Will you get vaccinated?

[QUOTE=mgftp;1639495583]
Far too many people in the US are so miserable about political outcomes that they tie everything in life to it.[/QUOTE]

You are clueless, politics has fuked everyone who has worked hard in this country, and continues to do so.

Where have you been the last year, you saying you are really happy? But actually 2016-2019 were the happiest days I’ve had since the 90s.............

Things are already starting to look like 2006, which was horrible.

The statement about Biden was, he’s not going to fool me with empty chairs comments, and about the UK as long as US has dems in power this is a global mindset, there is no individual USA with Dem in power, right now, they are in total control.

[QUOTE=LWW;1639502383]You are clueless, politics has fuked everyone who has worked hard in this country, and continues to do so.

Where have you been the last year, you saying you are really happy? But actually 2016-2019 were the happiest days I’ve had since the 90s.............

Things are already starting to look like 2006, which was horrible.

The statement about Biden was, he’s not going to fool me with empty chairs comments, and about the UK as long as US has dems in power this is a global mindset, there is no individual USA with Dem in power, right now, they are in total control.[/QUOTE]

I actually share some of your sentiments about this country and I can often catch myself making comments about rewarding the lazy and punishing the hardworking. I just try my best to not let that make me an angry and unhappy person regardless of how certain things may frustrate me. I am aware we get one very short and fragile life in this world, and I do my best to look at the positives and enjoy the moment. It seems like someone like yourself makes everything political and carries a real anger with you nearly every moment of your life. And I don't mean that as an insult, just an observation, and one that may be pretty off base as it's hard to interpret real emotions or feelings over the internet, or how much of your posts are humor based or trolling.

[QUOTE=mgftp;1639503503]I actually share some of your sentiments about this country and I can often catch myself making comments about rewarding the lazy and punishing the hardworking. I just try my best to not let that make me an angry and unhappy person regardless of how certain things may frustrate me. I am aware we get one very short and fragile life in this world, and I do my best to look at the positives and enjoy the moment. It seems like someone like yourself makes everything political and carries a real anger with you nearly every moment of your life. And I don't mean that as an insult, just an observation, and one that may be pretty off base as it's hard to interpret real emotions or feelings over the internet, or how much of your posts are humor based or trolling.[/QUOTE]


I didn't come on here and just rant like a guy angry at the world, I replied and called out your nonsense because you missed that people were allowed out in the streets for months protesting, yet a person trying to earn a living could not, and yeah THAT FUKING pissing me off.......................................

Also you can't even see what was going on in housing projects during covid, I'm sure they weren't sitting around bunkered-in, sipping tea.......

[QUOTE=JustTheDad;1639489713]Paul, I can't quote your post saying the lockdowns did more harm than good or the "death rates". So were those death rates supposed to be the CFRs, or the IFRs? Either way, 5.4% is a pretty high mortality rate, as is .5%.

There are something like 80 million people in the US between 40 and 59, so if we apply your .5% mortality rate to them, it's 400,000 deaths. You left out the 60-69 year olds, so we'd need to apply a higher to them, right? Another 400,000 deaths? With the lockdowns the virus still infected a large% of the population in just one year, but you want to pull possible deaths for in other countries to show they weren't doing some good in the US? Without them, we'd have had more cases and that would have potentially resulted in an even higher mortality rate in each age group.

You really need to avoid taking so many things out of context. It's possible you just don't understand, but you should learn. Look at your biggest potential source for increased mortality from the lockdowns. TB cases. 1.4 million is plausible, but it's the worst case scenario from a model of what could happen if no additional intervention is done to speed up the return to normal treatments globally. In India, one of the countries with the greatest potential increased mortality in that model, the worst case scenario is an increase of ~70K deaths due to TB, over 5 years/ month of lock down. Their COVID mortality rate went over 4k per day, so an actual 120K per month rate, vs a worst case scenario of 70K per 5 years per month of lockdown. Do math Paul, you're comparing a potential mortality increase of 1,700 per month increase to an actual rate of over 4000 per day when they stopped the lockdowns. If that's not clear enough, just realize you're pulling random numbers from calculations done on TB, Malaria, and HIV in third world countries modeled over years, and ignoring that those are possible deaths in populations that would have extremely high mortality rate from SARS cov2. Your math doesn't actually show what you want it to show. It actually supports the lockdowns and vaccines, but unfortunately, you again didn't understand or bother learning to read the data.

