My high sugar diet (Experimental)

I'm on my second day of a high carb, high protein diet, with minimal fat. Will go for as long as I can endure. It's for fun and also to see how much weight I will gain by doing so. Is de novo lipogenesis strong enough to make me fat? Lifting will be done to preserve mass and to keep blood sugar down when needed...but nothing extreme. Fullbody and some bodyweight stuff. Not going to do cardio or anything similiar for burning the excess, but I might go for walks or do stuff to be able to eat more.

Starting weight: 88.5 kg

Bodyfat: about 9%BF

Estimated maintenance: 3500kcal

Target minimum calories: 5000kcal

Day 1

Morning weight: 88.5 kg

Macros:

450g Protein
850g Carbs
20g Fat
0g Alcohol

Foods for the day (in no particular order):
350g of whey
400g of turkey
3 pears
3 apples
12 bananas
2 cucumbers
1 Small bucket of baby tomatos
100g of spinach
700g of 0-fat sherbet (lemon and mango)
250g bag of sour candy
Some skittles
4 big glasses of chokolate milk with coffee
3 energy drinks
ZMA/VitaminD/Omega/Betacarotene

Calories: ~5400

All the fibre had me stuffed today. No real lifting, but I did pull of a fullbody workout with kettlebells at home.

Counting was fairly strict, but I might have missed something, as I had a busy day with the kids and we went to visit my mother and so on...

Evening weight: 90.1 kg

That fat is extremely low, low enough to cause concern over missing minimums for essential fats... you need to make sure you're getting enough n3 and n6.

Also: when you say 'high sugar' are you being loose with the sources? Enough fructose could be a liver toxicity concern.

Day 2

Morning weight: 88.5kg (+/–0)

Well I expected some slight gain atleast, but I'm sure it will start going upwards soon^^

Macros:
400g Protein
960g Carbs
18g Fat
0 g Alcohol


Foods for the day:

200g of whey
10 bananas
1kg of 0-fat cottage cheese
1kg of vanilla low-fat quark
100g of spinach
1 jar of marmalade
2 pears
1 cucumber
700g of 0-fat sherbet (Melon and Cacti)
500g of sour candy
2 energy drinks
3 cups of black coffee
ZMA/VitaminD/Omega/Betacarotene

Calories: ~5600

Today I'm at work, yeah I work all sundays... but I'm always free both friday and saturday so it's a good tradeoff for me^^ Eating feels easier today, but I do get a bit jittery at times so some moving around does feel good. Did a set of 64 pushups, 64 bodyweight squats and took a powerwalk to work. No lifting planned today.

Evening weight: 91.5

[QUOTE=AdamWW;1580862561]That fat is extremely low, low enough to cause concern over missing minimums for essential fats... you need to make sure you're getting enough n3 and n6.

Also: when you say 'high sugar' are you being loose with the sources? Enough fructose could be a liver toxicity concern.[/QUOTE]

I'm supplementing omega's on a daily basis. But yeah, fat is well below my comfort level... and it is meant to be for this experiment's sake. Normally on 58g/day without hormonal issues, so those may come with this experiment. Going to look into the liver toxicity aspect, as I eat both fructose and glucose in amounts.

[QUOTE=Tucane;1580863471]I'm supplementing omega's on a daily basis. But yeah, fat is well below my comfort level... and it is meant to be for this experiment's sake. Normally on 58g/day without hormonal issues, so those may come with this experiment. Going to look into the liver toxicity aspect, as I eat both fructose and glucose in amounts.[/QUOTE]

Glucose isn't going to cause issues, fructose is really the only concern.

Fruit is usually about 50/50 fructose/other sugars but stuff like candy has a lot more.

You can always enter it into cronometer.com for totals if you want.

[QUOTE=AdamWW;1580864201]Glucose isn't going to cause issues, fructose is really the only concern.

Fruit is usually about 50/50 fructose/other sugars but stuff like candy has a lot more.

You can always enter it into cronometer.com for totals if you want.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for info. Almost forgot I had chronometer installed^^ Going to be more careful with the sources and do some digging for the products I eat regularly.

Honestly I'm starting to get fed up with the sugar intake already and it's only day 2... Adherence for 10 days is my target.

[QUOTE=Tucane;1580865191]Thanks for info. Almost forgot I had chronometer installed^^ Going to be more careful with the sources and do some digging for the products I eat regularly.

Honestly I'm starting to get fed up with the sugar intake already and it's only day 2... Adherence for 10 days is my target.[/QUOTE]

Any reason you targeted sugar specifically instead of just total carbs?

[QUOTE=AdamWW;1580874371]Any reason you targeted sugar specifically instead of just total carbs?[/QUOTE]

First I tried to just buy carbs, but most of them had too high trace fat to fit the frame. It was simply easier to avoid the fat in pure sugary products... so it came naturally through the choices made when shopping. (I normally love to eat oats, but for this experiment it simply had too much fat)

Is there any non-sugar all-carb type of product? Or something like that...

