Question for the pro vaxxers: Do you believe in vax mandates? Why?
Also, at what point will you start to believe the vax isn't working? When the govt admits it? Big pharma?
Genuinely curious questions.
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Question for the pro vaxxers: Do you believe in vax mandates? Why?
Also, at what point will you start to believe the vax isn't working? When the govt admits it? Big pharma?
Genuinely curious questions.
[QUOTE=TryingBB;1644346543]Only place I have heard about developing “real immunity” by getting the virus is here on this forum. Seriously saying if you have reliable source where I can read this, please share. Till them I’m a vaxxer , gonna keep my mask on and yes I’M a puzzy enuff to say I’m gonna get the booster a month or two after and when it comes out.
I think there are people getting covid a second time.
I actually met a lady last week who got it in December and got delta last month.
She said she’s getting vaccinated cuz she’s had enough of it already (she recovered on her own without hospitalization)[/QUOTE]
Cleveland clinic did a huge study. The results showed that antibodies from the people who got Covid are far more than those who just got vaccinated. Look it up.
[QUOTE=_zman;1644391243]Question for the pro vaxxers: Do you believe in vax mandates? Why?
[/QUOTE]
The issue is when people start calling everything a "mandate".
If businesses want to exclude you for not being vaccinated, that's not a mandate. If you can't go to school, still not a mandate. If your employer only wants to hire vaccinated people, not a mandate.
It is completely unethical to force someone to take a vaccine, but it's not wrong for other people to desire limited exposure to them and set up structures accordingly.
That being said governments (state or federal or local doesn't matter) forcing businesses to only accept certain customers (whether it's in the name of public health or not is irrelevant) is the textbook definition of government overreach.
I don't think the vaccine is bad at all I got vaccinated first chance I got. But (in my libertarian world that only exists in dreams) the government doesn't have the right to tell me to only let vaccinated customers enter. I may choose to decide that for myself.
Florida has the opposite (but also anti-libertarian) problem. DeSantis effectively banned vaccine based entry for businesses.
Just let business owners decide for themselves.
[QUOTE=Plateauplower;1644394043]Cass - Might want to edit out the voter fraud thing from your post before that my pillow guy comes knocking on your door :p
"Proven" election fraud ITT the craken has awakened :D[/QUOTE]
No the signature was mine..pillow guy if you're listening..please no jail time.
[QUOTE=Reliance012;1644385843] If you’d like to talk the science of any of my post.[/QUOTE]
I don't give a shyt about your nonsense.
Just ran 3 errands and starting tomorrow, masks are required again in
1.Best Buy
2. Costco
3. Giant Food supermarket.
booooooo
[QUOTE=x-trainer ben;1644398163]Just ran 3 errands and starting tomorrow, masks are required again in
1.Best Buy
2. Costco
3. Giant Food supermarket.
booooooo[/QUOTE]
I see people put the masks on at the door and just take them off after. People will try to police you but they can't really do chit about it. Costco might be the only place where an employee might ask you to leave.
[QUOTE=7Seconds;1644395153]The issue is when people start calling everything a "mandate".
If businesses want to exclude you for not being vaccinated, that's not a mandate. If you can't go to school, still not a mandate. If your employer only wants to hire vaccinated people, not a mandate.
It is completely unethical to force someone to take a vaccine, but it's not wrong for other people to desire limited exposure to them and set up structures accordingly.
That being said governments (state or federal or local doesn't matter) forcing businesses to only accept certain customers (whether it's in the name of public health or not is irrelevant) is the textbook definition of government overreach.
I don't think the vaccine is bad at all I got vaccinated first chance I got. But (in my libertarian world that only exists in dreams) the government doesn't have the right to tell me to only let vaccinated customers enter. I may choose to decide that for myself.
Florida has the opposite (but also anti-libertarian) problem. DeSantis effectively banned vaccine based entry for businesses.
Just let business owners decide for themselves.[/QUOTE]
Get the vax or leave your place of employment. Get the vax or you're not allowed to go to the gym, entertainment, or shop for food.
How is that not a mandate/mandatory?
Not to mention the vax might be doing more harm than good because of accelerated mutation. Studies are showing this to be true. So vaxers are actually causing more harm than unvaxed.
[QUOTE=TolerantLactose;1644353103][url]https://twitter.com/RanIsraeli/status/1423322271503028228[/url]
"95% of the severe patients are vaccinated".
"85-90% of the hospitalizations are in Fully vaccinated people."
"We are opening more and more COVID wards."
"The effectiveness of the vaccine is waning/fading out"
(Dr. Kobi Haviv, earlier today on Chanel 13
@newsisrael13 )
A booster will fix that right up.[/QUOTE]
When you see something so ridiculous, especially when you don't speak the language, you should step back and think about it.