I'm not arguing the lockdowns were well thought out or implemented. I'm only pointing out that even when you cherry pick the data points you think support your theories that the vaccines aren't helpful or that the lockdowns increased mortality, those data points don't actually support them. Sorry.[/QUOTE]

Exactly what post are you trying to quote? And what math?
Those numbers were released from the CDC directly you do realize so I’m not really sure whom you are trying to argue..? But I’m sure they will appreciate the well thought out post...

[url]https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/planning-scenarios.html[/url]

0-19 years: 3 deaths per 100,000 infections
20-49 years: 2 deaths per 10,000 infections
50-69 years: 5 deaths per 1,000 infections
70+ years: 5.4 deaths per 100 infections

Also if you are going to believe the number of Covid deaths are correct of what they are selling you, you should also realize that the CDC directed all medical professionals to list ALL DEATH CASES as covid whether tested positive or not. So..I’m not really buying those “Covid death numbers”

“Following new CDC guidelines: "As of April 14, 2020, CDC case counts and death counts include both confirmed and probable cases and deaths. This change was made to reflect an interim COVID-19 position statement issued by the Council for State and Territorial Epidemiologists on April 5, 2020. The position statement included a case definition and made COVID-19 a nationally notifiable disease.”

[url]https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/us-data/[/url]

I guess if you want to write to the CDC & let them know how inaccurate their “math” is, you are more than welcome too..short of that, IDK what to tell ya Batman..

[QUOTE=mgftp;1639495583]That alone puts you ahead of most miscers from what I can see. lol



On a very surface level I agree on shutdowns and necessity when it comes to where, how long, etc. It's really hard to say. My point to Paul was that he was saying the med ship brought to NY was barely used in one post, then saying we didn't need to do shutdowns in a following post. Being in NY and working in healthcare I am sure that ship would have been used to overflow if we carried on with life as normal.

And just now I am realizing Paul is the same poster who was saying people with Covid antibodies should have been in vaccine clinical trials. I find it hard to keep everyone around here straight unless they really stand out like yourself. If you are too harsh I am way worse since I can't keep posters straight and just seemingly lump the people with the same mindsets together, which is clearly wrong.



Far too many people in the US are so miserable about political outcomes that they tie everything in life to it.[/QUOTE]

Btw, I never once said people with Covid should have been in trials..maybe go back & re-read the posts..maybe you can figure it out this time.I have faith in you.

[QUOTE=Paul Kreul;1639513273]Exactly what post are you trying to quote? And what math?
[/QUOTE]

The one with those numbers. Wouldn't accept it. Gave me a message saying I didn't have permission to post on this server. Was odd.

Anyway, those are IFRs, not CFRs, and that's how I entered them to give you example numbers. I'm surprised the US IFR is that high, but the point is those rates result in models supporting the lockdowns. That's taking into account all your sources of additional morbidity and mortality. It comes down to how screening tests work. Number of tests to save a life vs increased survival years after diagnosis.
Also, some of the numbers you posted were from models being used to help evaluate where we need to intervene. They aren't actual death rates, they're the worst case scenario of what might happen if we do nothing to prevent them. But again, even if we do nothing, they're the worst case. They're from the same type of models that support the lockdowns while using your numbers.
You didn't set up a straw man argument which is good, but you got mislead about what you were posting and what conclusions it supported.

[QUOTE=JustTheDad;1639524323]The one with those numbers. Wouldn't accept it. Gave me a message saying I didn't have permission to post on this server. Was odd.

Anyway, those are IFRs, not CFRs, and that's how I entered them to give you example numbers. I'm surprised the US IFR is that high, but the point is those rates result in models supporting the lockdowns. That's taking into account all your sources of additional morbidity and mortality. It comes down to how screening tests work. Number of tests to save a life vs increased survival years after diagnosis.
Also, some of the numbers you posted were from models being used to help evaluate where we need to intervene. They aren't actual death rates, they're the worst case scenario of what might happen if we do nothing to prevent them. But again, even if we do nothing, they're the worst case. They're from the same type of models that support the lockdowns while using your numbers.
You didn't set up a straw man argument which is good, but you got mislead about what you were posting and what conclusions it supported.[/QUOTE]

I did not get misled by anything..you tried to prove my “math” wrong, when I was simply showing what the CDC directly posted. As far as the testing..well we know the faults of the PCR test. We know it is not a viral test but rather a bacteria test, we know what Mullis creator of the test stated regarding it, & we know the false classification of deaths the CDC is doing as the link I posted shows..if anything, I’m sorry, but I think you are being “mislead”

Dr. Fauci: Any PCR-positive with a CT over 35 is "just dead nucleotides, PERIOD." - TWiV # 641
ALSO Dr. Fauci: Let's keep testing everyone with the PCR-positive cutoff at 40 CT, guaranteeing massive false-positives

Lockdowns never once proved to save lives.

