25k?
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25k?
I've done some consulting in a few 24 hour clubs. The things is, even though they are franchised, they are all different and even the pay rates for trainers are different.
The most common way of payments is a split where a trainer keeps X percentage of everything they sell and the club gets Y.
The other is where you pay rent.. lets say $800/month. Anything you sell or make you keep and just pay the club $800/month.
It all comes down on how well you can market and sell your service and the size of the facility. I've seen 24 hour gyms that only do 2-3K/month in training and others who do 20K.
I've seen personal trainers who only have 3 clients and make $50/week training. I've seen other who can turn it into a full time job and make 3-4K+/month.
Hands down... the more you sell the more you make. There is a really good online course you can take that teachs you how to sell, without selling. I've heard some good things from a lot of the trainers who took it but I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post it here. PM me if you want more info.
[QUOTE=sanman918;672746301]I've done some consulting in a few 24 hour clubs. The things is, even though they are franchised, they are all different and even the pay rates for trainers are different.
The most common way of payments is a split where a trainer keeps X percentage of everything they sell and the club gets Y.
The other is where you pay rent.. lets say $800/month. Anything you sell or make you keep and just pay the club $800/month.
It all comes down on how well you can market and sell your service and the size of the facility. I've seen 24 hour gyms that only do 2-3K/month in training and others who do 20K.
I've seen personal trainers who only have 3 clients and make $50/week training. I've seen other who can turn it into a full time job and make 3-4K+/month.
Hands down... the more you sell the more you make. There is a really good online course you can take that teachs you how to sell, without selling. I've heard some good things from a lot of the trainers who took it but I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post it here. PM me if you want more info.[/QUOTE]
Thanks but I dont plan on doing any selling.
[QUOTE=BC02;672759591]Thanks but I dont plan on doing any selling.[/QUOTE]
Well from the club models I see where you don't sell any training, and the trainers just train they get paid $10-$13 / half hour.
[QUOTE=sanman918;672760501]Well from the club models I see where you don't sell any training, and the trainers just train they get paid $10-$13 / half hour.[/QUOTE]
cool. So about 40-50k per year then?
[QUOTE=BC02;672761831]cool. So about 40-50k per year then?[/QUOTE]
It depends on the size of the club. A club(s) with 10,000+ members you could do that. If you are in a smaller club you might be somewhere around 20-25K. What are your goals as a PT? The trainers I see pulling in 60k+ a year are those who really understand the business and are business savvy. This is a very small percentage of personal trainers... so there is a lot of opportunity out there.
[QUOTE=sanman918;672746301]I've done some consulting in a few 24 hour clubs. The things is, even though they are franchised, they are all different and even the pay rates for trainers are different.
The most common way of payments is a split where a trainer keeps X percentage of everything they sell and the club gets Y.
The other is where you pay rent.. lets say $800/month. Anything you sell or make you keep and just pay the club $800/month.
It all comes down on how well you can market and sell your service and the size of the facility. I've seen 24 hour gyms that only do 2-3K/month in training and others who do 20K.
I've seen personal trainers who only have 3 clients and make $50/week training. I've seen other who can turn it into a full time job and make 3-4K+/month.
Hands down... the more you sell the more you make. There is a really good online course you can take that teachs you how to sell, without selling. I've heard some good things from a lot of the trainers who took it but I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post it here. PM me if you want more info.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=sanman918;672760501]Well from the club models I see where you don't sell any training, and the trainers just train they get paid $10-$13 / half hour.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=sanman918;672767391]It depends on the size of the club. A club(s) with 10,000+ members you could do that. If you are in a smaller club you might be somewhere around 20-25K. What are your goals as a PT? The trainers I see pulling in 60k+ a year are those who really understand the business and are business savvy. This is a very small percentage of personal trainers... so there is a lot of opportunity out there.[/QUOTE]
[img]http://warriorwriters.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/troll.jpg[/img]
Usually the minimum. 24 hour is mostly for starters trying to learn the business and perhaps build a clientele.
[QUOTE=Keltron;672838101][img]http://warriorwriters.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/troll.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
LOL. The new guy will learn soon enough.
[quote=norwichgrad;674343011]lol. The new guy will learn soon enough.[/quote]lol
[QUOTE=Keltron;672838101][img]http://warriorwriters.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/troll.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
nvm
[QUOTE=buknasty;674512451]What is this guys deal srs. On one hand he sounds like he is actually trying to help then on the other hand he sounds like a scammer infomercial guy.
I dont frequent this part of the forum here, can you tell me what about he is saying is wrong?[/QUOTE]
Honestly, he doesn't even deserve that much thought. lol
BC02 is a [i]former[/i] trainer, who quit because he was unsuccessful as a trainer. We call them Bitter Non-Trainers, or BiNTs for short.
Every forum on every topic has some people like this, people who were once passionate about the topic, the hobby or profession, but who had a bad experience - usually their own fault - and who are bitter about it, and hang around just to try to ensure nobody else has any fun or does anything useful, either.
If we had proper moderators in this subforum, idiots like that would be banned. But the only time moderators step in here is with spammers, and if anyone mocks one of the moderators or points out their relentless self-promotion.
