Best Overall Ephedra Free Fat Burner?

just took my first dose of mitotropin about 2 hours ago.

So far my thoughts: EXCELLENT appiete(spelling) surpression. EXCELLENT energy levels.

So far, great!

Ive been taking Xenadrine RFA-x and it works phenomenol, but immediately after my workout I am absolutely drained. The energy level just isnt there. Maybe its just my intensity or has anyone else had this issue?

Hey guys! Want to help the newbiest of newbs?

For almost the past year, I've taken on a very healthy lifestyle, after a lifetime of crappy diet and little activity. I've lost around 50 pounds. I used to think the most beautiful female was soft and princess-like. Now, my inspiration is Jillian Michaels.

I want a ripped, lean look. I'm not looking to win bodybuilding competitions, just to be on the ripped side of "toned" and to have little excess fat.

Currently, I'm at those stubborn final 10-15 pounds. I want to burn fat and gain muscle. I do cardio 5-6 x a week and strength train 3 x a week. However, sometimes I wish I had more energy during my workouts and cardio. My diet is very, very clean. Besides a multi-vitamin and fishoil, the only supplement I take is protein powder.

I'm curious to try a fat burner, to see if it helps me blast those stubborn jiggly bits. I'm a 5'4", 134 pound, 18-year old female.

What would y'all recommend? What is the best way to take said product? What side effects should I expect? Any further tips?

Ive been off this forum for a while, what's the current best fat burner? Im currently on DREN , it started off crazy but im getting used to it, its still the best fat burner i've ever taken. Is there anything stronger than dren ??

I had also taken a break from this forum.

Now I'm not trying to insinuate anything so that's why I figured I'd post this here.

If anyone is interested in trading me a new 30 day set of REDuction for an almost new box of Gaspari Mitropin that I have only used for 2 days. Only 6 pills missing so if you have a couple of samples your good to go. I can pay shipping to you, you pay shipping to me.

Even steven.

This is very serious, I can take pictures of the box, my receipt that I just received this Friday 3/27 ordered 3/25 and would be willing to lay the pills out and take pictures.

Feel free to PM me. Do the math, I hope someone here is willing to trade.

Also, don't worry about my rep status. You can check my feedback and I just happened to hurt someones feelings here and he and his friends took it kind of hard. No big deal.

BTW, I will also require pictures and/or some form of confirmation that the new box of REDuction is being shipped to me. I will do the same for you.

Thanks.

[QUOTE=mmhoneycutt;309144411]Hey guys! Want to help the newbiest of newbs?

For almost the past year, I've taken on a very healthy lifestyle, after a lifetime of crappy diet and little activity. I've lost around 50 pounds. I used to think the most beautiful female was soft and princess-like. Now, my inspiration is Jillian Michaels.

I want a ripped, lean look. I'm not looking to win bodybuilding competitions, just to be on the ripped side of "toned" and to have little excess fat.

Currently, I'm at those stubborn final 10-15 pounds. I want to burn fat and gain muscle. I do cardio 5-6 x a week and strength train 3 x a week. However, sometimes I wish I had more energy during my workouts and cardio. My diet is very, very clean. Besides a multi-vitamin and fishoil, the only supplement I take is protein powder.

I'm curious to try a fat burner, to see if it helps me blast those stubborn jiggly bits. I'm a 5'4", 134 pound, 18-year old female.

What would y'all recommend? What is the best way to take said product? What side effects should I expect? Any further tips?[/QUOTE]

Obviously diet and training will have the biggest impact on your fat loss.

Fat burners can definitely help you get past a fat loss plateau and give you energy. You just have to be cautious if you are sensitive to stims.

You should check out SportPharma's Thermadrene:

[url]http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/sport/therma.html[/url]

bb.com is running a crazy buy 2 get 1 FREE deal on it right now (for a limited time).

[quote]Obviously diet and training will have the biggest impact on your fat loss.

Fat burners can definitely help you get past a fat loss plateau and give you energy. You just have to be cautious if you are sensitive to stims.