Well, you've impressed me again by actually demonstrating you know less about how PCR tests work than most middle school kids and still trying to argue about this.

You're making me sad. Please go read more. Even a wiki page should help you understand it isn't a viral test or a bacteria test.

I’d rather wait. If you want to or have, cool.

[QUOTE=JustTheDad;1639526273]Well, you've impressed me again by actually demonstrating you know less about how PCR tests work than most middle school kids and still trying to argue about this.

You're making me sad. Please go read more. Even a wiki page should help you understand it isn't a viral test or a bacteria test.[/QUOTE]

Oh? Can we just find out from the creator himself?

[url]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W8FYWzkR1ek[/url]

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=ZmZft4fXhQQ[/url]

Or do you know more than the actual guy that created the test on this one too?

The video you linked is really old and he is explaining why he believes HIV virus isn't the cause of AIDS. He believes that HIV is common and in the background of general human population and therefore testing for it with PCR is misleading. How is that interview relevant to whether PCR can be used to test for SARS-CoV2?
Or are you applying the same argument because you believe that SARS-CoV2 is common and not the cause of COVID?

[QUOTE=OldFartTom;1639527733]The video you linked is really old and he is explaining why he believes HIV virus isn't the cause of AIDS. He believes that HIV is common and in the background of general human population and therefore testing for it with PCR is misleading. How is that interview relevant to whether PCR can be used to test for SARS-CoV2?
Or are you applying the same argument because you believe that SARS-CoV2 is common and not the cause of COVID?[/QUOTE]

I posted 2 videos..you should watch the full uncut versions. I can link if you like.
He is explaining that you can put any kind of genetic material into the test & conjure up anything you would like it to say with enough replication events. This is what was done with Covid. Again..

Dr. Fauci: Any PCR-positive with a CT over 35 is "just dead nucleotides, PERIOD." - TWiV # 641

[url]https://www.microbe.tv/twiv/twiv-641/[/url]

ALSO Dr. Fauci: Let's keep testing everyone with the PCR-positive cutoff at 40 CT, guaranteeing massive false-positives

[QUOTE=Paul Kreul;1639526663]Oh? Can we just find out from the creator himself?

[url]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W8FYWzkR1ek[/url]

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=ZmZft4fXhQQ[/url]

Or do you know more than the actual guy that created the test on this one too?[/QUOTE]

Tell us in your own words, why specifically you think PCR would work on a prokaryote but not a virus? I want you to think. Not copy and paste things. Put it in your own words.

And Mullis is not saying PCR doesn’t work for testing for infectious organisms. He’s saying the test result can be misinterpreted in a medically relevant way. This is why PCR tests are vetted with positive and negative controls. This is why for rtPCR, ct values are relative the specific test. Different primers for different genes will amplify at different rates. (I’ll also remind you that he, while brilliant, was trying to explain away positive HIV PCR tests because he was adamant HIV did not cause AIDS).

There are hundreds of articles that have examined the specificity and sensitivity of PCR tests with regard to SARSCOV2. The ironic part of your misunderstanding is that false negatives are more common than false positives, and PCR decreases in sensitivity the longer an individual is infected.

[QUOTE=Reliance012;1639528813]Tell us in your own words, why specifically you think PCR would work on a prokaryote but not a virus? I want you to think. Not copy and paste things. Put it in your own words.

And Mullis is not saying PCR doesn’t work for testing for infectious organisms. He’s saying the test result can be misinterpreted in a medically relevant way. This is why PCR tests are vetted with positive and negative controls. This is why for rtPCR, ct values are relative the specific test. Different primers for different genes will amplify at different rates. (I’ll also remind you that he, while brilliant, was trying to explain away positive HIV PCR tests because he was adamant HIV did not cause AIDS).

There are hundreds of articles that have examined the specificity and sensitivity of PCR tests with regard to SARSCOV2. The ironic part of your misunderstanding is that false negatives are more common than false positives, and PCR decreases in sensitivity the longer an individual is infected.[/QUOTE]

This is why I try not to respond to you. You literally have no idea what is going on in the real world.

“WHO Finally Admits COVID-19 PCR Test Has a ‘Problem”

[url]https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/who-admits-covid-pcr-test-has-a-problem/[/url]

“The thing is, the more cycles that a test goes through, the more likely that a false positive will come up — anything over 30 cycles actually magnifies the samples so much that even insignificant sequences of viral DNA end up being magnified to the point that the test reads positive even if your viral load is extremely low or the virus is inactive and poses no threat to you or anyone else.”



