[quote=kyleaaron;674622431]bc02 is a [i]former[/i] trainer, who quit because he was unsuccessful as a trainer. We call them bitter non-trainers, or bints for short.
Every forum on every topic has some people like this, people who were once passionate about the topic, the hobby or profession, but who had a bad experience - usually their own fault - and who are bitter about it, and hang around just to try to ensure nobody else has any fun or does anything useful, either.
If we had proper moderators in this subforum, idiots like that would be banned. But the only time moderators step in here is with spammers, and if anyone mocks one of the moderators or points out their relentless self-promotion.[/quote]
bull **** on the unsuccessful trainer ****. I got my clients better results then anyone at any of the gyms i worked at. True i didnt make a lot of cash off it but i was more interested in being a good trainer and results, instead of caring about stupid **** that a coorperate trainer shouldnt have to worry about(sales). Most trainers who make the dough are economically successfull because of marketing/gimmicks and i didnt give a **** if the bosu ball would give me three more clients or not(for example), i was going to do what was going to get my client results. Period. Im willing to bet your clients dont get half the results mine did. Also fyi, i do train a couple people on my own and they are getting damn good results.
[quote=BC02]This message is hidden because BC02 is on your ignore list.[/quote]
Sorry, I'm not here to talk to silly BiNTs.
[QUOTE=KyleAaron;674671861]Sorry, I'm not here to talk to silly BiNTs.[/QUOTE]
I am currently doing my PT course in Australia and was reading a few Australian PT magazine's/journals and the most recent survey has full time trainers earning an average $59000 a year then you have your 2% of trainers earning 200k+, from what i have been reading this seems much higher than the average for an American trainer?
[QUOTE=BC02;674649711]bull **** on the unsuccessful trainer ****. I got my clients better results then anyone at any of the gyms i worked at. True i didnt make a lot of cash off it but i was more interested in being a good trainer and results, instead of caring about stupid **** that a coorperate trainer shouldnt have to worry about(sales). Most trainers who make the dough are economically successfull because of marketing/gimmicks and i didnt give a **** if the bosu ball would give me three more clients or not(for example), i was going to do what was going to get my client results. Period. Im willing to bet your clients dont get half the results mine did. Also fyi, i do train a couple people on my own and they are getting damn good results.[/QUOTE]
I good trainer is able to sustain themselves economically and still get their clients results. In order to be a "good" trainer you need to master both. To say you quit because you only cared about the training is an excuse not to use, but yourself because you afraid to admit failure.
Anyways I'm not going to waste my time talking to you as it isn't going to change your view anyway. You're already set in your ways, but I'm sure the whole sum-forum would appriciate it if you kept your negativity away.
[QUOTE=DaveCarlton;675496091]I am currently doing my PT course in Australia and was reading a few Australian PT magazine's/journals and the most recent survey has full time trainers earning an average $59000 a year then you have your 2% of trainers earning 200k+, from what i have been reading this seems much higher than the average for an American trainer?[/QUOTE]
The cost of living is also higher in Austraila from what I know, maybe that could explain the salary difference ?
[QUOTE=DaveCarlton;675496091]I am currently doing my PT course in Australia and was reading a few Australian PT magazine's/journals and the most recent survey has full time trainers earning an average $59000 a year then you have your 2% of trainers earning 200k+, from what i have been reading this seems much higher than the average for an American trainer?[/QUOTE]
I've heard the Australian average to be more like $40k. USA gyms seem to push the minimum wage and floor work a lot more, Australian gyms are either where you get a % of the amount you charge and the gym keeps the rest, or you set your own prices and pay rent to the gym. (Assuming you're working at a gym of course, outdoor bootcamps and in house training will vary in earning potential). I also doubt any trainers earn over 200k, unless they're training celebrities, doing multiple book deals and doing stuff like the Biggest Loser. I'm not sure what AFL/Rugby/Olympic strength coaches earn, maybe 100-150 for the top guys? But you need a degree for that.
Many PTs do other stuff than just training clients, they may work on the floor helping gym members and supervising, take group classes, take outdoor bootcamps, sell supplements, write books/articles and many more things to boost their income.
[QUOTE=DaveCarlton;675496091]I am currently doing my PT course in Australia and was reading a few Australian PT magazine's/journals and the most recent survey has full time trainers earning an average $59000 a year then you have your 2% of trainers earning 200k+, from what i have been reading this seems much higher than the average for an American trainer?[/QUOTE]
That would be correct for a [i]full-time[/i] trainer. However, most trainers are not full-time, but part-time.
At a mainstream community gym, you will be started off with something like 10 hours of gym shifts getting you A$20-$25/hr. People will be sick, quit, connected gyms will need someone to cover a shift while someone's on holiday, and that sort of thing, and you can without trouble in around six months get it up to about 20hr/week.
To get those hours, you'll need to be willing to work hours like all the opening shifts (0530-1000 or so) or Friday nights, or spread over 6 or 7 days a week rather than 5, whatever. Maybe a combination - fancy doing 0530-1000, followed by 1700-2100? There's your eight-hour day. You can be more fussy, only working shifts at consistent times, or multiple shifts together not split - but then you'll get less total hours.
