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What is the ideal ratio of fat calories to protein calories when on a keto diet? I've been having about 20 grams of fat and 30 grams of protein per meal, making it 180/120 calories respectively. Is a 3:2 ratio of fat calories to protein calories right?
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by bigpoppa [/i]
[B]What is the ideal ratio of fat calories to protein calories when on a keto diet? I've been having about 20 grams of fat and 30 grams of protein per meal, making it 180/120 calories respectively. Is a 3:2 ratio of fat calories to protein calories right? [/B][/QUOTE]you don't go by a ratio, you need to take in 1g/lb protein 50g carbs (though it can be higher or lower depending on your carb tolerance, basically whatever it takes to keep you in ketosis) Then add fat to reach desired daily cal intake. For example I weigh 205, I would take in 205g protein, I like 40g carbs, that = 980kcals. I want a 2000 cal diet so that leaves 1020 cals. 1020 / 9 = 113 g of fat daily. Divide all these by 6 (#of meals a day) and each meal I must eat 34g protein, 7g carbs, 19g fat. Got it ?
Yes, dont get overly hung up on ratio's. One size doesnt fit all.
Energy low? Bump up fat....
Recovery slow? Bump up protien....
Because it does me. I am a competative bodybuilder and have always in the past have used the popular high carb, medium protein, low (as close to 0 as possible) fat. This time I decided to use the NHE plan which basically is Keto with a carb load (I don't like calling them cheat days because they are planned and psychologically I stay stronger by not cheating) every 3rd or 4th day (Thurs. and Sun. for example). The carb load is only for the second half of the day like from 3:00 on until bedtime getting a total of about 400 grams. In the geginning of the diet, like the first week, I went from 223 to 218 and looked a little leaner. Here is the wild thing that is freaking me out. Since then over the last 3 weeks I have lost virtually no weight but have gotten leaner every day! My abs are coming in great - intercostals and everything. And everday I step on the scale - 218! My bodyfat was measured by a professional with skinfold and has gone from 9.8 at the beginning to 7.1 10 days ago. I will have it measured again today. I have 4.5 weeks before the contest. Even though it is a good thing to maintain weight while getting leaner it is kind of surprising. Everybody, including the professional nutritionist at the gym, is telling me the keto is horrible for a bodybuilder because it is catabolic. The things he says make sense but I just can't argue with the results. Does anybody have an explanation or should I just count my blessings and not question it?
Can you eat avocadoes on a keto diet?
I know they contain a lot of calories, but so do walnuts and almonds...
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by BFC [/i]
[B]Because it does me. I am a competative bodybuilder and have always in the past have used the popular high carb, medium protein, low (as close to 0 as possible) fat. This time I decided to use the NHE plan which basically is Keto with a carb load (I don't like calling them cheat days because they are planned and psychologically I stay stronger by not cheating) every 3rd or 4th day (Thurs. and Sun. for example). The carb load is only for the second half of the day like from 3:00 on until bedtime getting a total of about 400 grams. In the geginning of the diet, like the first week, I went from 223 to 218 and looked a little leaner. Here is the wild thing that is freaking me out. Since then over the last 3 weeks I have lost virtually no weight but have gotten leaner every day! My abs are coming in great - intercostals and everything. And everday I step on the scale - 218! My bodyfat was measured by a professional with skinfold and has gone from 9.8 at the beginning to 7.1 10 days ago. I will have it measured again today. I have 4.5 weeks before the contest. Even though it is a good thing to maintain weight while getting leaner it is kind of surprising. Everybody, including the professional nutritionist at the gym, is telling me the keto is horrible for a bodybuilder because it is catabolic. The things he says make sense but I just can't argue with the results. Does anybody have an explanation or should I just count my blessings and not question it? [/B][/QUOTE]
I experienced that exact same thing. By the end of the second week of my keto diet, weight loss was very slow, but I was still getting more defined rapidly. Supposedly you are actually building up muscle while losing fat if this is happening. Fitnessman mentioned that it is very possible to pack on a couple pounds of dense muscle mass while cutting with a keto diet!
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by bb5-0 [/i]
[B]Can you eat avocadoes on a keto diet?
