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[QUOTE=Rob1882;1487437051]Because they are buying bulks on fractions of pennies per serving come on.. Lol if you or others "Truly" do not care buy bulk raws toss them together mix it up and just scoop it into your mouth, it will cost you maybe 1/10th given you can't buy it as cheap as those companies are due to volume purchases but you can certainly get many hundreds of servings for the similar costs of a pre workout.
I'm paying for convenience I have expectations don't want me to care? than put it in capsules.
Meh? Hi-Tech produces a ton of similar-ish pre workouts for its dozen of companies under the umbrella maybe you see a dif between them but I do not
Interchangeable to me so 0 cares
End of the day I like God of War RED the most for both its stimulant blend and its flavoring so unless the OG D-Stunner coming back no cares ;)[/QUOTE]
Fair points Rob. But that **** is still soft :P
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[QUOTE=BenBlue;1487437281]Fair points Rob. But that **** is still soft :P[/QUOTE]
Been there done that got the T-Shirt and moved on 30-40$ for most of these anyone here can buy raws make hundreds if not thousands of servings for like 100$ and have dozens of tubs of pre workout. Want my money it better taste good because that is the difference were looking at again a whole lot with similar profiles a whole lot.
Either make it so cheap that I don't give a fk how it tastes.. or hire someone who can flavor it and mask disgusting ass raws.
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[QUOTE=Rob1882;1487437461]Been there done that got the T-Shirt and moved on 30-40$ for most of these anyone here can buy raws make hundreds if not thousands of servings for like 100$ and have dozens of tubs of pre workout. Want my money it better taste good because that is the difference were looking at again a whole lot with similar profiles a whole lot.[/QUOTE]
That's actually not true though dude. Buying raws in bulk isn't always cheaper, it very much depends on the product.
When i'm "paying for convenience", i'm paying to have it prepackaged and that's ****in it. Taste is great man, I've really enjoyed a lot of the newer products from a taste perspective, but it's nothing more than icing on the cake. Effects are all that matters. Yes, most products are using similar ingredients, but I think we all notice that difference products do have different effects, even if it's a slight difference. I'll take the product that tastes like **** but works best for me over the product that I just like but tastes amazing. OG D-stunner being the exception :P will never in my life buy that product again (a few brick and mortar stores near me still carry it)
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[QUOTE=BenBlue;1487437921]That's actually not true though dude. Buying raws in bulk isn't always cheaper, it very much depends on the product.
When i'm "paying for convenience", i'm paying to have it prepackaged and that's ****in it. Taste is great man, I've really enjoyed a lot of the newer products from a taste perspective, but it's nothing more than icing on the cake. Effects are all that matters. Yes, most products are using similar ingredients, but I think we all notice that difference products do have different effects, even if it's a slight difference. I'll take the product that tastes like **** but works best for me over the product that I just like but tastes amazing. OG D-stunner being the exception :P will never in my life buy that product again (a few brick and mortar stores near me still carry it)[/QUOTE]
Wrong
Raws are always cheaper always and even as a consumer you can get volume discounts you just are not looking very hard or contacting the right companies.
If they were not cheaper there would be negative profits on all of their products; No company is going to give away a pre workout they are banking profits on a pre workout some more than others but were largely talking stim cocktails and NO ingredients are all fairly inexpensive.
So what the problem is? DMAA insanely cheap so is caffeine, Yohimbine, ephedrine, so what is it your using that is expensive in a pre? Nootropics? even those can be had in bulk at fractions of the cost even more so if you buy volume.
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[QUOTE=Rob1882;1487437051]Because they are buying bulks on fractions of pennies per serving come on.. Lol if you or others "Truly" do not care buy bulk raws toss them together mix it up and just scoop it into your mouth, it will cost you maybe 1/10th given you can't buy it as cheap as those companies are due to volume purchases but you can certainly get many hundreds of servings for the similar costs of a pre workout.
[/QUOTE]
I'm well aware of how much it cost to make a pre, and what a company sells it for. I'm not going to buy 10+ bulk powders and mix those up every single day. No thanks partner.
I already do a few bulk products for blood glucose and two for pre-workout. Most of these compounds you need a mini scale to measure out exact dosages and I don't need to be wasting time every day doing so. So i'll just spend the extra cash for conveince sake, and if it tastes good, then cool, and if not, I could care less.