I have read a couple of studies pointing at the fact that de novo lipogenesis is really weak in human species and that the main driver of fat gain is actual fat intake on a surplus diet. So that's basically what I'm trying to test for myself.

I'm fairly certain that this approach is less fattening than overshooting fats on a ketodiet if surplus calories are equal. For health/wellbeing it feels a bit worse than keto actually. Sugar highs lead to energy levels going through the roof though... so lifting won't likely suffer if I can stand to keep this up for some more time.

[QUOTE=Tucane;1580877821]First I tried to just buy carbs, but most of them had too high trace fat to fit the frame. It was simply easier to avoid the fat in pure sugary products... so it came naturally through the choices made when shopping. (I normally love to eat oats, but for this experiment it simply had too much fat)

Is there any non-sugar all-carb type of product? Or something like that...

I have read a couple of studies pointing at the fact that de novo lipogenesis is really weak in human species and that the main driver of fat gain is actual fat intake on a surplus diet. So that's basically what I'm trying to test for myself.

I'm fairly certain that this approach is less fattening than overshooting fats on a ketodiet if surplus calories are equal. For health/wellbeing it feels a bit worse than keto actually. Sugar highs lead to energy levels going through the roof though... so lifting won't likely suffer if I can stand to keep this up for some more time.[/QUOTE]

I mean obviously I'd say a balanced approach is better, but given you're just doing this for an experiment, I'd argue higher carb would be 'better' in most ways assuming you don't overshoot fructose, etc...

Personally I can eat huge amounts of white rice, that kind of thing, but it just depends what you tolerate. Dates have a lot of fructose but theyre also very nutrient dense, and calorie-dense.

It's tough targeting just a single macro to get super high on... hence why usually don't try it :)

[QUOTE=Tucane;1580877821]Is there any non-sugar all-carb type of product? Or something like that...
[/QUOTE]

Plain/salted rice cakes fit the bill, and some of the flavored ones may as well. Unless you go for a butter or chocolate based one they should be almost all carbs, aside from minimal protein.

I'm quite interested to see how this experiment plays out.

Day 3

Morning weight: 90.2 kg

There's the first sign of real weight gain, could be a fluctuation of course... but, we'll see. Had a hangover kind of feeling waking up this morning, tired and foggy from all the sugar ingested, not unexpected.

Macros:

620g Protein
1050g Carbs
~50g Fat
0g Alcohol

Foods:

340g whey
12 bananas
1 mango
1 kiwi
2 cups of black coffee
250g of dried fruit mixed
2kg of 0-fat cottage cheese
1 jar of lingonberry jam
250g of dates
2 Propud Shakes Melon/Vanilla
1 Coffee with chokolate milk
200g of spinach
130g of danish salt liquorize

Calories ~7200

Evening weight:: 92.7kg

Counting might be a bit off today due to more food to keep track of, trace fats are higher for the same reason. Did pull of two intensive fullbody-workouts today, so I felt more hungry overall. Feeling really good today aswell, not counting the half-****ty morning.

200g whey = death

[QUOTE=Zerkesian;1580888311]Plain/salted rice cakes fit the bill, and some of the flavored ones may as well. Unless you go for a butter or chocolate based one they should be almost all carbs, aside from minimal protein.

I'm quite interested to see how this experiment plays out.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for checking in, will check on different brands of ricecakes for macros and stuff:-)

[QUOTE=AkiraFudo;1580896131]200g whey = death[/QUOTE]

Then it seems like there will be days I'm gonna die twice^^

[QUOTE=Tucane;1580862151]Day 1

Morning weight: 88.5 kg

Macros:

450g Protein
850g Carbs
20g Fat
0g Alcohol

Foods for the day (in no particular order):
350g of whey
400g of turkey
[B]3 pears
3 apples
12 bananas[/B]
2 cucumbers
1 Small bucket of baby tomatos
[B]100g of spinach[/B]
700g of 0-fat sherbet (lemon and mango)
250g bag of sour candy
Some skittles
4 big glasses of chokolate milk with coffee
3 energy drinks
ZMA/VitaminD/Omega/Betacarotene

Calories: ~5400

All the fibre had me stuffed today. No real lifting, but I did pull of a fullbody workout with kettlebells at home.

Counting was fairly strict, but I might have missed something, as I had a busy day with the kids and we went to visit my mother and so on...

Evening weight: 90.1 kg[/QUOTE]

run a contest prep with veggies then complain about fiber.....youre getting most of your carbs from digestible sources, I dont think its a fiber issue, I think its a 5000+ calorie issue of why youre full....