I know they contain a lot of calories, but so do walnuts and almonds... [/B][/QUOTE]
Its not necessarily the calories you need to worry about but the carbs. I believe an avocado has over 10 grams of carb per fruit. Fibrous veggies are probably a better source of carbs.
should teenagers consume more calories when cutting, because they have faster metabolisms and are still growing, would dieting actually hinder growth?
could anybody tell me if they drink milk while on keto, i drink about 5 pints a day, theres about 130grams carbs in that per day, is this inadequate for keto? should i drop the milk? if so where can i get all that protein from?
BFC I am a nutritionist and the "nutritionist" at your gym is an idoit! To make a statement that a " ketogenic diet is catabolic" shows that this person is an idiot. Look at your progress and then tell me that.
GOD I have helped so many competitive bodybuilders(male and female) get ready for shows(not to mention the 100's of others) that kinda talk just pisses me off! Does that clown have a masters? I will soon.........If they dont know and dont know they dont know, they shouldnt speak.............GOD!!!!
Sorry for the rant, but people know where I stand on this issue.
Like Tim said, most manage to gain muscle on a keto cutting diet. The main reason is the body needs fat. On a typical bodybuilding the diet lacks enough fat. When you do get enough you get results like you are having.
A little avacoda is fine.
Milk needs to limited
well you should drop your carbs to 20 grams for the first 4 days and then maybe lift it up to 5-10 grams altough u might feel weak but this is only temperally but u have to first depleteyour liver of it's store of carbs so ...kept the carbs low and you will lose not lest than 2 lb a week depend on how much wieght you have to lose..and btw do cardio it speeds up the process
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by fitnessman [/i]
[B]BFC I am a nutritionist and the "nutritionist" at your gym is an idoit! To make a statement that a " ketogenic diet is catabolic" shows that this person is an idiot. Look at your progress and then tell me that.
GOD I have helped so many competitive bodybuilders(male and female) get ready for shows(not to mention the 100's of others) that kinda talk just pisses me off! Does that clown have a masters? I will soon.........If they dont know and dont know they dont know, they shouldnt speak.............GOD!!!!
Sorry for the rant, but people know where I stand on this issue.
Like Tim said, most manage to gain muscle on a keto cutting diet. The main reason is the body needs fat. On a typical bodybuilding the diet lacks enough fat. When you do get enough you get results like you are having.
[/B][/QUOTE]
I appreciate your passion and your support. It's hard to break tradition - like high reps for cuts, low fat while dieting etc. I can't argue with the success that I've seen so I am going to stick with it. It's truly amazing!
Questions. Is it good to consume the bulk of your daily 50 carbs in the morning or does it matter? As I get closer to the show, should I lower calories by decreasing fat, protein or both?
Thanks again.
o dang this keto thing is getting maddddd popular aint it? lol >) a gang of my friends are sayin i look leaner.....and i'm feelin incredibly a lot stronger.....and i tell them about this keto and they ask "isn't that the atkins thing?" haha stupid question but is there a difference? i have no clue....but nehow....i feel like i'm gaining a lot more now that i cheat a lot more often.....i have like one small cheat snack or small cheat meal like every other day.....and i'm still losing lbs but gettin stronger....i dunno if that wud work for everyone but help urselves to a treat....it'z good for u psychologically~ >)
yo....i was juss wonderin ur overall results since u started keto....i'm assumin i started around the same time as u, cuz while i was researchin this and preparing i think u were too >)....how many lbs did u lose? in wat muscle area did u get stronger and by how much? i want to maximize my results....so i would like to compare my results and schedule wit urz, thankz for ur reply...
when you go for a week of carbs to shock the body , do you keep the same number of calories? of proteins (still 1gr/lb ) ? or do you eat more calories than during the keto phase and lower the proteins? what about the amount of fats?
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by mrhoon [/i]
[B]yo....i was juss wonderin ur overall results since u started keto....i'm assumin i started around the same time as u, cuz while i was researchin this and preparing i think u were too >)....how many lbs did u lose? in wat muscle area did u get stronger and by how much? i want to maximize my results....so i would like to compare my results and schedule wit urz, thankz for ur reply... [/B][/QUOTE]
Hey, have you ever thought about writing an ebonics dictionary!
UZ DA MAN!