Dr. Fauci: Any PCR-positive with a CT over 35 is "just dead nucleotides, PERIOD." - TWiV # 641
ALSO Dr. Fauci: Let's keep testing everyone with the PCR-positive cutoff at 40 CT, guaranteeing massive false-positives

But according to Reliance..it’s just the opposite

Herp Derp

[QUOTE=Paul Kreul;1639529383]This is why I try not to respond to you. You literally have no idea what is going on in the real world.

“WHO Finally Admits COVID-19 PCR Test Has a ‘Problem”

[url]https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/who-admits-covid-pcr-test-has-a-problem/[/url]

“The thing is, the more cycles that a test goes through, the more likely that a false positive will come up — anything over 30 cycles actually magnifies the samples so much that even insignificant sequences of viral DNA end up being magnified to the point that the test reads positive even if your viral load is extremely low or the virus is inactive and poses no threat to you or anyone else.”



















Dr. Fauci: Any PCR-positive with a CT over 35 is "just dead nucleotides, PERIOD." - TWiV # 641
ALSO Dr. Fauci: Let's keep testing everyone with the PCR-positive cutoff at 40 CT, guaranteeing massive false-positives[/QUOTE]

So again, you can’t explain anything in your own words. Ever. You copy and paste copy and paste. See a headline or title that looks like it fits the narrative... Copy and paste.

[QUOTE=Reliance012;1639529493]So again, you can’t explain anything in your own words. Ever. You copy and paste copy and paste. See a headline or title that looks like it fits my narrative... Copy and paste.[/QUOTE]

So again, you are proved wrong..by my copy & paste..
Thanks for playing

[QUOTE=Paul Kreul;1639529543]So again, you are proved wrong..by my copy & paste..
Thanks for playing[/QUOTE]

I can only correct your misunderstandings so many times.

[QUOTE=Reliance012;1639529573]I can only correct your misunderstandings so many times.[/QUOTE]

Cool. Good like with that jab

Edit-I guess you better write Faucci as well. Clearly he misunderstands the PCR test completely

Paul, at the end of the day you do your research and chose where to get your facts and perspective.
It's clear that your mindset/knowledge and JustTheDad's mindset/knowledge are from very different places. It's the old saying "East is East and West is West and never the twain shall meet" (originally from Kipling, that's the author of The Jungle Book, not the UK cake manufacturer :) )

I think you'll just have to agree to differ on this topic

Where is Pockets?

In the gym doing elevated hip hinges, stiff legged squats, shake weights, or somesuch
Maybe on a mission cross country to wrestle bears and he's away from cell phone signal
Will we ever know?

[QUOTE=OldFartTom;1639535123]Paul, at the end of the day you do your research and chose where to get your facts and perspective.
It's clear that your mindset/knowledge and JustTheDad's mindset/knowledge are from very different places. It's the old saying "East is East and West is West and never the twain shall meet" (originally from Kipling, that's the author of The Jungle Book, not the UK cake manufacturer :) )

I think you'll just have to agree to differ on this topic[/QUOTE]

I understand, & agree, I realize no one is really going to change their opinion around here. I think however what we can see with our own eyes should give us a good indication of what is going on. The constant backpedaling of the CDC, Faucci, & our elected officials. Again, I’ve never heard of an asymptomatic Pandemic. When someone is sick, they are not asymptomatic..meaning without symptoms. A Pandemic has people dying in the streets..or at the very least, showing symptoms. August of last year @ the height of lockdowns we drove to Idaho, & then made our way up to Sturgis..never once did I see anyone showing a hint of being sick. Every small town we went to, I would ask, “so with so many tourists coming in & out, has there been an increase in Covid cases?”every one of them from Neveda to South Dakota couldn’t help but laugh or smile, & say that they haven’t seen Covid at all. Sturgis was packed, not a mask seen in sight. I asked the hotel front desk employees if they had people getting sick from Covid..they smiled & said, “there is no Covid in SD.” I didn’t see so much as a cough more than a couple times in a row, a runny nose, a sneeze attack..nothing. One night at a bar in Deadwood, I was talking with a group of bikers (should have brought my bike..but it’s a long ride from Cali) that said a couple riders had died earlier in the week in a crash & the hospital was trying to label them as a Covid death..the families were outraged.
In a Pandemic we don’t have elected officials breaking their own rules, having dinner parties at restaurants that are supposed to be closed. In a Pandemic we don’t have elected officials getting their hair done while the salon is supposed to be closed under their orders, & we don’t have them traveling on plane state to state as they tell their constituents to avoid travel for the holidays, but it’s different when they do it. In a Pandemic we don’t have nurses & doctors in hospitals across the US posting TikTok dance videos while supposedly they are “overflowing” with Covid patients. In a Pandemic we wouldn’t need to be persuaded with a bunch of free chit just to get back to “normal”.

