycle. I posted it, to get some feedback from others who might be educated on this. Of course anyone selling their stuff, is going to make it sound like the greatest thing ever. Im not accusing U of doing that here, I just want feedback from other regarding theroretical pros/cons. Another thing that comes to mind, it was no secret U were in the process of making this stuff, which make me wonder why people like Par, PA, and others are selling it as well. Obviously they have the ability to do so, so if its the best post cycle stuff out there, then why isnt anyone else making it?? Must be a reason...... I just want to make an "educated" decision in regards to products I purchase. Sound reasonable? Im not saying U are being defensive Bill, but dont be either, ive bought plenty of your products too with great results. I was hoping someone could inform me of the possible negative reasons for taking this post cycle. There has to be some.

I don't see any negatives post cycle. It is a weak PH that will help, at least partially, alleviate the post-cycle hypoandrogenic state. In the process it will also act as a strong anti-estrogen, and help a little with LH. It is no secret I am not a huge fan of AE's post cycle, but if that is what you are in to there is not a better one.

I don't see why anyone would not be interested in this compound. I know Pat mentioned he didn't think it could be sold legally, which it can be. So it was probably just overlooked for weaker ones that were "safe".

**w_llewellyn** · 10-09-2002, 03:02 PM

Also, there has never been a steroidal supplement (PH/anti-estrogen) studied as thoroughly in humans. There is no question it does exactly what we state it to do.

Please ignore Jeff's rants. He looked on Medline, found whatever odd studies or associations he could with formestane, and then jumped to all sorts of ridiculous conclusions as to what was happening. It is a steroidal suicide aromatase inhibitor with weak PH activity, period.

**Dedicated1** · 10-09-2002, 03:03 PM

OK, Bill answer me one more question and i'll stop bugging U about this. [b]Formestane decreases AR, increases ER,
does NOT increase androgen levels DESPITE decreasing estrogen levels.[\b] That a true statement or not??

**w_llewellyn** · 10-09-2002, 03:18 PM

Originally posted by Dedicated1
[B]OK, Bill answer me one more question and i'll stop bugging U about this. Formestane decreases AR, increases ER,
does NOT increase androgen levels DESPITE decreasing estrogen levels.[\b] That a true statement or not??

If decreased AR and increased ER concentrations occurred in the study Jeff cited, it was due to the effect formestane had on estrogen levels. Estrogen has been shown to increase AR proliferation for example, so it is an obvious effect when suppressed.

This is the problem with Jeff running around on Medline. He doesn't understand well what he reads, and jumps to conclusions that are incorrect in his excitement to find something damaging to repeat on a public message board.

Also, every study I have where it was given to men showed clear elevations in testosterone levels. The studies are all referenced on my site.

**Brock Landers** · 10-09-2002, 03:35 PM

bill,
please forgive me for my ignorance, but what will this most likely be comparable to? Nolvadex-stopping gyno related probs after they start, or an arimidex-preventing? or am i not even in the same ballpark potency wise? i know its too early to make determinations, but based on your studies and beliefs.
thank you

**w_llewellyn** · 10-09-2002, 04:18 PM

Originally posted by Brock Landers
bill,
please forgive me for my ignorance, but what will this most likely be comparable to? Nolvadex-stopping gyno related probs after they start, or an arimidex-preventing? or am i not even in the same ballpark potency wise? i know its too early to make determinations, but based on your studies and beliefs.
thank you

Nolvadex and Arimidex both prevent or mitigate side effects already present caused by estrogen. They just go about it via different mechanisms. Formastat would be more like Arimidex, preventing aromatization. Arimidex is a bit more potent no doubt, but you may find it interesting that at least one study found formestate to be an acceptable treatment option after arimidex had failed. They are certainly not worlds apart in their abilities to suppress estrogen.

**CrossTrainer** · 10-09-2002, 08:04 PM

does anyone know when will the formastat be hitting the shelf in health food stores? currantly im taking 6-oxo and i plan on continuing to take it for several weeks and taking it in cycles. do yous think anti estrogens will be affected like pro hormones if they make them ilegal?

**w_llewellyn** · 10-09-2002, 08:58 PM

Originally posted by CrossTrainer
does anyone know when will the formastat be hitting the shelf in health food stores? currantly im taking 6-oxo and i plan on continuing to take it for several weeks and taking it in cycles. do yous think anti estrogens will be affected like pro hormones if they make them ilegal?

2-3 weeks if all goes as planned. I don't think they will be in danger as the PH's are. But then I haven't read the bill yet, so.

**Androgenic** · 10-10-2002, 09:57 AM

I want more information here. Is there some situations where one over the other would be advantageous? Can we get a real breakdown? I was about ready to buy 6-oxo. Please inform me.