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by mrhoon [/i]
[B]yo....i was juss wonderin ur overall results since u started keto....i'm assumin i started around the same time as u, cuz while i was researchin this and preparing i think u were too >)....how many lbs did u lose? in wat muscle area did u get stronger and by how much? i want to maximize my results....so i would like to compare my results and schedule wit urz, thankz for ur reply... [/B][/QUOTE]
I started my keto diet the first Monday in Febuary, and ended it exactly four weeks later. I lost about 15 pounds. Yeah, some of it was water weight, but I am clearly much more defined than I was before the diet. I can't tell yet for sure if I gained any muscle but I think I did. Sunday was the last day of the diet, and I felt weak Monday and Tuesday since you always feel weak the first few days of a dietary change. I'm quite sure that I didn't lose any muscle, and the fact that you lose no muscle on this diet was the reason I tried it in the first place. I think my legs have even gotten stronger while on the diet. I gained five pounds since I stopped the diet (all water weight in the muscles) and I look just as cut and vascular as I did at the end of the diet, and my muscles look bigger and fuller. I am easily satisfied enough with my results that I will only use a keto diet to cut from now on.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Tim [/i]
[B]
I started my keto diet the first Monday in Febuary, and ended it exactly four weeks later. I lost about 15 pounds. Yeah, some of it was water weight, but I am clearly much more defined than I was before the diet. I can't tell yet for sure if I gained any muscle but I think I did. Sunday was the last day of the diet, and I felt weak Monday and Tuesday since you always feel weak the first few days of a dietary change. I'm quite sure that I didn't lose any muscle, and the fact that you lose no muscle on this diet was the reason I tried it in the first place. I think my legs have even gotten stronger while on the diet. I gained five pounds since I stopped the diet (all water weight in the muscles) and I look just as cut and vascular as I did at the end of the diet, and my muscles look bigger and fuller. I am easily satisfied enough with my results that I will only use a keto diet to cut from now on. [/B][/QUOTE]
That's interesting because I think that also is why I haven't lost any weight in 3 weeks because even though I am definately losing fat, I feel that my legs are gaining muscle. Also I have inserted some bicycle sprints up hills that could have partially accounted for that - boy they hurt but what a pump!
Yeah, I started doing cardio too (mostly plain jogging) when I started cutting, so the extra stimulation the legs get from the cardio might actually help build them up.
Hey
I am on week three of Keto and as you probably read I haven't lost any weight either. As a matter af fact put on a couple of pounds. I am sure it is not fat because I have a mirror.
I will stay on this diet for three more weeks but i will add more cardio for the last three. Lets see what happens...
peace
I had the same problem, for about two weeks on keto, I did not lose any weight and put on about 3lbs. I stayed on and now I've lost the 3 pounds I put on and hopefully should start losing more soon. Also, I am still negative on the keto strips.
Hey Bro
Through the last two weeks I have been testing with the sticks.
I test every day, some days I show a slight amount but most days >negative..
I think it is something to do with the fat intake.
Seems like the day I eat real fatty foods I test pos.
This is my first time keto, So I am still figuring things out
good luck....
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by brwnsuga [/i]
[B]I had the same problem, for about two weeks on keto, I did not lose any weight and put on about 3lbs. I stayed on and now I've lost the 3 pounds I put on and hopefully should start losing more soon. Also, I am still negative on the keto strips. [/B][/QUOTE]
The key to a bodybuilder is "are you looking leaner" not necessarily losing weight. I have had to fight back going stricter on the diet because I am not losing "weight" but I am getting leaner - much leaner - and that is my goal. If you are getting leaner just hang tight. Fitnessman says when you give the body enough fat, you can actually build muscle while dieting and that is heaven on earth for the bodybuilder!
Hell Yeh sounds great. but I sure am trippin I have gained ten pounds since I've been on this diet.
I am really getting frustrated to the point that I am actually thinking about cutting back on some of my food intake.
But if I do i wont meet my daily requirements..
so wtf I 'm so confused, I don't know what to think
please reply???????
peace
Is your bodyfat decreasing?
Sometimes people who followed a typical carb based diet all their life have this happen. The reason being that for the first time, you are giving your body what it has needed all along.