[QUOTE=pinggolfer96;1580930981]run a contest prep with veggies then complain about fiber.....youre getting most of your carbs from digestible sources, I dont think its a fiber issue, I think its a 5000+ calorie issue of why youre full....[/QUOTE]

If not fibre then food volume mayhaps... have had 10k cheat days in the past that were less satiating.

Thanks for stopping by:-)

Going to call it a day now with eating/lifting, not going to sleep though... have a plane to catch for a trip to Mallorca in a few hours. Might not be able to track my weigh/macros the same way/precision as home, nor do I want to. Vacation is meant to be relaxing, but I will lift some weights and plan to eat in the same vein. The stuffing my face part will be done more intuitively, though. Will likely be more liquid calories aswell^^

Still running the diet?

[QUOTE=Zerkesian;1582035421]Still running the diet?[/QUOTE]

No, I actually got really fed up with the high sugar intake... so I abandoned the project. I did keep it up for a week more (during vacation) than I accounted for here in this thread, without tracking and notes though (assuming around 5k calories/day with alcohol in the mix).

Past that I returned to normal eating by needs/hunger cues and all the glycogen/waterweight dropped in a few days.

I'm sick of candy but I still eat dried fruit every now and then, because it's easy calories, has micros and tastes good. So I learned somehing^^

Would've loved to have seen the results of this over a longer term but can fully understand being fed up with it. That's a lot of sugar.

Thanks for playing guinea pig though.

[QUOTE=Tucane;1582543151]No, I actually got really fed up with the high sugar intake... so I abandoned the project. I did keep it up for a week more (during vacation) than I accounted for here in this thread, without tracking and notes though (assuming around 5k calories/day with alcohol in the mix).

Past that I returned to normal eating by needs/hunger cues and all the glycogen/waterweight dropped in a few days.

I'm sick of candy but I still eat dried fruit every now and then, because it's easy calories, has micros and tastes good. So I learned somehing^^[/QUOTE]

Dates with PB for the win

[QUOTE=AdamWW;1582725421]Dates with PB for the win[/QUOTE]

Never even considered that combo... sounds tasty! Now that I've gone intuitive style I'm gonna give it a try:-)

Nice back! @ avi pic^^

[QUOTE=Nicksosure1;1582588661]Would've loved to have seen the results of this over a longer term but can fully understand being fed up with it. That's a lot of sugar.

Thanks for playing guinea pig though.[/QUOTE]

It was fun for a while atleast:-) Might try another experiment in the future if I find something fun worth testing... maybe trying to gain weight on a pure carnivore & green veggies diet^^ I generally find weight gain more interesting than weight loss, the latter is too easy/simple.

[QUOTE=Tucane;1583043881]Never even considered that combo... sounds tasty! Now that I've gone intuitive style I'm gonna give it a try:-)

Nice back! @ avi pic^^[/QUOTE]

Nice dude!

I'm also on a long, LONG term intuitive bulk but mine is to recover from an ED... until I hit a weight wherein my bloodwork is healthy again. That back pick is from years ago when I was about.... 40lb heavier... i'll get there soon enough again :)

It's been pretty amazing mentally, but man the long term effects of my stupid restriction suck.

Seriously though, dates with DB is freakin awesome.

[QUOTE=Tucane;1583044411]It was fun for a while atleast:-) Might try another experiment in the future if I find something fun worth testing... maybe trying to gain weight on a pure carnivore & green veggies diet^^ I generally find weight gain more interesting than weight loss, the latter is too easy/simple.[/QUOTE]
I couldn't agree more. There certainly are many factors that go into weight loss but plenty more and more complicated ones that go into optimal weight gain and body composition, it's fascinating. I'll be sure to stay tuned for your next endeavor lol

[QUOTE=AdamWW;1583057691]Nice dude!

I'm also on a long, LONG term intuitive bulk but mine is to recover from an ED... until I hit a weight wherein my bloodwork is healthy again. That back pick is from years ago when I was about.... 40lb heavier... i'll get there soon enough again :)

It's been pretty amazing mentally, but man the long term effects of my stupid restriction suck.

Seriously though, dates with DB is freakin awesome.[/QUOTE]

Sounds great ! Permabulking without thinking reminds me of my first years of lifting, so free of worries :-)

For me the intuitive eating came from being bored with counting, it added too much mental strain (6-7 years of counting) and left me with a feeling of enjoying food less due to the control around it... I interpreted it as early signs of ED, so I felt the need to change my ways. Luckily my hunger cues seem to work well as long as I stay above 8%BF. Currently I do recomp at around maintenance I'd guess, homeostasis seems to keep me at 200lbs anyways and gym performance is good.

Do you take fish oil supplements?

[QUOTE=MuscleFuhrer;1583740971]Do you take fish oil supplements?[/QUOTE]

I did back when I ran the sugar diet, it has been a regular add-on for so long that I likely forgot to mention it. I still do unless I happen to eat salmon or something in that vein... currently I'm on a normal free eating diet plan though.