You should check out SportPharma's Thermadrene:

[url]http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/sport/therma.html[/url]

bb.com is running a crazy buy 2 get 1 FREE deal on it right now (for a limited time).[/quote]

Oh yes! I'm not expecting to suddenly be able to stop working out and eat bon-bons all day. I just think that it would be a possibly good supplement to my preexisting routine.

I'm not sensitive to stims.

What is your overall opinion of Thermadrene?

[QUOTE=mmhoneycutt;309270951]Oh yes! I'm not expecting to suddenly be able to stop working out and eat bon-bons all day. I just think that it would be a possibly good supplement to my preexisting routine.

I'm not sensitive to stims.

What is your overall opinion of Thermadrene?[/QUOTE]

Thermadrene is a very good, basic fat burner. It does not have all the bells and whistles that some formulas have but for the price it's tough to beat.

ive taken REDuction AM/Pm, Thermogenix 2, and now Mitotropin.

Mitotropin is by far the best. BY FAR.

no offense controlled labs, i love your purple wratth.

[QUOTE=mmhoneycutt;309144411]Hey guys! Want to help the newbiest of newbs?

For almost the past year, I've taken on a very healthy lifestyle, after a lifetime of crappy diet and little activity. I've lost around 50 pounds. I used to think the most beautiful female was soft and princess-like. Now, my inspiration is Jillian Michaels.

I want a ripped, lean look. I'm not looking to win bodybuilding competitions, just to be on the ripped side of "toned" and to have little excess fat.

Currently, I'm at those stubborn final 10-15 pounds. I want to burn fat and gain muscle. I do cardio 5-6 x a week and strength train 3 x a week. However, sometimes I wish I had more energy during my workouts and cardio. My diet is very, very clean. Besides a multi-vitamin and fishoil, the only supplement I take is protein powder.

I'm curious to try a fat burner, to see if it helps me blast those stubborn jiggly bits. I'm a 5'4", 134 pound, 18-year old female.

What would y'all recommend? What is the best way to take said product? What side effects should I expect? Any further tips?[/QUOTE]

try a free sample of REDuction, you will love it

finished meltdown, learned it was stomach fat only, not all around supposedly. Bought AM/PM reduction. anxious to try it soon.

[QUOTE=CONTROLLED LABS;309553401]try a free sample of REDuction, you will love it[/QUOTE]
Hi, ive currently been using Purple wraath with white flood... First energy supplement ive used and i must say WOW its amazing... Excellent for long workouts, i feel that i can just keep going and going.. and especially on long 20km runs that i do.

One question however, In Australia you cannot buy Reduction any reason for this?

anyone interested, animal packs is on sale at vitamin shoppe... 44 packet container for $32

I tried Lipo 6X & Hydroxycut Hardcore and they both worked for me:
Lipo 6X : Works aggressivly, almost always made me jittery and usually couldn't sleep early. But it did its work, gave me energy (pretty unreliable/unstable energy though, got extremely tired sometimes at once), lost a lot of weight, took away the appetite and all pretty fast too.
Hydroxycut Hardcore: Works a bit slower then Lipo 6X, but it does its work nicely. It gives me huge energy all day long, my weight is going down and the appetite is reasonable. But compared to Lipo 6X, its pretty slow.

I'm trying to order CL REDuction now, but its almost impossible to find in Belgium or Netherlands. (And I'm never ever in my life ordering from US again since I had to pay 120€ tax for something I bought for 400€ and 50€ tax for something I bought for 30€!!)

[QUOTE=enolacs;309955111]Care to explain, any reps wanna get in on this?[/QUOTE]

i cant explain cuz i dunno the details but one of the sales reps at vitamine shoppe was going over the ingredients and informed me of that. The VPX redline pills are for overall fat loss and Meltdown is just for stomach fat. He seemed knowledgeable about everything else I asked so I took his word for it.