[QUOTE=Reliance012;1639529573]I can only correct your misunderstandings so many times.[/QUOTE]

[img]https://i.imgflip.com/lu6s4.jpg[/img]

Your response made me think of this, but it's honestly inconceivable to me that Paul doesn't understand. It's like denying you didn't win the lottery after the numbers are drawn because someone on YouTube said a 1 in 300 million chance is a sure thing "eventually".


On a more interesting topic, did Mullis have HIV? I understand how much resentment he had against Cetus since they gave him something like a 10k bonus and sold the idea for 300million or so, and I understand why he hated Fauci for being right on the HIV argument (even though Fauci wasn't the reason he lost his credibility). Thing is, in that video Paul linked to, Mullis said only about a million of "us" have HIV. He didn't say only a million people have HIV. The wording is interesting and he died of pneumonia fairly young. Given all the drugs he did, the affairs, and his denial of it being the cause of AIDS, it wouldn't surprise me if he was HIV+, but I never actually saw anything saying he had contracted it.

[QUOTE=OldFartTom;1639543813]In the gym doing elevated hip hinges, stiff legged squats, shake weights, or somesuch
Maybe on a mission cross country to wrestle bears and he's away from cell phone signal
Will we ever know?[/QUOTE]

My favorite post of the thread and I can't offer any reps on it.

[QUOTE=LWW;1639511643]I didn't come on here and just rant like a guy angry at the world, I replied and called out your nonsense because you missed that people were allowed out in the streets for months protesting, yet a person trying to earn a living could not, and yeah THAT FUKING pissing me off.......................................

Also you can't even see what was going on in housing projects during covid, I'm sure they weren't sitting around bunkered-in, sipping tea.......[/QUOTE]

What exactly was my nonsense? I believe my original point you replied to is that shutdowns are what prevented the navy med shipped from being needed.

[QUOTE=Paul Kreul;1639522173]Btw, I never once said people with Covid should have been in trials..maybe go back & re-read the posts..maybe you can figure it out this time.I have faith in you.[/QUOTE]

You acted as if it was some conspiracy theory that they weren't.

Doni really need to go back and quote what you said? That is how far "conversation" with you has devolved?

"The Sturgis rally certainly could have led to a surge in Covid-19 coronaviruses cases. But how much of a surge is still unclear."

A quick Google search shows that AFTER Sturgis........ the cases jumped, not before.
This search took 1 sec. :)

[QUOTE=OldFartTom;1639543813]In the gym doing elevated hip hinges, stiff legged squats, shake weights, or somesuch
Maybe on a mission cross country to wrestle bears and he's away from cell phone signal
Will we ever know?[/QUOTE]

Stiff legged squats, LOL, now that is gold!!!

[QUOTE=x-trainer ben;1639545063]"

A quick Google search shows that AFTER Sturgis........ the cases jumped, not before.
This search took 1 sec. :)[/QUOTE]

Google also manipulates results, the horror of IT is it’s still human written algorithms that can be swayed to one side.

I find interesting that no busy Drs even have time to write information on the Internet, because they are busy actually treating. Better be careful getting all your info from Internet.

At the end of the day, what does any of this matter? Get your vaccine or don't. The government isn't mandating them; they can't as it's Unconstitutional. Hell, the MMR isn't even mandated; kids can still go to school in most states without that vaccination even with measles outbreaks. Some industries and businesses will require employees to get the vaccine and it's their choice to stay employed with them or not.

[QUOTE=LWW;1639545653]Google also manipulates results, the horror of IT is it’s still human written algorithms that can be swayed to one side.

I find interesting that no busy Drs even have time to write information on the Internet, because they are busy actually treating. Better be careful getting all your info from Internet.[/QUOTE]

Google finds the articles,but we open them and decide which sources are more reliable and which are not. I looked at 4 and decided which of the 4 to quote. Notice the unbiased approach to the conclusion.
Some of the articles concluded that is was a superspreader event because of the number of people and the cdc tracing.