This is what happened to me. I was stuck for the longest time when I was aroung 30. I started doing some research on high fat diets and tried one(and hated it) Read some more learned some more, talked to other fellow nutritionist. The more I learned the more it made sense. When I learned how eat, my body responded by getting bigger, leaner, and very much stronger. Now I love keto diets for bulking, cutting, maintaining and even for the couch potato in all of us.
So I am going to have to say based on my studies with myself and some of my clients..That you are having results due to the fact your body is getting what it needs.
Unless you just went up 4 pants sizes:)
YES it looks like i am loosing body fat I don't measure but I know my trouble spots and i can definetly tell they are slowly losing fat.
I am just so used to watching weight...
You know Fitnessman what you just said makes alot of sense and that sounds like exactly whats happening to me.
I am 42 now have been training on and off throught my life.
I would alwasy get to a point and get frustrated and back off.
But back then i never had my nutrition right like I do now.
For about the last 3 months I have really learned how to get my nutrition right and I am experiencing gains. I have to say it does look like I am loosing fat and i havn't went up in pants size.
But for some reason I am freaking out on my weight. 5'7" >190lbs
34 waist.
It could be i am just getting a little parinoid because i am not used to gaining like this. I am really liking the way I feel and I have to not let myself fall back in the same ol routine as in the past.
I am going to stay the course and see what happens.
So bear with me>>>>
Do you think I should cut any of my intake?? I have posted 1 day of my diet earlier in this thread. the other days are pretty much the same just switch out meats..
peace
You are gaining muscle and losing fat, So your intake has to be good. The gains will taper off in time, just enjoy the ride. You know I always wanted to bench 405, never could until I was like 32 or 33 years old, and that happen when I changed to a keto life stlye.
Again I think what is going on with you is what happened to me.
Once your metabolism fully adjusts to this diet the fat will burn even better.
I'm new to the keto diet and I'm trying to research it the best I can, so sorry if these quetions have been covered already.
The 50 g of carbs/day, do they all come from vegetables or are they complex carbs from oatmeal, whole grains, etc..?
Is this diet safe for a 19 year old?
Should the protein intake be 1 or 1.5 g/ lb of bodyweight?
Thanks and sorry again if these questions have been answered.
I'll try to answer your questions, but if fitnessman comes on here and disputes anything I say....ignore me and listen to him. :)
50 grams of carbs can really come in any form...the problem with the whole grains and oatmeal is that they are packed with carbs in each serving. Off the top of my head I don't know the exact numbers, but if I worked whole grains into my keto, I'm pretty sure I'd be eating extremely small portions of these. On the other hand something like lettuce has so little carbs, that I can pretty each as much of it as I can, I can eat full portions of brocolli, etc. Besides that (and this is probably just personal), I think eating a little bit of the whole grains (oatmeal type stuff) would really kick in the cravings...then again maybe not in the extremely small portions I'd be allowed.
As far as I know the diet is safe for a 19 yr. old. Fitnessman?
Protein intakes it depends. 1g/lb is what I'm using right now to shed bodyfat. You'd probably bump that up for maintenance or (definitely) for bulking.
Cortezthekiller-
Thank you so much for the info. I had never even thought about the small portions or the cravings; makes a lot of sense. I already eat a ****load of veggies as it is, so hopefully I won't have any problems adjusting. Thanks,
Mike
While on the topic on consuming neccesary carbs, i.e. a serving of broccoli.
What food is the best intake for carb and FIBER? I feel that consuming more than 15g of fiber is very important for anyone!!
Is Fiber One Cereal, or All Bran good?
I eat them dry, with no milk or I would presoak them in water and gulp them down.
Hey you guys, I just finished reading the thread, very informative.
I have used the keto diet before to lose 35 pounds. And consequently find a girlfriend. And found the 35 again =). Anyways back on it, and back to doing the intense lifting. I just wanted to post my typical diet in a day. (Note: times vary - my schedule is *ucked, so times are not listed.)
Meal 1: (Wakeup)
Serving of whey Protein
2 tablespoons flax seed oil
all mixed in a shake
Meal 2: Generally 2 - 3 hours after first meal and a run
Eggs - lots of them (scrambled and straight)
Prolly a total of like 5-6
(I don't trust the sausage at my school - looks carby)
Meal 3:
Can of tuna w/ a generous serving of mayo
Meal 4:
Lunch - usually a salad (lettuce and onion) w/ 4 chicken breasts
Meal 5:
Can of tuna w/ a generous serving of mayo
Meal 6:
Dinner - can vary - but usually few more chicken breasts or some hamburgers.