[QUOTE=majormods;310009211]i cant explain cuz i dunno the details but one of the sales reps at vitamine shoppe was going over the ingredients and informed me of that. The VPX redline pills are for overall fat loss and Meltdown is just for stomach fat. He seemed knowledgeable about everything else I asked so I took his word for it.[/QUOTE]

That doesn't make any sense at all. Unless it is a topical or injected formula I dont think it is possible for a product to target a specific area of the body. Once a drug enters the blood stream it is distributed throghout the whole body (basic pharmacokinetics) so really it would be impossible to for an oral supplement to only target only belly fat.

Combine that with the fact that meltdown contains many ingredients found in other fat burners and it is obvious that the sales rep was misinformed.

To my best understanding Redline caps are more energy/ metabolism boosting oriented wheras Meltdown is more euphoric/ appetite reduction oriented.

Just my two cents : )

[QUOTE=majormods;309568191]finished meltdown, learned it was stomach fat only, not all around supposedly. Bought AM/PM reduction. anxious to try it soon.[/QUOTE]

dude whoever told you that had absolutely NO CLUE WHATSOEVER what they were talking about. for real.

anything that helps speed up your metabolism is going to help you reduce bodyfat percentages all around, not just "belly fat." it's actually quite impossible for a fat-burner or weight-loss product to affect localized areas, as much as they'd like for you to believe it. I know that there's at least one or two products out there (ex. Relacore) that say they are made specifically for "belly fat" but it's a bunch of BS. this applies to MELTDOWN, and any/every fat-burner out there that helps speed up your metabolism: none of them affect local areas. they merely speed up your metabolism (as well as do other things, such as curb your cravings, etc) which in turn helps your body burn more calories than it normally does... everywhere. not just your belly.

As far as products specifically, I love how a new product gets released (ex. Mitotropin) and all of a sudden everyone says its amazing. before there can even be any long-term judgement on it. does anyone even know what's IN this product? aside from what it says.. if it's a proprietary blend, or a bunch of ingredients renamed as one "trademarked name" ingredient...? absolutely ridiculous. if you're a fanboy of Gaspari, that's one thing. but don't tell us how amazing it is if the thing just got released and you've been using it for like a week. I'd like to know real, genuine feedback.

I know from firsthand use that DREN by MHP is absolutely excellent. serving size is one capsule a day, but I've known people (within MHP, too) that take two capsules a day for better results. that product is insane. also, MELTDOWN by VPX has been out for a while, but it's still one of the better fat burners out there. if you haven't already, you should give it a try. for my money, both Hydroxycut HC and Lipo-6X are just wayyyyy too much money and wayyyyy too many capsules per day to take. both are rip-offs.

[QUOTE=XnewcastleX;310028431]dude whoever told you that had absolutely NO CLUE WHATSOEVER what they were talking about. for real.

anything that helps speed up your metabolism is going to help you reduce bodyfat percentages all around, not just "belly fat." it's actually quite impossible for a fat-burner or weight-loss product to affect localized areas, as much as they'd like for you to believe it. I know that there's at least one or two products out there (ex. Relacore) that say they are made specifically for "belly fat" but it's a bunch of BS. this applies to MELTDOWN, and any/every fat-burner out there that helps speed up your metabolism: none of them affect local areas. they merely speed up your metabolism (as well as do other things, such as curb your cravings, etc) which in turn helps your body burn more calories than it normally does... everywhere. not just your belly.

As far as products specifically, I love how a new product gets released (ex. Mitotropin) and all of a sudden everyone says its amazing. before there can even be any long-term judgement on it. does anyone even know what's IN this product? aside from what it says.. if it's a proprietary blend, or a bunch of ingredients renamed as one "trademarked name" ingredient...? absolutely ridiculous. if you're a fanboy of Gaspari, that's one thing. but don't tell us how amazing it is if the thing just got released and you've been using it for like a week. I'd like to know real, genuine feedback.

I know from firsthand use that DREN by MHP is absolutely excellent. serving size is one capsule a day, but I've known people (within MHP, too) that take two capsules a day for better results. that product is insane. also, MELTDOWN by VPX has been out for a while, but it's still one of the better fat burners out there. if you haven't already, you should give it a try. for my money, both Hydroxycut HC and Lipo-6X are just wayyyyy too much money and wayyyyy too many capsules per day to take. both are rip-offs.[/QUOTE]

DREN KICKS ASS!!!