It is true that the effectiveness is going to decrease the higher the prevalence of resistant strains becomes, but
Here's what Israel has done since January:
[img]https://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9354393&d=1628275500[/img]
[img]https://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9354403&d=1628275524[/img]
[img]https://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9354413&d=1628275537[/img]
[QUOTE=_zman;1644401133]
Get the vax or leave your place of employment. Get the vax or you're not allowed to go to the gym, entertainment, or shop for food.
How is that not a mandate/mandatory?[/quote]
It's not a mandate. It's a series of individual decisions.
[quote]Not to mention the vax might be doing more harm than good because of accelerated mutation. Studies are showing this to be true. So vaxers are actually causing more harm than unvaxed.[/QUOTE]
No idea. My knowledge on vaccines is a bit limited so I am going to have to leave that discussion for others.
[QUOTE=_zman;1644401133]I see people put the masks on at the door and just take them off after. People will try to police you but they can't really do chit about it. Costco might be the only place where an employee might ask you to leave.
Get the vax or leave your place of employment. Get the vax or you're not allowed to go to the gym, entertainment, or shop for food.
How is that not a mandate/mandatory?
Not to mention the vax might be doing more harm than good because of accelerated mutation. Studies are showing this to be true. So vaxers are actually causing more harm than unvaxed.[/QUOTE]
Exactly what studies?
This is all a moot point, I guess. [b]According to President Biden, EVERYONE in America (including the illegals) are all vaccinated at his count of 350 million people vaccinated...[/b]
[url]https://hannity.com/media-room/biden-says-350-million-americans-have-been-vaccinated-and-theyre-doing-fine/?utm_source=hootsuite[/url]
[QUOTE=Reliance012;1644404833]Exactly what studies?[/QUOTE]
Try searching for information on virus mutations with vaccines. Don't google it though. Your search results will be censored.
United Airlines announced that all U.S.-based employees will be required to receive a COVID-19 vaccine and upload their vaccination card to a company site by this fall.
[QUOTE=_zman;1644406473]Try searching for information on virus mutations with vaccines. Don't google it though. Your search results will be censored.[/QUOTE]
This sounds legit.
[QUOTE=_zman;1644401133]Not to mention the vax might be doing more harm than good because of accelerated mutation. Studies are showing this to be true. So vaxers are actually causing more harm than unvaxed.[/QUOTE]
That's an interesting statement.
"Studies are showing this to be true."
A vaccine can potentially lead to the propagation of mutations because it causes the immune system to hinder the wild type's replication in the vaccinated host. Of course that's going to be true when you have partial immunity, but we don't actually know if we're applying any evolutionary pressure to the current mutations with the vaccines, and a person who actually caught the wild type virus will do the same thing. For example, catching alpha then delta. You're immune system will favor a delta mutation that's even more resistant to your immune response to alpha and delta. It may be that you get slightly better cross strain immunity after an infection, and I suspect that's true, but I haven't looked into it.
History hasn't show viral escape to be nearly as concerning as bacterial escape, and happily, none of your three sentences is true. We don't accelerate mutations with a vaccine. They occur naturally and the less replication you have taking place in your body, the less chances will exist for dangerous mutations to occur. So "vaxers" aren't doing more harm, they're just getting sick less, going to the hospital less, dying less, and being a smaller burden on their tax paying neighbors.
I Googled Cassie and this is what I got:
[img]https://media.giphy.com/media/4dXIaidp7vpzXU5YxN/giphy.gif [/img]
[img]https://media.giphy.com/media/10w2kccsAdggZG/giphy.gif[/img]
I can't post the others I found or I'd get banned. But, I be like :rolleyes:
[QUOTE=CommitmentRulz;1644405823]This is all a moot point, I guess. [b]According to President Biden, EVERYONE in America (including the illegals) are all vaccinated at his count of 350 million people vaccinated...[/b]
[url]https://hannity.com/media-room/biden-says-350-million-americans-have-been-vaccinated-and-theyre-doing-fine/?utm_source=hootsuite[/url][/QUOTE]
Meh. Quick Google search shows that he simply reported the total doses administered rather than the number of people vaccinated. If President Trump made that mistake, his supporters wouldn't even notice and the other side would be through the roof using this as proof he's not fit for office. This is just theatre.
[QUOTE=JustTheDad;1644403233]When you see something so ridiculous, especially when you don't speak the language, you should step back and think about it.
It is true that the effectiveness is going to decrease the higher the prevalence of resistant strains becomes, but
Here's what Israel has done since January:
[img]https://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9354393&d=1628275500[/img]
[img]https://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9354403&d=1628275524[/img]
[img]https://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9354413&d=1628275537[/img][/QUOTE]
That's pretty much the case worldwide. I expect it to spike in the fall regardless of vaccination rates or whatever strain is floating about.