[QUOTE=x-trainer ben;1639546903]Google finds the articles,but we open them and decide which sources are more reliable and which are not. I looked at 4 and decided which of the 4 to quote. Notice the unbiased approach to the conclusion.
Some of the articles concluded that is was a superspreader event because of the number of people and the cdc tracing.[/QUOTE]

It’s totally bias, you never ever point out black protesting as a spreader, but you continue to look at a biker event that is pro Trump and Jan 6.

What your missing is the fact that black protesting (whites protesting for blacks) the Covid stays level because this went on for months, but the Trumpers have been at home or working the whole time, so it’s fuking obvious that when they go to a rally, you will see a spike.........

I wonder if that’s too much for your pee wee mind to handle?

Keep using silly Google and become a person who can’t think.........

More ab wheels than brains,.......

Yeah I’ll drive an hour to meet you for some ab wheel, NOT....

[QUOTE=LWW;1639545103]Stiff legged squats, LOL, now that is gold!!![/QUOTE] Yeah Bulgarian Deadlifts, Stiff legged Squats and shake weight are my go-to for trolling exercise suggestions

[QUOTE=OldFartTom;1639547963]Yeah Bulgarian Deadlifts, Stiff legged Squats and shake weight are my go-to for trolling exercise suggestions[/QUOTE]

Bulgarian Deadlifts is doable. :)

[QUOTE=LWW;1639547883]It’s totally bias, you never ever point out black protesting as a spreader, but you continue to look at a biker event that is pro Trump and Jan 6.

What your missing is the fact that black protesting (whites protesting for blacks) the Covid stays level because this went on for months, but the Trumpers have been at home or working the whole time, so it’s fuking obvious that when they go to a rally, you will see a spike.........

I wonder if that’s too much for your pee wee mind to handle?

Keep using silly Google and become a person who can’t think.........

More ab wheels than brains,.......

Yeah I’ll drive an hour to meet you for some ab wheel, NOT....[/QUOTE]

You just proved how much of an idiot you are again.
Sturgis was used because "Paul the covid denier",used it in his example. Did you miss that between drinks?
The ab wheel is a tool recently mentioned to stimulate the abs more than any other exercise on a percentage basis using studies, did you miss that between drinks?

Google is a tool to point you in a direction, not draw conclusions, did you miss that between breakfast drinks?

Meeting me was a" balls check" for you which you failed miserably, with your girly excuse that" I am too busy," but you missed that too between drinks.

[QUOTE=supramax;1639548173]Bulgarian Deadlifts is doable. :)[/QUOTE] Yes but pretty unlikely, if it was all just impossible nobody would bite

[QUOTE=LWW;1639547883]...Yeah I’ll drive an hour to meet you for some ab wheel, NOT....[/QUOTE] FFS, why don't you meet up and do a barbell workout, banning all discussion of virusseses (virii) or politics and no showing off about how much weight etc. You might have a good workout and learn something from each other. Is there somewhere with a decent gym 30 mins from each of you?

[QUOTE=OldFartTom;1639549393]Yes but pretty unlikely, if it was all just impossible nobody would bite

FFS, why don't you meet up and do a barbell workout, banning all discussion of virusseses (virii) or politics and no showing off about how much weight etc. You might have a good workout and learn something from each other. Is there somewhere with a decent gym 30 mins from each of you?[/QUOTE]

He is tooo busy with Dundalk Barbie to meet.
Not happening.

[QUOTE=OldFartTom;1639549393]Yes but pretty unlikely... [/QUOTE]

I don't know about that. Single leg deadlifts are a thing, so why not elevate the unweighted leg? You might have just invented an exercise. :)

P.S. You have naming rights.

[QUOTE=mgftp;1639474243]The NY hospital system was on the brink of collapse if hospitalizations kept increasing as they were and the ship was there as backup. The shutdown which it appears you are saying shouldn't have happened is what saved NY from from needing the ship and becoming Italy or India at it's worst.[/QUOTE]

Italy did have lockdowns and curfews. So why didn't they save Italy from becoming Italy?

Nobody ITT does yoga?

[QUOTE=sy2502;1639551473]Italy did have lockdowns and curfews. So why didn't they save Italy from becoming Italy?[/QUOTE]

Too late? Far from an expert on the situation, but that would surely be my guess. I also think it's fair to say without lockdowns things would have gotten worse.

[QUOTE=mgftp;1639553993]Nobody ITT does yoga?