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[QUOTE=82ndAirborne;1487435891]am i the only one that could give two bleeps what my pre taste like? First off I mix my pre with e9, noxygen, and high volume so matter what the taste is or was its all jumbled anyway, and secondly while id rather it not taste like chit, I much more care about its effectivness. Im not saying you guys who do care so much are in any way wrong, I mean to each his own, but i hear so much talk about flavoring and im just have to smile becasue that is literally something that is never been on my radar[/QUOTE]^^^
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Looks very interesting.
[IMG]https://scontent-fra3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/17191519_10155130421544540_8754096866161986180_n.jpg?oh=4c4345a4397e93289a39fa9da1d74515&oe=592F4F3E[/IMG]
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Speaking of pres and stims. For caffeine I keep it at about 300 to 350 in a pre. Only a few times I went up to 400. of course other stims are in some of the pres but I never go above 1 scoop. I seem to do just fine and if I feel like it didn't do much for me that workout it's because I need to change my routine, it was an off day or I am over tired and need a rest day. I seem to be fine the next workout and have not had a stim break for a long time unless you count a week of vacation with only some mountain dew or diet soda each day a break.
Flavor I agree for the most part. I find most good enough where some say they are terrible. Take all the sour gummy bear flavored pres on the market. So much hate yet I find them good enough. Not swish in my mouth and savor like a fine wine good but it's a pre and I get that thing down fast. Sure some are better than others but overall if it's decent I say it's good.
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I saw that too.
I love coffee proteins like that. PES Cafe is a constant staple.
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[QUOTE=Rob1882;1487438021]Wrong
Raws are always cheaper always and even as a consumer you can get volume discounts you just are not looking very hard or contacting the right companies.
If they were not cheaper there would be negative profits on all of their products; No company is going to give away a pre workout they are banking profits on a pre workout some more than others but were largely talking stim cocktails and NO ingredients are all fairly inexpensive.
So what the problem is? DMAA insanely cheap so is caffeine, Yohimbine, ephedrine, so what is it your using that is expensive in a pre? Nootropics? even those can be had in bulk at fractions of the cost even more so if you buy volume.[/QUOTE]
Maybe if i'm looking to produce in that kind of bulk quantity, sure, but I'm not reselling supps, i'm buying for myself. At the end of the day there isn't that much of a cost difference when you're not buying in mass quantities, but the headache doubles. Again, convenience factor is the prepackaged aspect. i'll happily pay slightly more for that, but the margins are pretty damn small when we're talking about someone buying strictly for personal use.
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[QUOTE=TMac26;1487438421]I saw that too.
I love coffee proteins like that. PES Cafe is a constant staple.[/QUOTE]
This
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[QUOTE=dailob;1487434591]wasn't this protein from allmax the one that's spiked?
[/QUOTE]
Found out that actually was the one cause for spiking. Disregard my previous post on it.
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[QUOTE=kbayne;1487438181]I'm well aware of how much it cost to make a pre, and what a company sells it for. I'm not going to buy 10+ bulk powders and mix those up every single day. No thanks partner.
I already do a few bulk products for blood glucose and two for pre-workout. Most of these compounds you need a mini scale to measure out exact dosages and I don't need to be wasting time every day doing so. So i'll just spend the extra cash for conveince sake, and if it tastes good, then cool, and if not, I could care less.[/QUOTE]
Than you must also be aware you can pre mix those bulks yes? What exactly do you think they do?
I mean who cares about taste right partner? Come on lol PES has taken great pride in its flavoring its customer base clearly appreciates it from the OG Alphamine till now and only perfected it since.
And yet again any product has a ton with similar-ish profiles similar prices why pay more for something you need to hold your nose and shot gun down if you can have one that is at least palatable.
This argument of ima man so don't care is weak argument, the ability to chug some sewage water foul tasting cocktail does not make anyone more "Manly".
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you guys all really need new hobbies, idk get why you spend so much time arguing over Koolaid.
This is really when I find the hodgetwins speaking to me,
Do whatever the **** you want to do!
Serious question:
Is this what I should expect of my life after marriage? Because nothxjeff
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[QUOTE=Farley1324;1487436021]Yeah as long as it doesn't make me gag or something crazy I don't care when picking which Pre to get or take. But once I have decided on a particular product I'll seek out the best flavor[/QUOTE]
Agree with this 100%. As long as it is "drinkable" I am good.
[QUOTE=Rob1882;1487438021]Wrong
Raws are always cheaper always and even as a consumer you can get volume discounts you just are not looking very hard or contacting the right companies.