CL reps, i've been taking am/pm, loving it so far but i got a question, do you think i can stack pm with melatonin? i usually take around 1.5mg.

IMO, the DCP/Leviathan Reloaded stack and ReCreate by USPLabs. I also enjoy combining Avant Labs' Napalm with liquid Clenbuterol. I really like how the orals work synergistically with the topicals.

has anyone tried out Universal Ripped Fast? is there going to be any negative side effects if i take this along with the whey protein and multivitamins?

[QUOTE=naturalguy;309236021]Obviously diet and training will have the biggest impact on your fat loss.

Fat burners can definitely help you get past a fat loss plateau and give you energy. You just have to be cautious if you are sensitive to stims.

You should check out SportPharma's Thermadrene:

[url]http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/sport/therma.html[/url]

bb.com is running a crazy buy 2 get 1 FREE deal on it right now (for a limited time).[/QUOTE]

Perfect time to stock up on a no frills fat-burner!

[QUOTE=naturalguy;309271501]Thermadrene is a very good, basic fat burner. It does not have all the bells and whistles that some formulas have but for the price it's tough to beat.[/QUOTE]

Sometimes it's just that-- bells and whistles and nothing more. Getting diet in check, your training routine down, and visualizing your goals is first and foremost. Once you take care of the basics, then look into a fat-burner. With Thermadrene, we don't promise overnight results b/c that's just not realistic for long term success but with a solid diet and training routine, you can expect Thermadrene to help enhance the fat loss and get you to where you want to be.

thinking about taking REDuction. i'm also using ON Vassive-NO. will they mix well together or should i cut out the NO?

[QUOTE=majormods;309568191]finished meltdown, learned it was stomach fat only, not all around supposedly. Bought AM/PM reduction. anxious to try it soon.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Kaije;310227681]thinking about taking REDuction. i'm also using ON Vassive-NO. will they mix well together or should i cut out the NO?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Nivea;309975921]I tried Lipo 6X & Hydroxycut Hardcore and they both worked for me:
Lipo 6X : Works aggressivly, almost always made me jittery and usually couldn't sleep early. But it did its work, gave me lots of energy, lost a lot of weight, took away the appetite and all pretty fast too.
Hydroxycut Hardcore: Works a bit slower then Lipo 6X, but it does its work nicely. It gives me energy, my weight is going down and the appetite is reasonable. But compared to Lipo 6X, its pretty slow.

I'm trying to order CL REDuction now, but its almost impossible to find in Belgium or Netherlands. (And I'm never ever in my life ordering from US again since I had to pay 120? tax for something I bought for 400? and 50? tax for something I bought for 30?!!)[/QUOTE]

you guys will love REDuction, it has been flying lately :)

[QUOTE=ryanwade;309618661]Hi, ive currently been using Purple wraath with white flood... First energy supplement ive used and i must say WOW its amazing... Excellent for long workouts, i feel that i can just keep going and going.. and especially on long 20km runs that i do.

One question however, In Australia you cannot buy Reduction any reason for this?[/QUOTE]

awesome to hear.

in regards to REDUction in Australia. some of the ingredients cant be sold down there, so we modified it and it will be selling as a flavored powder down there in about 6-8 week (just shipped to them today)

[QUOTE=barook;310042461]CL reps, i've been taking am/pm, loving it so far but i got a question, do you think i can stack pm with melatonin? i usually take around 1.5mg.[/QUOTE]
i wouldnt add any other sleep aids. REDuction PM is already awesome for that

One word of caution for those starting Mitotropin. If your diet and training and on the money then up your water intake. And by I up, I mean double it. I was drinking about a gallon of water a day. Now I upped it to two gallons and that took care of the dryness. Unfortunately for me I happen to also take some allergy medicine that really dries me up so I was experiencing dry eyes and throat. No matter how much water I drank. I had to stop taking it. Nothing wrong with the product, it just doesn't suit me. I've been lucky enough to trade it out with someone here for some protein. I was hoping to REDuction but that's ok.