Too late? Far from an expert on the situation, but that would surely be my guess. I also think it's fair to say without lockdowns things would have gotten worse.[/QUOTE]

It's not at all fair actually, as studies have shown

[quote]A Stanford study comparing Covid responses in different countries found “no clear significant beneficial effect” from stay-at-home orders and business closures.

The peer-reviewed study, published Jan. 5 in the European Journal of Clinical Investigation, found that lockdown orders early in the Covid pandemic didn’t provide more benefits than other measures such as social distancing and travel reduction.

The study investigated measures by England, France, Germany, Iran, Italy, Netherlands, Spain, the U.S., South Korea and Sweden.

The first eight countries imposed stay-at-home orders on residents while South Korea and Sweden took less restrictive steps.

The researchers used a mathematical model to compare the countries.

They found “no clear, significant beneficial effect of (more restrictive measures) on case growth in any country.”

[/quote]
[url]https://padailypost.com/2021/01/18/stanford-study-lockdowns-have-no-clear-benefit/[/url]

We had an example here in the US where states with more relaxed covid measures faired the same as those with the most stringent measures, if not better.

[QUOTE=x-trainer ben;1639549713]He is tooo busy with Dundalk Barbie to meet.
Not happening.[/QUOTE]

I won’t step foot in Dundalk, but I did go to the ZU in Dundalk many years ago, that place is like the bar in Star Wars where They first met Han Solo.......

I’m in the process of moving, far away from that area, most our stuff is in storage, Our house is being built now.

[QUOTE=sy2502;1639554813]It's not at all fair actually, as studies have shown


[url]https://padailypost.com/2021/01/18/stanford-study-lockdowns-have-no-clear-benefit/[/url]

We had an example here in the US where states with more relaxed covid measures faired the same as those with the most stringent measures, if not better.[/QUOTE]

As I said a page or two back, who has any idea how necessary shutdowns or the extent of shutdowns were. Take NY for example, we didn't lockdown except for very small portions of the geography as a whole but the masks, social distancing, and working from home (are we calling this shutdown?) to me would have an effect on disease spread. I don't see how you could think otherwise with Covid being an airborne disease spread by close proximity.

I guess I need to stop saying lockdown, and just say shutdown or take precautions?

[QUOTE=LWW;1639558693]I won’t step foot in Dundalk, but I did go to the ZU in Dundalk many years ago, that place is like the bar in Star Wars where They first met Han Solo.......

I’m in the process of moving, far away from that area, most our stuff is in storage, Our house is being built now.[/QUOTE]

Did you get building material prices locked in?

[url]https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/********-lifts-ban-posts-claiming-covid-19-man/story?id=77931433[/url]

[b][color=red]ABC News: ******** lifts ban on posts claiming COVID-19 was man-made, amid revitalized origins debate[/color][/b]

Do sheep KNOW they are sheep?

[QUOTE=CommitmentRulz;1639563653]Do sheep KNOW they are sheep?[/QUOTE]
They did a ewe turn

[QUOTE=supramax;1639551313]I don't know about that. Single leg deadlifts are a thing, so why not elevate the unweighted leg? You might have just invented an exercise. :)

P.S. You have naming rights.[/QUOTE]
I didn't invent Bulgarian Deadlifts, but I will lay claim to stiff legged squats, I need to monetize it though. I'll get a website called nose over toes guy and hope people confuse me with that other guy, paywall it as a subscription program plus rent a lot of advert clicks "Do this one weird exercise every day and PTs will hate you". I think I'll buy one of these [url]https://revologycars.com/car/1968-mustang-22-fastback-r-spec/[/url] with the money

[QUOTE=mgftp;1639559433]

Did you get building material prices locked in?[/QUOTE]

Yeahhhh buddyyyyyyyy!!!!!

It’ll be ready in a month, I’ll stop being an angry white man then, lol.

But now I’m biting my tongue driving in and out of the hood having to listen to 5 year hood children talk chit to me srs.

When I first moved there, no rats, now there are rats........ real rats not snitches.

[QUOTE=sy2502;1639554813]It's not at all fair actually, as studies have shown
[url]https://padailypost.com/2021/01/18/stanford-study-lockdowns-have-no-clear-benefit/[/url]
We had an example here in the US where states with more relaxed covid measures faired the same as those with the most stringent measures, if not better.[/QUOTE]

Sy2502,

Do you think it's strange how everyone who thinks there was no reduction in transmission and mortality from the lockdowns ever actually reads the articles and studies they're accepting as proof?