If they were not cheaper there would be negative profits on all of their products; No company is going to give away a pre workout they are banking profits on a pre workout some more than others but were largely talking stim cocktails and NO ingredients are all fairly inexpensive.
So what the problem is? DMAA insanely cheap so is caffeine, Yohimbine, ephedrine, so what is it your using that is expensive in a pre? Nootropics? even those can be had in bulk at fractions of the cost even more so if you buy volume.[/QUOTE]
Some noots are very very expensive even if buying in bulk for a individual compared to quantities that a supp company could order. I agree stims are cheap but outside of the normal noots (ALCAR, choline, ect) they can get expensive.
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[QUOTE=carguy123;1487438901]Agree with this 100%. As long as it is "drinkable" I am good.
Some noots are very very expensive even if buying in bulk for a individual compared to quantities that a supp company could order. I agree stims are cheap but outside of the normal noots (ALCAR, choline, ect) they can get expensive.[/QUOTE]
Again doesn't matter were talking bulk raw cost vs pre packaged costs
It's always cheaper they are not going to re-package a raw and charge less than they paid for it.
[QUOTE=DamonX;1487438891]you guys all really need new hobbies, idk get why you spend so much time arguing over Koolaid.
This is really when I find the hodgetwins speaking to me,
Do whatever the **** you want to do!
Serious question:
Is this what I should expect of my life after marriage? Because nothxjeff[/QUOTE]
You don't get a say Mr Man REP :P everything MAN has tastes good gtfo!
And yes expect it :D also you will always be wrong always even if your right your still wrong she will still be right :o
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[QUOTE=DamonX;1487438891]you guys all really need new hobbies, idk get why you spend so much time arguing over Koolaid.
This is really when I find the hodgetwins speaking to me,
Do whatever the **** you want to do!
Serious question:
Is this what I should expect of my life after marriage? Because nothxjeff[/QUOTE]
Get off your high horse jackass lol I work sales and post while i'm working. Outside of work I hardly post. I'm sure it's the same for many in here.
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[QUOTE=Rob1882;1487438761]Than you must also be aware you can pre mix those bulks yes? What exactly do you think they do?
I mean who cares about taste right partner? Come on lol PES has taken great pride in its flavoring its customer base clearly appreciates it from the OG Alphamine till now and only perfected it since.
And yet again any product has a ton with similar-ish profiles similar prices why pay more for something you need to hold your nose and shot gun down if you can have one that is at least palatable.
This argument of ima man so don't care is weak argument, the ability to chug some sewage water foul tasting cocktail does not make anyone more "Manly".[/QUOTE]
Rob, its not about "imma man, watch me chug this". It's simply about the convenience of having an already all in one product that you don't have to take the time to mix every single ingredient together.
What did I say above, now days, taste is what makes products sell. So you're not going against anything I am on the taste subject. I simply said I don't care if it tastes good or bad. I don't have room for 10+ bulk products, I'm sure as hell not gonna measure out every single ingredient, and I make enough money so I can buy these products. If money was an issue and I needed a way to save, sure I'd go the bulk route.
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You all have no idea about bad tasting pre workout unless you had and ill say it again, OG Ready 4 War.
It made D-Stunner look like goddamn crystal light. And I'm not kidding. It was "unflavored" and it literally tasted like goddamn ground up sewage pipe. I literally vomited a couple times from it.
But this was well over 12+ years ago and I was young trying to be "manly man" so I chugged it anyway
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[QUOTE=DamonX;1487438891]you guys all really need new hobbies, idk get why you spend so much time arguing over Koolaid.
This is really when I find the hodgetwins speaking to me,
Do whatever the **** you want to do!
Serious question:
Is this what I should expect of my life after marriage? Because nothxjeff[/QUOTE]
Hey settle down or I'll stop buying so many MAN products ;) And I can tell you about 10 years of married life...
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[QUOTE=kbayne;1487439621]Rob, its not about "imma man, watch me chug this". It's simply about the convenience of having an already all in one product that you don't have to take the time to mix every single ingredient together.
What did I say above, now days, taste is what makes products sell. So you're not going against anything I am on the taste subject. I simply said I don't care if it tastes good or bad. I don't have room for 10+ bulk products, I'm sure as hell not gonna measure out every single ingredient, and I make enough money so I can buy these products. If money was an issue and I needed a way to save, sure I'd go the bulk route.[/QUOTE]
Not all of the argument was directed at you ;) Just adding to the prior discussion.