**w_llewellyn** · 10-10-2002, 10:23 AM

Originally posted by Androgenic
I want more information here. Is there some situations where one over the other would be advantageous? Can we get a real breakdown? I was about ready to buy 6-oxo. Please inform me.

I am not trying to slam Pat's product, seriously. I'm pretty impressed that he was able to synthesize it without blowing himself up in the process actually (sounded difficult). That said however, I knew of this compound 2 years ago, and was not super impressed at the time. In retrospect, it probably is more potent than I gave it credit for back then. But today, we have a clinically proven agent much more powerful available. Formestane is no doubt the strongest AE you'll ever buy over the counter. I see no reason to go for the weaker, more costly option. But that is just me.

**Androgenic** · 10-10-2002, 07:50 PM

Can anyone respond to this besides Bill. I appreciate his opinion, but I'd like to hear someone else comment on this. Is bill's product too new that no one has tried it? I know 6-oxo has received positive feedback. Any comments are welcome.

**laz** · 10-10-2002, 09:25 PM

So how good is this product for preventing gyno while on a ph cycle? And is this the same stuff as testobol by promatrix?

**Jonblaze639** · 10-10-2002, 10:49 PM

Originally posted by laz
So how good is this product for preventing gyno while on a ph cycle?

thats all i wanna know!
not worried about post cycle therapy but actually DURING a cycle, which product do you think is the best overall to prevent gyno etc.....viratase, 6oxo, formastat......say like a 4-ad, fina cycle or something? which one would u recommend to use to have a bit limilar results to like armidex.

thanx.

**windwords7** · 10-10-2002, 10:54 PM

Just my two cent blaze but the it appears that formastat is the more powerful estrogen eliminator, having an action similar to armidex which is of course the most powerful anti-e around.

6-OXO is still good but seems to be more at the level of Nolva. If it were me, I would want the one that acts like armidex to prevent or halt gyno. I would run Nolva after a run of armidex so if I really had my choice it would formastat first and then a month of 6OXO.

THIS IS JUST MY OPINION AND PREFERENCE!!

**Androgenic** · 10-11-2002, 08:45 AM

Your saying that Formastat would be better during a cycle and 6-oxo post-cycle?

**windwords7** · 10-11-2002, 08:52 AM

No I am saying that I would choose formastat to halt and reverse the onset of gyno and then run 6OXO to finish up the process.

If you are not prone to gyno I would run neither during a cycle.

If you want to keep estrogen down during a cycle to keep your leans gain then either would do the job but I would have to try both to see what I like better for that purpose.

**Jonblaze639** · 10-11-2002, 10:11 AM

Originally posted by windwords7
No I am saying that I would choose formastat to halt and reverse the onset of gyno

sweet, thats what i was looking for.

**bpdaddy** · 10-11-2002, 01:02 PM

What's the discount price gonna be Mr. L?

6OXO is $31.95 for 60 caps - should last 20 days.

What about yours?

**SirSavageX** · 10-11-2002, 02:04 PM

Originally posted by bpdaddy
What's the discount price gonna be Mr. L?

6OXO is $31.95 for 60 caps - should last 20 days.

What about yours?

I'll let you know when I receive my first order, since, naturally, I'll be the cheapest.

**Jonblaze639** · 10-11-2002, 02:25 PM

Originally posted by SirSavageX
I'll let you know when I receive my first order

how soon do you expect that to be?

**SirSavageX** · 10-11-2002, 02:33 PM

Soon after I receive the new pricing sheet from Leonard (wholesale manager).

**w_llewellyn** · 10-11-2002, 04:37 PM

Originally posted by bpdaddy
What's the discount price gonna be Mr. L?

6OXO is $31.95 for 60 caps - should last 20 days.

What about yours?

Retail is $44.95 for 90 caps, which will last for 30-45 days on average. I would guess the discounted price on most sites will be pretty close to 6-oxo, maybe even a little cheaper.

**bpdaddy** · 10-11-2002, 04:51 PM

Originally posted by w_llewellyn
Retail is $44.95 for 90 caps, which will last for 30-45 days on average. I would guess the discounted price on most sites will be pretty close to 6-oxo, maybe even a little cheaper.

Sounds really good.

Will it compare to 6OXO Test recovery ability?

Thread: Formastat VS 6oxo

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Formastat VS 6oxo

Re: Formastat VS 6oxo

Typo

FOUND IT

Re: Typo

One more question

Re: One more question

I'd like a side by side comparison

Re: I'd like a side by side comparison

will pat please respond to this

so let me see

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