I've taken three boxes of REDuction over the last six months and I hardly noticed anything. I didn't get jittery nor did I have any problem with being extra dry. It is a solid addition and I'll be ordering some more soon. It definitely has helped me get passed some barriers.

Thanks again, CL. They are truly the only name brand product I believe whose performance exceeds their value.

Don't be fooled though, none of these fat burners are going to get you as lean as solid diet and training will. They are great addition to periodically get you over a hump or past a barrier, but if your living on these so you can eat like crap then your going to be greatly disappointed in the long run.

[QUOTE=CONTROLLED LABS;310230861]you guys will love REDuction, it has been flying lately :)[/QUOTE]

We'll love it, IF we can get it :D Can you help me find an online store in Belgium or Netherlands, or a normal store in Belgium?

Tried hydroxy it made me jittery and wife started calling me a lunatic so i stopped using it. Got some lipo 6 today lets see how this works.

[QUOTE=Chococat;310336291]

I've taken three boxes of REDuction over the last six months and I hardly noticed anything. I didn't get jittery nor did I have any problem with being extra dry. It is a solid addition and I'll be ordering some more soon. It definitely has helped me get passed some barriers.

Thanks again, CL. They are truly the only name brand product I believe whose performance exceeds their value.

[/QUOTE]
WOW, thanks for the feedback and support :)
[QUOTE=Nivea;310440331]We'll love it, IF we can get it :D Can you help me find an online store in Belgium or Netherlands, or a normal store in Belgium?[/QUOTE]

contact our distributor there, you can find them here : [url]http://controlledlabs.com/retailers.php[/url]

[QUOTE=jtexasboyz;310448111]Tried hydroxy it made me jittery and wife started calling me a lunatic so i stopped using it. Got some lipo 6 today lets see how this works.[/QUOTE]


I haven't felt jittery once with hydroxycut and lipo 6x made me jittery almost every day.


contacted the benelux distributor of cl, lets hope they can help me :)

I have been on the Reduction+LX stack

so far I have experienced great results... i was between 215-220... im now between 205-210

I started with an intense workout plan... but the last couple weeks... i havent worked out much...

its been all work and school, and i am still reaping these benefits.

Thought my diet is pretty strict. I eat high fiber oatmeal in the morning, grilled chicken w/ a banana a few hours later. a sandwhich with high fiber bread a few hours later... then grilled chicken with steamed veggies as my final meal.

and my job requires me to move around quite a bit.

PS. is fiber supposed to make you this gassy? i take in about 30+ grams a day.

Mitotropin.

mitotropin!!!!!!!

I was eating a lot of fiber in my diet and I was real gassy too man no worries. I always felt bloated and stuff, lowered my intake to about 20g per day and now I feel a lot better!

[QUOTE=theninja86;311718141]I was eating a lot of fiber in my diet and I was real gassy too man no worries. I always felt bloated and stuff, lowered my intake to about 20g per day and now I feel a lot better![/QUOTE]

dude, thats what i was thinking. i feel bloated and it seems like it makes my gut bigger.

however, isnt the more fiber, the better?

I've used lipo6 a couple of times with great results and was considering trying lipo6x. Has anyone used both products and is it worth trying the lipo6x or should I just stick with the original?

[QUOTE=EatenByAlgae;311742531]dude, thats what i was thinking. i feel bloated and it seems like it makes my gut bigger.

however, isnt the more fiber, the better?[/QUOTE]
Not necessarily, too much fiber can be bad for you. If you're in excess of 50g per day you can actually cause an intestinal obstruction. Just limit yourself and you'll be fine, too much and it can also slow or inhibit mineral and vitamin absorption.