I have hundreds of pre workouts, most of them are tolerable there is only a handful I have had so bad I gave them away and those are largely not even sold now/anymore. I had one that gave me a migraine it smelled almost like robitussin had a similar taste but strong bitters gave me an instant headache ruined my workout.
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BTW
[img]http://karenknowsbest.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/Caring-continuum-couldnt-care-less-vs-could-care-less.png[/img]
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[QUOTE=TMac26;1487440001]You all have no idea about bad tasting pre workout unless you had and ill say it again, OG Ready 4 War.
It made D-Stunner look like goddamn crystal light. And I'm not kidding. It was "unflavored" and it literally tasted like goddamn ground up sewage pipe. I literally vomited a couple times from it.
But this was well over 12+ years ago and I was young trying to be "manly man" so I chugged it anyway[/QUOTE]
WHat? With a beard like yours you vomited from something? Now I have to know what those old supplements tasted like. I got myself to tolerating raw Super Cissus where I would just throw in my mouth and wash down with water. Also some bulk 1,3 and another stim I forgot that was pretty hard to swallow. I diluted i water of course and "did the math" to make sure was not overdosing but I know the flavor was bad.
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If someone can shoot bulk berberine, teacrine, or even cissus, then I think they can slam anything.
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[QUOTE=Rob1882;1487439091]Again doesn't matter were talking bulk raw cost vs pre packaged costs
It's always cheaper they are not going to re-package a raw and charge less than they paid for it.
t :o[/QUOTE]
My point was that even if a suppklement company buys the raws and marks them up it can still be cheaper than me personally going out and buying the raws. We all know raws get cheaper with quanity, usually signififcantly. So them buying kilos vs me buying 10-20mg is a HUGE difference. I found all this out when I looking for raw phenylpiracetam. It was literally cheaper for me to buy a product that contained the dosage I was after vs me trying to buy this raw
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[QUOTE=kbayne;1487440551]If someone can shoot bulk berberine, teacrine, or even cissus, then I think they can slam anything.[/QUOTE]
Cissus is harsh I made an attempt when Coop first mentioned it to me :| I bought bunch bulk he recommended I than tried to scoop it in my mouth of course coop said make sure you cap it; I thought meh how bad could it be..
It was worse than I imagine and its a fine fine powder it coated everything :X
[QUOTE=carguy123;1487440691]My point was that even if a suppklement company buys the raws and marks them up it can still be cheaper than me personally going out and buying the raws. We all know raws get cheaper with quanity, usually signififcantly. So them buying kilos vs me buying 10-20mg is a HUGE difference. I found all this out when I looking for raw phenylpiracetam. It was literally cheaper for me to buy a product that contained the dosage I was after vs me trying to buy this raw[/QUOTE]
Got to buy at least 100s of grams breh :P not mgs lol
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[QUOTE=kbayne;1487440551]If someone can shoot bulk berberine, teacrine, or even cissus, then I think they can slam anything.[/QUOTE]
I'm guessing you don't know much about flavoring :)
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[QUOTE=crpav;1487440541]WHat? With a beard like yours you vomited from something? Now I have to know what those old supplements tasted like. I got myself to tolerating raw Super Cissus where I would just throw in my mouth and wash down with water. Also some bulk 1,3 and another stim I forgot that was pretty hard to swallow. I diluted i water of course and "did the math" to make sure was not overdosing but I know the flavor was bad.[/QUOTE]
It was goddamn awful lol.
It wasn't the fact that it was bitter, but it just tasted terrible. Zero masking of the ingredients. And it mixed up this dirty orange color.
I mean it worked great, IF you could get it down. I used to plug my nose and chug since if I couldn't smell it, I couldn't taste it. But one day I caught a whiff while drinking and just blew it out everywhere.
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[QUOTE=kbayne;1487440551]If someone can shoot bulk berberine, teacrine, or even cissus, then I think they can slam anything.[/QUOTE]
Will NEVER buy cissus powder ever again! NEVER
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[QUOTE=carguy123;1487440691]My point was that even if a suppklement company buys the raws and marks them up it can still be cheaper than me personally going out and buying the raws. We all know raws get cheaper with quanity, usually signififcantly. So them buying kilos vs me buying 10-20mg is a HUGE difference. I found all this out when I looking for raw phenylpiracetam. It was literally cheaper for me to buy a product that contained the dosage I was after vs me trying to buy this raw[/QUOTE]
Exactly. It's not always cheaper when buying for personal use. We're not supp companies reselling products over here.