Meal 7: Before bed
2 Servings cottage cheese
1 serving of whey
2 tablespoons flax seed
psyillium husks (fiber)
Post-workout shake :
whey
I can not bring myself to add the extra carbs. I fear them. ;)
Any comments welcome.
Hey guys,
what value does coffee have in a keto diet (good/bad) what are the options with that (sugar, cream, caffeine?)
1 carb per cup. Some people believe it produces an insulin response - which is bad. Like alot of things coffee on keto is grey. A cup or 2 a day won't affect you, just make sure you drink more water to compensate for it, as it does dehyhdrate.
what about sugar or a sugar substitute?
Again, these produce an insulin response. Some people count these towards their carb total for the day even though they are technically not sugar. If you use one or 2 artificial sweetners a day you should be fine, but some people arent. You have to check and see your own tolerance.
Help me all the keto masters, fitnesman, dorian, chi-town?
I can't find ketostix in my country. How do I know I'm in ketosis state?
Fitnessman once talked about bad breath and strong urine is a signal for ketosis. Well, my breath is already bad even before I started keto diet. :D What is strong urine means??
Oh right now my bodyweight is 200 lbs. I take 200 gr protein, 80 gr carbs including post work out and 120 gr fat. total calories is about 2000 and 2200. I tried to lose weight to 165 lbs.
Strong and real smelly urine is a sign.
That is a start for your diet. If energy runs low increse fat.
Make the 50g dietary carbs are fibrous ones.
What country are you in ?
Maybe someone in your country can tell you where to find them.
I find it hard to believe they are not available.
You could always order on the net. Though, cost would be considerably higher. Just a thought.
I don't believe them to be a banned substance. Just a tool of measurment. :confused:
PEACE
I live in Singapore, I ask the drug store and they don't even know what keto is :D
maybe I'll try buy one on the net. thanks Chi !! do you have any links to buy ketostrip online? Thanks again
Do a search on yahoo or google and type in "ketostix", they are everywhere.
PEACE
ok through reading this whole thread ive learned this, someone tell me if im missing something thanks
-im 185 so i eat 1850 cals a day when i gradually lose weight do i also lower the calories?
-postworkout 30g whey 30g dextrose
-50g of carbs a day
-carb loads are for 24 hrs, im going to be doing them on the weekends since the last day of my workouts are on fridays, how many gms of carbs should i be eating, is the carb load just one meal, or meals with a certain amount of carbs for an amount of time
thanks
For a load I prefer 60% carbs, 30% protein, 10% fat....4-6 meals.
Yes as bodyweight drops adjust intake.
oh and one more thing this week since im dropping my cals this is my week off, should i be taking glutamine when i came up and before i sleep since im dropping cals or should i start using glutamine next week once i start doing cardio and working out?
I only use glutamine post cardio.
not even before you sleep? cant you go into a catabolic state?
and post workout?
No. You will plenty of fatty acids to prevent that.
oh ok fitnessman youve been great help, thanks alot
(was a single post, Im posting here to keep it in the mix)
I understand that Fitnessman does a keto diet year round... as, I am planning on doing the same thing.. is there anything I should keep in mind when going on a keto for an extended period of time (other than the obvious taking vitamins, drinking water, workout, etc)?
Should I take a break from it every now and then (cycle the diet)?
Ive been in the habit lately (after almost 3 months on a keto diet) of having a carb centric day every 2 weeks (thats a carb load.. not carb excess), should I do this more frequently on an extended keto diet?
any info or links would be great... thx
Dessicated liver or folic acid is helpful for me.
I take breaks for vacations and around the holidays.
I carb load every week. Even a few beers during that period.
The more you get used to the diet, the more you will understand how great it is. On vacations of eating anything I wish, its still hard to shift back to a sugar burning metabolism.
this keto diet has really changed the way I look and live... I used to be one of those guys that could never put the diet altogether... now, Im actually looking more like a bodybuilder, rather than a powerlifter... thanks for all the help