You don't seem like youre all too crazy on the fiber though so I'm sure you'll live! If you were drinking Metamucil like it was water then I'd say worry haha.

has anyone ever used MAN Scorch or how it compares to meltdown or reduction, result wise? any help is welcomed :)

[QUOTE=Vanderdroz;312275521]has anyone ever used MAN Scorch or how it compares to meltdown or reduction, result wise? any help is welcomed :)[/QUOTE]

I did a bottle a scorch stacked with vaporize, I wasn't that impressed. In all honesty though my diet should have been better. the best results ive ever gotten have been from lipo 6...i havent tried the reduction or meltdown

Honestly, I've tried SO many different thermos having been in the military and all. In my opinion, which you may or may not agree with, Leviathan Reloaded has been the best. I'm on it right now and it makes me feel great throughout the day and it actually helps raise test levels too so you're building muscle as you burn fat. Is it just me or does that sound pretty damn spiffy?

Just got done with a full cycle of Reduction. I have to say I enjoyed the fact that you only take the pills in the morning and at night, instead of throughout the day. The morning pills make my heart pound before I eat breakfast, and seemed to get me through the day well. The PM pills are gnarly! I had some of the most intense dreams (of all kinds), that I still remember clearly! My overall satisfaction with the product is 8.5/10, results through the first bottle got me down 10lbs. I may buy another cycle, not sure yet.

[QUOTE=ridemx445;312572371]Just got done with a full cycle of Reduction. I have to say I enjoyed the fact that you only take the pills in the morning and at night, instead of throughout the day. The morning pills make my heart pound before I eat breakfast, and seemed to get me through the day well. The PM pills are gnarly! I had some of the most intense dreams (of all kinds), that I still remember clearly! My overall satisfaction with the product is 8.5/10, results through the first bottle got me down 10lbs. I may buy another cycle, not sure yet.[/QUOTE]

WOW, spectacular results on REDuction for sure. are you trying a second box?

I'm about to get my Reduction, I was wondering what that intensive dreaming hype is all about :D I haven't had a dream in years (at least 1 that I remember when I get up), so I'll see if it works :p
But I'm wondering if its healthy long term?

I've been stuck on 92.5kg with Hydroxycut for about 2 weeks now, so I'll see if it works or not soon enough :)

Hey, Nobody has said anything about Thermolife's Dicana
[url]http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/thermo/di.html[/url]

[b]Any comments/opinions? Experience[/b]
Dicana™ Proprietary Blend: 2000mcg *
(A Proprietary Combination Of Patent Pending Diiodothyroacetic Acid Isomer)

Ginger CO2-Extract 20% Gingerols 166mcg *
Coleus Forskohlii 20% Forskolin

Diiodothyroacetic acid is a direct naturally occurring metabolite of T3, Triac, and T2, (1,2,3) which was never investigated or used as a fat loss aid before ThermoLife introduced Dicana. Diiodothyronines and their metabolites, like DIAC, retain the calorigenic and antilipidemic effects of thyroid analogues (4,5). Diiodothyroacetic acid in particular has been found to have very strong effects in lowering "bad" LDL cholesterol and reducing blood lipid peroxidation(6).

One of the prime concerns regarding using thyroid mimetics to promote fat loss is the danger of thyroid suppression. However it has been identified that only the 3,5 analogues of diiodothyronines (and thus their metabolites which retain the same key structure-activity characteristics regarding thyroidomimetic action) and not their 3,3' isomers suppress TSH levels, leading to hypothyreodism(7). The new version Dicana contains only the 3,3' isomer of diiodothyroacetic acid, thus minimizing thyroid suppression fears

[QUOTE=StillWorkin;313125731]Hey, Nobody has said anything about Thermolife's Dicana
[url]http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/thermo/di.html[/url]

[b]Any comments/opinions? Experience[/b]
Dicana? Proprietary Blend: 2000mcg *
(A Proprietary Combination Of Patent Pending Diiodothyroacetic Acid Isomer)

Ginger CO2-Extract 20% Gingerols 166mcg *
Coleus Forskohlii 20% Forskolin

Diiodothyroacetic acid is a direct naturally occurring metabolite of T3, Triac, and T2, (1,2,3) which was never investigated or used as a fat loss aid before ThermoLife introduced Dicana. Diiodothyronines and their metabolites, like DIAC, retain the calorigenic and antilipidemic effects of thyroid analogues (4,5). Diiodothyroacetic acid in particular has been found to have very strong effects in lowering "bad" LDL cholesterol and reducing blood lipid peroxidation(6).