Once you've gym shifts, you then go and get PT on top of that, which will pay A$30-$40/hr. A typical client will want 2x 30 minute sessions weekly. So to work 10 hours you'll need 10 clients. In practice, around 1 in 6 of all scheduled PT sessions don't happen, someone is sick or quits or has to travel for work (the sorts of people who can afford PT are often those with jobs requiring travel or unexpected extra work). So to ensure 10hr PT you need 12hr scheduled - or 12 clients.
At most community gyms, you will find that of 8-16 trainers, 2-3 do about half the total PT sessions, having 12-20 clients each. The other 5-16 have got 0-3 clients each, and do just a few hours of PT each week.
Those with few gym shift hours or clients, usually it's because they want it that way. They're university students or stay-at-home parents just wanting a part-time job, that sort of person is around half of all trainers. The other ones with few clients are just not very good trainers, and/or they're picky about the hours they'll work or the clients they'll work with.
At a good gym where the trainers are active and competent, around half the total clients will be recruited by the trainers, and around half will be people wandering up to front desk or the manager and saying, "I want to do PT." Typically the manager might give you 1-2 clients to start you off, but after that if you get none of your own, the manager will give you none - they figure if you can't get them you probably can't keep them. At a gym where the trainers are clueless slugs, 90% of the clients will come through the manager - and there'll be less total clients. So really it's up to the PT to make their career happen.
If you really want it as a full-time job, it'll generally take 6-12 months to build up to that, working up to something like 20-30hr of gym shift and 10-20hr of PT weekly. So $50,000 or so is about right for that person - again, after those 6-12 months of building things up.
At a mainstream commercial gym the PT sessions and hourly rates will be higher, but you'll be paying rent to be there, so unless you're stunningly successful, your net cash in pocket will be less than or the same as someone at a community gym. For example, do 20hr PT at a community gym, get $700, get taxed and it's about $600. 20hr PT at a commercial gym will get you $1,200, but you pay $300 rent, sales tax, and then income tax, too - ending up with about $600.
If you were doing like 40hr of PT then the commercial gym would be better, but nobody does that. If nothing else, it'd make you crazy, you'd get burned out and become a BiNT. 8hr of PT a day is 8-16 different clients, and remember this is [i]personal[/i] training, each of them needs an individualised workout and attention, they want to feel like they're the only person that day. So you might do 8-16 clients a day for a few weeks, but you'll lose some or most of them.
Many trainers do combinations of things, like some gym shifts, some PT, some group classes, maybe pool lifeguard or massage or reception work, etc. And of course the gym supervisor or PT team leader jobs are there to be taken if you're more or less competent, those are generally part-time, too.
So you can make a full-time career out of it, and earn that $60,000 or so - but most trainers are not full-time, maybe 1 in 5 at most. I say again, most PTs have 0-3 clients. But most of them choose that.
With me as an example, I started work at two separate gyms in August last year. Until December I worked at one gym 2-4 mornings a week, and the other gym 2-4 evenings a week, in each case with 3-4 hour shifts. The split shifts were too much, the commute annoyed me and I wasn't seeing my wife. I quit the evening gym and took work at a gym nearby the morning one, and associated with it (both YMCAs).
In the next fortnight I have 53 rostered hours on the gym floor, and have scheduled 23hr of PT sessions with 14 different clients. However, 10hr of the PT sessions are within gym shifts, so it'll work out as gym 43hr + PT 23hr, for a total of 66hr.
I will be getting up at 0450 tomorrow to get to work at 0530 and open the gym. I am there at 0530 or 0600 Monday through Thursday, working through to about 1000, though I have a couple of 1000-1400 shifts at the second gym. Sundays I'm there at 0730 to open at 0800, I have a shift till 1230, I do my own workout, have lunch, then PT begins at 1330, and then a second gym shift 1500-1900 when I close up. I take Friday and Saturday off.
I could do more hours than this, but I would have to work some evenings as well, or a sixth day each week, that sort of thing. This would take away from other things I want to do. So I've chosen to limit my hours. I've previously done 110hr in a fortnight, good money, I was miserable.
These 43 gym hours and 23 PT hours fortnightly will be about $45,000 before tax. The Y pays less than other gyms, the one I quit, the same level of work would have got me about $55,000 - except I couldn't have got as much PT there, and the place annoyed me, the Y is heaps better.
During holiday periods like Christmas/New Year PT dies off, but trainers go on holiday themselves, so if you hang around you can pick up their shifts. Again, it's a lifestyle choice.
Other trainers have been there for 3-4 years and are doing 10hr of gym shifts and have 3 clients. But they want it that way. Those who are unsuccessful and unhappy about it you find starting blogs telling other PTs how to sell training. You won't find them sharing raw numbers as I have.
[QUOTE=lilmanthatcould;675498531]I good salesmen is able to sustain themselves economically.a good trainer gets clients results. they arent one in the same[/QUOTE]
fixed