Coronavirus gonna coronavirus. And govt gonna govt.
[QUOTE=TolerantLactose;1644415663]That's pretty much the case worldwide. I expect it to spike in the fall regardless of vaccination rates or whatever strain is floating about.
Coronavirus gonna coronavirus. And govt gonna govt.[/QUOTE]
There’s a lot of factors that go into models. The cdc has done a bad job with covid. Florida is in what would be winter of Midwest. It’s high because they are 100% giving zero fuks. It’ll burn out and be done while many places struggle. That is what will happen.
[img]https://i.imgur.com/QNIFj4v.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/WoiDCcV.png[/img]
[QUOTE=_zman;1644401133]I see people put the masks on at the door and just take them off after. People will try to police you but they can't really do chit about it. Costco might be the only place where an employee might ask you to leave.
Get the vax or leave your place of employment. Get the vax or you're not allowed to go to the gym, entertainment, or shop for food.
How is that not a mandate/mandatory?
[b]Not to mention the vax might be doing more harm than good because of accelerated mutation. Studies are showing this to be true. So vaxers are actually causing more harm than unvaxed.[/b][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=mtpockets;1644438853][img]https://i.imgur.com/QNIFj4v.jpg[/img]
[/QUOTE]
They missed
“-to the vaxxed are killing the unvaxxed”
This is going to be a very long never ending thing. We’re just gonna have to accept this as the new normal and keep marching I think. There is no way pleasing 7,874,965,825 (world population 2021) people and bringing them to the same page - and who knows even if the “page” is the right page or not.
I’ve about had enough of this fuking crap and started to loose my chit
[QUOTE=TryingBB;1644444723]They missed
“-to the vaxxed are killing the unvaxxed”
This is going to be a very long never ending thing. We’re just gonna have to accept this as the new normal and keep marching I think. There is no way pleasing 7,874,965,825 (world population 2021) people and bringing them to the same page - and who knows even if the “page” is the right page or not.
I’ve about had enough of this fuking crap and started to loose my chit[/QUOTE]
The socialists Only need fool the people that Covid is going to go away as long as it takes to accomplish socialism/communism. That’s when all hell will break loose.
[QUOTE=Kraken;1644445083]The socialists Only need fool the people that Covid is going to go away as long as it takes to accomplish socialism/communism. That’s when all hell will break loose.[/QUOTE]
This is exactly the type of stuff I’m talking about…never ending opinions and so called “agendas”
With the 1918 Pandemic, from the time it showed up, went thru several waves and was no longer in the news was like 3-4 years, we still have a ways to go vaccine or not, its time we just got on with life. (Im double vacced...phizer...and will take any booster if it comes out)
One in every five Oregonians who contracted Covid 19 in July were fully vaccinated.
[b][url]https://www.oregonlive.com/news/2021/08/about-1-in-5-oregonians-diagnosed-with-covid-19-in-july-was-fully-vaccinated.html[/url][/b]
[QUOTE=IronCharles;1644456643]One in every five Oregonians who contracted Covid 19 in July were fully vaccinated.
[b][url]https://www.oregonlive.com/news/2021/08/about-1-in-5-oregonians-diagnosed-with-covid-19-in-july-was-fully-vaccinated.html[/url][/b][/QUOTE]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/bJYNc4P.jpg?1[/img]
UGH!
Masks required at the gym again, it was torture squatting and trying to breathe today!
Recovery between sets also takes longer while trying to get in Oxygen.
Just when i was really enjoying it, they pull this.
[QUOTE=x-trainer ben;1644467143]UGH!
Masks required at the gym again, it was torture squatting and trying to breathe today!
Recovery between sets also takes longer while trying to get in Oxygen.
Just when i was really enjoying it, they pull this.[/QUOTE]
In MD? what gym is this?
Well, damn, that sucks, but fyi all fuking around aside, if you ever stopped in you know where I train, no masks required there.
[QUOTE=IronCharles;1644456643]One in every five Oregonians who contracted Covid 19 in July were fully vaccinated.
[b][url]https://www.oregonlive.com/news/2021/08/about-1-in-5-oregonians-diagnosed-with-covid-19-in-july-was-fully-vaccinated.html[/url][/b][/QUOTE]
Good info thanks much, lots of detail in that report.
[url]https://www.oregon.gov/oha/covid19/Documents/DataReports/Breakthrough-Report-08-2021.pdf[/url]
[QUOTE=LWW;1644487653]In MD? what gym is this?
Well, damn, that sucks, but fyi all fuking around aside, if you ever stopped in you know where I train, no masks required there.[/QUOTE]
DC an MD