One of the prime concerns regarding using thyroid mimetics to promote fat loss is the danger of thyroid suppression. However it has been identified that only the 3,5 analogues of diiodothyronines (and thus their metabolites which retain the same key structure-activity characteristics regarding thyroidomimetic action) and not their 3,3' isomers suppress TSH levels, leading to hypothyreodism(7). The new version Dicana contains only the 3,3' isomer of diiodothyroacetic acid, thus minimizing thyroid suppression fears[/QUOTE]

i would assume no one mentioned it because it's horrible

[QUOTE=ws26champny;313168761]i would assume no one mentioned it because it's horrible[/QUOTE]
Ok, could you be more specific? Like why?

[QUOTE=Nivea;313100701]I'm about to get my Reduction, I was wondering what that intensive dreaming hype is all about :D I haven't had a dream in years (at least 1 that I remember when I get up), so I'll see if it works :p
But I'm wondering if its healthy long term?

I've been stuck on 92.5kg with Hydroxycut for about 2 weeks now, so I'll see if it works or not soon enough :)[/QUOTE]

dreams are wicked vivid, you will love it :) (no need to cycle it, its perfectly fine)

I've always heard that fat burners were bad because of potential dmg to heart, but is that limited to the EC stack?
What i wanna know is, of all the fat burners in this thread, im guessing ephedra free, are basically stims? So they help get your heart beating a little faster when you hit the gym? is that it? (aside from appetite suppression)

Are some more extreme in getting the heart to beat faster? and is that basically what it comes down to for fat burners, getting the heart to beat faster?

[QUOTE=CONTROLLED LABS;313202021]dreams are wicked vivid, you will love it :) (no need to cycle it, its perfectly fine)[/QUOTE]

Must agree on the Reduction, and the full extreme stack. First cycle of AM/PM loss of 6 lbs, Just started Reduction AM/PM, Blue Up, Blue Gene, Purple Wraath, White Blood, White Flood, Green Buldge.

[QUOTE=ws26champny;313168761]i would assume no one mentioned it because it's horrible[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=StillWorkin;313125731]Hey, Nobody has said anything about Thermolife's Dicana
[url]http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/thermo/di.html[/url]

[b]Any comments/opinions? Experience[/b]
Dicana? Proprietary Blend: 2000mcg *
(A Proprietary Combination Of Patent Pending Diiodothyroacetic Acid Isomer)

Ginger CO2-Extract 20% Gingerols 166mcg *
Coleus Forskohlii 20% Forskolin

Diiodothyroacetic acid is a direct naturally occurring metabolite of T3, Triac, and T2, (1,2,3) which was never investigated or used as a fat loss aid before ThermoLife introduced Dicana. Diiodothyronines and their metabolites, like DIAC, retain the calorigenic and antilipidemic effects of thyroid analogues (4,5). Diiodothyroacetic acid in particular has been found to have very strong effects in lowering "bad" LDL cholesterol and reducing blood lipid peroxidation(6).

One of the prime concerns regarding using thyroid mimetics to promote fat loss is the danger of thyroid suppression. However it has been identified that only the 3,5 analogues of diiodothyronines (and thus their metabolites which retain the same key structure-activity characteristics regarding thyroidomimetic action) and not their 3,3' isomers suppress TSH levels, leading to hypothyreodism(7). The new version Dicana contains only the 3,3' isomer of diiodothyroacetic acid, thus minimizing thyroid suppression fears[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=StillWorkin;313180501]Ok, could you be more specific? Like why?[/QUOTE]

^^This

[QUOTE=StillWorkin;313747391]^^This[/QUOTE]

I believe it is a T3 uncoupler similar to Mitotropin.