[url]https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/eci.13484[/url]

It is very true that when evaluated the way they set up their models, they couldn't find "strong" evidence of a statistically significant reduction in transmission rates beyond what their models attributed to the less restrictive measures in other countries. I like what they tried to do in it, and would suggest you actually read it to see what their assumptions were and how they set up the analysis.

After you read it, whether or not you choose to accept it as evidence the lockdowns didn't help or did more harm than good will be up to you. I'm not going to comment much unless you have specific questions about it. I'm just happy you brought something to the discussion that's actually relevant, and not completely kooky or unrelated. So thank you.

[QUOTE=mgftp;1639544963]What exactly was my nonsense? I believe my original point you replied to is that shutdowns are what prevented the navy med shipped from being needed.



You acted as if it was some conspiracy theory that they weren't.

Doni really need to go back and quote what you said? That is how far "conversation" with you has devolved?[/QUOTE]

Yes, I think you do..please, show me & everyone EXACTLY what I posted.
I’m gunna luv this

[QUOTE=x-trainer ben;1639545063]"The Sturgis rally certainly could have led to a surge in Covid-19 coronaviruses cases. But how much of a surge is still unclear."

A quick Google search shows that AFTER Sturgis........ the cases jumped, not before.
This search took 1 sec. :)[/QUOTE]

Google.
I don’t think anything more needs to be said.

[QUOTE=JustTheDad;1639565763]Sy2502,

Do you think it's strange how everyone who thinks there was no reduction in transmission and mortality from the lockdowns ever actually reads the articles and studies they're accepting as proof?

[url]https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/eci.13484[/url]

It is very true that when evaluated the way they set up their models, they couldn't find "strong" evidence of a statistically significant reduction in transmission rates beyond what their models attributed to the less restrictive measures in other countries. I like what they tried to do in it, and would suggest you actually read it to see what their assumptions were and how they set up the analysis.

After you read it, whether or not you choose to accept it as evidence the lockdowns didn't help or did more harm than good will be up to you. I'm not going to comment much unless you have specific questions about it. I'm just happy you brought something to the discussion that's actually relevant, and not completely kooky or unrelated. So thank you.[/QUOTE]

Again, lockdowns did not prove to save lives...you still have not proved anything. The laundry list I gave you should have given you some indication of that..we can go through it point by point if you like. Your call.

Been awhile since I checked on some of these, I found the following earlier this year...

So here we have two counties, Collier (FL) &Imperial (CA) one with an early mandate when cases & deaths were very low, threatening their citizens with huge fines & literally jail time

The other county (Collier) has people openly not complying. That county is older, and 5x the density. And their results are better.

You might say, well Collier might have a younger population, that’s a big influence on outcomes, right?

Oh wait, turns out Collier’s median age is 50.8(!!!) And Imperial’s is 32.4. Collier’s median age is 57% higher than Imperial

And yet Imperial has done so, so much worse

Now, you may be saying, well I assume Imperial is bigger and more dense, because that’s ALWAYS why numbers are worse, right?

Nope. Collier is 187 per square mile, Imperial is 34.

Collier is more than 5x the density of Imperial County. So that doesn’t work.

Last I checked California and New York are still doing worse than Florida

NY’s actually doing the worst of the three, so I’m wondering if we’ll see any of Fauci’s friends in the media ask him to update his “New York had the best response” answer.

Because people still somehow believe the holidays had anything to do with increased numbers throughout the fall, California’s hospitalizations turned up on 10/25, over a month before Thanksgiving. They came down two weeks after Christmas.

The holidays had nothing to do with it.

Repeatedly, states like NY and CA have been praised by experts for "doing it right" with Covid policy, while vilifying Florida for their approach. Only one of these states' hospitalizations have been well below the US average for the last 3 months.

Can you guess which one?


Cases in the Midwest decreased 50% between Thanksgiving and Christmas. As of 1/18 cases are down 64% from their peak in mid-Nov. Some of the largest decreases are in the states that have been the least restrictive (SD, IA, NE). Wonder why they don't talk about the Midwest anymore

Iowa and New Mexico have similar population sizes, but Iowa's population density is much higher overall. So how was Iowa able to get COVID "under control" several days before New Mexico with significantly fewer restrictions?

Iowa current COVID deaths per million: 1,288

New Mexico current COVID deaths per million: 1,282

How can Iowa and New Mexico's current death rates be nearly identical? How are Iowa's number of COVID patients falling at a much faster rate despite not doing nearly as much as NM?

New Mexico closed indoor dining this summer, instructed its residents to stay home except when absolutely necessary in September, and had a full lockdown in mid-November. Iowa, with a similar population size and much higher population density, did none of these things.